By on April 6, 2016

2016-Cadillac-CT6-01

Cadillac has reportedly scrapped plans to build a range-topping CT8 flagship.

A tweet from insider analysts Autoline states that the CT8 program is dead, with American’s thirst for crossovers and SUVs being a likely cause.

That leaves the recently introduced CT6 sedan as the largest traditional Caddy, though it’s the palatial body-on-frame Escalade that really wears the brand’s crown.

The CT8 was to be the pinnacle of a product push continued by Cadillac president Johan de Nysschen when he came on board in 2014. There was talk of it resurrecting a nameplate from the past, perhaps Fleetwood.

But automakers have to build what customers what, not what they need, and buyers want cavernous utility vehicles these days.

If the CT8 is truly stillborn, the CT6 gets to play the role of traditional flagship, albeit one that offers a 2.0-liter four-cylinder base engine. But hey, the proportions are right and there’s a V8 on the way.

The CT6 faces stiff competition in its class, including a resurrected Lincoln Continental due out later this year. Last year, Cadillac’s ATS and CTS sedans saw steep sales declines, and the CT6 was recently saddled with mediocre residual values.

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139 Comments on “Did Cadillac Just Pull the Plug on the CT8?...”


  • avatar
    sportyaccordy

    I don’t know who will make a bigger mess in their pants over this announcement…. Pete DeLorenzo or DW. Either way, I would avoid either of them over the next ~72 hours.

    Smart move by Cadillac IMO. Don’t let the S-Class fool you- by all measures the flagship large sedan is as dead as a doorknob for anyone with anything less than Mercedes grade brand power. Audi, BMW, Lexus, Jaguar’s offerings are all down in the dumps saleswise and aside from BMW are all ancient… some being largely unchanged over the last 10 years aside from facelifts.

    I’m still thinking GM’s best move is the Escalade sub brand. People don’t want Brembo ™ brakes, Ring tunes, alphabet soup and Art & Science. They want $35-60K Escalade knockoffs.

    • 0 avatar
      Chocolatedeath

      I was just thinking the samething, however atleast Delorenzo would say that if GM made it that they would be better off. DW would just say they suck no matter what.

    • 0 avatar

      Peter has posted the news and expressed his disgust over it.

      And I think he has a point, BECAUSE…

      The halo factor of a CT8 – I’d prefer “Fleetwood” – may help drive sales of the lesser vehicles.

      You don’t want CT8 to be a big seller, in fact. Such a car merely needs to exist, sell a few examples, and do what it does better than anything in its class.

      In the luxury world, exclusivity, at least in part, is its own reward.

      • 0 avatar
        Kyree S. Williams

        “You don’t want CT8 to be a big seller, in fact. Such a car merely needs to exist, sell a few examples, and do what it does better than anything in its class.”

        In part. In reality, the reason the S-Class dominates is that it epitomizes Mercedes-Benz. It is the brand’s crowning achievement, the thing that it does best and has done best for the last 5 decades. It would be an uphill battle trying to compete with that. And if you notice, Mercedes-Benz is making all of its other cars (E-Class and C-Class especially) essentially seem like sawn-off S-Classes.

        For BMW, the car that defines the brand is the 3-Series. Everything else tries to be like—if it isn’t outright *based on*—the 3-Series. Even the comparatively-large X5 has a sporting bent and drives much smaller and nimbler than it should. The 7-Series may be the first BMW to get all the cool technology, but it’s relatively inconsequential…and BMW doesn’t even try to go after the S-Class’s market share in that arena. People value BMW for the 3-Series, which handily outsells the C-Class.

        Cadillac’s sedans once ran with those of Rolls-Royce, but it then watered those down to Mercedes-Benz luxury levels after the men came home from World War II. The brand has since conceded that crown, through several eras of sh*t products. The car that now defines Cadillac is the Escalade, a big BOF, V8-powered SUV. Cadillac should work on emulating the Esclaade experience, for which people are willing to pay through the nose, in its other cars, instead of trying to chase the Germans…which is a game that it can never win. Maybe expand the Escalade nameplate into a complete sub-brand of products, like Range Rover.

        • 0 avatar
          CoreyDL

          “(E-Class and C-Class especially) essentially seem like sawn-off S-Classes.”

          It ain’t workin on the C-Class, IMO. While the inside is lovely, the exterior styling is really a hot mess past the front doors.

          • 0 avatar
            Kyree S. Williams

            Agreed. Someone in our company has had a C300 Sport service loaner for several days (I think he drives a newer E-Class), and I’ve parked next to it a few times. It looks like a squatting dog.

            Side note: one of the other executives drives a late-model 535i M-Sport. Every week, like clockwork, he has some kind of BMW loaner in his parking spot, most recently a 428i coupe, before that an X3. It seems like he has as many problems with his 5-Series as I did with my X5. I want to go up to him and tell him he can cry on my shoulder if he wants…lol

        • 0 avatar
          bd2

          With the 5 Series, BMW was the “king” of the midsize sedan segment as well, but Mercedes had surpassed them with the outgoing E Class and likely will continue doing so with the new one.

          With the current C Class, Mercedes has also drawn the line closer to the 3 Series.

          In numerous other markets, the C Class now outsells the 3 Series.

      • 0 avatar
        sportyaccordy

        No, halo cars don’t work, especially in the context of the limited resources Cadillac has. Infiniti has soldiered on and succeeded without a halo car for over a decade now. Jaguar has a halo car and as a brand gets outsold several times over by many individual Infiniti models. And in any case Cadillac has a halo “car”- the Escalade.

        A CT8 won’t fix CUE, or make the back seats bigger, or make the 3.6L V6 competitive with the growing number of boosted 6s. If GM wants to sell more ATSs and CTSs, they should fix what’s wrong with those cars, rather than siphon those resources off to build a flagship nobody will buy or care about. This isn’t the 60s when people were dumb enough to fall for that kind of transmutive aspirational BS.

        • 0 avatar
          28-Cars-Later

          Actually I think it would have made the back seat bigger, but otherwise I agree.

          “This isn’t the 60s when people were dumb enough to fall for that kind of transmutive aspirational BS.”

          So there are no more aspirational consumer products, humanity just moved on?

          • 0 avatar
            sportyaccordy

            There are, but the old transmutive “halo product” is dead, largely due to ridiculously easy access to credit.

            Plus if halo cars even exist anymore, and IMO they don’t, big sedans are not them. Something like an S-class is a 100% old man’s car. People under 55 like CUVs/SUVs. This is why the Escalade can outsell the S-Class for the same money, and all of the S-Classes competitors are in a decade long sales slump. It’s the same story with the large mainstreamer sedan. The concept is outdated.

      • 0 avatar
        DeadWeight

        Petey boy went into the closet to change his mind.

        He’s been slobbing Johan’s cob for the better part of two years.

        If he doesn’t realize by now that Cadillac is a failed brand, and Johan is a con man, he’s a bigger fool than I had previously thought possible.

        • 0 avatar
          Dave M.

          I wouldn’t call Johan a con man. He is trying his best to salvage Caddy and make lemonade. I can’t imagine walking in his shoes (but I would appreciate the money…).

      • 0 avatar
        smartascii

        I think the idea of a halo car only works if it becomes synonymous with the brand overall. People don’t buy a C-Class because it comes out of the same showroom as the S-Class; they buy it because it’s a Mercedes. And the S-Class has done more than any other car over the past few decades to define what Mercedes is (as an aside, those W220s that have all collapsed on their Airmatic suspensions did more to harm the brand than pretty much anything else).
        Cadillac can build a CT8 or Fleetwood or anything else it wants, and if it’s a world-class product, they’ll sell some. But no one will come and lease an ATS because that flagship exists, since the public perception of the Cadillac brand is that it’s the Escalade and a bunch of other crappy cars.

    • 0 avatar
      DeadWeight

      Let’s get the party started properly today with news of yet more absolute backtracking & complete open-mouth-insert-foot-and-stick-sharp-object-in a$$ by Cadillac’s “awesome set of tools living and working in SoHo” Head Honcho/Big Cheese/Chief Lifestyle & Arbiter of All Things Brand Elevating Lifestyle Guru, Johan de Nysschen, as Cadillac just pulled the plug on their “Mercedes S Class Beating Upcoming Ultra Luxurious, technological Tour-De-Force, must-have, better-than-zeee-Germans, “Flagship” CT8:

      http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/future-cars/news/a28725/cadillac-ct8-cancelled/

      “Cadillac’s bold plan to revitalize its sales and image seems to have hit a snag: According to Autoline, plans for a Cadillac CT8 to compete with the Mercedes S-Class have been officially cancelled.”

      ……This just in. Cadillac CT8 program cancelled. Was to be flagship sedan for the brand. No doubt market shift to CUVs & SUVs played a role.
      — Autoline (@Autoline) April 5, 2016

      Complete product confusion: Check

      Old & new model mix being sold side-by-side: Check

      Still close to 1,000 (mostly dumpy) Cadillac Dealers selling rebadged Buick LaCrosses & fail-ATSs/CTSs: Check

      Ongoing reliability & Fit & Finish issues unbecoming a “premium/luxury” brand: Check

      Absolutely failed marketing/advertising campaign (Dare Greatly! + The Arena + Mom Let Me Play With Dolls & I’m A Fashion Designer Now): Check

      Opening “Urban Cool/Hipster Approved” SoHo Digs for the Cadillac Free Range, Certified Fair Trade,Antibiotic Free, Organic, Artisinal Coach Building Company, PLLC: Check

      Hiring Uwe ‘MonteBlanc Fountain Pen’ Ellinghaus & Melody ‘Millennial Chic’ Handbag-Lee: Check

      Convincing Clueless Mary Barra & the rest of the morons at GM HQ to cut a 12 billion USD check to Johann to “reinvent” the Cadillac brand (a division that sells 5 out of every 100 GM vehicles, most at breakeven or a loss) & image with already failed product: Check

  • avatar
    seth1065

    Well this will make DW very happy. It was the right decision really. Why try to build a S class fighter that would have been a very steep hill to climb if folks want big SUV’s. I rather caddy do it right or not do it at all ,so it seems they are not gonna do it at all. Can not really blame them.

  • avatar

    Mercedes S-class W222 owns this segment. DOMINATES this segment.

    For the average Caddy buying retiree, the XTS (and to a lesser extent: CTS) will be more than enough as it checks all the right boxes.

    1) It’s a “big Caddy”

    2) AWD with a 300HP V6.

    3) Heated/ventilated seats.

    4) Panoramic roof.

    5) Nav with optional heads up display.
    Large, cushy interior.

    6) quiet, cushy ride

    7) rich looks

    The CT6- which I was excited to check out as a replacement to my mom’s 2010 STS AWD 3.6-L was a letdown.

    #1 the touchpad for CUE doesn’t make sense. It is used to give touchability in German cars without touch screens.

    #2. Rear monitors looked nice, but had no retract or extend button.

    #3. The button layout resembles Mercedes’ cars (finally) but some features aren’t well placed and are difficult to notice/find.

    #4 the rear view mirror had no quick-access button for rear view- a button I’d have put on the side edge.

    There is an overlaying feeling of cheapness throughout the interior which turned me off.

    The XT5 was no better. An SRX with a new nose, updated CUE and a BMW-like shifter.

    I think mom’s best option is the XTS or XT5. Both CTS and XTS have grown so large that they successfully replace the STS. Optional tech features are more than satisfying.

    The XTS makes more sense unless you are a chauffeur or take long road trips while pampering the kids.

    There’s no need for a CT8.

    It’s called an ESCALADE. It makes more sense than a large sedan. It just needs the CT6’s tech features.

    On a side note, LINCOLN needs to build the Navigator Concept just to be relevant again.

    • 0 avatar
      sportyaccordy

      It makes no sense to even try to compete. S Class is sucking up all the air in that segment. GM’s only hope in the luxury realm is the Escalade sub brand. Follow Land Rover’s blueprint.

      • 0 avatar
        DeadWeight

        Come lounge in my Halo CT6 2.0T, bro!

        Regale in its many splendors!!!

        Absent my plan to save Cadillac (a HO V6 or V8 under every hood, absolutely plush riding, capacious, meticulously assembled, uber reliable, bank-vault solid, quiet as a European Cathedral, torque and horsepower rich, real metal, leather and wood everywhere inside, intense customer service friendly vehicles)…

        …there’s only this Hail Mary with Cadillac’s current model lineup (save the Escalade):

        ATS – $0 down, $249/month lease; $28,999.00 MSRP

        CTS – $0 down, $279/month lease; $33,999.00 MSRP

        XT5 (now getting bad initial reviews) – $0 down, $309/month lease; $33,999.00 MSRP

        CT6 (now starting to get panned after initial knob slobbering by auto presstitutes is over) – $0 down, $359/month lease; $36,999.00 with 2.0T, $39,999.00 with ubiquitous GM 3.6 liter.

        Blow out the now defunct XTSlaCrosse on $0 down, $279/month leases

    • 0 avatar
      VoGo

      In reality, the S-class is outsold by the Tesla Model S in the US.

      So, “DOMINATES” must mean “loses” in BTSR-world.

      • 0 avatar

        VoGo

        You place the Model S (starting at $70,000 and ending at $150,000) to the S-class which is larger, far more luxurious and starts at $90,000+???

        Do you even know the competition in this segment?

        Do you know what a segment is?

        Now you understand why I don’t take ANYONE on the internet making criticisms seriously at all.

        When YOU BUY ONE (or lease one) THEN YOU CAN TALK.

        Until that day, I simply can’t hear you.

        Unlike you – I have OWNERSHIP EXPERIENCE

        • 0 avatar
          Jason

          You ALSO have this THING for RANDOM CAPITALIZATION which is really STRANGE.

        • 0 avatar
          FreedMike

          Teslas are thick on the ground at every upscale mall and shopping area around here, BTSR. It may be a different type of car than the S-class Benz, but they definitely chase the same kind of upscale buyer.

          • 0 avatar

            Model S and W222 aren’t in the same price bracket.
            They don’t attract the same kind of buyers.
            The material quality is like comparing Rubbermaid to Gucci.
            Why am I even entertaining this?

            You want to correlate “selling it in posh malls” with it “being in a segment “?

          • 0 avatar
            Kyree S. Williams

            The S-Class is the best luxury limousine there is, short of a Rolls-Royce.

            The Model S has that cool tech factor.

            They do different things for different people, but with some overlap. I, for one, could see myself buying either one of them at different moments. But…they attract people with the same kind of money…and I’m sure a good number of them have taken sales away from traditional flagship sedans, including the S-Class.

          • 0 avatar
            dal20402

            Almost all of the Model Ss sold around here are P85/P90/P85D models, usually loaded up with options. Those compete straight-up against the S-Class and can get close to $150,000. You’re right that the 70 is competing in a different segment but at least in tech-land almost nobody buys them.

            The buyer demographics are totally different. S-Class buyers are OLD and have owned Mercedes for decades. Tesla buyers are young and have tech money.

          • 0 avatar
            FreedMike

            Yes, BTSR, they ARE in the same price range. Yes, the same kind of buyers (folks with money) buy them because they’re prestigious, and people with money like to buy prestigious cars (radical concept, I know). Someone with $100,000 to drop on a car might have his own definition of prestige and what it means to him. Some might want the highest-tech car they can put their hands on. Others might want the private-jet-on-wheels thing. And many others might just want a Porsche 911 instead. Since you supposedly are rolling in stacks, I’d guess you’d know that, but whatever.

            Yes, the Tesla’s interior isn’t as nice as a S-class. But, yes, the Tesla also has a massive performance advantage over the S-class (and just about anything else on four wheels, for that matter). It’s all about what the buyer prioritizes.

            I’d argue that someone with $100,000 to drop on a car should be able to decide for himself what he wants that $100,000 car to do, versus some blowhard telling him he’s stupid because his $100,000 Tesla has an “inferior” interior.

            But then again, folks with money don’t usually tell other people how stupid they are for spending it the way the like. They tend to respect other rich guy’s choices.

            (And for the record, make my S-class the AMG version, in metallic red.)

    • 0 avatar
      Kyree S. Williams

      Exactly.

    • 0 avatar
      NormSV650

      My Mom didn’t need the V6 power but wanted more fuel economy off the highway. She picked a 2011 LaCrosse 2.4l Ecotec on the cheap and it fills her bill with a great ride and 26 mpg with no highway. I tuned the ecu with a little more pep and toned down the torque management as she won’t be road coursing it or being seen at the drag strip anytime soon.

      I drove before tuned and it was a little piggy from a stop but has excellent steering due to the lightweight 4-cylinder up front.

  • avatar

    They did. Gone are the hopes for a halo limousine Bob Lutz would be proud of to park next to your S Class Mercedes.

  • avatar
    Chocolatedeath

    I wonder how much larger can Lincoln stretch the platform of the new Continental ? Call it a Town Car. Use the engine from the top of the top of the line Mustang and call it a day. Oh and 10 speed auto

  • avatar
    Hummer

    What they need to do is make a larger SUV offering, the Escalade is great but a larger SUV would be key to dominating the luxury SUV market.

    • 0 avatar
      Kyree S. Williams

      The Escalade ESV is no Excursion, but…I mean,…how much larger does it *really* need to be?

      What Cadillac should actually do is turn the Escalade into a sub-brand (a la Land Rover’s Range Rover line) and leverage the CT6’s Omega platform to build a RWD 7-seat crossover the approximate size of the existing Lambda crossovers (Acadia, Enclave, Traverse). That might cannibalize other GM cars’ sales, but it would also compete handily with the GL/GLS-Class, Q7, and even smaller, predominantly-five-seat crossovers like the X5 and the Range Rover Sport. It’s not the glorious, be-all-end-all segment, but it’s a profitable one. Hell, GM should know that by the number of suburban families that buy overpriced Tahoe LTZs and Yukon Denalis for $65K all day long. A hybrid variant wouldn’t hurt, either. Call it the Escalade Sport, or whatever.

      It would also stand a chance of being inducted into the league of world-class SUVs, along with all of the European models I just mentioned.

      • 0 avatar
        Hummer

        The plastic bumpers on the front and back make these trucks look bulky, but remove those and your looking at a pretty average sized fullsize. The width could stand to increase a couple inches, the top half of the truck could have less slope to the roof to improve interior room. Basically a range topper needs to take the escalades short comings and fix them to be a unforgiving no bars held luxury SUV.

        The Europeans are even worse at it than the Americans, they’re fullsizers look smaller than our midsizers. Physically they’re not, but it’s a major turnoff when looking at the euro & Japanese offerings.

      • 0 avatar
        sportyaccordy

        Exactly. The S-Class’ main competitors aren’t other large luxury sedans- they are the Escalade, Range Rover and Model S.

        Also, the segments the ATS & CTS are in are either flat and saturated or in outright decline. By contrast, the X3/X5/Q7 segments have all been growing. The Escalade sub brand is stronger and means way more to more people than Cadillac. It’s like Jaguar vs Land Rover. It’s clear which of those two is doing the heavy lifting for JLR. So GM should leverage that. The XT5 was a huge mistake. It should have been a midsize unibody Escalade.

        • 0 avatar
          Kyree S. Williams

          I agree with you, except for the part about the XT5 being a huge mistake. Right now, the FWD SRX is Cadillac’s best-seller, and it does a good job of competing against the Lexus RX and Lincoln MKX, both of which were recently redesigned. I don’t think there’s any reason to abandon or ignore that segment, especially because those are the kinds of cars people lease by the boatload.

          But it could have been folded into an Escalade sub-brand.

          • 0 avatar
            sportyaccordy

            Huge mistake was probably hyperbole. But it would probably do better as a butch chrome Escalade box than an A&S origami dodgeball. Just from a practical standpoint- cargo space & visibility- the Escalade’s form works better. But they are already committed.

    • 0 avatar
      dal20402

      The Escalade ESV is already the largest vehicle in the segment. Make it wider and you would be violating rules for passenger car registration in a lot of states. Although maybe in some places that would be a selling point… “Our SUV is so big you have to register it as a commercial vehicle.”

      • 0 avatar
        Kyree S. Williams

        True. The SVT Raptor is one consumer vehicle that is large enough to necessitate marker lights. But I don’t think an Escalade needs to be as large.

  • avatar
    30-mile fetch

    Cadillac seems confused and indecisive in regards to their flagship sedan. The odd stopgap FWD XTS received the tepid reviews expected for a half-effort full size luxury car. This CT6 that I believe fully looks the part of an expensive flagship sedan, was labelled as yet another stopgap until the real one arrives. Except now it won’t.

    So now you have a very good looking “flagship” sedan that starts at $53K with a 4 cylinder engine. What is that intended to compete with? The $72K base price standard V8 LS460? $100K standard turbo V8 S Class? Regardless of the styling, it seems more likely to be compared to a Hyundai Equus or Kia K900. That’s not who an established luxury brand wants to be compared to.

    • 0 avatar
      Kyree S. Williams

      The XTS is a fine car. It does what it’s supposed to, serves the still-thriving fleet and livery market, and couldn’t have cost that much to build. It’s not in keeping with where Cadillac wants to be…but it’s what the brand is known for. I see no harm in keeping it around a little longer, although it was never meant to be a flagship, and Cadillac said that. It was just the largest sedan they had at the time.

      The CT6 *was* supposed to be Cadillac’s S-Class fighter…until GM pulled back and said, “Just kidding, the real one comes later.” That whole thing was suspicious. I think, at that time, GM was already considering not doing a proper flagship sedan, and the entire thing became vaporware from that point on.

      Yes, the CT6’s chief competitor is probably the Infiniti Q70L, as well as versions of the Kia K900 and Hyundai Equus.

      • 0 avatar
        FreedMike

        Well, if it’s primarily competing against the Infiniti and Equus, that may not be the worst place to be. The brand needs to establish some cred in that segment. That means they have to compete against someone. Better to compete against lower-volume players than the S-class or Lexus LS, you know?

        And I’m not nutty about the CT6’s looks, but it’ll be a FAR more appealing car than the Infiniti or Equus, especially in the performance department. The reviews of the CT6 I’ve seen indicate it’s a pretty brilliant car to drive.

        Establish a rep in that segment against the weaker players, and then leverage it. Maybe not such a bad idea.

        • 0 avatar
          derekson

          Yes, the CT6 seems like a solid player for Cadillac. It isn’t priced to a place where it needs to be as good as an S-class, and its size means it can play a tweener role since its about the size of the no longer sold SWB S-class or 7-series.

          The mistake was getting hung up on the “flagship” conversation. The answer should have just been “we have a flagship, it’s called the Escalade”.

  • avatar
    Kyree S. Williams

    Like I said on Jalopnik, Cadillac had no hope of fielding an S-Class competitor. No one in the market for an S-Class would have bought it, and its prestige wouldn’t have trickled down to the other models.

    That said, I still have no clue as to what the CT6 wants to be. It’s *not* in the same league as full-sized RWD cars from competitors. It probably belongs in the same “tweener” category as the Infiniti Q70L…a car that is full-sized, without offering the prestige (or price tag) of a true flagship sedan, or essentially a stretched version of a mid-sized luxury sedan. That can be alluring for some, who just want the size and space. But the 2.0T is an unwelcome engine and should be dropped.

    The Escalade, as you said, is a much better flagship. For the first time in four generations, it is a true luxury car and is different enough from the other GM vehicles with which it shares its bodyshells and frames. But Cadillac needs to make an ultra-luxury variant for the $110K+ crowd that can compete with similarly-priced versions of the Range Rover, G-Class and Cayenne.

    • 0 avatar
      30-mile fetch

      “I still have no clue as to what the CT6 wants to be”

      I thought it took a lot of money to develop and launch a car. It surprises me that Cadillac had no cohesive plan for the market position this car would occupy, yet developed it anyway and saddled it with a base trim and powertrain likely to hobble its perception with luxury buyers.

      • 0 avatar
        Kyree S. Williams

        Exactly. Cadillac could have just saved itself the trouble and brought us the long-wheelbase CTS-L variant you *know* they’re developing for the Chinese market.

      • 0 avatar
        ajla

        “I thought it took a lot of money to develop and launch a car. It surprises me that Cadillac had no cohesive plan”

        Well, I wouldn’t say I’m surprised.

    • 0 avatar
      FreedMike

      To sell a true Range Rover competitor, I think they’d need something that doesn’t look exactly like a Suburban in profile, built on a dedicated platform.

      Near as I can tell, what Cadillac is trying to do with the smaller engine in the CT6 is position itself as a technical leader. They can get away with the smaller engine because the CT6 is lightweight. Worth noting – Audi did the same thing with the all-aluminum A8 a few years back, and this kind of technical image has served them pretty well (their ad tagline is “Truth in Engineering,” after all).

      The car geek in me loves that approach. Whether it sells with the public is another question.

      • 0 avatar
        Kyree S. Williams

        True, although the XJ—despite its antediluvian looks at the time—has also been all-aluminum since its MY2004 redesign.

        • 0 avatar
          CoreyDL

          I actually saw two circa 04-06 XJ models on my way to work yesterday (3.3 miles) and then another on my way home. Behind one at a light I had time to notice the rear hips on that car, that spiked edge extending from the rear window to the tail lamps, smooth as can be.

          Just such an awesome piece of modern-yet-heritage design. I will always love those.

          • 0 avatar
            Kyree S. Williams

            Oh yes. I am particularly fond of the facelifted 2008-2009 versions.

          • 0 avatar
            CoreyDL

            As Alex Dykes has informed, they’re just no picnic to own and operate on any sort of reasonable monetary level. IIRC he spent something like $4,000 on his last year.

          • 0 avatar
            Kyree S. Williams

            And yet that’s one of the more preservable Euro flagships of that era, too. The X350/X358 XJ has a lot of little things go wrong, like the air suspension seals, but you can fix it and keep going. Plus, I’m pretty sure Mr. Dykes has one of the performance variants, which would have added headache.

            Meanwhile, any variant of the E65 7-Series, Phaeton, W220 S-Class or D3 A8 will just disintegrate around you, into a mess of grenaded mechanicals and fried prototype-grade electronics modules…no matter what you do.

            That was just not a good era for full-sized luxury sedans. Buy an LS.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            Perhaps we need a reading from the Book of LS460.

      • 0 avatar
        sportyaccordy

        I’m gonna say people in the market for large luxury sedans don’t care about weight or chassis dynamics… at least dynamics in the context of driving engagement.

        It’s like Cadillac is in a time warp in 1994, when mag comparisons and dynamics were a major concern for luxury buyers.

        • 0 avatar
          Kyree S. Williams

          Or 2001, because they *must* have benchmarked the ATS against the E36 or E46 3-Series. It has an extremely competent chassis, but is downright uncomfortable and lacking-in-space, and does not reflect what people value in modern compact luxury sedans.

      • 0 avatar
        FreedMike

        Well, I buy “excellence in engineering” when Audi’s selling it. From Jaguar? Not so much.

    • 0 avatar
      28-Cars-Later

      This is just the new Seville, which when last seen was riding on a slightly longer Sigma chassis.

      • 0 avatar
        CoreyDL

        Should’ve called it that, in line with the rebirth of the Continental over at Lincoln.

        • 0 avatar
          28-Cars-Later

          But they have set a precedent, they can’t all of the sudden make smart moves this deep in the game.

          • 0 avatar
            CoreyDL

            That would be… Daring Greatly!

            (TM)(R)(LTD)(LLC)

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            What will probably happen is the brand will keep making boneheaded moves right up until the next GM bankruptcy. From now until then, just enjoy the freak show. Clearly the adults are not in charge over in SoHo.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            I just had a thought, perhaps some time down the line in a GM bankruptcy, Tesla should buy the rights to Cadillac so it can actually Dare Greatly ;)

    • 0 avatar
      VenomV12

      What I really want to see is what happens to the Escalade/Range Rover market now the Bentayga is here. There are a lot of people out there that are in the Ferrari/Bentley crowd that bought $100,000 Range Rovers and Escalades because that was the highest they could go in that market but now they have the Bentayga option and at the end of the day a $150,000 to $200,000 Range Rover still isn’t a Bentley. I think the G-Wagen and Range Rover sales are going to be hurt quite significantly by the Bentayga.

      • 0 avatar
        Hummer

        The Bentayga may take sales from the euro guys but it’s still a smallish crossover and I can’t see it taking very many sales from an actual fullsize.

        • 0 avatar
          VenomV12

          That’s probably true to some extent until they come out with an extended wheelbase model which I assume they will do, I can’t see them passing up that end of the market. I’m still puzzled why Range Rover won’t add a damn third row option to the fullsize model, clearly they aren’t averse to third rows since you can’t get one in the smaller Sport. It makes no sense, especially for the LWB model. They would snag a lot of Cadillac Escalade ESV buyers with a model like that.

  • avatar
    nickoo

    Just bring back a bof fleetwood and fleetwood limo built on the bones of the ‘slade. Lower cost and totally in line with what actually sells american luxury. 1996 fleetwood is the last of the caddis I would own.

    • 0 avatar
      01 Deville

      I owned one. And an 02 Deville and a W220 S Class. While I liked how the 5.7 stayed just off idle while going uphill at 80 MPH, that car was far too unrefined in ride, handling and space utilization compared to the Deville and S-Class, to be a choice for people with money. And, that is why it died.

  • avatar
    FreedMike

    Makes sense. They need to build some brand equity in their lower priced sedans before they contemplate taking on the S-class Benz.

  • avatar
    fr88

    Has anyone considered the possibility that the reason tiny, cramped mini-Cadillacs (ATS, CTS) aren’t selling while the XTS is doing reasonably well in its market segment (despite being a hideous hunchback)is that Cadillac buyers want a car with stretch out comfort and room. That’s a big reason why they buy Escalades. Try being 6’2″ and get into the back seat of either an ATS (can’t be done) or a CTS (barely doable). Give American and Chinese buyers a large flagship sedan with the presence and passenger room of an Escalade and it might do quite well.

    Regardless, a large, over the top flagship sedan would help restore Cadillac to its historic status as a world class luxury auto maker, not just a retailer for pimped out Yukons and little BMW wannabes. I think dropping the flagship project is just another of a string of bad decisions by the de Nysschen regime. Here’s your opportunity, Lincoln, handed to you on a silver platter.

    • 0 avatar
      Kyree S. Williams

      I’m 5’10”, and have some real trouble getting into the rear seat of the ATS. I can just imagine how bad it would be for someone who is over 6 feet tall.

      • 0 avatar
        FreedMike

        To an extent, the rear seats in just about any compact sport sedan suck. I tried getting into the back seat of a 3-series BMW and it was no picnic either.

        The ATS’ back seat area just sucks more than most. They do need to fix that.

        • 0 avatar
          Kyree S. Williams

          I dunno…the current 3-Series’ backseat is roomier than a 5-Series with the thicker MultiContour/Comfort seats. It’s one of the roomier vehicles, along with the Infiniti Q50.

    • 0 avatar
      NormSV650

      The XTS hunchback look is due in some part to rear ride height. I lowered the rear of my VSport by almost two inches and doesn’t look as bad as a CLA or Charger.

  • avatar

    BMW makes an M7 with a V12. They don’t sell a lot of them.

    A Halo car isn’t mass market. It just needs to exist for the perceived status to trickle down.

    It is the $5,000 handbag marketing trick. We don’t expect to sell many handbags for 5K..maybe a few. It exists to make the $800 handbag look downright reasonable. All the people with the $800 handbag know about the $5k version…all they need to know is ONE person who has it…and it justifies the 100’s of $800 bags you sell. There will always be the one, and yes, everyone else will know who she is. While slightly envious of the 5k bag buyer, all the $800 dollar folks will think they “got a deal”.

    Likewise, a V12 M/B or BMW, an RS7, or a CT8. Go really big and put a V16 in there…they’ll sell. Not a lot, but make an exclusive-you don’t need permission from Germany, and you’ll sell enough to justify the exercise.

    Now, the ATS piling up on lots, that is a different story, and you shouldn’t conflate them….

    • 0 avatar
      sportyaccordy

      A V16 CT8 won’t fix all the problems plaguing the ATS/CTS. GM would be wiser to spend the money overhauling CUE and making the back seats on those cars competitive.

    • 0 avatar
      CoreyDL

      False. The M7 does not yet exist. The closest you can get is the M760Li.

      • 0 avatar
        Kyree S. Williams

        Interestingly, BMW is only selling the long-wheelbase variants of the 7-Series here in the U.S. this time around. I suspect that’s because those are the only ones anyone ever bought. So all of them are just badged as -i models (750i, M760i, etc…), even though they are technically the -Li variants.

        • 0 avatar
          CoreyDL

          Huh, so it’s long without being labeled as such. Interesting.

        • 0 avatar
          sportyaccordy

          Mercedes has been doing the same with the S since the W221 I think. Makes sense- width aside the large sedan segment is not far off from the “midsize” segment in size.

          • 0 avatar
            Kyree S. Williams

            True, but there *is* no shorter-wheelbase S-Class. The standard S-Class is as long as the A8L and the long-wheelbase 7-Series. There is still a short-wheelbase 7-Series; BMW has just chosen not to sell it stateside.

          • 0 avatar
            CoreyDL

            These chassis code mentions made me look up to see which one I really hated, and thought was poor quality and Buick-like.

            W220, my least favorite S-Class ever. Followed by the W221 and it’s bubbly wheel arches which are so pronounced in silver. I’m not too keen on the W222 either for looks, but I know it’s a better car than the 220 and 221.

            W126 and W140 signify a real S-Class to me.

          • 0 avatar
            sportyaccordy

            My only memory of the W220 are riding around in my friend’s parent’s S430 when it was new, on the prowl for chicks :)

          • 0 avatar
            Kyree S. Williams

            The W220 made its way into a lot of late-90s/early-aughts rap and R&B songs, as I recall:

            “Soldier, cash money, rule your world
            What’s topping that?
            Huh, S-four-three-oh keep me on my toes
            Get a tingle in my spine, — —- only he knows”

            -“Hot Boyz (Remix)”, Missy Elliot.

      • 0 avatar

        I thought I saw one at the NY Auto Show, but it had been three hours at that point :)

    • 0 avatar
      Kyree S. Williams

      There’s no M7 *yet*. There will be a partial-M model of the 7-Series, the M760i.

      You might be thinking of the Alpina B7, which isn’t the same as an M.

      Also, I don’t think the 12-cylinder versions of the S-Class, 7-Series and A8 really drip prestige onto to the lesser V8-powered versions of the same. The standard S-Class, for example, justifies itself. For a little over $100K, you get an S550 that is an extremely, well-built, full-featured limousine. The S600, S63, S65 and Mercedes-Maybach models are for people who want a little (or a lot) extra. But the ordinary S550 is a proven choice, and it would have no trouble selling even if it *were* the end of the line.

    • 0 avatar
      Hummer

      Take two 6.2L V8 engines, attach them end to end and you have your V16 flagship engine right there

  • avatar
    CoreyDL

    Paging DW! This article is just for yous!

    • 0 avatar
      DeadWeight

      I’m here, brah!

      Cadillac: Standard of the World.

      Daring greatly, powered by 2.0T 4 bangers!

      The Arena; Narrated By Millennial Chick

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDCX4sxU-iS

      CT6 “Daring” – by Jason Wu

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JNezjVnaV14

      HOW COULD CADILLAC MISS WITH PRODUCTS & ADS LIKE THESE?!?!

      • 0 avatar
        CoreyDL

        LOL

        Yay!

      • 0 avatar
        28-Cars-Later

        That Jason Wu link had exactly 28 views :D

        Who the hell is Jason Wu again?

        • 0 avatar
          DeadWeight

          Jason Wu is an Asian-American fashion designer whose mom encouraged him to play with dolls and girls clothes when he was a wee lad, and now he’s featured, puddle-skipping in SoHo, in some obscure reference to Cadillac, in commercials featuring the angry, long-eyebrow faced CT6 (flagship).

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            Gotcha.

            Additional: I get GM wants to be able to run commercials in China for this model, but maybe somebody other than a fashion designer would be more appropriate. I’m not a CT6 leaser/buyer but I seriously had no idea who Mr. Wu was nor do I care a bit about him, if anything its not helping the model in my eyes. GM if you want to stick an Asian face in your commercial that’s cool but try to find someone more accomplished, at least for the sedan commercial. I’m sure brain dead Gen Y women might know this man and care when you’re trying to sell them a new purse on wheels but let’s be honest, that’s not the target market of this model.

          • 0 avatar
            DeadWeight

            Audi went with a commercial featuring hipster (yet fairly accomplished Chef and owner of Momofuku) Korean-American chef, David Chang.

            http://www.grubstreet.com/2014/03/david-chang-audi-commercial.html

            Uwe Pen Boy scrounged hard to counter with Jason Wu (who very few heard of).

            Gotta hand it that Cadillac marketing team; just when you think they hit rock bottom, they manage to surprise again and again…and again.

      • 0 avatar

        “What is this thing? … Avalon? … No … Hyundai? … No … Kia? … No … Yugo? … No … (Shows badge) … I am shocked – is it a Cadillac???”

  • avatar
    VenomV12

    I’m beginning to think Cadillacs other than the Escalade only sell in the Midwest. I go all over the country and the only place I ever see them is in the Midwest. I was just in NYC for a week plus some time in Connecticut, Boston and Maine and saw no CTSs, ATSs etc etc, only some new Escalades. Park Avenue and Fifth Avenue had tons of new S-Classes as did the rest of the places I went, I saw zero new 7 Series and a handful of Audi A8s. I even saw a new Maybach on Fifth Avenue. It’s pretty clear who is dominating the top end luxury car segment. In terms of the mid range luxury car segment, I would say it is a tossup between the E-Class lease specials and the A6 lease specials but I would lean more towards Audi. Of course the dark horse in the room is Tesla where I see more and more all the time on the road, especially in Chicago. In a lot of ways I think the people that Cadillac hopes to snag from Mercedes, BMW, Audi and Lexus might go to Tesla and not them if they ever leave those brands and skip Cadillac altogether.

    • 0 avatar
      CoreyDL

      The only Maybach I ever did see was in South Korea, and it was parked right up on the sidewalk because f*ck you, I’m rich.

    • 0 avatar

      In the leafy, golden ‘burbs of NYC, Bergen County, Westchester County, Fairfield County and Nassau County, Caddy doesn’t sell as the aspirational brand. You see lots of them “in service”, they’ll take you to the airport, but as far as private buyers, VenomV12 is spot on. Your XTS is car service.

      Lots of leased BMW and Audi-I have multiple neighbors on BMW or Audi lease #3. Tesla is the car to get instead of another E Class Lease if you have multiple cars. I can go all day in Westchester without seeing a new model CTS, and I’ve never seen a CT6 in the wild. I’ve actually seen more McLarens ! Mr. V12 is again correct, in that the only Caddy in the School Run of $80k trucks in certain Villages will be an Escalade…and only the current model, never, ever, last generation.

      Nope, Caddy hasn’t cracked the code in the big four burbs…most folks when they see my CTS, make a crack about me being officially old, but then when they ride in it are impressed by the power, quiet and ride. They are legitimately surprised GM can build a decent car. It is sad to say, but for most of my demographically desirable peeps, most have never had much exposure to Caddy, save great uncles’ Fleetwood when they were kids. They still aren’t putting 50k down, though, on the GM car….

      My second gen CTS is actually a rare car here in the most competitive area in the US, save LA.

      • 0 avatar
        CoreyDL

        “and I’ve never seen a CT6 in the wild”

        They’re literally just hitting dealers -just now-, this week.

      • 0 avatar
        28-Cars-Later

        I just watched a review on YT, looks comfy but very tight inside. Nice power and sound, but it does it on a one-off engine, which to me means drive now & fail later. I mean for the right money its a maybe, but still not too different than the Sigma Catera, which I always thought was too small, but otherwise halfway decent for what it was.

        youtube.com/watch?v=tRFlNCT3ylc

    • 0 avatar
      clivesl

      I have seen more of the ATS than I would have expected here in the Bay area. I probably see more Cadillac cars than I do SUV’s around here.

      It’s funny, as I said, around here you can kind of see where Cadillac is trying to go. German rides are so thick on the ground here that Cadillac is actually making some inroads with their sport sedans.

      I’ve always thought it was the right way to go for Caddy to try and reclaim their performance chops before trying to compete with the imports in the less sport focused luxury market.

      Now they need the first luxury minvan. Slap some gull wings on a Lambda, load that sucker up with all the technology you can find and sell it for 60K all day long.

    • 0 avatar
      ajla

      Cadillacs other than the Escalade and SRX don’t sell anywhere. NYC to Nebraska. From sea to shining sea.

  • avatar
    kmars2009

    When well heeled people want a large, opulent car, the first vehicle that comes to mind is the Mercedes-Benz S Class.
    The second, would either be the Audi A8L, or BMW 7 Series.
    Third would be Lexus LS, or even Genesis.
    Cadillac is dreaming if they think they can compete.
    They need to keep their eyes on Lincoln, as Lincoln seems to be making a resurgence. The pics of the upcoming 18 Navigator, look like Cadillac Escalade will be having some competition.

    • 0 avatar
      el scotto

      When well heeled people want a large opulent car; they schedule one with their car service.

    • 0 avatar
      bd2

      The historical sales volume of the A8 indicates that the A8 is NOT anywhere close to being the 2nd flagship sedan that comes to mind after the S Class.

      That would be the 7 Series with the LS being for those who are more price-conscious (or reliability conscious).

      • 0 avatar
        kmars2009

        I will admit A8L sales don’t compare to S Class or 7 Series, however, I’m not referring to ONLY the American market. The A8 sells better in Europe. People in the American market aren’t ALWAYS the trend setters.
        The A8L is a fine luxury car. I think it looks a little too much like the lesser models from Audi. Hence the low sales. People want to stamd out when spemding that kind of cash.
        Lexus LS is becoming too ugly in the front. Maybe that will divert sales elsewhere.

    • 0 avatar
      derekson

      The idea that Cadillac needs to learn from Lincoln is pretty hilarious.

      • 0 avatar
        kmars2009

        The fact that GM needed a government bailout, and Ford didn’t, is even MORE hilarious. Especially since Cadillac cars are doing poorly! Lincoln is increasing it’s sales…and didn’t even rip the government off.

  • avatar
    01 Deville

    Escalade name has probably more brand equity than Cadillac. So I will rename all cadillac SUV/Crossovers Escalade. Cancelling CT8 makes sense, it can be replaced with extended wheelbase CT6 with interior benchmarked against S-Class. This is where Johann and his marketing crew can be useful where they decide on the execution rather than a GM lifer saying to me the interior looks equivalent to S-Class.

    • 0 avatar
      DeadWeight

      “This is where Johann and his marketing crew can be useful…”

      Inherent, logical fallacy.

      Rejected by system.

      Please try again later.

      • 0 avatar
        01 Deville

        Johann might not understand Cadillac but he understands luxury and marketing. He is also making a team of like minded people who understand marketing. Allow me to say that Cadillacs of past decade have lacked many things but nothing stands out more than lack of vision for the brand. Hopefully Johan will provide that for Cadillac. He made Audi what it is today. I still remember looking at A8 when it came out in early 90s and comparing it against W140 S-Class and thinking what are people at Audi smoking, but guess what Audi is a global force that MB and BMW are afraid of everyday.

        BTW I have nothing invested in Johan besides maybe a future large RWD sedan that I can buy after first few years of depreciation. Your silly insults for him do not bother me, but I feel that he can make a difference at Cadillac based on what I have seen from him so far. Two quick examples.

        1. He realized the error of price parity and priced CT6 correctly.
        2. He acknowledged that Escalade needs refinement, this suggests an attitude of improving your most successful product, rather that if it ain’t broke don’t fix it mentality so clearly evident in GM products.

        • 0 avatar
          DeadWeight

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXXwssdBRYY

          Somber CT6 face:

          http://www.ooyuz.com/images/2016/0/21/1453421882745.jpg

          https://drawception.com/pub/panels/2012/4-6/MGwqNKttRR-6.png

        • 0 avatar
          28-Cars-Later

          I haven’t read the resume on the man but from what I do know it seems his one trick seems to be “rename everything”. Time will tell, so far he’s already said a series of stupid things but he also has to promote decisions which took place before his tenure to which he may or may not agree. Like many things, the jury is out on JdN’s business ability vis-à-vis Cadillac.

          1. I seem to recall him parroting it at a much higher price. He may not have made the higher price decision and simply ran with it, but it was only after *we* pointed out the futility and I assume JdN’s staff agreed, was a new price announced. An more effective leader would never have made the higher priced announcement in the first place.

          2. Perhaps, but JdN is well aware of his technical limitations on using a shared Chevrolet platform. I’m not sure what the improvements could be, but I would be interested to see the refinements. I rode in an Escalade EXT in Las Vegas, other than soft touch all around it struck me as a fancy Suburban.

          • 0 avatar
            01 Deville

            Regarding 1. I think he was still trying to find his feet.

            Regarding 2. My blueprint for Escalade would be G-Class. Although the internals will be a crude truck. Interior can be bench-marked against S-Class. Escalade is the only reason Cadillac cannot be written off, as this a vehicle with penetration (with or without length) into real money households.

            I am still not 100% convinced that Johan is the best that can happen to Cadillac but at least he has a long term plan, and he is ready to take accountability for his decisions by agreeing to report Cadillac financials independently.

            While I don’t expect Musk or Jobs like vision from GM Board, I think they have enough smarts between them to not commit billions to a BS plan.

        • 0 avatar
          CoreyDL

          “I still remember looking at A8 when it came out in early 90s”

          Minor point of history, the A8 was available in the US starting in 98. If it was early 90s, you’d be looking at the Audi V8 still.

          • 0 avatar
            01 Deville

            OK by looking I meant watching it on either Auto Motor Und Sport or some other European presentation in late 93.
            First time I drove a used one was in mid 2000’s and wasn’t much impressed compared to a used E38.It didn’t matter though because I was a broke grad student.
            It still doesn’t matter I suppose, as I won’t be able to afford a new car in that class in the foreseeable future.

  • avatar
    Nigel

    My guess is the bean counters determined that on realistic projected sales the CT8 as envisioned and designed was a money loser. If that’s the case it was the right move.

    Now if some genius in NYC would just notice their most successful product has a proper name and not some mumbo-jumbo naming scheme and think “hum let’s call CT6 a Deville or Seville” that would be something.

  • avatar
    bd2

    If true (confirmation from GM), surprised and not surprised.

    Surprised since JdN had long stated that the CT6 was the SWB “flagship” and that a proper flagship (CT8) was on the way.

    Not surprised since luxury sedan sales are falling, esp. at the higher end of the market (where only the S Class really sells in large nos.).

    The main problem with the ATS and CTS was limited passenger room compared to the competition which is a major no-no for the US market which places a premium on space.

    In a way, the CT6 is like an upsized replacement for the CTS.

    There’s a good chance that we won’t see a replacement for both the ATS and CTS and that we will see one sedan that is a “tweener” in size (basically going back to the size of the 1G/2G CTS) with maybe an A3/1 Series/CLA competitor that isn’t much smaller than the ATS.

    Hopefully, this isn’t a total “cancellation” and that a proper flagship sedan will be revived down the road.

    Probably leads credence to Cadillac still doing an Omega-based crossover that will slot above the FWD 3-row and the Escalade.

    But Cadillac has been painfully slow in expanding its crossover lineup.

    • 0 avatar
      28-Cars-Later

      The Alpha CTS is a “tweener” and it sucks. My message to them is stop building crappy sedans with no room inside, build crappy crossovers with no interior room instead.

  • avatar
    Von

    I only clicked on the article to see DW’s response to it. Skipped the article, and went straight to the comments. DW delivered the goods.

  • avatar

    We Officially Give Up Trying: By pulling the plug on its much-hyped CT8, Cadillac is no longer pretends to be interested in reclaiming its onetime “Standard of the World” title.

    I saw the new XT5 crossover and CT6 sedan at the NY Auto Show. Underwhelmed. At best they’re OK. Let’s just say that the Lincoln Continental and Hyundai’s Genesis sub-brand are more credible designs in that price and market range.

    XT5 might do OK for a few years but w/out that and Escalade sales, they are so screwed.

    • 0 avatar
      DeadWeight

      Johan should be fired.

      Full stop.

      End of rational debate.

      He put his vision of Cadillac as a Mercedes/BMW/Audi competitor, in every segment, by 2020 out there, and had Mary Barra sign off on a quite expensive 12 billion USD pot of money dedicated exclusively to Cadillac, while also moving Cadillac’s HQ to SoHo, and getting full autonomy over advertising/branding via Publicus (that fielded one of the worst ad/marketing campaigns thus far in automotive history).

      Johan brought in Uwe Ellinghaus and Melody Lee, who both have been unmitigated failures at successfully rebranding Cadillac, also.

      Johan went out of his way to talk up price parity with the Germans, while now admitting this is not even remotely possible.

      Johan went out of his way to discuss the fact that Cadillac has close to 1000 dealerships, that sell 1/5 as many vehicles as the average BMW or Audi Dealership, and that he was going to both upgrade these dealerships handmade their numbers, which hasn’t happened (and won’t happen).

      Johan “talked up” the need for high-end, halo vehicles, in an effort to conquest Mercedes, BMW and Audi loyalists, and there has been no progress on that front.

      When will the hollow excuses Johan and his apologists causally and frequently toss out be called the bull$hit that they are, with delay, after delay, and excuse after excuse, and when will Johan be correctly and accurately labeled a failed division head?

  • avatar
    kmars2009

    Lincoln will be killing it soon enough with the Continental, Navigator, Aviator, and renamed MkZ (Zephyr?). They are even considering a version of the Mustang. Not sure if it will be Mark IX or Capri.

  • avatar
    laserwizard

    The problem with Cadihack is that its design language of Arts and Scientology (!) is rancid – it is stale – even though Cadihack has the nerve to charge $80K for a car that isn’t even luxurious on the inside – who approved that horrificly cheap grey plastic surround in the center of the dash?

    Cadihack has to completely re-think its disaster of design and find something that actually has style!

  • avatar
    laserwizard

    Cadihack has to reduce its models and reduce its production – it must become more exclusive in order to command the outrageous prices they are charging; they must rethink their interior design – and those bland exteriors are not worth squat. These cars must be bold and stunning. Cadihack should adopt a build to order and custom order model. Right now Cadihack is just an $80K Chevrolet that isn’t any better than a GMC.

    • 0 avatar
      28-Cars-Later

      We’ve discussed this ad nauseum, Cadillac has too many dealers and thus produces semi-premium volume models but tries to price them as premium/luxury products which doesn’t work. The brand needs to reduce the amount of dealers it has before it can successfully market, let alone produce, truly premium product.

  • avatar
    kmars2009

    GM still hasn’t figured out that old people like BIG cars, not BMW WANNABES! LOL

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