By on February 4, 2016

2016 Mazda CX-3 GT (18 of 25)

Ben writes:

Hi Bark,

I am currently in my second year of a 3 1/2 year lease on a 2015 Mazda3 GT — which is probably the most engaging, convenient and efficient vehicle I’ve ever owned. Everything
they say about Mazda nailing the driving dynamics is spot on.

I wasn’t married prior to leasing the vehicle, nor did I have my first child, nor was I expecting another child 14 months after having my first (almost Irish twins). I drove less, hated my job more and didn’t understand the joy a family can bring you. Now I have a 100+ mile total commute daily that I don’t even notice because of my quality of life, job and quite possibly my vehicle.

Yet, I feel the urge to make a vehicle change for 3 reasons:

  1. I am going to be way over the lease mileage soon. I’ll only be about two grand upside down if I get out now.
  2. I’m getting older. The dynamics of the Mazda3 are incredible, but the wheels might be a little big, the suspension a little hard, and — with an 85+ db level at 77 mph — it’s not quite the serene space I’d like.
  3. Having 100-percent more child in five months means I need all the cash I can get. Getting less car could mean saving more.

Do I ride my lease out and swallow the pill at the end? Do I get into $12,000 commuter that I could own for $250/month in three to four years? Is there a $14,000 car that is soft, quiet and comfortable I should consider that I would likely keep longer than a commuter box? Or …

Yikes, talk about a lot of variables, Ben! Let’s try to address each one individually, then find a final recommendation.

First of all, you’re not entirely clear on what “way over the lease mileage” actually means in numbers. The roughly $2,000 that you’re upside down right now will only buy you 8,000-13,000 miles at the end of your lease, depending on the rate for your mileage overage charges. Considering that you’re driving about 100 miles a day, that’s about 25,000 miles a year of commuting alone, not to mention any rad trips you’ll be taking in the next year-and-a-half. HAHAHA RAD TRIPS JUST KIDDING YOU’LL BE STUCK CHANGING DIAPERS AT HOME. Sorry, I had to get that out of my system. Trust me, as a parent of two kiddos, I know the hell joy you’re about to experience.

Anyway, if you have a 12,000 mile lease, that means you’re going to be at least 18,000 miles over at the end, assuming you’re not already pacing over your allowed mileage. Plus, there’s always the off chance that you’ll have some sort of damage to the car between now and then (like, oh, I don’t know, two small children spilling things all over the interior), so you might have some additional fees tacked on at the end. In short, keeping the Mazda for the lease duration only makes sense if you like writing very large checks for things that you no longer get to use.

Secondly, I don’t wanna hear any bullshit about “getting older” and suspensions being a “little hard.” I’m 38, and I daily drive a Fiesta ST. Remove the sand from your nether regions and suck it up, Francis. Oh, and while you’re at it, check out The BarkCast on your next long drive!

Thirdly, having two kids isn’t 100-percent more expensive than having one kid. You’ve already got a lot of the clothes, toys, cribs, and whatnot from your first kid. The second kid slides right in, financially speaking. However, the actual parenting of two kids isn’t twice as hard. It’s at least six times as hard. You’ll get no fucking sleep for the next 24-36 months, and maybe beyond. Accept that.

So, considering all that, and making a few assumptions about the usage of this car, such as how often the kids will be riding along (sounds like a fair amount), I’m going to give you a couple of options.

Option #1: Drive to the Mazda dealer and beg them to help you out of your lease and put you in a new Mazda.

You’d be surprised how desperately Mazda dealers want (and need) to sell new cars nowadays. This could drastically help you eliminate some of that negative equity that you’ve got in your current 3. You could buy a CX-3 Sport FWD at sticker for around $350/month with Mazda’s current promo of 1.9% over 60 months — not as tricked out as your 3 GT, but still a nice car. Yes, this is beyond your budget, but you’d be avoiding having to roll negative equity into a new loan if the dealer is willing to swallow that $2,000 pill. Mazda also offers “pull-ahead” leases with some regularity, but another 12,000-15,000 mile a year lease isn’t going to help your situation, so avoid that temptation.

Option #2: Sell the 3 to somebody who isn’t a desperate Mazda dealer, accept their punitive lease termination conditions, and go spend $12,000-14,000 on a used car that meets the needs of your growing family.

This isn’t a sexy pick (Ask Bark is alllllll about keeping things sexy) and there’s every chance that you’ll end up truly resenting it. But, it might be the most practical thing that you can do, as least in the short term. I’m not gonna lie, though — there’s not a whole lot in your price range that’s gonna light you on fire in the same way as your 3. You’re either looking at a higher-mileage late model car that probably cost less than your 3 did new, with little to no remaining warranty, or a lower-mileage, early model car that also has no warranty and cost less than your 3 did new. Since your growing family is already assured to hit you with unexpected expenses, I chose to look at late model, certified pre-owned (CPO) cars to ensure that you’ll be covered in case something catastrophic happens. Also, captive finance companies often have good financing specials on CPO inventory.

How about this 2013 Hyundai Sonata GLS? Certified, one owner, lease return car. Spacious enough for the family, a few bells and whistles, and a low, low 2.49% HMFC finance option.

If you wanna keep things feeling Hiroshima-ish, this certified 2012 Mazda 6 looks like an attractive option, and has many of the things you like about your 3, in a bigger, cheaper package.

This 2012 Honda Accord could be a decent option, too. I’m not in love with the fact it’s had three owners in three years, but it is likely going to be the cheapest Accord you can find (and we know how the B&B just loves Accords!).

Basically, you’ll have your choice of three- to four-year-old certified midsize sedans in this price range. There’s nothing wrong with that. You’ll get good reliability and gas mileage, and a quieter, comfier ride.

But … before you go down that road, head to your local Mazda dealer and take a crack at Option #1, and do it at the end of March — if you can hold out that long. Tax season will be drying up a bit, and the manufacturer will likely have some end-of-quarter incentives that the dealer will be desperately trying to hit. A $2,000 bill is nothing to them if they’re looking at a five- or six-figure bonus.


Best & Brightest, you have spoken with one voice and TTAC has heard you loud and clear. Whether it’s because you love my brilliant insights into the automotive world, or because you love telling me what an idiot I am, or even because you like suggesting Siennas to people who want a track car, you have clicked and commented enough on recent Ask Bark entries that I will be answering doubly as often! That’s right, you’ll get two of these Ask Bark articles per week from now on.

But this can only happen if you, the readers of this fine website, continue to send your questions to me via email at [email protected]. I’m happy to continue answering all of your concerns about what car to buy and how to buy it, but I’m also great at questions such as “What should we name our child?” (Easy: Bark!) 0r “What’s the worst collegiate major for future job prospects?” (Jazz Saxophone Performance — ask me how I know!). So keep on keepin’ on with your questions, people.

Get the latest TTAC e-Newsletter!

Recommended

137 Comments on “Ask Bark: Growing a Family While Trying To Shrink Bills...”


  • avatar
    mike978

    I would suggest a CX5 as the CX3 may be too small.
    One question – could he just buy out the 3 he has since that is practical enough for him.

    • 0 avatar
      30-mile fetch

      That’s exactly what I was thinking.

      • 0 avatar
        Der_Kommissar

        I have the 3s Touring, and two kids (but only one in a rear facing car seat), and choose the 3 over the CX-3 because, believe it or not, the CX-3 has less space in both the rear seat and the trunk. The CX-5 is great, but has less power then the 3 without kicking it hard in sport mode, during which the engine sounds like its about to asplode at any time. Tough call. Honestly? Get a Mazda 6 sport with the MT if you can drive it.

        • 0 avatar
          mike978

          The Cx5 has both 2.0 and 2.5 litre engines like the 3. So it is as powerful, and only a bit heavier.

          The other thing to bear on mind is there going to be kid #3 in 14 months??

          • 0 avatar
            Der_Kommissar

            If you’ve driven both (not just read the specs) you would agree that the CX-5 with the 2.5 feels slower than the Mazda 3s (with the 2.5). The CX-5 is a good bit heavier. You really need sport mode on to get a similar feeling, and sport mode really thrashes the engine due to the changes in shift points.

          • 0 avatar
            mike978

            I agree the CX5 is not as fast as the 3. Never disagreed, but 184hp is hardly unpowered compared to other CUVs. Would be a bit of a step down from the 3 speed wise but not necessarily handling wise. Read Jacks review of the CX5 when it came out with just the 2.0 engine.

    • 0 avatar
      JohnTaurus_3.0_AX4N

      He admits it is pratical, but the noise, sport (ie harsh) suspension are things he wants to leave behind.

    • 0 avatar
      AlfaRomasochist

      Either way if it’s a Mazda lease – which is through Chase – he can either go online to get his current buyout number or call Mazda leasing for the same data. If he asks nicely they’ll give him the dealer buyout (which doesn’t include the individual sales tax) and the individual buyout (which does).

      He can do that today. Then compare that number with the trade-in / private sale value of the car and make a decision.

      We recently did that with a Mazda lease with 12 months remaining and actually ended up with money in our pocket, though we were still within the target mileage. There was no “early termination” fee or anything of the sort.

    • 0 avatar
      zoomzoomfan

      For what it’s worth, I recently traded my 2008 Mazda3 hatchback for a 2016 Mazda6 as my wife and I are trying to have a baby. The 6 has plenty of room for car seats (cars.com actually does a Car Seat Fit Test in which the 6 scores well). My wife has a CX-5 we bought new in late 2012. I’d go for a 2014+ Mazda6 (the Sport models have 17-inch wheels and are quieter) or a CX-5.

  • avatar
    johnhowington

    mom needs a minivan, and you need to get your priorities straight and stop thinking about the car you drive everyday. think about your children’s future instead.

    • 0 avatar
      bludragon

      Two kids fit perfectly fine in a Mazda3.

      • 0 avatar
        jkross22

        If they are old enough to not need car seats, that is true, but backward facing car seats are really big.

        • 0 avatar
          bludragon

          You just made me realize we are missing a data point, and that is if there is another car in the household and what that is?

          2 rear facing car seats have worked just fine for us in a 2008 civic. Granted, I am not that tall (5’10 and more in the torso than legs), but generally what you can do is put one kid front facing behind the driver, with the rear facing kid behind the passenger seat.

          14 months apart is kind of young to do that, but you still have the option of a smaller infant carrier behind the driver, while the older kid is in a rear facing convertible behind the passenger seat… By the time the infant outgrows the carrier, the older kid should be big enough to go front facing behind the driver.

      • 0 avatar
        duffman13

        Not in a rear-facer that’s not an infant carrier they don’t.

        Source: Have a Mazda 3 and an 11 month old. I can fit the infant carrier without much impact to front seat space, but no way am I fitting his big boy car seat.

    • 0 avatar
      PrincipalDan

      Ohhhhhhhhh that will go over SO well…

      Then again she did consent to being knocked up boom boom with Catholic Twins as this old Midwestern Catholic boy often heard in his youth.

    • 0 avatar
      30-mile fetch

      Man writes in with car related question. Genius internet commenter assumes said question is the totality of the man’s concerns, priorities, and efforts and f^cks up by giving a rude condescending answer.

      Just another day on the internet.

      • 0 avatar
        Kyree S. Williams

        In all seriousness, the best antidote really is to outright ignore people who behave like that, instead of engaging with them by giving them the responses they crave. You’ll notice these people are rarely part of the regular B&B, too, so if you ignore them, they’ll likely move on and go torment Jalopnik.

      • 0 avatar
        johnhowington

        dont take it personal “30-mile fetch”, i just call “first world problems” when i see them.

        • 0 avatar
          JohnTaurus_3.0_AX4N

          So, who pissed in your corn flakes? Can I be next?

          Your smug attitude does not hide your ignorance. Why are you even on a car site? Your comment is strong evidence that you clearly dont “get,” the mind of a true car guy (or gal).

          It seems all youre here for is to prove how smart and witty you are. Too bad it backfired, big time. You just showed us all exactly what you are. Next time, just take a picture of your rear end in the mirror and post it as a responce, then you wont have to type a single word.

          That is all.

          • 0 avatar
            johnhowington

            JohnTaurus_3.0_AX4N, I’ll just call you Ace for simplicity. Ace, this forum as you call it is really just a bunch of car salesmen, and always has been. In fact that is what automotive journalists are at their core: salesmen. So with that in mind try not to get so upset about my contra opinions, being a father of 3 I know what the original writer is going through when it comes to several mid life crises. Enjoy life friend, and my (to you) smug opinions.

    • 0 avatar
      Der_Kommissar

      That’s exactly what we did with the second kid- get mom an Odyssey EX and myself a Mazda 3.

    • 0 avatar
      SP

      Rainbow kitty, your words are true.

      But it seems like you aren’t enjoying talking about car buying advice.

      Might you be happier if you stopped clicking on columns fully dedicated to car buying advice?

      Then you could spend more time thinking about your own family’s future.

      • 0 avatar
        johnhowington

        SP, compliments on the easy name to address. Thank you for the concern on my happiness, refer to the part of my previous post that mentions enjoying my contra opinions. bask in them, wallow in them, live with them, or stop posting.

  • avatar
    bludragon

    The first thing I would do is the math on buying the car at the end of the lease…
    Then, perhaps look for a used set of 16in mazda3 wheels on CL

    • 0 avatar
      bball40dtw

      I like this idea. Buy it out at the end of the lease and drive it into the ground. It’ll be fine as the non-primary family car.

    • 0 avatar

      I didn’t suggest this for one reason—Ben is obviously tired of driving this car.

      • 0 avatar
        bball40dtw

        Then he needs a 2012 Ford Fusion. Should have no problem getting a clean one with under 40K miles that is priced under $13K.

        Try to sell the Mazda3 or just take the hit.

        • 0 avatar
          tonycd

          Good God, bball, you’re positively stalking me. I just put my sister across the country in EXACTLY THIS CAR a couple months ago. Priorities were reliability, price, comfy on the highway, rear seat room. She and her husband love it.

          • 0 avatar
            bball40dtw

            Don’t look behind you…

          • 0 avatar
            stevelovescars

            Similarly, a good friend needed a car quickly a few months ago (her old Pacifica had sudden and expensive transmission issues, I’m sure you’re shocked).

            Her priorities were some flash, reliability, all wheel drive, and a sunroof. Ended up finding a CPO Lincoln 2012 MKZ with 24k miles on it for $18k. Basically it’s a loaded Fusion with air conditioned seats, AWD, and chrome wheels. She loves it and I have to admit it’s pretty pleasant to live with though I always overlooked them as, well, flashier Fusions. As used cars, though, the price premium for the brand and extra options seems to have been wiped out.

          • 0 avatar
            bball40dtw

            stevelovescars knows!

            My parents drive a very similar 2012 MKZ. They were going to buy a new car until I had them good look at the Lincoln dealership my wife and I bought our MkT from.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            This recommendation has been Church canon for some time.

        • 0 avatar
          Kyree S. Williams

          That’s a great suggestion. The 2010-2012 Fusion is an excellent car that’s overlooked because it’s not as flashy or fancy as Ford’s newest offerings. And Ben might even be able to get the newest one. You could probably get a late-model SE with some options. for around $14K or so, with reasonable shape. Both of those cars are comfortable, with reasonably-lively handling.

          • 0 avatar
            bball40dtw

            The depreciation on the 10-12 Fusion could be Ben’s friend. I think the Camry and Accord are fine midsizers for the general public, but a similar year Fusion should be much cheaper.

          • 0 avatar
            Kyree S. Williams

            I don’t even like the ’08-’12 Accord. The design didn’t age well, and something about the aggressive lumbar on the driver’s seat really hurts my back. I don’t really care for the Camry from then, either.

            Really, a Fusion would be my top pick for a sedan from that era, followed by the ’08-’12 Malibu. Those were both very competent Detroit choices.

          • 0 avatar
            bball40dtw

            You are right about the Malibu. It’s a good car that no one cared about. It isn’t flashy, but it is acceptable transportation.

            (The 10-12 Fusion and MKZ are still my go to used vehicles)

        • 0 avatar
          JohnTaurus_3.0_AX4N

          I was really wondering why a freakin’ Hyundai made the list, but one of the best midsizers out there didnt. A 2012 or older Fusion, or a 2013+ with the 2.5L (to avoid possible EcoBoost trouble later on), would be just about perfect, assuming he likes it himself. Although, every Fusion owner Ive talked to say they love theirs, I remember one guy in a first gen said he traded in his 5th Camry for his SEL V-6, and said he’d already kept it twice as long/twice the mileage as any Camry peviously with no plans to get rid of it- honestly all I said was “how do you like the car” and he went on for quite a while lol.

      • 0 avatar
        bludragon

        “I didn’t suggest this for one reason—Ben is obviously tired of driving this car.”

        Yes, unfortunately that is at odds with the OMG we’re having a (2nd) baby and need to save money panic…

    • 0 avatar
      qfrog

      Yep, taller tires oriented more towards grand touring use along with smaller wheels will help quiet the car and soften the ride.

    • 0 avatar
      White Shadow

      Does it ever make sense to purchase your leased car? I never lease, so I don’t really know. It just seems like it would cost more to buy the car you just leased for three years than it would have if you just purchased it in the first place.

      • 0 avatar
        bball40dtw

        It does in some cases. I leased a VW and bought out the lease because the total payments on the lease + buyout loan ended up being cheaper than the payments on a 60/72 month loan. It usually only happens if there is a bunch of cash on the lease and not on a buy.

      • 0 avatar
        rocketrodeo

        My experience with this is old, but positive. I leased a 1987 Acura Integra for 48 months with a 15K/yr allowance. I put almost 35K on it the first year alone, so I knew that this wouldn’t end well if I turned it in at the end of the lease. Since Acuras were an unknown quantity at the beginning of the lease they apparently underestimated the residual and I was able to purchase it for considerably less than its book value at the end of four years. As folks have pointed out, a lease is just a purchase with a big final payment.

  • avatar
    carlisimo

    Why are we talking about the CX-3? I have a 2016 Mazda3 and a one-month old, and the back seat is just deep enough for rear-facing seats; the CX-3’s rear seats are smaller and probably unacceptable until the kids are old enough to be front-facing.

    Buy a used Miata and use it to commute, keeping the Mazda3 for family duties. It will make the Mazda3 feel like a very plush, quiet car with overly damped, slow-to-respond controls and a cushy ride. (That’s how I feel as a Miata owner who bought a Mazda3s GT.) Okay no, that’s terrible advice. Unfortunately, the Mazda6 isn’t terribly quiet either, though it is spacious enough. Used Fusion? They seem to have good dynamics along with some quietness and softness. You only give up reliability. Same with used VWs. Used Grand Caravan? They’re lousy, but they’re so lousy that they’re an incredible value on the used market.

  • avatar
    ldl20

    Be careful with Option #2. If you take the hit and terminate the lease–fine, it’s your money. But if you try and swap or transfer the lease to someone else, read the fine print in the contract. You may still end up as the lease holder even after a swap (Volkswagen, for example, does this). So, if the new owner takes out a church group while drunk-driving through town, you’re done!

    Instead of terminating the lease on my 2012 Jetta SEL, I bought it outright (took a 1400 hit), got the title in my name, then sold it to an interested buyer who waited while I did the paperwork.

    • 0 avatar
      Land Ark

      Good advice. I looked into taking over my mom’s lease and it was so complicated and cumbersome that we scrapped the idea. I can’t imagine trying to jump through those hoops with someone you don’t know on the other end.

  • avatar
    DeadWeight

    Get something as inexpensive as you can, because health care premiums and costs will rise at twice their annual pre-decade rates between 2016 and 2026.

    “When the legislation that became known as “Obamacare” was first drafted, the key legislator was the Democratic Chairman of the Senate Finance Committee, Max Baucus, whose committee took the lead in drafting the legislation. As Baucus himself repeatedly boasted, the architect of that legislation was Elizabeth Folwer, his chief health policy counsel; indeed, as Marcy Wheeler discovered, it was Fowler who actually drafted it. As Politico put it at the time: “If you drew an organizational chart of major players in the Senate health care negotiations, Fowler would be the chief operating officer.”

    What was most amazing about all of that was that, before joining Baucus’ office as the point person for the health care bill, Fowler was the Vice President for Public Policy and External Affairs (i.e. informal lobbying) at WellPoint, the nation’s largest health insurance provider (before going to WellPoint, as well as after, Fowler had worked as Baucus’ top health care aide). And when that health care bill was drafted, the person whom Fowler replaced as chief health counsel in Baucus’ office, Michelle Easton, was lobbying for WellPoint as a principal at Tarplin, Downs, and Young.

    Whatever one’s views on Obamacare were and are: the bill’s mandate that everyone purchase the products of the private health insurance industry, unaccompanied by any public alternative, was a huge gift to that industry; as Wheeler wrote at the time: “to the extent that Liz Fowler is the author of this document, we might as well consider WellPoint its author as well.” Watch the five-minute Bill Moyers report from 2009, embedded below, on the key role played in all of this by Liz Fowler and the “revolving door” between the health insurance/lobbying industry and government officials at the time this bill was written and passed…”

    Read the entire Glenn Greenwald expose here –

    Obamacare architect leaves White House for pharmaceutical industry job

    http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/dec/05/obamacare-fowler-lobbyist-industry1

  • avatar
    lastwgn

    Been there, done that. Leased an ’07 Mazda6 when I was in deep with three kids in Catholic schools, two of them in high school. The beauty of the typical Mazda lease, if you look carefully at all the fine print, is that the lease payments plus residual value purchase price at lease end is very, very close to sticker price for the car. In the case of my 6, it was about $1,000 below sticker. I leased the car with the full intention of purchasing it at lease end for the approximately $12,500 residual. What that meant was that during the lease term I had full warranty and a responsible monthly payment. At the end of the lease, rather than haggle over things such as miles (which I knew I would be over) and condition (which I knew I would maintain as impecable as possible), I simply bought the car as I would any other used car. The big difference is I knew everything about the cars history.

    Find the Mazda you think will work for the next 5 years, lease it and firmly plan to buy it at lease end. With two children and a long commute each day, your best answer in my opinion is the current 6. Plenty of room in the backseat, where there is none in the CX-3. Serene cabin for the commute. Best lease deals avaialable from Mazda and excellent gas mileage to also keep costs low.

    • 0 avatar
      Kyree S. Williams

      In fairness, the new 6 is spirited, but it’s kind of harsh and noisy (probably less so if you don’t opt for the ridiculous 19″ wheels on the Grand Touring trim), so I think a thorough test-drive is in order.

      Failing that, the Accord (especially the Sport), and the Fusion offer most of the 6’s handling with more comfort and sound-insulation. Ford might start offering good lease deals on ’16 Fusions as the facelifted ’17 units hit the lots in a few months. And the Fusion might have the allegedly-better SYNC3 system…so bonus.

  • avatar
    SlowMyke

    Not sure on the overall reliability, but perhaps a cmax hybrid? The mileage will be pretty good (not the best for hybrids, I suppose) and you can have 2013 and 2014 cpo models with less than 30,000 miles for around $17k. I know for warranties the batteries ford 80,000 miles, so that ought to get you through the next few years pretty worry free.

    • 0 avatar
      bball40dtw

      Hybrid system is warrantied for 8 years or 100K miles. That’s a good suggestion, I like mine.

    • 0 avatar
      Kyree S. Williams

      The C-Max is incredibly easy to load cargo in and out of, is easy to see out of, and is quite comfortable. IIRC, it’s on the same platform as the Escape and Focus.

      I still lament Ford’s decision not to bring us the Grand C-Max, but maybe they heard the death knell of the Mazda5 and decided not to sell it with a sliding door (even though there’s now a passenger-oriented Transit Connect)

      • 0 avatar
        bball40dtw

        It’s on the same platform. It shares most of it’s interior with the Escape and it’s drivetrain with e the Fusion Hybrid. For me, it’s been the perfect city/suburban car. I would prefer driving a midsized sedan 100+ miles everyday, but for my commute, the C-max is just about perfect.

        And, as you said, YOU CAN SEE OUT OF IT!

        • 0 avatar
          This Is Dawg

          This reminded me of the love some of the B&B spout for the Flex. How does visibility in the C Max compare to the Flex? I have to say, I’m pretty surprised the cheapest CPO Flex I could find was still $25k.

          • 0 avatar
            PrincipalDan

            @This Is Dawg… The Flex paradox, no one is buying them new (not enough to make Ford happy) but used they are a hot commodity.

            Most unpopular new cars end up depreciating like crazy but the Flex is the exception to the rule.

          • 0 avatar
            bball40dtw

            C-Max visibility > Flex visibility

            That being said, the Flex is easy to see out off. However, like Dan said, finding a used example that you want is difficult. This is why I purchased an MkT. A couple years ago I paid $23K for a CPO MkT with the 3.5TT. It had under 50K miles when we bought it. It also has a bumper to bumper warranty that doesn’t expire until next June.

          • 0 avatar
            JimZ

            the Flex is a good example of why automakers are loathe to make niche vehicles. They know that the people who want these kinds of cars are also the kind of people who refuse to buy brand new cars. And the automakers aren’t in the business of selling used cars.

      • 0 avatar
        JimZ

        I think the industry has realized that in the shrinking minivan market, only three companies can hope to sell them in any volume. everyone else might as well not bother.

        • 0 avatar
          bball40dtw

          I would have bought a Grand C-Max or a gas powered C-Max, but I bought a C-Max anyway. I ordered it the first day ordering was open. However, I realize that I am weird.

          • 0 avatar
            JohnTaurus_3.0_AX4N

            The C-Max would be the new Ford car/crossover Id buy most likely. I love the design, it looks great and is pratical. Id go all-in for an Energi, but if a non-Hybrid version (with a manual and a diesel!!! No im not in the “brown station wagon” club, I promise) were offered, itd be my choice.

            Actually, what Id REALLY love is a B-Max with a 1.0L EcoBoost and 6mt. I love it, or at least what I see/read about the B as I cant exactly pop over to jolly old England for a bloody test drive, along with some tea and crumpets (while im there lol).

          • 0 avatar
            bball40dtw

            The C-Max is the best car that I have ever owned. It’s a bit boring (in comparison to the Focus ST and GTI I had previously), but it is so good at being an urban/suburban runabout for a small family.

          • 0 avatar
            RobertRyan

            @Bball,
            Ford is having massive problems here, selling any Euro based Sedans/Crossovers. Even the Transit is not selking

          • 0 avatar
            bball40dtw

            It doesn’t really matter though. As long as Australians buy the Ranger, Territory, and a couple of other vehicles, Ford is happy. They sell some trucks and make a profit. Your new vehicle market isn’t big enough for them to care any more than that.

  • avatar
    Nick 2012

    My vote would be to determine if you live near any of the tracks below, set aside the $150 fee, and base your car choice for 525,540 minutes off of what would work best for a 1 hour track session.

    That may cause your spouse to summarily execute you, however. Consider yourself warned.

    The residual on the 3 GT lease would be a helpful datapoint. If it is favorable and you’re tired of the ride (but not the car), consider smaller wheel/tires and see where that gets you. As a fellow long commuter, you’re going to want some reasonable options on the car to stay comfortable.

    http://www.scca.com/articles/1999592-track-night-announces-7-new-tracks-for-2016

  • avatar
    A09

    I understand the OP’s dilemma since my family experienced something similar. Wife had a 2011 Mazda3 GT Skyactiv Sedan. With a 2.5 year-old he was kicking the backseat constantly. Child two is on the way in six months; and the rear-facing child seat fit only because the front passenger seat was moved four clicks forward. We ended up trading in the 2011 Mazda3 for a new CR-V in December.

    I recommend a Mazda5. I like the way it drives, and the ingress/egress is ideal for a budding family or elderly. My parents have a ’05 Mazda3 GT Sedan; still running well but starting to rust. I am keeping an eye on the 2012-up Mazda 5 as the replacement when the Mazda3 retires.

  • avatar
    Driver8

    I vote for a base 6. Incredible value compared to a loaded 3.

    • 0 avatar
      30-mile fetch

      He’s tired of road noise and a firmer ride. How would this help?

      • 0 avatar
        Der_Kommissar

        The base 6 provides incremental improvements to both- a bit more sound deadening and more sidewall.

        • 0 avatar
          mike978

          Exactly. The 6 rides well and is not especially noisy any more.

          • 0 avatar
            ijbrekke

            Incremental, but certainly not luxurious. It’s definitely all about how much compromise he wants. A quiet, soft ride will not handle well or be fun to drive.

            My 2015 6 does fine overall, though it struggles a lot with rougher roads in the ride+noise department. I look forward to swapping the stock tires and probably adding some MLV to the doors in the future.

          • 0 avatar
            30-mile fetch

            Ah, yes. Mazda uber-fan will hear no criticism no matter how faint. Even though another Mazda uber-fan, Car and Driver, had this to say about a 2016:

            “Economy-grade interior noise levels in a mid-priced family sedan”

            The Mazda6 is an excellent car, but every car has drawbacks. Even ones you are ga-ga over. Note der kommissar said “incremental” improvements over the 3. If the OP wants out of his 3 because of the noise and ride and is willing to pay to do so, he probably wants more than “incremental” improvements.

          • 0 avatar
            mike978

            30mile – I agree it is noisier than some of its competitors, never did disagree. But there is a difference between being relatively louder than some and being noisy in an absolute sense. Nuance.
            But your comment must be true if it was in C&D!

            I am all for finding faults if they exist. But I don’t think we have to make up reasons just so each car has a “negative”.

  • avatar
    mikedt

    get a minivan for the wife (assuming she commutes less than you do) and get rid of the Mazda 3 and go buy something that gets great gas mileage. Because a) at 100 miles a day you’re not set up for leasing and b) while gas prices are cheap now they aren’t going to stay that way.

  • avatar
    Tinn-Can

    Can you even fit 16″ wheels over the 3s brakes? I don’t think they fit over the older hatchback sport trim calipers…

  • avatar
    nels0300

    “Is there a $14,000 car that is soft, quiet and comfortable I should consider that I would likely keep longer than a commuter box?”

    Soft, quiet, and comfortable, plus plent of room for rear facing car seats?

    You can get a Toyota Avalon with 40-60K miles for $14K.

  • avatar
    Alfisti

    I really think he needs 5 doors, it is so much easier with a family (i have a 4 yr old and a new born).

    A Ford Escape ticks a ton of boxes to be frank, the engine options are so much more engaging than a Rav4, CRV or CX5.

    Otherwise maybe consider an Outback if you are willing to forgo the sporty drive.

  • avatar
    slow_poke

    let me just say that kid two may not be 100% more money, but definitely >100% more time. the first year will be crushing. crushing. but you will get thru it.

    i had a >60mile commute and realized i don’t need a ‘great handling car’ when i’m a) idling in traffic, b) grinding out miles on a freeway. quiet and comfortable (and safety for the kids) are the most important. gas mileage also key (that’s just money you will be spending on kids…) Sold the S2000.

    we were astonished by the amount of stuff we needed to haul until they were out of cribs / diapers. we had an old unreliable outback and replaced w/ a newer lease return Outback. doesn’t have great mileage but is fairly quiet / comfortable. driving dynamics…. its an outback. one regret would be better mileage. but not that expensive and expect it to be the family hauler for YEARS.

    if you can end w/ two cars, try for something that holds everything (outback, mini-van…) that is more utilitarian but doesn’t have the gas mileage, and a 2nd for grinding miles w/ good mpg.

    i never buy new, and really never lease which just seems more expensive than buying the keeping forever. go 3-4yrs old, gentle lease returns are great, get something that will last a long time. you’ll be dropping into a hole for 3-4yrs after which you’ll start to get some more free time and then you can re-assess. kids cost more than you think…

    as for cars, a friend got a CX-5 that fit his rearfacing carseat and got ~40mpg. amazing. i think it will be hard to find an intersection of inexpensive, good mileage, and quiet at speed… if you want quiet, maybe adopt the convertible practice of headphones… commutes are never fun.

    do i sound beaten down???

  • avatar
    nels0300

    Almost forgot, you can still get an AWD Forester with a 6 speed manual.

    My wife has a 2013 with the 5 speed manual, and it’s not a stripper model either. Rides GREAT and holds tons of stuff.

    You’d probably have to buy new though, because the manual is hard to find, and a used 3 year old Subaru doesn’t make sense because they have ridiculous resale value, at least here in MN.

  • avatar
    2drsedanman

    @ Slow poke,

    “do i sound beaten down???” No, you sound like a realist. Kids bring sacrifices.

    Someone mentioned a used Avalon. Bingo! Rides good, good highway mileage, quiet, four doors, bullet proof drive train that won’t nickle and dime you to death. I know, I’m a Toyota fan boy. Still a good choice though.

    • 0 avatar
      nels0300

      I really think an Avalon is the way to go if you’re going used. Not only are the mechanicals great, I believe these cars are probably better maintained and less abused than the average used family-type vehicle.

      I’d look for Grandma/Grandpa’s lower mileage 2012 and older if I were in his shoes. They’re not hard to find.

    • 0 avatar
      Willyam

      Absolutely. My folks owned two of these in a row (although when they went more sporty and less Buick-ey they were none too happy). Their 2003-ish was the first car I’d sat in that gave me an anxiety attack. It was so quiet I kind of freaked out and had to crank the windows open.

      Their friends always rode with them, even though most owned luxury Lexus and German SUV’s. The ride was just THAT good.

      Eventually they went SRX, as the Avalon was too long for my petite mother to see the bumpers and she didn’t like trying to get it into garage spaces anymore.

      I’d comment on the service quality…but there wasn’t any. Ever.

  • avatar
    Coopdeville

    Was it supposed to be “road trips” in the article or did Bark truly mean rad trips, as in totally tubular trips, dude?

  • avatar
    tsoden

    My wife and I took out a 3 year lease on a 2012 Prius. The beauty of this lease was that it was a promotion through Toyota Credit where the interest rate was 0%… and the buyout after three years was $13500. We planned to buy the car out at the end of the lease, but found out that while the car met most of our needs, it proved to be a bit too small and was not great for winter months.

    We traded the car in early and the dealer bought out the last two months, paid off the residual of the car so he could have it in his used car fleet AND cut us a check for $1500 as the car has equity in it… something I had NEVER heard of before.

    We didn’t even have to get another Toyota for this to happen. the dealer simply wanted it for his used car fleet…otherwise it would have been sent back to toyota credit and put up for auction.

    In the end we walked away with check in hand and signed a deal for a new 2015 Hyundai Santa Fe Sport.

    • 0 avatar
      Japanese Buick

      I actually think a used Prius is a good choice to look at. Their values have been hammered by low gas prices, plus they are as reliable as a hammer and cheap to own (not just the high gas mileage, the maint requirements are pretty light too.

      I currently commute (60 miles/day) in a Prius and have a Miata for fun driving. Definitely recommend the Prius for commuting.

  • avatar
    hriehl1

    The Mazda you need is the Mazda5. Thank me later when you discover the practicality of rear sliding doors with two in child seats. They’re reasonably priced and their relative lack of popularity work in the buyer’s favor. Find a 6-speed manual still on the lot and they’ll be VERY anxious to deal.

    I’ve got 75K trouble-free miles on my 6-speed manual (original brakes too)… yes it is a stripper but still has the essentials; do you REALLY need an electric motor to move your seat? I get 30 MPG real-world.

    Many of the other cars suggested are really 2-way compromises; they’re neither engaging drivers nor optimized family haulers. The Mazda5 excels in the latter.

    Your life is changing… deal accordingly.

    • 0 avatar
      greenbrierdriver

      ’13 Mazda5 is what we bought to replace the Caravan that some drunk destroyed for us. (Parked on the curb, thankfully) and while it isnt the most wonderful car I have ever owned – I thank heaven for those sliding doors in back, every time I have to strap the grandsons in!! DIL has a Mazda 3 and I detest having to put the boys in that thing. Additionally, with the rear seats folded down, the cargo room is cavernous. Decent mileage (28 mpg at mostly 80+ from DFW to Houston and back), Reasonable power, not a rocket, but still fun. 57k on it and has needed nothing but oil changes and tires replaced – it had cheapo Chinese specials on it from the PO.

  • avatar
    make_light

    If you want something quiet, I would stay far away from the 08-12 Accords. Am I the only one who finds that generation insanely overrated? Sure it’s likely to be reliable and roomy, but the interior is hard and unappealing, they’re ungainly looking, and SO LOUD (and this is coming from someone who drives Subarus). I have two friends with ’11 Accords and I can’t believe how noisy they are.

    • 0 avatar
      Dingleberrypiez_Returns

      I completely agree. My experience with Accords is that they look great on paper and on the road, but are not pleasant to actually drive. Gnarly interior materials, harsh NVH, and painfully slow with the 4 cylinder.

    • 0 avatar
      Truckducken

      Hey, if you’re an Accord fan like me, you just pretend the product was on hiatus from 2007 until 2013. That missing generation was pure crap.

  • avatar
    Big Al from Oz

    I like Bark’s response to the “lost” individual with the problems of the daily grind living in a modern society.

    His problem is as complex as “geez, what underwear do I wear today”. The reality is most anyone really don’t give a fnck about your trivial problems.

    1. Simple, get a snip and don’t have more kids.

    2. Get a job closer to home, that you like.

    3. Due to your current circumstances, get rid of your Mazda and buy a diesel dual cab 4×4 Colorado if you want to continue driving 100 miles a day.

    This vehicle will enable you to offer your kids a great life in the outdoors, camping, fishing, beach going, beer drinking and BBQs.

    If your wife doesn’t like this, be like the majority of many selfish people and divorce her.

    Then you’ll not have the child problem 100% of the time and you can buy a little zoom, zoom, zoom wagon to fulfill your days driving your 100 miles to and from work.

    • 0 avatar
      bball40dtw

      o_O

      • 0 avatar
        davefromcalgary

        A diesel Colorado is Al’s answer to every Ask Bark. Like our friend who was interested in occasional track days.

        • 0 avatar
          bball40dtw

          Let’s break down his whole suggestion!

          1) Elective surgery
          2) Quit the job you like and find a new one
          3) Diesel Colorado with divorce

          For a guy trying to save money, this seems sort of expensive.

          • 0 avatar
            Big Al from Oz

            bball,
            It’s quite simple, LIVE WITHIN your means.

            If you can only afford a sh!tty Focus, Mazda 3, etc then that all you have.

            Make do with what you’ve got.

            I can’t believe what this guy calls a problem, and what is even more unbelievable is he was able to sign a contract for his Mazda.

            Sorry, this guy doesn’t have my sympathy.

            Simple everyday issue that HE must resolve and learn. Do you really need advice when you know you need to reduce outgoings to maintain your family?????

            This is stuff kids can even comprehend.

          • 0 avatar
            JimZ

            “2) Quit the job you like and find a new one”

            right, because it’s as simple as driving down to the Job Store and picking a new one off of the shelf.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            @bball

            I’ll go with elective surgery, sounds like fun.

            @JimZ

            They never have my size anyway.

        • 0 avatar
          Big Al from Oz

          davefromcalgary,
          I’ll give the guy a hand.

          Prioritise your life by looking at what you want from life.

          Face the guy is married with a couple of kids. He simply isn’t going to have it all. Is this guy a little selfish, maybe to selfish to be married with kids?

          Here’s how you prioritise. You must look at what is most important for your FAMILY first.

          1. Location, does my current location work for my family and myself.

          2. Employment, Do I like my job and will my job offer me enough to enhance my family’s life?

          3. Education, Do this area offer the best opportunities for my children or even myself or spouse?

          4. Job, Do I like my job and can I sustain hours of commuting and the additional costs, ie, am I better off having less pay and driving 5 miles to work?

          5. Lifestyle, What do I want for my family and myself as a lifestyle.

          6. I only make X amount per year and what can I afford to make the above work for me.

          Simple.

          Then buy a vehicle to suit.

          • 0 avatar
            Cactuar

            Al what you’re suggesting requires dying to self and putting other people first. It also requires self-control to live within one’s means. These character traits are not popular here.

            Car guys want to get confirmation from their peers for what they’ve already decided in their head. And since car guys tend to act like irrational children (leasing, high car turnover etc), that means your comments will not be well received.

            You’re still right though.

            Edit: Btw, self-confessed car guy here. The reason I can comment on the irrationality of car guys is that I struggle with it. Ask my wife about my perfect family car (hint: it’s a wagon and has an AMG badge on it). I even defended the rear-facing option of the E class as a substitute for our Odyssey. Then I grew up and carried on with real life. Until the next time I see an E class wagon on the road…

    • 0 avatar
      hubcap

      Slow Clap???

  • avatar
    dartman

    If the lease is thru Mazda Capital (Chase) and you have been diligent with on time payments and a decent credit score you should be able to get out of the lease and re-finance the new balance. You are the perfect demo for Mazda and they will really want to keep you in the “family” so to speak It wont be as cheap as if you were buying the equivalent used car, but you know the history of your car which is worth something . keep the car until the wheels fall-off, use it to teach your kids how to drive. I did exactly this with a 1996 Nissan Maxima that we kept in the family for 14 years and 200k miles; the Mazda3 should be able to duplicate that reliability. I purchased a 2011 3s for my son when he went to med school and a 2015 3i for my daughter when she went to grad school. They are great little cars. Never lease again. Good luck.

  • avatar
    Willyam

    I have a follow-up question if Ben has made it this far without throwing his laptop into a nearby pond in disgust.

    Since you are now married, what’s hers is hers and what’s yours is hers (a little joke there, but go with me).

    What does she drive? I once put my first spouse (long story) through grad school by using her paid for Grand Am to commute 38 miles to make more money, while she took over my used up Integra to drive the two blocks to school. You could switch cars, stop piling miles on the Mazda3, and still have it in the family until lease expiration. Maybe what she drives is paid for/reliable enough that annual miles isn’t a factor anymore. Please tell me you don’t have two car payments and more kiddos on the way (yea I did that too…)

  • avatar
    VoGo

    This may be out of left field, but is it possible to keep the leased Mazda and also purchase an additional car to limit the miles you put on the Mazda?

    I am thinking of a 10-12 year old cushy midsize/large sedan that was well kept by the previous owner. Perhaps something with a 3800 under the hood? I would set a budget of something like $2,500-3000 and get the car in the best shape you can find.

  • avatar
    seth1065

    I would agree we need some more info here, and if both kids will be in child care cost of #2 kids goes up in the family budget big time, so assuming they are a 2 car family one of these has to be kid duty worthy, the 3 can be but sounds like it would be a tight fit all around, 100 miles a day commute will add miles big time but that is why leasing should be out for the future. Maybe Mazda will help you out and get you in a 6 that would help you in space but at a bigger nut to handle each month as you will be buying vs leasing. Can you CPO a mazda 5 ? If the wife’s car can handle kid duties and his is used maybe 20% for kid duties keep it, and buy out at the end of the lease get some smaller tires and suck it up run it into the ground and hope your at a better place when you need another car 8 years down the road.

    • 0 avatar
      VW16v

      I’d recommend looks at the crash test ratings of a Mazda5 before purchasing. But, Mazda will want to keep you in their family of autos. Maybe you can get out of the lease for a bigger Mazda. This lesson learned to never lease a car.

  • avatar
    AtomB

    And get yourself snipped before you have three kids and the only vehicle choice you’ll be making is Odyssey or Sienna?

  • avatar
    Drzhivago138

    The most fun a kid can have growing up is going on a camping trip in a pre-1997 Ford SuperCab with inward-facing jump seats. Or going anywhere, really.

  • avatar
    ajla

    These “Ask Bark” pieces are ridiculously entertaining.

  • avatar
    KixStart

    This is why I don’t like leasing; things change.

    100 miles round trip every day? If you had a shorter commute, you could spend more time with your family. However, might be tough to fix that.

    Consider a used Prius. Gas under $2 means they’re going cheaper than usual, they’re pretty roomy inside (rear-facing baby seat might be a challenge, better test that) and it will save you money on gas and brakes. It will not drive like your Mazda 3 but it will be a good value and they are top rated for reliability.

    • 0 avatar
      dal20402

      “things change.”

      Amen. My one lease ever (an ’06 Civic) was a disaster because of dramatic life changes that happened in the middle of it. Had I bought, I could have just sold the thing. Instead it got far more complicated.

  • avatar
    nickoo

    85 db is not likely. Thats high enough to damage hearung after prlonged exposure time.

    • 0 avatar
      PeriSoft

      “85 db is not likely. Thats high enough to damage hearung after prlonged exposure time.”

      Most literature suggests that you’re OK at 85dba for 8 hours. But it certainly wouldn’t be pleasant.

      Most of that 85db is probably sub-100hz, which probably (though not authoritatively; I couldn’t find any literature on this when I was doing research) limits the potential for hearing damage.

      But yeah, 85db at 70mph sounds really crazy for a remotely modern car. Either something is wrong or he only drives on the lane warning strips.

  • avatar
    NN

    It’s obviously not about you anymore, so put weight on the practical needs. You need something with lots of vertical storage space, and preferably a 3rd row in case your kids someday have a friend or two and you and friend’s parents take turns giving each other a break from time to time. Kids come with tons of stuff…strollers, co-sleepers, and eventually bicycles and more. Maybe someday you’ll also get a dog to complete the nuclear family…pets are great for kids. And you’ll get rid of any sedan real quick. It’s a tough time in life to be a car enthusiast…a CX-5 might work and be fun, but a CR-V or Rav-4 will probably be a bit more practical and family friendly. Nothing tops a minivan…I have two kids and we have two minivans now. Sooner or later you realize it’s just the right tool for the job.

  • avatar
    Jamez9k

    I don’t get why some are knocking on the guy. Like others have said : Things change. No one can precisely predict their future.

    My S/O got into a similar situation with her lease when she met me. I live some considerable distance from the city and she couldn’t predict that one day she would meet me and that her mileage would shoot up as a result (especially once she let go of her rented appartment to move into my house). Out solution was to find a cheap beater car for her to use over the last winter while the lease was parked in the garage. The next spring we took the lease back to the dealership and resold the beater.

    And IMHO the CX-3 is about the worst idea for a family vehicle. That thing is an ergonomic nightmare. I’m coming from a Mazda 2 and I can tell you I felt much more cramped inside the CX-3 (front AND back). Even with the seat all the way down head room was severely limited and the A-pillar only centimeters from my head. And I’m only 5’9! I don’t even think you could fit child seats in that thing without making the front seats completely useless for human beings.

    • 0 avatar
      bball40dtw

      Because people suck and apparently never make mistakes. However, sometimes I think you just have to make the best of your mistakes. I think the best thing is for the OP to keep the Mazda3 and buy it out at the end of the lease. I think I could give an even better answer if I knew what his wife was driving. If she has a Pilot/Explorer/Traverse/Highlander/etc, my man just needs to live with the Mazda3 because it’ll be the cheapest choice.

  • avatar
    bball40dtw

    Stephen Stills and Billy Preston offer excellent advice for this situation:

    “Love the one you’re with”

  • avatar
    05lgt

    I have no idea how or why “ask bark” has become my favorite recurring feature here. I haven’t even started the comments yet. Thanks for doubling down.

  • avatar
    05lgt

    OK, read the comments. Glad I read the piece first, because some people put way too much of themselves into what they read. Dude didn’t make a mistake, he improved his life at home, at work, and in general. He realized that *might* make changing cars a good idea and asked Bark. Best idea I saw was *if* he can escape the lease without losing too much but a C-Max. Depending on lease specifics, maybe stay Mazda or even ride out the lease with overages. Then the echo chamber/shouting head thing kicked in. As a member of the B&B, I apologize to the question writer for our behavior.

  • avatar
    HotPotato

    I will echo the love for the Ford C-Max Hybrid:
    * an incredible bargain if bought used, yet packed with modern tech
    * very quiet and comfortable, with excellent visibility
    * handles crisply with great steering, like a tall Focus
    * 188hp and instant electric torque, plus 37+ real-world MPG
    * easy load height for your kid, your groceries, and your ass

    Plus as a hybrid it has an EPA-mandated 100,000 drivetrain warranty (150,000 miles in California). Just make sure the many, many recalls have been attended to.

    Top alternatives are, uh, other microvans. The Mazda5 is also nice to drive and has a third row, but the can’t match the C-Max’s MPG, acceleration, or crash scores. The Kia Soul and second-gen Scion sB have the right shape, but aren’t otherwise standouts.

    And then there’s the Fiat 500L, same idea but UNBELIEVABLY ROOMY and flexible for parents. Car seats in the back, sure! Strollers in the cargo bay, sure! Flip the seats completely out of the way and go nuts at IKEA, you bet! Its acceleration and MPG are both a bit better than other the non-hybrid microvans, though it requires premium gas. It’s also an unpopular vehicle, which makes it cheap to buy, either used or brand-new with staggering amounts of available cash on the hood. Still, it’s not as fun to drive as some of the others…and the B&B don’t trust Fiats, turbos, or dual-clutch automatics (though you can also get it with a manual or a conventional automatic). But you’d have to reeeeally need that interior room to choose this over a used C-Max for the same money.

    If you can’t see yourself in a microvan, then how about a US-made VW Passat? Freaking gigantic inside, drives pretty nice, and cheap.

    Or a Ford Fusion 2.5. If you go back to the pre-2013 bodystyle, you can even afford step up to a Fusion Hybrid (the 2.5 hybrid is incredibly long-lived, that’s a popular New York City taxi powertrain) or the Lincoln MK-whatever-it’s-called version of the Fusion.

  • avatar
    laserwizard

    Find out what the buy out option cost is going to be and refinance for three years or less. Own it since you like it and not have to worry about leasing it.

    This scenario proves women are the root of all evil. When you didn’t have one, everything was just fine.


Back to TopLeave a Reply

You must be logged in to post a comment.

Recent Comments

New Car Research

Get a Free Dealer Quote

Staff

  • Contributors

  • Matthew Guy, Canada
  • Seth Parks, United States
  • Ronnie Schreiber, United States
  • Bozi Tatarevic, United States
  • Chris Tonn, United States
  • Moderators

  • Adam Tonge, United States
  • Kyree Williams, United States