By on March 16, 2016

CTS-V brakes

In six years, almost every new car sold in the U.S. will come with automatic emergency braking systems, making the relatively new safety feature as prolific as airbags or anti-lock brakes.

A group of 10 major automakers plans to announce tomorrow that they will make automatic braking standard on all of their cars by September, 2022, Reuters reports.

Members of the group, which includes Ford, General Motors, Fiat Chrysler Automobiles, Honda, Toyota and Volkswagen, have been in talks with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) and Insurance Institute for Highway Safety (IIHS) for several months as they hashed out a plan.

Together, the group of automakers produces over 99 percent of all light vehicles sold in the U.S. today.

Standard automatic braking would represent a big leap in the amount of autonomous technology installed in new vehicles, though automakers are increasingly turning to it as a way of improving road and pedestrian safety.

Under the proposed agreement, some automakers would be allowed to take longer installing the technology in vehicles where it is difficult to adapt, such as those equipped with manual transmissions (but how many of those will be left in 2022?).

NHTSA Administrator Mark Rosekind has previously said that having automatic braking in all cars would prevent 20 percent of all crashes, or 1 million accidents annually in the U.S. alone.

By voluntarily agreeing to adopt the technology, the automakers avoid having it imposed on them sometime in the future by bodies like the NHTSA.

 

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82 Comments on “A Group of Automakers is Pledging Automatic Braking For Everyone...”


  • avatar
    DeadWeight

    “It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming … who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”

    — Some Millennial Chick hawking Chinese Made Cadillac CT6s

  • avatar
    qfrog

    I have been wondering how these systems cope with track driving situations. How close can you be to somebody entering a braking zone before the car steps in and says whoa there partner that is close enough. I suspect it isn’t going to be too much of an issue but I’m curious to see how it works in those scenarios.

  • avatar
    RHD

    Great idea… so when a pigeon or an owl flies in front of your 2022 car and the computer panics and slams on the brakes, the guy in the 2016 SUV behind you who doesn’t have automatic braking rear-ends your car – all of which could have been avoided by leaving the humans in charge.

    • 0 avatar
      ahintofpepperjack

      Relax. You don’t think this braking technology can/will detect the difference between a bird and a 4,000lb car in front of you?

      Because it will.

    • 0 avatar
      RideHeight

      “leaving the humans in charge”

      Move over, Stephen King. There’s someone scarier than you.

    • 0 avatar
      brn

      The SUV behind you doesn’t need to be a 2016. It weights 2000lbs more and can’t stop as quickly.

      • 0 avatar
        RHD

        The scenario I described was a 2022 car with automatic braking technology, followed by a then-archaic 2016. The point is that a human can tell, due to the context, if a bird, a puppy, a squirrel, or a skunk crossing the road needs to be run over, ignored, avoided or if the brakes should be applied and if so, how hard. If a soccer ball is rolling in the street, and a 6-year old is running across a lawn toward it, that’s a different scenario than just a soccer ball.
        But on the other hand, half the drivers out there are below average, and need their cars to do the gear shifting, lane-line watching and braking for them.

        • 0 avatar
          orenwolf

          1) you are building a straw-man argument by trying to have us accept as fact that a soccer ball will stop the car. It won’t, and so your argument is irrelevant.

          Even if that were not the case, what makes you think a driver wouldn’t slam on the brakes when they see a soccer ball fly by them? there’s a reason why it’s illegal to swerve for small animals in some jurisdictions, because people act erratically when that happens and *cause accidents*.

          So your argument is without merit on both fronts. But please, keep explaining why car technology peaked in 1965.

    • 0 avatar
      Yuppie

      Multiple sensors that triangulate the target?

  • avatar
    Boxerman

    Hmm we are going to be radared to death, literally. Also the system will fail in the snow because the sensors are covered, but by then the populace wont know how to brake so accidents and lawsuits.

    On the other hand driving with my wife who is a late braker in normal traffic, would love her car to have these systems.

    Frankly 90% of the people cant really drive so these systems are a boon, but they create learned helplessness. Try backing up a car without a rearview camera once you are sued to it. How many people now rely on lane departure warning, blind spot alert etc..

    Take the fun out of owning and driving a car, and you get less drivers all while trying to convince consumers to have the latest tech. Cars today are boring and driving a hassle for most.

    A camel is a horse designed by a comitee, and cars today are as appealing as camels.

    Too bad for the rest of us who like cars and driving.

    Of course all this safety tech pushed by the insurance industry will put them out of business too, the invisible hand at work.

    • 0 avatar
      Coopdeville

      “they create learned helplessness”

      This +1000. Haven’t some recent air disasters been blamed on pilots who lack enough real world skills to know what to do in an emergency when the auto-pilot can’t cope?

      These safety features are great when you need them but will only foster ever decreasing driving skills among the general public, if that’s even possible. Why should Jacen even look up from his phone if the car will like totally stop itself if it needs to?

      Do kids still say “like” and “totally?”

      • 0 avatar
        jmo

        When was the last time a domestic passenger jet crashed in the US? 2009. The automation works very, very, very well.

        • 0 avatar
          DeadWeight

          “When was the last time a domestic passenger jet crashed in the US? 2009. The automation works very, very, very well.”

          Yes, because comparisons between wide body, modern, commercial aircraft, and automobiles & light trucks are so apt fitting.

          GM even went the extra mile on ignition cylinders.

        • 0 avatar
          stuki

          It’s been lots longer than that, since the last time I crashed……

        • 0 avatar
          Coopdeville

          Why does it have to be domestic or recent for it to be a real issue?

          The most basic of searches gives me these examples. I bet there’s more if I knew where to look and didn’t work for a living:
          Air France Flight 447
          Adam Air Flight 574
          Asiana Airlines Flight 214
          Eastern Airlines Flight 401 (this one goes back a few years, but still relates to pilots not noticing the auto-pilot had failed until the crash)

          My only point being that if this can happen to professional pilots on even a limited basis with all of their advanced training, Joe-average with his 4 hours of driving instruction back when he was 16 is totally screwed.

      • 0 avatar
        FBS

        I imagine that in hypothetical mid-1990s TTAC, the Best-n-Brightest X-Treme would be making similar remarks about the spread of anti-lock brakes.

        The majority of motorists are disinterested in driving and anything that helps make up for inattentiveness or a lack of skill will make driving safer for everyone. Automatic braking systems, properly implemented, should be imperceptible for 99.999% of your time behind the wheel.

        The added cost is a much more valid concern, I think.

        • 0 avatar
          stuki

          The added cost, along with the reluctance of even people who could technically afford it to pay for it, will lead to it being mandated. Returns to Lobbying/Inevitably at best half literate politicians and bureaucrats falling all over themselves to invite “experts” (read: Salesmen), to testify/explain the technology will see to that,

          Which means less safe cars for the young and less wealthy, who are now even further from being able to buy a new car with the new “safety” tech.

          I have no doubt the tech is useful in some situations. But government is useful in no situations. And if, as is common in the post civilized, progressive era, the former presupposes the latter, the net result is still negative.

        • 0 avatar
          Pch101

          If TTAC had been around a century ago, there would have been a contingent of posters whining about the loss of the hand crank starter.

          • 0 avatar
            orenwolf

            And a contingent complaining how modern assembly line methods will kill the “soul” of driving versus traditional handcrafting, despite the immense reduction in defects thanks to the assembly line.

          • 0 avatar
            CoreyDL

            My shirts don’t feel as nice ev-ry since they created that damn cotton gin.

      • 0 avatar
        CoreyDL

        Girls say like and totally all the time, yes. Add in “love it,” and “I’m so jealous.” They say that as well, even when it doesn’t make sense.

    • 0 avatar
      Pch101

      Fatality rates are falling because passive safety devices work.

      That’s a pretty good indication that passive safety works because relying upon drivers talent doesn’t work.

    • 0 avatar
      orenwolf

      They work fine in snow. My 2016 Mazda 6 works fine in Barrie, ON weather.

      These systems kick in when they detect that the driver is not doing enough to compensate for the issue at hand. No one is going to drive headlong into another vehicle because they think the car will stop for them. On the other hand, timid drivers who have never practiced threshold braking because it’s stupidly not taught in most courses, thereby braking too lightly in an accident, will now be assisted in stopping safely.

      These systems work, which is why there is unified interest in implementation. Lives actually tend to matter.

  • avatar
    Cactuar

    “Introducing the new 2022 Chevrolet Cruze, starting at only 34,995$.”

  • avatar
    ja-gti

    I think the goal of auto companies is to load up cars with so much technology that when the inevitable malfunction occurs, you simply get rid of the car. Similar to smart phones – when they start to get bugs, you don’t think about fixing them, you think about a new phone.

    Long term car ownership will become obsolete. Instead, leasing will make the most sense and will ensure automakers have constant demand for new product.

    • 0 avatar
      White Shadow

      Cars will never be a throw-away item like a toaster or even a TV, simply because the inherent value of a car (which will continue to rise) will ensure that there’s always someone who will be willing to fix whatever goes wrong, even if it means spending a significant percentage of the vehicle’s current value.

      • 0 avatar
        John

        Perhaps – but I’m old enough to remember when TVs weren’t throw-away items – when there was a TV repair shop on most every block, and a vacuum tube tester in every drug store. My last TV with a CRT – a made-in-Japan Sony – lasted exactly 25 trouble free years. Think the same thing will never happen to cars?

        • 0 avatar
          CoreyDL

          That’s already happened, a 25-year reliable car, yeah? Cars got way awesome in the early ’90s. Course they’re always going to take maintenance unlike a TV.

        • 0 avatar
          White Shadow

          TVs are not a good basis for comparison for two key reasons. First, they have gotten less costly over the years in an extreme way, and even more so when you adjust for inflation from the days when they looked like a piece of furniture. Secondly, they are extremely reliable. So how could they not be throw-away items?

  • avatar
    Master Baiter

    Occasionally the “brake” warning on my wife’s 2014 Odyssey goes off when it should not (rounding a curve or if the lane jogs one way or another.). I would not want it to apply the brakes on its own in these circumstances.
    .
    .

    • 0 avatar
      orenwolf

      The tech in your 2014 car is not the same as the tech for these braking systems. Presumably why autonomous braking was not an option in your vehicle then.

    • 0 avatar
      ponchoman49

      My buddies rental 2016 Taurus with radar cruise control kept shutting itself off on the thruway during a snow storm. There was nothing in front of him just snow flurries. This electronic crap can and will fail if it is in anything other than perfect California weather.

  • avatar
    zip89105

    More crap I don’t want. A carjackers dream.

    • 0 avatar
      highdesertcat

      I would be more worried about someone rear-ending me because their old car does not have automatic braking.

      Before anti-lock braking became widely used, I remember where cars without anti-lock braking would lose stopping control and skid into cars with anti-lock braking that had already stopped.

    • 0 avatar

      Hadn’t previously thought about this. Technology wants to be exploited.

      • 0 avatar

        I’ll add to this. Technology BEGS to be exploited.

        • 0 avatar
          highdesertcat

          Technology is great. I love my tech stuff. I survived the transition from Drum Brakes to Disc Brakes and ABS.

          How long will it be before ALL vehicles on the road will have Automatic Braking?

          Today there are still people driving cars from Detroit equipped with Drum Brakes, and Disc Brakes have been around for more than 5 decades, appearing first in race cars and European cars way back when.

          • 0 avatar
            ponchoman49

            LOL you do realize that A brand new 2017 Hyundai Elantra uses rear drum brakes right. Also the “all new” but not really 2016 Toyota Tacoma.

    • 0 avatar
      orenwolf

      I know technology is scary, I get it, I do. There are still people who think microwaves irradiate your house. but not every “computerized” software system is subject to remote hacking.

      Now sure, eventually the day may come when this is possible, but no one is hacking my 2016 Mazda6 and enabling the braking system. Sorry.

      • 0 avatar
        highdesertcat

        Microwave ovens DO irradiate your house! Turn one on in the vicinity of any 2.4GHz device like a Router, Remote Control, Burglar Alarm System, Cordless Phone, and see how well they work.

        That’s why Cordless Phones went to 5.8GHz and 1.6GHz DECT, and other spectrum bandwidth.

        • 0 avatar
          orenwolf

          Holy shit seriously?

          I chose that example because I thought for sure no one would honestly believe that!

          Microwaves do not leak microwave radiation in working condition! 2.4ghz interference is usually caused by RF harmonics in the electrical wiring. Or do you believe running your Vaccuum while an analog tv was on was the Vaccuum irradiating your house too?

          http://www.fda.gov/radiation-emittingproducts/radiationemittingproductsandprocedures/homebusinessandentertainment/ucm116385.htm

  • avatar
    SCE to AUX

    Assigning liability after an accident will become more challenging.

    Will mfrs release black box data that reveals a failure of their product?

    By the way, who are the remaining 4 mfrs not mentioned in the article? Even Reuters didn’t say.

  • avatar
    SaulTigh

    It seems future Aubrey McClendon’s will have to do it the old fashioned, American way…with a gun.

  • avatar
    sketch447

    Hey, great idea!!………..Oh, waitaminute:
    When the NHTSA mandated back-up cameras in all cars, it claimed it would increase the price “only” 300 bucks.

    IN REALITY, the price of a new car went up $900 – $1200. Some much more because automakers packaged the backup cams with expensive touch screens and navigation systems…..

    Automatic braking systems are far more complex than backup cams. Who wants to guess how much this will skyrocket the cost of a new car?

  • avatar
    pdl2dmtl

    At the rate the car prices are going up, it is possible that that price will be the entry point. Gizmos extra.

  • avatar
    [email protected]

    “Under the proposed agreement, some automakers would be allowed to take longer installing the technology in vehicles”

    “Members of the group, which includes … Volkswagen”

    Yep, I’m going to trust my life to a company who just love to comply with government standards.

  • avatar
    TonyJZX

    I’m not a huge fan of mandated safety aids but really, its too late in the day. I am often reminded that one can buy a car for under $15,000 usd that is ncap5 euro5 and has 6 airbags abs tc dsc bfd tla wtf etc.

    It is a natural consequence that companies will be able to high integrate safety circuitry for less money IF IT HELPS THEM SELL CARS.

    If you can turn it off, you’re good. Even if you cant turn it off, people like you dont matter.

    You guys go on about how much this is going to cost… like really? You think a simple camera sensor, a handful of circuits interfacing with braking functions is going to cost much more?

    20 yrs ago a car for $15,000 didnt come with all the stuff that they come with now.

    Its a non event and its partway to the self driving future. Embrace it people, google says you have to.

    • 0 avatar
      TMA1

      On the question of cost, why do manufacturers still charge $1,000+ for navigation systems that are less effective than a $100 Garmin? Because they’re not interested in passing the savings on to you.

  • avatar

    I’ve had time to think about it. DeadWeight gets street cred for making me think. Think! Imagine that.

  • avatar
    balreadysaid

    Go up a twisting 10 degree incline. Cars parked on your passenger side will set any type of radar off. My 2016 silverado has lane keep assist, and collision warning. It goes haywire in some situations thinking I’m in full mid crash, because I floored it around a wide turn, and it saw a car that looks like it’s heading for the front. It doesn’t apply the brakes but it pumps them up for hard use, while vibrating the seat, and flashing bright red lights in heads up.and making noises. I think it’s good but I know for a fact it can’t work perfect in a city.too many variables. Construction work,streets that are so tore up you think your in Moab.no sensors can handle what some cities are made outta. I can’t keep a new truck for more than 20k from New. They fall apart in short order hitting the streets like I have near me. I don’t think this will work.

  • avatar
    turf3

    So we have one commenter “orenwolf” who clearly has imbibed the idea that whatever electronic doohickey they come up with next will always be integrated correctly and will fail catastrophically so rarely as to be insignificant; this despite daily examples of how well consumer-grade electronics built to a cost target work (Micro$oft, anyone?).

    And many others sounding a note of caution.

    But I want to come at it from a slightly different perspective: what is going to happen once the cars with all this stuff start failing? You know that when the automatic braking system, or the stop-start system, or whatever comes after that, fails, it will set an error code and you won’t be able to get your car inspected or registered. What’s going to happen the next time the economy tanks, and all the baristas and Wal-mart clerks can’t afford to get their 10 and 15 year old cars with failed nanny systems fixed, and they have to have those cars to get to work?

    I remember what it was like in the 70s when the economy sucked. But in those days most adults either had grown up in the Depression or their parents had, and they understood self-reliance, and most of the equipment you needed to carry on your life could be fixed by anyone reasonably attentive with a decent kit of tools. And of course if you go back to the Depression itself, most of the equipment could be fixed with baling wire and twine. What’s going to happen the next time, once everyone is specialized and no one can fix anything themselves?

    • 0 avatar
      highdesertcat

      Very insightful. In my neck of the woods people hold on to their cars because there is no rust in the desert. I still drive a 1989 Camry V6 but it has Disc Brakes all-around. My best friend still drives a 1993 S-10 with Discs and ABS in the front and Drums in the rear.

      It’s not unusual to find classics from the 50s still used as daily drivers where I live. Makes sense actually because it is cheaper to replace worn or broken parts than it is to go into debt for a new or used car.

      Now if they can only do something about the corrosive and deteriorating effects of E10 and E15 in old cars.

    • 0 avatar
      ponchoman49

      Wow somebody that does “get” it. The middle class is shrinking rapidly leaving the rich and the Walmart worker. Soon that is all that will be left and it will be interesting to see how these 10.00 per hour workers will deal with 500-5000 dollar repairs to get there rolling video arcades to pass inspection, emissions or registration. It’s going to get worse people. The government is already lobbying to get electronic devices in your car to tally up how many miles your going, where and how often you go out etc so that they can throw more taxes at you. There is going to come a point when most younger people in the future will not be able to afford any car let alone a self driving one that costs more than there house.

    • 0 avatar
      orenwolf

      Hahaha yes, right, I’m the only person on this entire site who believes vehicle safety systems, when deployed by this many vehicle manufacturers, have been stringently tested using modern techniques unavailable perhaps a decade ago.

      Instead, we are expected to believe that the engineers forgot about soccer balls, snow, and the element of risk involved in activating brakes on a vehicle autonomously.

      I’m just (apparently) the only one willing to wade into this s conversation to point out that these technologies exist today, are saving lives, and no robot apocalypse has happened because of them.

      Yes, I’m looking forward to a world where the elderly can still have mobility due to safety features, and where pedestrian fatalities can stop increasing in cities. But yes, let’s scare away that future with FUD so that my parents can still rely on me to get them places instead of technology.

      Let me guess: Anthropgenic climate change isn’t happening, Prius’s pollute more than Hummers did because of their batteries, and a first generation Crown Victoria is the safest vehicle on the roads because of its size and lack of modern crap inside it, correct?

      • 0 avatar
        mcs

        Read the 2016 Subaru Legacy manual section about its pre-collision braking system. They list numerous situations where it doesn’t work.

        Just a small sample of when it could fail:

        – When the detected object is something other than a vehicle, motorcycle,bicycle or pedestrian
        • A domestic animal or other animal (a dog or deer, etc.)
        • A guardrail, telephone pole, tree, fence or wall, etc.
        – Even if the obstacle is a motorcycle, bicycle or pedestrian, depending on the brightness of the surroundings as well as the relative movement, and aspect or angle of the object, there may be cases when the system cannot detect it.
        • When driving at night or in a tunnel when there is a vehicle in front that does not have its taillights on
        • When the detected object is a fence or wall, etc. with a uniform pattern (a striped pattern or brick pattern, etc.)
        • When there is a wall or door made of glass or a mirror in front
        • When driving on a bumpy or unpaved road
        when a vehicle is viewed from the side, oncoming vehicle, vehicles approaching in reverse, small animals or children, or walls or doors are not likely to be detected.

        See the actual manual for the full list. This is just a small subset.

        • 0 avatar
          orenwolf

          These are incidences where the system will fail to activate, which is *what you want*, you want the system to be conservative and engage only when it is certain.

          Again, why a soccer ball won’t slam on your brakes.

      • 0 avatar
        turf3

        Your trust in the reliability of consumer-grade electronics designed and built to a cost target is touching, but probably understandable in one so young.

        However, you still seem unable to grasp that continuing to load up cars with increasingly complex, unrepairable or prohibitively-expensive-to-repair computer stuff is going to have serious side effects on the mobility of the working poor in the future.

        Let’s assume that the vehicle continues to be operable once the auto-braking system, or another similar system fails. If you can’t get it inspected, you can’t insure it either, probably. Now you have an increasing population of people who cannot afford to drive vehicles that pass safety inspections and carry insurance. The income threshold where that starts to happen will continue to rise and will rise all the faster, the more of this kind of feature is included.

        What do you propose be done about this?

  • avatar
    laserwizard

    How long before Big Brother gets access to all of our vehicles and forces us all to stop fleeing the country? I loathe this idea. More reason to keep my old car.

    • 0 avatar
      orenwolf

      Planning to flee to where exactly? You don’t suppose they’d, oh, stop you at the border first if you were wanted so badly they’d disable your car?

      Bad news. Shady dealers already disable cars for non-payment with ignition interlocks. They don’t need to touch your braking system to do it. Some people CHOOSE to install these systems as theft deterred systems so their vehicles can be disabled remotely.

      None of this involves automatic braking systems. Sorry.


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