By on May 3, 2013

003-2014-porsche-911-turbo

In exchange for the loss of the third pedal, we now get two variants of the Porsche 911 Turbo. A standard car with a 3.8L 520 horsepower flat-six and a Turbo S with 560 horsepower. Rear-wheel steering is also in place, much like the GT3, while active front and rear spoilers will give d-bags twice the aerodynamics to manually deploy while stuck in traffic.

 

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61 Comments on “End Of An Era: Porsche Debuts PDK Only 911 Turbo...”


  • avatar
    cargogh

    They still do a nice silver paint.

  • avatar
    NMGOM

    I could understand the removal of the manual from a track car like the GT3 (where every millisecond counts), but the Turbo? A street car? Why could not that wonderful 7-speed manual be listed at least as an option, especially after they made such a fuss about it last year and perfected it? This makes no sense.

    —————-

    • 0 avatar
      vaujot

      I think the reason may be fuel efficiency – PDK is more efficient than manual transmissions, at least in the official tests. And Porsche is feeling the pressure of fleet consumption regulations.

      Also, I don’t know if the 7 Speed manual you mention is designed to withstand the torque of the Turbo-engine.

    • 0 avatar
      juicy sushi

      The GT3 was always the track rat car, but also was the car which spoke to the purists. The Turbo was very much the street GT. And as a luxurious GT, I’d be the manual take rate on 997 Turbos was pretty low.

      I’ve also read criticisms that the new 7-speed manual isn’t as nice as the old 6-speeds, since it was developed for the PDK and then offered as a manual for the hard core. I could be wrong though…

      • 0 avatar
        945T

        That new 7-speed is sublime. Power everywhere when you need it.
        Anyway, to be honest I bemoaned the 991’s loss of a proper parking brake. Yes I know it has hill assist etc… But I want personal, mechanical control over my parking brake. That signifies that the 991 as great as it is, is not for me –
        Porsche is following the herd now.
        In regards to the 997 Turbo S cab I’ve driven, that car was just brutal. When it would do 100kph in first gear in a pedestrian smattering 3.6 seconds, well that clutch is a hinderence.

    • 0 avatar
      Nicholas Weaver

      Why should they bother? Anyone who really cares about performance will be buying the DSG/PDK. Anyone wants a car to just drive is probably going to buy the DSG/PDK.

      Thus the only ones buying the manual over the manumatic are us performance dinosaurs, who believe that the car is “more engaging” with a manual [1].

      Which anyone who can read sales figures realize is a dying breed of buyer. Since although such dinosaurs nash and wail about the dying of the manual transmission, we haven’t been buying the manuals.

      [1] Which says, to me, quit griping, save your money, and buy a Miata (or used S2000) as well as a separate spec Miata racecar and a crap ton of track time instead. Thats an engaging (and cheaper) ride. Any new Porsche won’t have half the engagement factor of a manual Miata or S2000.

      • 0 avatar
        LeeK

        Well said there, Nick.

      • 0 avatar
        jkross22

        It’s weird to read comments where people argue for less choice. Wow.

        • 0 avatar
          ellomdian

          Here here. Also, why don’t they offer a carbureted model? If I am not fussing with needles and jets, or at least setting a manual choke on cold days, I just am not INVOLVED in the driving experience…

          • 0 avatar
            blowfish

            a fnd says to start a carb version of Ferarri BB 512 was total fun, everything else can be put on mastercard but the experience is totally priceless!

            One needs to hand covered the carb intake and it can back fire, these fire tricks is not the same kind as circus soleil does at vegas.

        • 0 avatar
          Sigivald

          More accurately, he’s explaining *why* there’s less choice.

          Nobody. Was. Buying. Them.

          • 0 avatar
            Lorenzo

            Well, not “new”. Aficionados like to save on depreciation and apply the savings to repair bills. There was always a supply of Detroit enthusiast models because they could sell to military customers, E-3 and up, who would let them go for a song when transferred, but these are WAY out of their price (and insurance premium) range. The sons of our moneyed elites are letting us down.

      • 0 avatar
        fredtal

        I’m a few years away from replacing my manual A3 and hoping I can still find a manual box then.

        • 0 avatar
          Sam P

          You can still get a stick shift in any Honda sedan without a V6.

          I think you’ll be fine especially if you’re willing to look at BMW. Plenty of sticks over there, you just have to order one. You can even get a 335i with a stick *and* AWD.

          I’m shooting for buying a new F30 328i with a 6-speed in 2017ish to replace my E46 330i and taking factory delivery in Munich.

      • 0 avatar

        I tried to make this point in the previous thread, but perhaps it was too late. What are you going to do when the tide reaches MX-5? You think “never”, but are you sure?

        • 0 avatar
          DeadWeight

          The trend of doing away with true manual gearboxes, of the kind requiring a foot operated clutch, has never baffled me more than it does now given that “sports cars” with pedigrees such as the 911 are no longer immune to it.

          I’ve always “gotten it” when this trend relates to commuter boxes, since the take rate on manuals has been low and dropping further over time, but clutchless cars labeled as true “sports cars” … it just speaks more to the fact that the pool of buyers genuinely appreciative of the inherent superiority of a manual gearbox with manual stickshift and foot operated clutch is shrinking, versus verification of the claim that paddle operated gearboxes have now achieved the ability to offer the same or better tactile feedback and sensory stimulation.

          This makes me quite sad, and I didn’t even touch on the reliability and durability superiority of the “old fashioned” manual transmission.

          • 0 avatar
            Charliej

            Why is a manual transmission “inherently superior” to an automatic transmission? If the automatic transmission provides superior acceleration, fuel economy and driving ease, is it not the superior transmission? By the way, I personally prefer a manual transmission when driving. That does not mean that the manufacturer is obligated to provide one for each car they sell.

          • 0 avatar

            In the times of amazing reliability across the board, manufacturers somehow managed to undermine even the the final argument for the manuals. When I look at JK owners complaining, the reports of 6-speed manuals popping out of the gear balance reports of 42RLE autos overheating. Seems like the quality lapses at the transmission contractors override the inherent design advantages these days.

      • 0 avatar
        hubcap

        @Pete
        “What are you going to do when the tide reaches MX-5? You think “never”, but are you sure?”

        It is what is is. Until it’s not. I’ll take at as it comes and the way I see it, there will be plenty of manual transmission cars into the foreseeable future.

        @Charlie
        “Why is a manual transmission “inherently superior” to an automatic transmission?”

        I can’t speak for everyone but IMO people are referencing a feeling of being connected to the car. This happens, for some, to a much greater degree with a manual transmission.

        Why is that preference difficult for some people (not you) to understand? We all have what we like. For some its a manual, for others an automatic and for others a DCT.

        I’m not a big new car buyer and I prefer manuals. That means I’m part of the reason why new car manufacturers aren’t allowing buyers to check that box.

        Oh well, I’ll make do in the pre-owned market.

        I want to add something else. Porsche and other manufacturers offer numerous performance enhancing options such as dynamic engine mounts, adaptive suspensions, torque vectoring differentials etc.

        I wonder how many of these options are purchased by people looking for pure performance?

  • avatar
    Eggshen2013

    “while active front and rear spoilers will give d-bags twice the aerodynamics to manually deploy while stuck in traffic.”

    I wish I could afford to be a d-bag with twice the aerodynamics!

  • avatar
    CJinSD

    The Porsche 911 must have as many or more variations than cars that sell in 20 times the numbers, but there is a gaping hole in the lineup now for a pure driver’s car. They need something stripped like their old Club Sports, with manual 2-wheel steering and a manual transmission. Well, maybe they don’t need it, but some of us that used to love Porsches need it.

    • 0 avatar
      juicy sushi

      I think they would claim that there is a Cayman for that, or at least, will be soon.

    • 0 avatar
      Sigivald

      Would you buy one, new?

      I don’t mean “want to buy one”, I mean “actually go to a Porsche dealer and drive one home”?

      If not, well… they don’t believe you when you say they “need” that option.

      • 0 avatar
        Xeranar

        The cayman seems to be a quite a happy sports car that is making the boxster more or less irrelevant. If I was in the position to drop 50K on a sports car, yes. I feel most of the B&B are pretty much stingy bastards. It’s incredibly hard to judge any kind of take rates from these discussions.

        • 0 avatar
          hubcap

          @Xeranar
          “I feel most of the B&B are pretty much stingy bastards.”

          Maybe, but I’m more inclined to think they’d rather let somebody else eat the depreciation and they still get the same enjoyment from the car at a lesser price.

          Why spend money if you don’t need to?

          @Sigivald
          “Would you buy one, new?”

          Hell No.

  • avatar
    LeeK

    “will give d-bags twice the aerodynamics…”

    I know this is a tongue-in-cheek comment meant for amusement, but why does this subject always come up when discussing Porsche owners? The are ALL d-bags? Really? Those of us less financially fortunate will never, ever own one of these cars unless they are twenty years old or more. Does owning a Porsche because you have a few bucks to apply to more frivolous pursuits automatically make you a d-bag? Or does the brand attract more douchey personalities? Do d-bags not drive Hondas, Nissans, and Toyotas?

    The few people I’ve personally known who own Porsches (about four, that I can recall) have been pretty chill and not douchey at all. I get enthusiastic talking with them about the car itself because as an enthusiast, I get it. None of the four I’ve known have purchased the cars to prove how rich they are. They just want to drive an awesome performance vehicle and are blessed with the financial resources to do so.

    Or is this just a function of stereotyping between haves and have-nots?

    • 0 avatar
      Mykl

      I think this person is simply referencing the type of individual who purchases a badge because it’s a way to tell the world that they’re better than they are. Clearly there are *real* car enthusiasts who purchase these cars, but I’m going to bet that in your day to day meanderings you’re more likely to come across the type who purchased the car for image rather than for how it drove.

      • 0 avatar
        Synchromesh

        The real enthusiasts would’ve bought that manual that’s been discontinued. That leaves dbags.

        Imho, vast majority of German car owners are dbags. I’ve met very few exceptions through years.

        • 0 avatar
          Mykl

          I don’t really agree with any of that.

        • 0 avatar
          E46M3_333

          So, a dbag is anyone who earns more money than you?

        • 0 avatar
          LeeK

          “Imho, vast majority of German car owners are dbags”

          Does that include Volkswagens? d-bag Beetle drivers?

        • 0 avatar
          JD23

          Since people keep throwing around the term “douchebag,” it would be instructive for someone to provide a precise definition. I’m thinking it’s something along the lines of a person one dislikes, but also secretly envies.

          • 0 avatar
            azmtbkr81

            I’ll take a shot. Douche-bags are boorish, flashy, self-serving, generally male louts who are often but not always nouveau riche. Donald Trump and the characters from Jersey Shore are prime examples.

            These days anyone driving a coupe like the 911 likely falls under the enthusiast category; true douche-bags much prefer luxury CUVs or in some cases lifted pickup trucks with large wheels and low profile tires.

    • 0 avatar
      Type57SC

      I think the D-bag comment is about extending the spoiler in traffic so at slow speeds just like a peacock. If your friends bought their 911’s, they probably don’t do this move.

      • 0 avatar
        LeeK

        One of the four friends I mentioned was a physicist and a professor at the University of Chicago. He was a life-long BMW owner, but always had a desire for a 911. Two years ago he was diagnosed with cancer and realized that his time on the earth was limited. After checking with his grown daughters (who would inherit his earthly possessions and investment portfolio — he was divorced from their biological mother and didn’t remarry), he decided to go for it and got a 911 Turbo Cabriolet. He enjoyed the heck out of it when the brutal Chicago winter weather subsided. Alas, he passed away a few month later, but he was happy that he finally got to achieve his dream, even for just a short while.

        Not a douchey bone in is body, either. A genuinely nice guy.

        • 0 avatar
          sllloyd

          Don’t go ruining a perfectly good stereotype LeeK!

        • 0 avatar
          wumpus

          With a total ownership time of a few months, he didn’t significantly change the data. Presumably as a long-term BMW owner, he is one of the reasons that top gear assures us that the previous d-bag preferred car (BMW) has been replaced with an Audi. Also we need before and after evidence from the daughters on whether buying or owning such a car converts one to a dbag.

          If you inherited a turbo porsche (or any other car as part of an estate that would hit the estate tax hard) are there ways to let the estate take the depreciation hit? I was guessing that leasing from the estate might work, but you would have to either prove that your lease rates were fair (while still being less than depreciation) or pay taxes multiple times before you got the lease money back. Perhaps just delay taking the car? Best&brightest chatter implies that any warranty (if existing and transferable) would be worth more than dodging a depreciation bullet.

    • 0 avatar

      “Those of us less financially fortunate will never, ever own one of these cars”

      Keep dreaming

    • 0 avatar
      Nick

      ‘why does this subject always come up when discussing Porsche owners?’

      Toronto

  • avatar
    iganpo

    My take on the the third pedal and stickshift advantages:
    – Prevents falling asleep in stop and go traffic
    – Warns pedestrians in parking lot. If you modulate the throttle gently, you can rev the engine just loud enough to make an audible impression but without seeming deliberate and obnoxious
    – More engaging to drive, more skills to perfect while on normal roads.

    Yeah, if I had the means for a Porsche I’d want it to be stickshift. But sadly that’s just me (and a handful of dinosaurs).

    • 0 avatar
      SunnyvaleCA

      I think there is a marketing & perception advantage, too. With the outgoing turbo people could claim that the car is an enthusiast car because of the stick even if 95% opt for the auto. There was benefit to offering a stick even if just about nobody bought them.

      Have people tried the GTS model. It’s no turbo, but it is a very engaging car to drive. Come to think of it, putting the GTS engine into a Cayman and Boxter would make a lot of people very happy.

      • 0 avatar
        tedward

        ” There was benefit to offering a stick even if just about nobody bought them.”

        I agree, but I think they also took a huge whipping in the press because the old turbo wasn’t as fast as much cheaper cars running dual clutch transmissions. Personally I can see why the turbo is going automatic only, especially with the potential engineering costs of developing a manual that can handle that powerband. The GT3 on the other hand…with that car I’d agree with you 100%. There’s no excuse for changing the transmission in that car, especially since as a manual only offering until now they are essentially abandoning all of their current buyers for that model. No one who buys a GT3 doesn’t already prefer a manual purists car over the available, more powerful, Turbo model. Those who actually race their cars have always had the option of a sequential gearbox Cup car as well.

        The Turbos have been, in my opinion, the non-enthusiast premium car for some time now from Porsche, only eclipsed by any AWD 911 in terms of appealing to the image conscious. Dropping the manual here just kind of makes me shrug.

  • avatar
    Mykl

    Sad day, but to be honest I wouldn’t mind a well sorted flappy-paddle box. The last time I did a mountain tour I realized that I didn’t need to row my own to maximize enjoyment as long as the gearbox was always in the gear I selected.

    The place I would miss it most is in day to day driving, rowing through the gears and feeling the mechanical parts at work is somewhat theraputic.

  • avatar

    I wonder why the S comes out at the same time this time. SS later?

    • 0 avatar
      wumpus

      Mercedes used to make ss cars, neither they nor BMW, Audi or Porsche seem to do any more.

      I’m pretty sure the “s” stands for sport, but I like to think it stands for schnell.

  • avatar
    Type57SC

    there’s something very Cayman-y about this look.

    Also the little kink at the top of the A pillar looks like bad execution in this light color.

  • avatar
    Kyree S. Williams

    What’s amazing to me is just how timeless the 911’s styling is. The majority of cars—including models from Porsche’s sister brands Volkswagen and Audi—have to have all sorts of creases and/or swoops to look remotely modern. It’s a beautiful machine…

  • avatar
    mkirk

    You guys are like all of us 4×4 types that bitch and moan about the demise of the solid front axle. Had we purchased them, they’d still make them. Now you gotta be like us…grab your tools and buy used. Admittedly this is likely a dicier proposition than buying an old K5 Blazer or something though.

    • 0 avatar
      fredtal

      You are right, and I still have my Lotus Elan for manual joy. Still I’d like my daily driver to be fun and for me that means a manual. Not that a 500+hp Porsche PDK wouldn’t be fun.

  • avatar
    Charliej

    I owned a Porsche, twenty five years ago. It had a manual transmission. I don”t think that I was, or am a douchbag. I and all my friends that owned Porsches bought them used. None of us could afford a new Porsche, but we enjoyed our used ones very much. Those who could not fix their own cars, did not enjoy them as much as the rest of us.

  • avatar
    Jacob

    Didn’t we have this discussion last week? Anyways, doesn’t Porsche offer plenty of cars with manual transmissions? There is the 991 Carrera, Boxster, and Cayman. I can see why the used PDX on the 911 Turbo. It’s a halo car that very few will drive, but many will talk about. PDX gives it the best lap and 0-60 times, so that gives bragging rights to Porsche when it comes to comparing its capabilities with cars like Nissan GTR, Lambos, etc.

  • avatar
    Syke

    And there’s always all those used Porsches out there – which is all the more many of us who can appreciate the marque will ever be able to afford. We’re also the crowd that keeping the ‘never quite collectible’ (924/944/968/928) models alive, running, and annoying the 911 purists.

  • avatar
    mikey

    I don’t see a problem. Porche is like every other car company out there. They need to comprimise,and make something for all drivers.

    If the people that are looking at a Porche 911 Turbo,are satified with the automatic,so be it.

    I believe its an M.P.G thing. The GM 6 speed forces me to shift from first, to fourth,under certain RPM/MPH conditions. I don’t like it,and it took some getting used to.

    Fact is, its all part of the evolution of the modern automobile. Get used to it.

    • 0 avatar
      hubcap

      @mikey

      “The GM 6 speed forces me to shift from first, to fourth,under certain RPM/MPH conditions. I don’t like it,and it took some getting used to.”

      I think that’s defeatable.

  • avatar
    mikey

    @hubcap….Yes it is, two taps on the traction control. You lose traction control,and stability control….I think. I believe it lowers your rev limiter also?

    To be quite honest, the car still frightens me a bit. I kinda like the traction/stability control. I will never come close to the rev limiter.

    • 0 avatar
      bumpy ii

      There are gadgets you can buy to bypass that silly lockout thing.

      Just one example: http://www.phastekperformance.com/2010-Camaro-Skip-Shift-Elimator-Harness-manual-LS3-p/ph-camaro-skipshift-eliminator.htm

  • avatar
    bumpy ii

    Apropos of nothing in particular, I saw a Porsche 911 today. I knew that’s what it was because it said “Porsche 911″ on the rear. Failboatage.

  • avatar
    Stumpaster

    Huh? What? Ah, no stick, wow! How about the rest of the car? Heading over to CD to read about it.

  • avatar

    I need Porsche to make this car in a manual so that in 15 years I can by a low mileage example from said d-bag that put only 20K miles on it.

    That’s why it needs to be a manual, because I want one.

    That way that I can reward conspicuous consumption by taking advantage of the depreciation for my own financial and materialistic gain.

    Gosh, is that so hard.

  • avatar
    dabradler

    Who gives a crap about the transmission, did you see the video of those freaking LED headlights on the Turbo S?! so incredibly sci-fi, worth the 200k right there.(no jokes.)


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