By on May 3, 2012

I hate France. I hate it with a vengeance.  Anyone who has ever had the misfortune of landing at Charles De Gaulle Airport will understand what I mean. So when a colleague from “Die Welt” (“The World”, a major German newspaper) returned from his drive of the Citroen DS5 and excitedly exclaimed “This is the best French car in 20 years!”, we haters just laughed. He might as well have returned covered in pustules, exclaiming “This is my best syphilis infection in 20 years!” I also hate hybrids. This too is easily comprehensible by anyone who has a look at the smug ignoramuses driving these ugly gravity lenses. And I hate diesel. It is the fuel of lorries and Satan.

So now I’m looking at a car that is all three of these things: the Citroen DS5 Hybrid4. It’s also a spaceship full of chrome. Elvis would approve, but still buy a Cadillac. It’s quite good-looking in a overdesigned way. You can appreciate it in the same way you’d enjoy a Hollywood set made of papier-mache. Those twin wide tailpipes? You can shake hands through them. The bulging bonnet? Half of it is empty space, interrupted only by a few spindly, rusting metal stripes that hold something in place.

The complex drivetrain has a diesel engine driving the front wheels with up to 120 kW and an electric motor driving the rear wheels part-time with up to 27 kW, but, due to a French penchant for unnecessary complexity, it puts out 20 kW in most situations. The main engineering effort went into the “Auto”-Mode, which is an economy mode that becomes completely overwhelmed if you try to actually *drive* the car: “Eek! Full throttle! What should I do? I’ll change down. No, up! Nnng… or better down again? I think I’ll start the electric motor and go have some coffee…”

Every gear change of the automated manual transmission takes *years*, in which the car slows down. Despite a plethora of windows, you can’t see the road very well. It’s hopeless. It gets better in “Sport”, but the facade crumbles quickly. Regardless of mode, frugal it isn’t: I logged between 24 to 34 mpg in “Auto” – not from the guesswork of a French dashboard computer, but from real measurements over 1500 miles. An old 2003 BMW 320d we had as a company car did nearly 40 mpg on the same routes under the same driver.

At this point we have lost the internet-ADD crowd, and can work with the small, but patient segment that is game for more in-depth analysis. The DS5 can be quite wonderful as soon as you stop trying to go quickly. Sure, the chassis can corner at high speeds, which suits the “never brake” school of economy and range. But just sit back, relax, coast along, caress the throttle, and it becomes a very nice rolling lounge in that funky French. Yes, the hybrid drive costs more money than it can ever save, which even Citroen themselves admit. But you don’t buy it to save money. You buy it because it is a cool technical gimmick to own. You can have permanent 4WD in winter, when you drive up to the chalet with your skis. You can silently return to your garage at night on the electric drive alone. The DS5 is quiet at all speeds, a truly nice place to chat and trundle along the motorway no matter what distance . I sit,, listening to Isabelle Boulay on the car stereo, and began to feel some kind of affinity with the French. If they built this, perhaps they can be, in a very far future, forgiven for also having built CDG.

So, should you consider buying one? No. The boot is ridiculously small for the exterior size and if you fold the rear seats down, the battery still intrudes into the cargo area. It’s useless as a family car. And judging from what a bit of spring rain did to mine, by the time a DS5 has completed its journey over the atlantic, you will have bought 1.8 tons of pure rust. No, you shouldn’t buy one yourself.

But you should try to convince your company to lease you one. As a long distance hauler that belongs to someone else, it is superb. It is also a symbol of what Citroen excels at; being interesting, being playful, being brave, being (yes) French, being everything that something like an Opel isn’t. I cannot in clean conscience recommend buying a DS5 H4 for yourself, but I want to recommend watching Citroen closely, and even giving one a try. They might surprise you. They surprised me.

“Clemens Gleich is German writer and aspires to mad scientist mainly by experimenting on himself. He covers topics from cars and motorcycles to nucular power generators and the nanoscopic silicon baby kittens that die in their billions every time you open up Youporn. You can try a Google translate on www.mojomag.de for further education on this. It’s better for the kittens.”

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92 Comments on “Review: Citroen DS5 Hybrid 4...”


  • avatar
    VanillaDude

    You aren’t the first German to hate France, btw.

    I like France. Very much. They helped us become a country. We lost a lot of Americans in France not all that very long ago. They were shot by invaders who hated France. Where would you be if your side won? I mean, where would you be goose stepping right now?

    If I were you, I’d cool it on the cultural references. I like my Germans a tad more aware.

    I’m just glad Israel doesn’t produce a car, or we’d be hearing you tell us how badly it handles gas.

    • 0 avatar
      blau

      amen

    • 0 avatar
      SasaP

      Agreed, no german should talk that way of France for at least 100 years…given they dont stir more sh!t.

      As far as car goes….mpg sucks – if I can take anything I have just read as a fact.

      • 0 avatar
        MeaCulpa

        Why the hell not? France and Germany are allies, they founded the ECC/EU together and have excellent relations. In other words they’re BFFs, exactly the people you should take a piss at.

      • 0 avatar
        mshenzi

        We’re closing in on 75 years– one more generation to go on that statute of limitations. But it’s worth remembering that if Herr Gleich is reasonably young, even his parents were probably born after the war. And it sounds like he’s more interested in avoiding France than taking it over, so maybe things are changing, eh?

    • 0 avatar
      MeaCulpa

      First of the germans abandonen goose stepping during WWII, second, and most importantly maybe you should drop the “Germans should be sorry for the holocaust and the world wars” attitude. The author looks like he’s born in the 80’s or even the 90’s, he can harldly in any way shape or form be blamed or held accountable for the actions of a minority of Germans in the 30’s and 40’s.
      The Germans and French has a long and proud history of going at each other, the fact that they are able to do that in a humorous way instead of with bombers, war reparations or guns should be a sign that people and nations can reconcile their differences.

      • 0 avatar
        VanillaDude

        Goose stepping wasn’t abandoned, nor was there sorrow for the Holocaust. Millions were killed, not because they fought, but because the Germans couldn’t use them and saw no reason to stop killing them. Most of the million killed were not soldiers. They were completely innocent human beings. Millions of Germans were killed, by Germans, because they were different. Most were Jews, but it didn’t matter if the Gestapo had the time to pick up someone who was called in by their hateful neighbors.

        The reason this stopped was because the Germans were forced to stop. They didn’t come to their senses. They didn’t have a change of heart. They had to have the awareness of their criminal conduct blown through their helmets. Hitler was thisclose to getting Nukes. We couldn’t wait and we nearly waited too long.

        Ignorance is not an excuse. Americans ended slavery. We didn’t have to be invaded by Canadians in order to see the right. We stopped the mistreatment of minorities and are sensitive towards any events that expose mistreatment. We didn’t allow the KKK to spread into other countries and instigate international incidents because good Southerners stood up to the hatred and courageously told the KKK to return to Hell. Fortunately we stopped these horrors before we were forced to stop by others.

        Forgiveness has been given, but let’s not see this happen again. It isn’t funny. Just as the Japanese should not berate Koreans, Germans have a long list of peoples they owe a lot to, and shouldn’t berate either.

        No one is perfect. That is why we need one another to remind us when one of us starts growing devil horns out of our foreheads.

        As I told Clemens in German below, I get a lot of crap from Germans when I am over there about US culture, so I will not take any from them either. They should be appreciative they were stopped in 1945, even if it wasn’t themselves that did the stopping.

      • 0 avatar
        MeaCulpa

        @VanillaDude

        Goose stepping was abandoned by the Wehrmacht as they didn’t have the time to teach it to new recruits, so yes they did.
        But your reply is just a bunch of straw man arguments strung together with BS PC. Your grasp of history is horrifying. But I fear that it’s pointless to argue with somebody who believes that the sin of the father – or in this case the grand father – is the sin of the son.
        And yes racism totally ended in the south because they got oh so enlightened, it wasn’t like the federal government had anything to do with it.
        Anyway that’s beside the point, Germany and French are two countries with excellent relations, much like Canada and the US despite the war of 1812, and just like a US Journalist can start a review with “I hate Canada, anybody who ever tasted Molson understands why” without anybody crying foul so should a German be able to joke about France.

    • 0 avatar
      MattPete

      thank-you VanillaDude.

    • 0 avatar
      drivelikejehu

      What’s next, are you going to blame the author for Germanic attacks on the Roman Empire?

      Besides which, France actually declared war on Germany in 1939, not the other way around. Why not- they engineered the great Maginot Line. Sadly though they lacked the work ethic to extend it all along the border.

      • 0 avatar
        MeaCulpa

        Depending on witch attack – I presume that you’re talking about the goths “pillaging” of Rome, the actual destruction of significant buildings where actually the responsibility of the Christians thanks to there disdain of false idols – maybe he should blame the Swedes, or maybe the Polish? The goths came from Sweden but probably originated in Poland, they where quite the rag-tag-team. So the next time a Swede says or writes something about hating Italy we can all get our nickers in a twist.

    • 0 avatar

      Dear Mr. Dude,

      I am aware of the fact that people in the US are a bit more sensitive about political incorrectness, but I can assure you that in Europe we can take the mickey out of each other’s contries weaknesses again now the war is over for a while now (how time flies!). Only the Brits still love to bring up the war in their jokes (mostly about Germany and, well: France), but then, they are weird.

      Someone further down wanted more in-depth information about the car: You can, if interested, find a much longer version in which I even drive an old DS from 1967 on http://www.heise.de/autos (German).

      Thanks for getting involved. Writing would be boring without feedback of any kind.

      Best wishes,
      Clemens Gleich

      • 0 avatar
        elimgarak

        This is true. I wonder if anything spicy will occur off the pitch when chelsea brings their 20k to munich on the 19th and start with their “10 german bombers in the air….”, “2 world wars, 1 world cup”, “if you won the war, stand up”.

      • 0 avatar
        Sinistermisterman

        +1 I don’t think Vanilladude understands that in Europe we mercilessly rip into each others nationalities with gusto, but don’t actually mean any real harm. It’s just fun to wind people up.
        Us Europeans have been blowing two shades of sh*t out of each other for the better part of 2000 years, and now that we aren’t, I think we’re allowed a little humour and sarcasm.
        The generation that lived and fought through WW2 is fading away, and give it another 30 years or so and for the first time in thousands of years we will have very, very few people alive in the major European countries who actually fought against one another. I won’t forget what has happened (my Grandparents all fought/served in WW2), but I won’t let it dictate my future, or my feelings towards my ‘neighbours.’
        I’m British by birth, I call the French – Frogs, and the Germans – Krauts or sausage eaters. The French deride the British as ‘those damned Anglo Saxons’ whilst the Germans call us ‘Island Monkeys.’ It’s not taken seriously.
        *Edit*
        I have owned one Citroen, and it will never, EVER happen again.

      • 0 avatar
        VanillaDude

        Die Kritik war gut, sehr gut, aber nicht der Ton der Kritik. Sie müssen wissen, dass viele Amerikaner nicht gut denken, von Deutschen nach dem Krieg. Wir haben nicht vergessen. Als ich in Deutschland bin, höre ich die Amerikaner kritisiert. Ich glaube, es ist wichtig, aber ebenso wichtig.

        I hope my German was as clear as your English.
        Herr Dude

      • 0 avatar
        JustinM

        Vanilla Dude, your German was clear enough to this American, and you don’t speak for me.

      • 0 avatar
        thornmark

        Americans of German descent are the largest ancestral group in the US.

        The French are somewhat reviled around the world and for some reason. Their colonies were set up largely for exploitation and have faired poorly when compared with the former colonies of other European powers.

        Napoleon invaded and occupied the German kingdoms a century before Germany invaded France. France attacked the American colonists in the French & Indian War and only aided the US ag/ the Brits during the war of independence because they were against the Brits.

        Against the founding of this country, the US intervened in the two European wars as an instrument of the British policy aimed at preventing a dominant continental European power (see Napoleon). Historians credit French demands after WWI for creating the conditions of misery in Germany that lead to the second war.

        The French effort in WWII is overrated as De Gaule was largely a British/US creature and there were far more surrender monkeys than resistance players. The French were the #1 industrial spies in the US, during the Cold War & wouldn’t doubt if they still were.

        The French government fought against German reunification tooth and nail.

        The Coneheads admitted they were from France.

    • 0 avatar
      afflo

      I don’t get the disdain for the French… Good food, rich culture, and just as proud and nationalistic as we are. And, as noted, we share a common bond in our desires not to be under the reign of a king, and not be pushed around by other nations. Come to think of it, the ‘proud and nationalistic as we are’ part may be the crux of the issue… Nobody is allowed to be as proud of their country as we are!

      And Citroens… so weird, so delightful. If I didn’t have things like a “personal budget” and “garage space” to worry about, I’d have a goat and a goddess as play-toys. (2CV and a DS, of course). Let the straight-laced squares have their ’57 Bel Airs and ’65 Mustangs!

      • 0 avatar

        Afflo: With such sympathy for Citroens, get a ride in the DS5, and make it the Hybrid, because the hybrid gets a better rear axle than the standard version (multi-link instead of a torsion bar). Couple that with the electric boost in “Sport” mode and you will see the H4 is faster (and therefore better) than the standard diesel.

        As for the rest: You imperialist pig! I shall include you in my “hate” list, which is getting ridiculously long…

      • 0 avatar
        ranwhenparked

        Yeah, I’ve often thought that, the United States and France do tend to have very similar “screw everyone else, we’re looking out for #1″ national attitudes, so you’d think there would be more mutual respect and admiration there – but, then, you can have a situation where people that are too much alike simply don’t get along.

        Also, I believe the disdain did not always exist, certainly during most of the late 18th century, you couldn’t find two friendlier or closer nations than France and the United States. The relationship went decidedly downhill when they decided in their infinite wisdom to execute the pro-American Louis XVI and thereafter remake all of society from the ground up into a utopian paradise of constant violence, bloodshed, mass killings, and oppression. The paths diverged, and we just haven’t seemed to be able to get back on the same page since, even though that was 220 years ago.

      • 0 avatar
        Sinistermisterman

        @ranwhenparked
        To get back on the same page, you both have to develop the same level of disdain for Great Britain that both the fledgling USA and France did back in the late 18th Century. When ‘your enemy is my enemy’, seeing eye to eye becomes a damn site easier.

      • 0 avatar
        VanillaDude

        –Yeah, I’ve often thought that, the United States and France do tend to have very similar “screw everyone else, we’re looking out for #1″ national attitudes,–

        You must not travel much. There is no country that does not look out for themselves first. No country willingly sacrifices it’s national interest for someone else. Your thought, if that is what it is, is not based on reality.

      • 0 avatar
        MeaCulpa

        But the king was the mayor suporter of the US.
        ranwhenparked is on to something, nationalism/patriotism as a central element of the state is quite a american/french trait. The two countries also share the most central trait regarding who should pay taxes, oh and Louisiana law is influenced by french law.

    • 0 avatar
      Franzouse

      Amen brutha!
      this guy was trying so hard to be funny that he wound up looking like an ignorant jerk.

  • avatar
    raph

    Sigh… it started with so much diesel hybrid french hate, I was almost ready to do thy bidding master. Enjoyed the read though.

  • avatar
    GT-86

    Citroen is always known for doing things in a bizarre manner… and this is no exception. Still, at least they made the jump to diesel-electric… frankly there is so much *hate* about the French and very little about the car in this post. We all know the stereotypes about the French and French cars, but it sure would have been nice to know more about the actual car.

    I would LOVE to see Citroen here in the US again, but they need the C6… think about it, huge interior, streamlined shape, fabulously comfortable… it’s just perfect for the US roads and US drivers.

    • 0 avatar

      There’s a C6 on my street. So I see some Citroen in the U.S. again on an almost daily basis. Definitely focused on comfort much more than performance and handling.

    • 0 avatar
      marjanmm

      There is an old C6 TTAC review, look it up. The reviewer liked it but the commentators mostly complained of the minor sealing fault at high speeds when reclosing windows.

  • avatar
    lon888

    A German calling a French car overly complex? That’s like a pot calling the kettle black. I don’t think any car can be more overly complex than anything German-built. My VW GTI has three, count ‘em three timing chains and none of them drive the water pump. That’s handled by a fourth cogged belt on the back of the engine. Sheesh.

    • 0 avatar
      mshenzi

      I still remember staring in wonder at the first version of a cupholder I saw in a Mercedes. It was a magnificent exercise in over-engineering. The Citroen guys must have been SO jealous when they saw it.

  • avatar
    seanx37

    Charles De Gaulle Airport is awful. Dirty,crowded, poorly laid out, and expensive. I just changed planes there once. That was enough. I remember thinking how can a major country have such an awful airport? Do they not know first impressions count? Hell, here in Detroit, the airport is mostly pleasant. You have to wait til you get in your car and drive I-94 thru Detroit to get the same impression.

    • 0 avatar

      The fact that Guatemala City’s airport outshines CDG should be an embarrassment.

    • 0 avatar
      psarhjinian

      I always thought CDG had a nifty, 60s-pop-in-ruin feel to it.

      If no one has shot a retro porn flick there, they should.

    • 0 avatar
      DC Bruce

      I gather that you’ve never been through JFK or LAX or Heathrow, to name a few that I found worse the CDG (although admittedly, I was in CDG 10 years ago)

      Considering how many Europeans first experience of the United States is JFK, it’s a wonder any of them come back. Attention all Europeans! If you have a choice flying to the U.S. east coast, Washington’s Dulles has completed its renovation and is leagues nicer. If you want to see NYC, there are hourly trains, some of which are pretty fast (up to 160 mph) and buses, which are very cheap, but slower. Shameless OT plug for DC now over . . .

      FWIW, I’ve been too Paris a number of times in the past 30 years as well as southwestern France. My command of French is very much less than perfect; but with only a handful of exceptions, I have found the French’s reputation for hauteur undeserved.

      Citroen has a reputation for complexity that goes back more than 50 years. I’ve always wondered why someone didn’t do a diesel hybrid, since it would seem that a diesel engine’s characteristics are ideally suited to a CVT setup like Toyota’s.

      • 0 avatar
        psarhjinian

        Turbodiesel-electric hybrid doesn’t make as much sense as gas-electric, outside of locomotives (and even they use it as a transmission):
        * The power curves aren’t as complementary; in fact, both have top-end problems
        * Stop-start isn’t something diesels are suited to
        * You get all the cost and complexity of a TDI (turbo, intercooler, high pressure injectors, complex emissions control, overbuilt block) and all the cost and complexity of a hybrid, all in one car. People complain about the ROI on diesel _or_ gas-electric now.

        That said, Toyota’s CVT isn’t really a CVT: it’s an electric motor that acts like one, connected to a conventional set of planetary gears. I do agree that a diesel’s narrow power band is well matched to a CVT.

      • 0 avatar
        SherbornSean

        You can get a shower at JFK, but not at Dulles. That tips the balance towards NYC in my book

      • 0 avatar
        supersleuth

        Unless you’re on a domestic flight into La Guardia. I’ve seen nicer Greyhound bus terminals.

      • 0 avatar
        Roberto Esponja

        Regarding New York, what the heck is La Guardia used for, anyway? I’ve flown in and out of NY a bazillion times, and have never been at the La Guardia airport. The JetBlue terminal at JFK is nice, BTW.

      • 0 avatar
        jimbobjoe

        @Roberto Esponja

        Flights to and from LaGuardia are restricted to 1500 miles (except, for some reason, a few exceptions on Saturdays.) For the most part, the airport isn’t used for connecting traffic. It’s just for people flying in and out of NYC going up to Canada, down to Florida, and as far west as Chicago. It is closer to Manhattan and easier to get in and out of than JFK.

      • 0 avatar

        I have to agree. I think if you make an attempt to speak French, they are much warmer to you.

    • 0 avatar
      MattPete

      Ever flown out of Dulles? The geniuses had 1 security sniffer/scanner for the entire airport. We got there 3 hours in advance and made our plane. Our colleagues got there 2.5 hours in advanced and missed the flight due to incredible backup caused by the security scanner bottleneck. Idiots. Idiots. Idiots.

      In contrast, when we flew back from Tampa, they had 4+ (5?) scanners for an airport that had only fraction of Dulles’ traffic. It took us no time at all to get to our gate.

      Dayton is the same way, as is Cedar Rapids. Dulles, in comparison, is run like a 3rd-world country. Even after they built the additional security lines in the basement (the top level had an architectural bottleneck), they staff only a handful, and you can still wait a half hour or more to get through security.

      • 0 avatar
        mshenzi

        Worst I’ve ever experienced was Vancouver airport (mid 2000s). I’ve been in lots of developed and developing world airports, and never saw molasses-paced chaos to match it, including the combination of defensiveness and willful unresponsiveness among the people working there.

  • avatar
    philadlj

    That is one slick-looking car. I love what Citroen is doing with their designs of late, especially the DS models. Inside and out, they’re utterly unique.

    Yes, they’re over-the-top and a little needlessly nutty at times, but no other (non-super-)cars I know look so much like they were lifted straight of the pages of a sketchbook and brought to life in steel and glass.

    If there’s clever parts-binning going on inside or out, it can’t be detected in photos; the DS3, DS4, and DS5 have totally different interiors; even the steering wheels and HVAC controls are unique to each model.

    I can’t imagine how PSA can make any money off of them. Maybe they don’t, which is kind of a problem.

  • avatar
    Mark MacInnis

    (sniff)….”You Americans and Germans are SUCH peasants. Of COURSE zey are unable to comprehend ze charm and ze genius behind our beloved Aeroport de Charle De Gaul…. nor are you competent enough to assess the beauty behind our Citroen’s. Did we not, after all, create the DCV? Harrumph. Peasants, I say….”

  • avatar
    Sundowner

    I also hate the French, but I’m German as well, and predisposed towards feeling so. Still it’s hard not to hate a country who’s largest contribution to the world is that basically every single nation capable of sewing a flag and declaring independance has beaten France at some point or another in history. Even the Mexicans have beaten the French, and will be celebaring the occasion this Saturday.

    I also hate hybrids and diesel as well, along with “automated” manuals. I give you credit for your openmindedness in the review, but the car should still be burned on principle alone.

    • 0 avatar
      VanillaDude

      Hearing a German complain about the French is like hearing a rapist explain how women are no good. What the Germans did was that wrong.

      • 0 avatar
        LKre

        VanillaDude – there are less cultural references in the review than in your comments. Is that really necessary to shove germans, rapists, women and French in the same sentence? It is a perfectly normal review.

      • 0 avatar
        VanillaDude

        “I hate France. I hate it with a vengeance.”

        Normal review? Did you read it?

        If this reviewer wished to review the car, he could have done so normally. He didn’t. He messed up.

      • 0 avatar
        indyb6

        Hearing an American defending the French against a German is like… Like… (bursts in laughter).. So typically “American”

        What the USA continues to do worldwide in the name of “National Security” and “Stability in ‘insert world region here’ ” is just plain vanilla WRONG.

        And, as LKre mentioned, is it really necessary to shove all those words in a single comment? If anything, it makes you look like a tad more unaware oh-so-typical American male.

        If I were you, I’d cool down on flaming and bitching and just enjoy what makes this website unique and its reviews even more so.

      • 0 avatar
        MattPete

        I’m of German decent, and I’m with VanillaDude on calling out the blatant mouth-breathing bigotry.

    • 0 avatar
      Abdul_Alhazred

      >> hate a country who’s largest contribution to the world is that basically every single nation capable of sewing a flag and declaring independance has beaten France at some point or another in history

      Every country capable of sewing a flag except for…Your country. Sure, you may have rolled them for a few years in the forties but what did Germany get for that? A bunch of dead Germans and a country split in half. Who really won that one?

      • 0 avatar
        LKre

        VanillaDude, the reviewer was joking and acting out to draw attention, but his overall tone is acceptable. You are overreacting, and I say that as someone who grew up in USSR with its notions of Evil Nazis and Beautiful France.

      • 0 avatar
        MeaCulpa

        The Franco-Prussian War was a pretty decisive victory for the proto-jerrys, the Napoleonic Wars also ended well for ze Germans (Prussians to be precise) and not so well for the frogs or the Yanks.
        But as we all know Europe has no history at all except for between 1917-1918 and 1941-1944 or – and this is stretching it – maybe 1914-1918 and 1939-1944 so that dosn’t count. And the french and the Germans can’t fight at all, and all mayor battles and losses where on the western front…. History 101 you know.

  • avatar
    NN

    I take it the stated hatred of France is probably done in jest, however, it’s not well received, deservedly so. Kind of juvenile humor, easy to be taken wrongly. I’ve connected through CDG once and I recall it was somewhat of a mess to navigate but I didn’t think it to be any less worthy than ATL or ORD.

    Regarding the car, I love it…I’m no Francophile but I love anything with strong national character, no matter the faults, as it makes the automotive world that much more colorful and interesting. Would I put my own money on the line for one??? heavens no! But If I find myself in France looking for what type of car to rent, I’ll want to briefly live the French life in a Citroen.

    • 0 avatar
      MeaCulpa

      I think it’s not well received due to the fact that americans are pretty stuck up about germany 1914-1918 and ca 1930-1944 and sort of doesn’t view France and Germany as two modern countries that are allies and that the two countries has a history of animosity that predates the great war.
      Sort of in the same way the US and the UK became allies shortly after the “tax dodging terrorists”/”freedom fighters” thing was settled.
      CdG is an god awful airport, Heathrow – esp. domestic – is just as ugly but CdG takes the cake due to the poor organisation, horrible prices (only topped by Turkish airports)and lack of English skills. Schiphol or one of the larger German airports is the place to transfer if you travel in Europe.

  • avatar
    Zackman

    French bread = good.
    French wine = good.
    French food = good (some).
    French cars?…ummm…er…2CV = good. Citroen = good.
    French car with lots of chrome = Outstanding!
    German anything = Great. Ask my son how he likes his 1942 K98k. He likes his M1 Garand better, however…
    Diesel = Bad.
    Overstyled? = Great…sometimes.
    Charles DeGaulle airport = said to be bad. Le Bourget Airport better, just ask Mr. Charles Lindbergh if he were still with us.

  • avatar
    supersleuth

    In heaven, the policeman is British, the lover is Italian, the cook is French, the engineer is German and it is all organized by the Swiss.

    In hell, the policeman is German, the lover is Swiss, the cook is British, the engineer is French and it is all organized by the Italians.

    • 0 avatar
      SherbornSean

      For me, heaven is where we let go of all these ridiculous national stereotypes. Can we talk about cars now?

    • 0 avatar
      Zackman

      Laugh of the week! Post of the month so far…

    • 0 avatar
      MattPete

      That is an example of amusing and tasteful humor.

      In contrast, the author of the article came across as a mouth-breathing bigot.

  • avatar
    jerseydevil

    supersleuth, that was funny, thanks. made me giggle.

    other thoughts. CDG was designed by George Jetson. It is uber-cool. How anyone be there with out giggling is beyond me.

    Citroens are winderful period. Whimsical, not at all like German cars, which are always cutting in front of you in line.

    What is better then crusing peacefully in a comfortable car in central France? Nothing.

    Good review tho – im still grinning.

  • avatar
    srogers

    I liked the review and the humour. No feigned cultural outrage here.

  • avatar
    tallnikita

    French bread = good => crusty crap that leaves a mess attracting mice
    French wine = good => overpriced imported crap
    French food = good (some)=> fattening, which is why they have to eat half size portions
    French cars?…ummm…er…2CV = good. Citroen = good => guess you missed rusted metal photos on that new DS5
    French car with lots of chrome = Outstanding => see above
    German anything = Great => VW yeay!
    Diesel = Bad = more expensive than gas in this country = fail

    I hate nobody with a vengeance, life’s too short for that. The reviewer is too young, that’s all.

  • avatar
    tankinbeans

    I cannot, in good conscience, hate anybody based on nationality since my family can very well be described as Heinz 57 with a little bit of this and a little bit of that. There’s definitely German, scandinavian, English, Irish, Scottish, Welsh, Czech, Polish and, supposedly French. I have nothing to prove that last point (my family doesn’t talk much about geneaology), but there it is.

    I found most of the review funny, if a bit overly ADD-look-a-squirrelish.

  • avatar
    icemilkcoffee

    People think, diesels are good, and hybrids are good…. diesel hybrids must be tits. Too bad that’s not how it works. A diesel engine is actually very efficient at idle due to the lack of throttling loss. A gas engine is inefficient at idle, hence it makes sense to stop it from idling, and use an electric motor to help it along every time you need to wake up from idle. A diesel engine also takes more energy to start because of higher compression. The electric motor’s strong suit is the instant low end torque. A perfect complement to the gas engine, which has little low end torque. Whereas the diesel engine is all about low end torque.

  • avatar
    geofcol

    Oh yea baby keep it coming. I loved reading this. I hope he reviews a Russian car next. If your feelings are hurt just get back to work and it will all be o.k.

  • avatar

    Gentlepersons: Everybody welcome Clemens Gleich, a new writer at TTAC, and a very seasoned writer in Europe. We are lucky to have him.

    I want you all to extend the same courtesy to Clemens that civilized people extend to all newcomers: Be welcoming, be friendly, and leave the billyclubs at home. Commenters who cannot adhere to these principles will be removed from the party and will not be invited back.

    I am sitting in a departure lounge at LAX and will be off-line for most of the day. Derek has authority to ban any commenter who does not adhere to this rule.

    B

    • 0 avatar
      dingram01

      Yes, I agree, Bertel. I know in my experience, I find it very hurtful when people aren’t nice to me when I walk into a room of strangers and shout “your Mama’s ugly!” I mean what is the world coming to?

    • 0 avatar
      tallnikita

      Lay off the crack, Bertel, the guy was begging for it.

    • 0 avatar
      seth1065

      Dear Mr. Dude,

      I am aware of the fact that people in the US are a bit more sensitive about political incorrectness, but I can assure you that in Europe we can take the mickey out of each other’s contries weaknesses again now the war is over for a while now (how time flies!). Only the Brits still love to bring up the war in their jokes (mostly about Germany and, well: France), but then, they are weird.

      Someone further down wanted more in-depth information about the car: You can, if interested, find a much longer version in which I even drive an old DS from 1967 on http://www.heise.de/autos (German).

      Thanks for getting involved. Writing would be boring without feedback of any kind.

      Best wishes,
      Clemens Gleich

      wanted to chime in on Van dude being kicked out but the page is no longer taking comments so here goes if the writer is pissed he does not seem to take offence here, so I say BS you over reacted, I have read all the comments and it is really not that big of a deal, If the Europeans piss on each other for fun fine with me, I mock the people in texas when I am down there so I guess all is fair in love and war, total over reaction by you sir, I sentence you to buying the last SAAB made before they went belly up.

  • avatar
    tmport

    I didn’t think the review was in bad taste. I can’t disagree about CdG. I’ve flown into and out of that airport numerous times, and I’ve blocked it out so effectively that I don’t even have a clear image of it. I do, however, recall taking the train once from the airport to Paris–scary.

    The car is pretty in a weird futuristic sort of way, especially the interior. But that gas mileage is pretty crummy, and the rust is unbelievable.

    *Just FYI, from Clemens’ website, it’s apparent that he is not the person in the photograph.

  • avatar
    Spike_in_Brisbane

    Doesn’t TTAC have a moderator anymore? I own a Citroen C5. I love it and I enjoyed the comments here about cars but boy, they were hard to find between all the drivel about nationalism and airports. I welcome our new contributor.

  • avatar
    mart_o_rama

    Isabelle Boulay is French Canadian, thus from a land that has never seen a Citroen in the flesh (except special case imported units). Just FYI. :-)

  • avatar
    Joss

    Bit of Napoleon through Brandenburg Gate goes… Vichy/Petain love-in. Churchill cigar stubs out french navy.
    Citroen review reads like blow-up that railway car.

  • avatar
    visualry

    I enjoyed this review… thought it was a nice balance of humor and car ks detail. Nothing to get worked up over folks :-)
    Hopefully with a euro-beat writer we will get to see more reviews (and skewers) on name plates that we don’t get to see here in the states. Keep ‘em coming.

  • avatar
    mazder3

    This is the best looking wine-bar-on-wheels I’ve ever seen! Too bad about the rust, though. Welcome aboard, Mr. Gleich. Can’t wait for the review of the DS3 Racing!

    Also, I don’t understand why the author didn’t just “copy->Google translate->edit for proper meaning->paste” the whole DS5 review from his site. It is quite humorous and well-written and didn’t mention the things that created the raised hackles here.

  • avatar
    newfdawg

    Just what I like, a totally unbiased review–so how’s everything in Stalingrad?

  • avatar
    LKre

    Perhaps TTAC should leave Russia alone for now as Jeremy Clarkson very recently “took care” of Moscow and russian cars in his usual fashion. Google it, great read.

  • avatar
    panzerfaust

    It looks like a Ford.

  • avatar
    wallstreet

    Welcome Clemens Gleich ! I enjoy it. This is refreshing.

  • avatar
    Buckshot

    I was looking forward to read this review with 73 comments. I was thinking that people must like this car. What i found was people arguing about ww2. If you can´t handle the OP without getting crazy, then GTFO.

  • avatar
    obruni

    and if you don’t like being called a bigot for making bigoted statements, you shouldn’t be writing such things…or threatening to censor users who call you out on it.

  • avatar
    campocaceres

    I would like to go on record as saying I welcome what I interpreted as tongue-in-cheek tone of this article. Light-hearted humor like this is childs play on the internet. Please do continue to write for this great site, and ruffle some feathers while you’re at it.

    As always, it’s nice to be able to read frank reviews about cars like these which we don’t get on this side of the pond. TTAC has continually grown to be more international each year, and I applaud that. Welcome!

    Also: save the kittens!

    • 0 avatar
      Mathias

      “Clemens Gleich is German writer and [..] covers topics from cars and motorcycles to nucular power [..]”

      It’s NU-CLE-AR.
      Say it with me: nuclear.

  • avatar
    NICOLAS_S

    I red this car review and was first shocked by the first 2 sentences.

    But it is only a way to highlight how the DS5 can be attractive or amazing even for someone who says to hate all what is relative to France or french.

    I bought a DS5 Hybrid and will receive it on Monday.

    In France 70% of car are sold with diesel engine.
    Clearly I like diesel engine -my other car is a BMW X5 e70 3.0 diesel.

    Consumption of a diesel car is very low and can provide high power (up to 381 HP with new M50d Bmw).

    When you compare a BMW 335i vs a 335d -306 HP each-, the 335d beats the 335i in performance. Consumption is 20 to 30% lower with the diesel. Of course external sound is less pleasant with a diesel, but as car as now so quiet, who cares.

    Why not an Hybrid diesel ? Toyato Prius is not very attractive in France because most of same categroy diesel car are reaching the same gas consumption.

    Audi is also going to launch a Diesel Hybrid. It may not be so stupid…. if they go on this way.

    • 0 avatar
      Qusus

      I think you’re mistaken. The 335i will noticeably outperform its diesel counterpart in nearly every performance measurement, save for maybe mid-range acceleration from 50-75.

    • 0 avatar
      28-cars-later

      I wish we could get some of those diesels here in the US. The 335D I think is offered but is well north of $50K US dollars. If Citroen could sneak in some French built turbodiesels and afford to price them competitively with their 4-cyl equilivelents, I think they’d have a winner.

  • avatar
    Ryoku75

    Weird, but oddly not that bad looking, at least its drivability is a step up from the 2CV.


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