By on March 4, 2015

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The Canadian-market Chevrolet Orlando is dead, according to sales analyst Timothy Cain. Thanks to some sleuthing, Cain discovered that GM Canada quietly killed off the Orlando for 2015.

The Orlando never managed to make a dent in the Canada small minivan market, despite being the right car for Canadian market and road conditions. More than likely, the sub-$20,000 Dodge Caravan Canada Value Package stole away customers who wanted an affordable minivan that can haul a couple of kids and their hockey bags. The success of the Caravan has always been a thorn in the side of other small vans like the Mazda5 and Kia Rondo.

 

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56 Comments on “Chevrolet Axes Slow Selling Orlando In Canada...”


  • avatar
    DrGastro997

    “Orlando” axed seems to be a logical move by GM- that’s one ugly thing.

  • avatar
    Arthur Dailey

    GM may have pulled out prematurely here.

    Yes the $19.995 Dodge Caravan hurt the sales of the smaller micro-vans such as the Mazda 5, Rondo and Orlando. But Chrysler/Fiat have already announced that they are killing the Caravan and moving their mini-van upmarket, thus leaving room for these smaller vehicles.

    I work with someone who has an Orlando (downsized from an Uplander) and it is actually quite a nice vehicle. Great sightlines, decent ride, lots of interior room and comfortable front seats.

    • 0 avatar
      psarhjinian

      I agree: if Dodge axes the Caravan, either Fiat isn’t making money on them at all, or they’re supremely strategically inept. In terms of marketshare—and yes, Canada isn’t large—the Caravan is up there with the Civic, Corolla and F-Series.

      I’ve seen a few Orlandos around and drove one. It rides like a Cruze, which isn’t a bad thing at all. What is unfortunate is that it’s pretty cramped, especially in the third row. The Mazda5 is bigger, and it’s a poor substitute for the short-wheelbase U-Body in terms of space (in every other way, though, it pistolwhips the U-Body).

      This is a tough market: the margins are super low, and if you make something competent, you’re likely stealing sales from something else in your lineup that’s higher-margin, like the Equinox and Traverse. It’s why Toyota and Honda don’t even try to price-match the Caravan.

      I expect we’ll see a City Express wagon trim replacing it.

  • avatar
    Hummer

    I saw a license plate I didn’t recognize, but it had a small dealership surround advertising plate holder thing. So I looked up th dealership to see where it was. Ended up being a place in Canada north of Maine, on the dealerships website I saw one of these for the first time, I have to say, this thing was destined to fail if price was so high a 20k caravan provided competition. It’s much too small to start anywhere near 20k.

    Mistakes like this will ensure automakers selling in Canada won’t be able to seperate Canada’s market from America. Now, if they get rid of the asinine differences in safety, equipment, and the Devils measurement system, the country as a whole would benefit with cheaper vehicles.

    • 0 avatar
      Maymar

      For what it’s worth, the Orlando was built in South Korea, so they already had a metric cluster available. And, this doesn’t meet US safety standards (I want to say it needed a knee airbag to pass?).

      Realistically, our more expensive vehicles are purely a factor of our traditionally weaker dollar, and our smaller, more spread out market.

  • avatar
    brianyates

    Hummer,what do you mean”the devil’s measurement system”?Did you know that it{I assume you’re referring to the metric system)works quite well in many countries in the world. When will the U.S. adopt it too? I understand that alot of NA built vehicles already have metric size nuts and bolts used in their manufacture.

    • 0 avatar
      Hummer

      It was a joke buddy, I’m well versed in both systems.

      GMs been using metric sizes since at least the 80s, but the joke is on Canada for spending billions to change to a system that’s costs the citizens twice since they have to pay for the original change and then for everything coming across from America.
      The U.S. will likely never change to the metric system, so long as we remain a (semi) World power, and the fact that the changeover would require trillions of dollars to move to a system that less than 20% of the population understands.

      Not a big deal, just fun to poke at it.

      • 0 avatar
        Drzhivago138

        “The metric system is the tool of the devil! My car gets 40 rods to the hogshead and that’s the way I likes it!”

      • 0 avatar
        HerrKaLeun

        Maybe only 20% of the US population understand the metric system….

        But how many US people actually understand the IP-system? Ask some random people in the US how many cubic feet are in a cubic mile. Or how many inches of water equal 1 psi? Probably fewer than 20%

        Actually surprising that time (besides the archaic am-pm) and electricity is measured in the same system.

        • 0 avatar
          Hummer

          True, but the number of people that understand the more basic concepts of the standard measurements is much greater than those that understand how to convert up and down through the metric system.

          And much as it goes against half of the arguments in favor of the metric system, the standard system just feels so natural, probably because I grew up using it, but everything about metric system just seems unnatural. Similarly the small scale on the Celsius range just doesn’t seem practical, at least next to the Fahrenheit system where you have a much wider range of values.
          As far as measurements, weight, etc there’s positives and negatives about both, going through the work it tends to be slightly easier using metric values, but again it’s much easier to picture the scale in standard values.

          Electricity by terms of being harvested and implemented is relative to history, fairly new, so there really wasn’t ever isolation separating science to create to seperate paths. Thank goodness, learning two seperate systems for electricity would be hell.

          • 0 avatar
            ect

            To be realist, it must be said that Imperial and US measures are like the manual transmission – waning and destined to disappear in time.

            Much of US industry already works in metric (certainly anyone who exports), and that will only increase. The auto industry has been fully metric for some decades.

            Whatever one’s personal preference might be, the writing is on the wall.

          • 0 avatar
            danio3834

            “Much of US industry already works in metric (certainly anyone who exports), and that will only increase. The auto industry has been fully metric for some decades”

            Truth. Relics like Hummer don’t realize that the globalized US industries function in the metric system already. The auto industry converts back to US customary units pretty much only for stubborn customers and technicians who refuse to learn new things.

          • 0 avatar
            Hummer

            It’s used in industry, I’m not going to argue with that, it’s fact. What I’m saying as a natural system that’s used in the everyday world, the standard system has more power in the United States. No one bakes a cake using ingredients measured in metric units; gas, and other liquids have been sold in standard units for at least the past 100 years, similarly speed has been measured in miles per hour. The U.S. cannot afford to replace a couple million road signs, they cannot change millions of pages of legislation or the ingrained use of the standard system with a piece of legislation.
            It’s simply not practical by any means.

            The more likely future is the strengthened schooling on understanding both systems, but with a lack of use by the majority of citizens, the standard will the dominant system.
            Danio, please actually read what I have to say before making jumps that don’t represent my views. It’s fairly common knowledge the majority of US industry is using the metric system.

          • 0 avatar
            danio3834

            I read what you wrote, but you’re not picking up what I’m laying down.

            You’re saying that it would be too difficult and expensive for the U.S. to convert. Never mind that it was already attempted because it was thoroughly researched and determined to be in the best interests of the U.S. to join the rest of the world in a unified system of measurement.

            What I’m saying is that it really wouldn’t be that much of a big deal as there are significant amounts of people in the U.S. who already use it and have been for a long time. Certainly more so than in 1975 when it was last tried. Not just in industry, but in government too as even most of the U.S. government officially uses the metric system. It’s even taught in schools.

            Aside from the obvious widespread use, the initial costs of switching could be easily offset by the reduced long term costs of not having to maintain measurements in both systems simply for the plebes who think the customary units just “feel better”.

          • 0 avatar
            Big Al from Oz

            @Hummer,
            If you are using a standard or system, why do you need to convert?

            In Australia why do I need to convert 1km into whatever?

            I was taught all systems of measurement. I did Elementary School in the US and finished Primary (Elementary) in Australia.

            Australia back then had the Imperial British system. So we were taught rods, links, furlongs, acres etc. Even fluid measures in Imperial are different than the US.

            Australia metrified in the 70s, best move ever. Imagine if the US currency was 12 pennies to a dime and 3 dimes to the dollar (yard). Makes as much sense.

            The metrification of the US should be more important than even the Keystone pipeline.

            As this directly affects trade and costs the US consumers money.

          • 0 avatar
            Pch101

            “What I’m saying is that it really wouldn’t be that much of a big deal as there are significant amounts of people in the U.S. who already use it and have been for a long time.”

            The US won’t be going metric, nor does it need to. It makes sense for science and manufacturing, but the average consumer gains nothing from switching.

          • 0 avatar
            mcs

            @hummer No one bakes a cake using ingredients measured in metric units;

            Check out the “Martha Bakes” series on PBS. I saw a preview and she is in fact weighing cake ingredients in grams. Online recipes on kingarthurflour.com can be switched over to metric weights and it’s the easiest and most accurate way to bake a cake. Try it yourself. Much easier than dealing with a measuring cup.

            I think future generations will get tired of the messy half-metric system in the US and change to full metric. Now, the question is when will countries like the UK, Japan, and Australia follow the rest of the world and start driving in the right side of the road. Sweden did it. Seems as though that would simplify vehicle design.

          • 0 avatar
            Pch101

            Switching sides would be very costly.

            When Sweden switched sides, many of the cars there were already LHD and the road network was less developed. Changing sides now would be pointless.

          • 0 avatar
            Pch101

            “Online recipes on kingarthurflour.com can be switched over to metric weights and it’s the easiest and most accurate way to bake a cake.”

            This is not an issue of metric vs. standard, but of volume vs. weight.

            The same thing could be accomplished by using pounds and ounces instead of cups and teaspoons.

          • 0 avatar
            ect

            mcs, the lhd/rhd issue is an interesting one to compare to metric/US.

            IIRC, the US represents about 5% of the world’s population, and is partially metric, partially Imperial/US measure. Metric is very gradually gaining ground, so people do and will increasingly need to know it in order to work in industry (or many government departments).

            It hasn’t been pointed out in these comments, but even the US military uses metric extensively. It’s simply necessary for operating with our allies. So, even grunt soldiers have to figure it out.

            Full metric conversion in the US is inevitable. It will take considerable time, but it will happen.

            By contrast, something approximating 1/3 of the world’s population drive on the left. They don’t seem to feel any pressing need to go through the agony of changing that, and there doesn’t seem to be any compelling reason why they should.

          • 0 avatar
            danio3834

            “The US won’t be going metric, nor does it need to. It makes sense for science and manufacturing, but the average consumer gains nothing from switching.”

            Most of the country already has. All that’s left is basically the consumer level. The costs of remaining a lone holdout of ever decreasing significance in an entirely metric world will inevitably cause it to happen more and more.

          • 0 avatar
            Pch101

            There’s no reason for the American consumer to switch, nor is there anything inevitable about switching. This passion for having a universal system of measurement for the mundane is this thread’s equivalent of Esperanto — it’s a political argument rather than a practical one. Buying and selling milk by the quart or the liter makes no difference at all.

        • 0 avatar
          S1L1SC

          Just ask them how many feet in a mile – I don’t know and I have lived here for 1/2 my life – but then most of my US-born co-workers can’t tell me either.

      • 0 avatar
        Pch101

        “the joke is on Canada for spending billions to change to a system that’s costs the citizens twice since they have to pay for the original change and then for everything coming across from America.”

        You haven’t been to Canada, have you?

        • 0 avatar
          Hummer

          Tell me what I said incorrectly, so that I know.
          I hope to be in Windsor in April.

          From articals I’ve read, and people that grew up in Detroit recounting the differences, I have a pretty good idea in as far as the cost to the citizens. And you can’t really say that testing and development for building a vehicle with slight differences for a relatively small market doesn’t make its way into new vehicle cost.

          • 0 avatar
            danio3834

            Vehicle standards are nearly completely unified for the two markets. If you mean the costs of installing a speedometer with the kilometer readings on the outer ring, you must be mistaken as to how much that actually costs to design and produce. GM had it pretty well figured out with their switchable units.

            The costs of packaging for different consumer preferences are far greater.

          • 0 avatar
            Pch101

            I frankly have no idea what you’re thinking — I’m just noting that what you’ve said makes no sense. It isn’t uniquely expensive to install a metric speedo in an instrument cluster.

          • 0 avatar
            mcs

            From what I remember, they just printed a different speedometer face for Canada. U.S. cars had kph numbers printed on the speedometer along with mph. At the time, I think the US was planning on switching to metric as well.

            When the switch happened, I was going to school in Boston and used to come home to Michigan by cutting across Canada, so I experienced the changeover first hand. From what I remember, it was easy to memorize the speed conversions and I didn’t have a problem. They also converted many of the signs by just spray painting over the old ones with a template.

            Modern digital speedometers are easy to switch. Just press a button or find the menu option (okay, maybe not always easy!) and you’re in metric mode.

          • 0 avatar
            Hummer

            Not just a speedometer, but day time running lights, developing a different series of units for the display computers, a new manual, I feel like I’m missing one or two more. I dont think Amber turn signals are required iirc?

            Either way I suppose it’s not that much more, I feel like I was thinking there were a list of differences last night, not sure why.

          • 0 avatar
            danio3834

            Many vehicles in the US already have DRLs, the vast majority have the capability to have it activated via control module configuration. The added cost is basically nil because cars are designed with the capability built in. Metric units aren’t being developed specifically for the Canadian vehicles, the vehicles are already largely designed in those units. If anything, the conversion to U.S. customary is the extra expense.

            Developing and printing French versions of manuals to comply with language laws costs more than managing the metric content.

          • 0 avatar
            Pch101

            “Not just a speedometer, but day time running lights, developing a different series of units for the display computers, a new manual, I feel like I’m missing one or two more.”

            What do daytime running lights have to do with metric?

            There is quite a bit of muddled thinking here.

          • 0 avatar
            Hummer

            I originally tried to seperate the regulations and metric system, I probably muddied the water somewhere.

      • 0 avatar
        deanst

        Metric probably dominates in industry in both countries. As far as consumer goods go, we just label our butter 454 grams (i.e. a pound) and the “metric conversion” is complete.

        Just don’t get me started on Americans’ inability to acknowledge the superiority of a robertson screwdriver. (Phillips really suck.)

        • 0 avatar
          danio3834

          A friend of mine moved from Canada to the U.S. a while back. When he remodeled his house, he want back to Canada to buy all the Robertson headed screws he needed to complete the job because of his preference for them. He jokes that the next person to move into that place will lose their minds if they even have to remove any fasteners.

        • 0 avatar
          Scoutdude

          Robertson and Phillips had two different design critera. Robertson is designed to not slip even if it means breaking the bit or screw ad has no concern of ease of engagement. Phillips are designed specifically to cam out before something breaks and to allow easy engagement.

          Personally I use neither and choose Phillips II also known as Phillips Square. They can be used with a Robertson, Phillips or their own bit that is included in the box. The incorporate the best of Robertson, Phillips and Posidriv into one universal drive.

          Note there is no need to drive to Canada to purchase Robertson they are commonly available at Home Depot. They are also commonly used in electrical panels.

          http://www.homedepot.com/p/Phillips-II-Plus-8-1-5-8-in-Phillips-Square-Flat-Head-Wood-Deck-Screws-5-lb-Pack-55162-0/203878181?N=bqmjZ1z0sgtkZ1z0sgtoZ5yc1vZ25ecod

  • avatar

    Everyone in Canada already knows:

    MOPAR or NO CAR.

  • avatar
    Firestorm 500

    Ugly killed the Orlando.

    That’s the worst looking front cap I’ve seen in a while. A Nissan Juke looks like Miss Canada next to the Orlando.

  • avatar
    TCragg

    My workplace (in Southern Ontario) has about 550 well-paid blue-collar employees. The parking lot is predictably populated with late-model F-150s, Sierras, Rams, Caravans, and various Honda/Toyota/Hyundai/Kia cars and SUVs. There is exactly one Orlando in a hideous shade of blue parked there every day. If my parking lot is a microcosm of the Canadian new car market, it’s easy to see why the Orlando is being axed. My wife had a GM supplier discount up until recently (X-plan or whatever GM calls it). When we purchased our Mazda 5 in 2012, we looked at the Orlando, and it was not appealing. The lack of sliding doors killed it for us. Not a horrible concept, but it wasn’t van enough for us, and despite the discount, we still bought elsewhere.

  • avatar
    jkross22

    If the Aztek and Nissan Cube had a baby….. and got most of the Aztek genes.

  • avatar
    Sjalabais

    Couldn’t resist:

    “Chevrolet Axes Slow Selling Chevrolet In Europe”

    Old news, yet I like the sound of it.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/car-manufacturers/chevrolet/10497312/GM-to-drop-Chevrolet-in-Europe.html

  • avatar
    Boxofrain

    I find in Canada most people operate with a mix of metric and imperial measurements. Ask someone what they weigh or how tall they are, you will get your answer in pounds and feet, not kilos and centimetres. All barbell plates in commercial gyms are in pounds. Very few kilo plates around. Distance on roadways is now discussed in kilos, not miles. Talk about the speed of a high performance car and you’ll be discussing it in MPH for the most part. Drag strips are 1/8 and 1/4 mile still.

    If you want someone to buy a bag of potatoes at the store you will ask them to get a 5, 10 or 20 pound bag. This product does not seem to be referred to in kilos. A package of bacon is still a pound of bacon, regardless of how many grams are in the package.

    • 0 avatar
      TCragg

      You are correct. The average citizen in Canada is fully Metricized in temperature, liquid measurement, and speed measurement. Weight and dimensions are, for the most part, still expressed in Imperial units by the average Canadian. Chalk that up to history, and the influence of our non-Metric neighbour to the south. I was born in the early 70s and attended school during the height of the Trudeau/Canada Metric Commission era, so we had zero education in Imperial measurement. Everything I know about pounds, feet, and gallons I learned from my parents or US car magazines. It didn’t help that the Mulroney government in the 80s scaled back the Metric program, so what was started by the Liberals was never really completed. It’s interesting that one of the reasons for Canada’s conversion to Metric was the imminent conversion by the USA (our largest trading partner), which would fully convert by the late 70s. Both Canadian and US Metric authorities were scaled back during the Mulroney/Reagan eras.

      • 0 avatar
        Arthur Dailey

        Exactly. In Canada there is a combination of both. I refuse to work in metric as a matter of principle and still get by with no problems.

        In the US I would guess that most industries also use metric, including all that export. Add in kitchen/prepared foods, the military, etc and probably most Americans have some working knowledge of metric.

        • 0 avatar
          ect

          “I refuse to work in metric as a matter of principle”

          Principle? Sounds more like just plain foolishness.

          I deal with Europeans in metric, Canadians mostly in metric (sometimes Imperial, where the context makes sense), and Americans mostly in Imperial/US. It’s nothing to get excited about.

  • avatar
    ixim

    Plenty of metric engine sizes here for years, as in 3.8l = 225 cubic inches (same as the old Mopar Slant Six).

    • 0 avatar
      Numbers_Matching

      A c t u a l l y ixim, 225 ci.in. ~ 3.7L
      I rmember seeing an old beater Dart with ‘3.7L’ stenciled on the fender.
      Popular ~3.8L engines? 229 Chevy, 231 Buick, 232 Essex Ford – all 90 degree V6s.

      • 0 avatar
        ixim

        Thx for the correction. FWIW, back in the Ford Administration, when the failed push to completely metricize the USA was on, one rule of thumb was 1l = 60 cubic inches. So 3.8 X 60 = 228 cubes. And my 2.4l ‘Nox is 144 inches. And those stingy inches generate 184 HP – way more than one horse per inch, something only old muscle cars could do, back then. And on half the gas.

  • avatar
    SteelyMoose

    Twenty-three posts that were nothing more than a standard vs. metric pissing match.

    Thank goodness for scroll wheels.

  • avatar

    No sliding doors ==> not a minivan.

  • avatar
    honda_lawn_art

    Chevy Orlando; almost sounds like a car built specially to be a rental for your Disney vacation.
    Maybe Chevy could give cars some really Canadian sounding names, like Frontenac, or Gordon.


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