By on November 10, 2016

Donald Trump, Image: Image: Gage Skidmore/Flickr (CC BY-SA 2.0)Threatening to move isn’t new.

16 years ago, legions of American citizens promised to leave the United States if Republican George W. Bush beat Democrat Al Gore. While there’s evidence that suggests emigration from the United States to Canada occurred at an accelerated rate during Bush’s two terms in the White House, it was more likely tied to the state of the economy overall than differences in personal politics.

But that didn’t stop Americans — not just celebrities, but Americans en masse — from shutting down Citizen And Immigration Canada’s website with excessive traffic on the night of 2016’s Trump electoral victory earlier this week.

Had the website operated normally, you would have discovered that moving to Canada isn’t easy. Yet your desire to relocate will not be sated by a move to sunny SoCal or the Florida Keys. You’re determined to live in Cape Breton, or Portage la Prairie, or Trois-Rivières. And in the automotive sphere, there are some things you really need to know.

2016 Honda Civic Coupe Touring Rallye Red frontFREIGHT
You’ve heard that Canadians pay more for cars, trucks, SUVs, and vans. That’s typically true, though not always. We discussed September Ford F-150 incentives that produced prices much lower in Canada than in the United States. Regardless, you anticipate higher prices. You’re prepared for that.

You may be less prepared to swallow the absurd freight/delivery/destination fees automakers charge in Canada. Take, for instance, Canada’s best-selling car, the Canadian-built Honda Civic. American Honda charges $835 for destination and handling. Honda Canada demands $1,595. (A $100 federal air conditioner fee is often included in destination charges.) Even accounting for the currency conundrum, that’s still USD $1,184, a 42-percent increase compared with American Honda’s fee.

It can be a lot worse. The Mercedes-Benz E300 4Matic I tested a couple of weeks ago was allegedly a $61,200 car, but with destination included, the base price shot up to $63,895.

TAXES
Sales taxes differ greatly across the country. Heeding the call of the popular Cape Breton If Donald Trump Wins website mentioned above would land you in Nova Scotia, where the $63,995 (with a/c fee) Mercedes-Benz E300 becomes $73,594 because of a highest-in-the-nation 15-percent harmonized sales tax.

Alberta, which collects the federal government’s 5-percent goods and services tax but has no provincial sales tax of its own, is the least-heavily-taxed new car environment.

STEELIES
Many parts of the Canada experience colder, snowier winters than many parts of the U.S. Pair Canada’s generally piercing winters with pragmatic buying habits, however, and the prevalence of steel wheels is undeniable.

Even on expensive cars, and often from October to April, Canadians love to throw a nice set alloys with Michelin Pilots into the back of the shed and fit a set of downsized, poverty-spec, steelies with Bridgestone Blizzaks instead.

Sitting in traffic with the sun rising at 8:45, the seat heaters on full blast, and the cars around you clouded by exhaust in -20°C weather, all of these steel wheels have an effect on your psyche. It’s like living on a street with nice homes where nobody mows the lawn; like sitting in your high-priced lawyer’s fancy office only to see his filthy keyboard.

Or maybe it’s just the timing. We alloy loyalists think it’s the steelies that get us down. But then again, the steel wheel onslaught is linked to the cold, the darkness, the scraping of windshields, and the snowplow once again clogging your driveway just after you’ve cleared it a second time.2015 GMC Sierra Crew Cab SLT 62 4x4 rearPICKUPS & MINIVANS
Americans like pickup trucks. But Americans don’t like pickup trucks as much as Americans liked pickup trucks a decade ago. In 2006, 17.5 percent of the new vehicles sold in America were pickup trucks. Americans were buying 240,000 per month.

Today, pickup trucks account for 15.2 percent of the market; Americans are buying 220,000 per month.

Moving to Canada? Prepare to see new pickup trucks forming a measurably larger portion of the new vehicle market. Canadians are buying more pickup trucks than ever. 19.1 percent of the Canadian auto industry’s sales are now produced by pickups, up from 15.8 percent in 2006.

Canadians are also far more likely to choose a minivan as their next family hauler. Nearly 5 percent of Canadian auto buyers opt for a minivan, compared with little more than 3 percent in the U.S.2016 Mazda CX-3 GT (1 of 25)MAZDA
Canadians buy different stuff. More long underwear, more double-doubles at Tim Hortons, more curling brooms.

Also, more Kia Rondos, Mazda 5s, Nissan Micras, and Toyota Venzas. Americans can’t buy those vehicles at all, but they account for 1 out of every 100 new vehicles sold in Canada. But besides the specific vehicles that distinguish the two markets, there are broader themes.

Consider the whole Mazda brand as a prime example. Though Mazda Canada’s market share is consistently declining, the brand still owns 3.5 percent of the Canadian market, more than double its U.S. share. Credit the Mazda 3, which, while struggling of late in Canada, is still the country’s fourth-best-selling car. (It ranks 20th in the U.S.)

Volkswagen almost doubles its U.S. share in Canada. Hyundai’s hold on the Canadian market is 64-percent stronger than it is in the U.S.

Chevrolet, on the other hand, owns just 7.5 percent of the Canadian market, way down from the Bowtie brand’s 11.8-percent share in the U.S.

FUEL
Those who’ve driven across the border before determining that a Trump presidency was cause for a northerly move will already be prepared for much higher fuel costs. For the rest of you, the facts may be frightening.

The U.S. average fuel cost hasn’t topped $3.00/gallon in the last two years and currently sits at $2.19/gallon.

In Canada, our average per gallon cost jumped to USD $4.55/gallon as recently as the spring of last year and now sits just below USD $4.00/gallon.

Sure y’all are ready for this?

Timothy Cain is the founder of GoodCarBadCar.net, which obsesses over the free and frequent publication of U.S. and Canadian auto sales figures. Follow on Twitter @goodcarbadcar and on Facebook.

[Image: Gage Skidmore/Flickr (CC BY-SA 2.0)]

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146 Comments on “So A Trump Win Means You’re Moving To Canada? Here’s What You Need To Know, Automotively...”


  • avatar
    Deaks2

    We graciously agree to take in 40 000 American refugees per year. ;) We have practice from the lake incident this past summer.

    Seriously though, I was reading some of the news coverage in the Globe and Mail and the CEO of a tech company stated that they were hoping for a US immigration freeze as it will allow Canada to swallow up the highly skilled folks who would have otherwise moved to the USA. Interesting though…

  • avatar
    Arthur Dailey

    SALT! Yes in caps. Not used in all parts of the country. Some areas use the much more environmentally friendly sand.

    But salt destroys cars. You will need to get your’s Krowned annually.

    And that also means that there are far fewer ‘old’ cars around. They have rusted out. In Canada the body traditionally dies before the engine does. So forget about buying your $3k beater and driving it to 400,000 kms.

    In Quebec winter tires are mandatory. That will soon probably spread to other provinces.

    Hatchbacks and wagons also sell more proportionally in Canada than in the USA.

    And don’t forget to add an engine block heater. Otherwise in some parts of Canada your car will not start the next morning.

    • 0 avatar
      heavy handle

      The biggest difference between the US and Canadian markets is that cars don’t last in (most of) Canada, and they consequently do not hold their value.

      Reminds me of the story earlier this year about the reader who was thinking of bringing his 1990s Accord to Ottawa. His would be one of the very few 1990s cars in Ottawa, at least during the winter months.

      This explains why Canadians buy more new cars per capita, but also cheaper cars overall. It’s not that we don’t like premium SUVs and pickups as much as Americans do. The reality is that the people who would buy mid-range used cars in the US get cheap new cars instead.

      • 0 avatar
        brn

        “The biggest difference between the US and Canadian markets is that cars don’t last”

        Hmmm, does that have anything to do with? “more Kia Rondos, Mazda 5s, Nissan Micras, and Toyota Venzas”

        • 0 avatar
          heavy handle

          brn,

          If you had read the rest of my comment, you would know.

          The Rondo, 5 and Micra are cheap entry-level cars that would not sell in the US because they compete with used cars. Think about it, would you rather buy a decent used car or a Micra? In the US it’s a no-brainer. In Canada the Micra makes sense because it has a warranty and isn’t rusted.

          As for the Venza, it’s Toyota’s Dodge Journey-equivalent. It’s a Camry that can hold your kids’ hockey gear and that’s high enough to get them to the rink in a snow storm. Think soccer Mom, driving through a blizzard.

          • 0 avatar
            Arthur Dailey

            @heavy. The original Rondo was more expensive than the base level Caravan. The Rondo came with heated front seats and fog lights as standard equipment.

            The new Rondo, not available in the USA can now be purchased with a manual transmission. Making it about the same price as the base Caravan but still more than the base Journey. And a fully tricked out Rondo moves it into Mercedes B class pricing territory.

            And it is more expensive than low end Civics, Jettas, Corollas or Elantras. Let alone the smaller cars.

            So no, it does not compete with used cars. The same goes for the Mazda 5 which is priced higher than the Mazda 3.

            The Venza is certainly not an inexpensive vehicle. And the cost and difficulty of finding winter tires for it is exorbitant.

            You are however correct, in that cars do not last as long in Canada. However the prices for good used cars in Canada are generally higher than in the USA.

      • 0 avatar
        jdspielman

        That 90’s Accord would probably be stolen right away as well.

    • 0 avatar
      BigOldChryslers

      Yep, if you want your vehicles to last in parts of Canada where they salt the roads in winter, get them oil sprayed at Krown every fall.

  • avatar
    Pch101

    An article about RIV and the importation rules could be helpful.

    In the interest of public welfare, an advisory about the man-eating potholes of Montreal is probably warranted.

    Along those lines, are there places where one can trade in limbs and first-born children in order to pay for Ontario car insurance? Maps of their locations would be helpful.

    • 0 avatar
      orenwolf

      My insurance rate, for my ’16 Mazda 6, is about $165/month ($CDN), from within the GTA. Damn right you’re going to pay more. Don’t come to Ontario if you don’t want to pay taxes for things like health care and social services, or regulated insurance, prescription and telecommunications rates. :)

      As for steelies, man I hate them – I was lucky enough to get a steal on some OEM alloys from a base model Mazda6 from the dealer, from a customer who bought a new car and installed their own, larger rims. They were technically “used” since they arrived on the vehicle “driven” about 10km, but I’ll live. :)

      As for cars, most Ontario dealers are members of OMVIC, and offer some rights for vehicle purchases: https://www.omvic.on.ca/portal/Consumers/ConsumerProtection/KnowYourRights.aspx

      • 0 avatar
        CoreyDL

        “’16 Mazda 6, is about $165/month”

        :O Holy crap! Are you <25 as well, so higher risk? Multi-car discount? Multi line renter/homeowner discount?

      • 0 avatar
        Arthur Dailey

        5 drivers and 3 cars. None worth more than $10k. Zero claims (touch wood) for over 20 years. All with clear abstracts. $1,000 deductible.

        Auto insurance per year, just over $5,500.

        Please bring in public auto insurance like some of the western provinces.

        • 0 avatar
          heavy handle

          Arthur,

          You must be in the GTA.

          • 0 avatar
            Arthur Dailey

            @heavy. Yes. Currently the annual appreciation on the house more than makes up for the cost of insurance. Heck, the house made more this year than I did.

            But there are smaller cities in the province where I would pay about 40% less.

            We are shopping for a new vehicle, which means that the insurance will go up, again. The 3rd car is worth less than $1k as a trade. So I thought about just keeping it. But if we do keep it as a 4th vehicle, it would add around $2k to the annual insurance cost!

      • 0 avatar
        GS 455

        In Manitoba (public insurance) with a perfect driving record insurance for your Mazda 6 would be $1390 CDN per year and the annual driver’s licence fee would be $35. Manitoba’s drivers have the lowest mumber of winter tire users in Canada partly due to drier winters, partly due to misguided belief that “all season” tires = 4 seasons but mostly because they are too cheap to get a 2nd set of tires. Interestingly judging by steelie use it’s been my observation that Mazda drivers have the highest rate of winter tire use.

      • 0 avatar
        Jagboi

        I pay about $120/month for a 2007 Jaguar X Type, minus front glass coverage, but with rental car and uninsured motorist coverage.

        Because of the gravel that is used on the roads in winter here, a typical windshield life is about 2 years. I priced it out and I can just about pay for a new windshield every 2 years with what the insurance costs, and if I pay for it myself I don’t have any claims.

        Other thing to think of is Canadian insurance typically is greater coverage, I think the minimum public liability policy you can by is a million dollars coverage, mine is 2 million.

      • 0 avatar
        Lou_BC

        My F150 crew is around $133/month for insurance. My wife’s Sienna is around 108/month. I’d pay more if I lived in Vancouver.

    • 0 avatar
      Monty

      2010 BMW 335I, a 2012 Nissan Versa Hatchback – total combined insurance bill for two drivers with maximum merit points is $2470

      And we have dedicated rims and snow tires – a good investment due to not the conditions, but to other drivers bad habits.

      It was +19C (+70F) here in Winnipeg MB yesterday, so no sign of snow anytime soon!

  • avatar
    SCE to AUX

    I’d like to see all those US celebrities who threatened to leave the country if Trump won, do so. They’ll discover how little they are missed.

    • 0 avatar
      Higheriq

      I always wondered why those folks never mentioned moving to Mexico – don’t they realize it’s warmer down there.

      • 0 avatar
        2manycars

        Many if not most “liberals” are closet racists and bigots. They don’t want to move to Mexico and live with little brown people. They want to be in Canada or Europe amongst what they view as erudite, elite white folk — all the while criticizing those they disagree with politically for imagined racism.

        Wherever they go, such an emigration is a beautiful thing. Having the most ardent Leftists move out of the U.S. would be the best thing that ever happened here.

        • 0 avatar

          Actually it has more to do with not wanting to live in a 3rd world country.

          Also, I’m not going anywhere anytime soon. I am staying behind to fight for America.

        • 0 avatar
          Steve Biro

          Point of information: You should correct this to be “liberal elite.” Most liberals are not members of the political and media elite. They’re just open-minded.

          • 0 avatar
            jkross22

            Open minded? You mean the ‘safe space’ liberals on campus demanding separate dorms for minorities? Or the California liberals who want to borrow $65-100 billion to build a train from SF to LA while other infrastructure in the state gets ignored and middle class residents can’t afford a public state college.

            Yeah, they’re real open minded.

          • 0 avatar
            Lou_BC

            In Canada smaller towns and rural areas are usually conservative. Big cities are liberal. That isn’t really much different than the USA.

    • 0 avatar
      CoreyDL

      Those celebrities are mostly on TV and in movies – which can be done from anywhere anyway. It’s such a stupid threat.

    • 0 avatar
      heavy handle

      That list was a hoax anyway. It’s made-up of a few comedians who made trite jokes, people who said “I’m rich, so I have a choice, but most people don’t,” and a few “I already work outside of the US.” Taken out of context, and spun by the political machine, it made for some filler for the news channels and sites, but there’s no substance beneath.
      Nobody (other than Randy Quaid) really wants to change their citizenship.

    • 0 avatar
      slavuta

      I would say, we will see how little of these celebrities we will miss. Moreover, I will gladly provide armed escort [one way] for them through upstate NY border so there will not be attempts from some of the youth that protesting today, to make them stay.

    • 0 avatar
      indi500fan

      Sadly, at least according to ZeroHedge this morning, almost all have already welshed on their promises.

      But some prankster in LA did put up some nicely done real estate signs for them.

    • 0 avatar
      orenwolf

      They’re welcome to go to Monaco or something, we don’t want them here. In fact, you’re welcome to take Justin Beiber off our hands, as well.

    • 0 avatar
      ect

      Usually it’s the extreme right-wingers who threaten to move to Canada if something they don’t like comes to pass.

      My favourite in recent years was all the people screaming that they’d move to Canada if the Supreme Court upheld the Affordable Care Act, to get away from government-run health insurance.

  • avatar
    FormerFF

    Move to Canada? No, stay and fight for your country.

  • avatar
    True_Blue

    Also, prepare for long lines at border crossings, and the possibility of your vehicle being searched. I used to cross quite frequently at both the Queenston/Lewiston and the Peace Bridge… lengthy backups are a fact of life.

    55 mph is 88 kph. Enjoy the QEW!

    • 0 avatar
      sutherland555

      401 through the Greater Toronto Area is no picnic either. Guaranteed to have at least one accident and/or construction somewhere along the way.

      Don’t forget the Don Valley Parkway for good measure. Inexplicably jammed at odd hours for no good reason. Great drive when it’s clear though!

  • avatar
    danio3834

    You might have trouble getting over our wall ;) We’ve got lots of cool sh1t back here, buddy.

    Importing a car into Canada from the US is pretty easy since most standards are harmonized. As a bonus, we’ll take grey market vehicles at 15 years old rather than 25.

    The hardest part is getting the car OUT of the US as US CBP requires that you declare that you’re exporting the car from the country 72 hours in advance. Something about terrorism. There’s some paperwork to fill out which you may want a broker to help you with on your first try. Or just take it across without doing that since Canadian CBP doesn’t care.

    Once you get it to Canadian Customs, you’ll have to pay the $250 Registrar of Imported Vehicles bullsh1t fee, and $100 A/C excise tax. Then you’ll have to get an inspection from Canadian Tire to show that the vehicle has daytime running lights, and install them as required. Then you can go to The Ministry (or Registry) and get it registered and plated.

    • 0 avatar
      Adam Tonge

      “We’ve got lots of cool sh1t back here, buddy.”

      I’m not your buddy, guy! :)

      Also, all Americans that are fleeing to Canada because of the election should swim to freedom (Canada) across the Detroit River. It is only moving at three feet per second right now. You’ll be okay.

      • 0 avatar
        CoreyDL

        Oh yes, Ottawa left, Newfoundland right!

      • 0 avatar
        55_wrench

        @ Adam,
        I saw what you did there! Tried to think up another one, but my mind’s like a BB in a tin can this morning.

        I work for a Toronto-based company (great people BTW) and was just there last month. One of the features of Toronto revolves around two seasons: Winter and Construction. It’s a lot harder keeping the infrastructure going up there, so as fall sets in, the race is on to repair the damage from the previous winter.

    • 0 avatar
      BigOldChryslers

      I believe the 72 hour rule for cars being exported from the US has to do with them checking the VIN to make sure it’s not stolen, not related to terrorism specifically.

      Note that the US border offices that handle vehicle exports have lousy hours. Check their hours before planning your trip. Also, even if you do everything right and fax the paperwork to the office 72+ hours in advance of showing up with the car, they will have lost the paperwork and you’re at the mercy of the border agent to decide whether to approve the export on the spot or make you wait another 72 hours.

      Canada Border Services may not care whether you have the paperwork when you drive across, but the ministry of transport will not give you a Canadian ownership and plates unless you have the proper form and it is stamped by CBS. I imported a car and they forgot to stamp the form, which made for an unexpected adventure when I went to get it titled.

      Fortunately, the cars I’ve imported are old enough to not need RIV inspection. If you value your car, don’t take it to Crappy Tire.

      • 0 avatar
        mikey

        Agreed …… Think of the most terrible Dealer service you’ve ever received. Double that , and you can get some idea of the level of service to expect from Crappy Tire.

      • 0 avatar
        danio3834

        “Canada Border Services may not care whether you have the paperwork when you drive across, but the ministry of transport will not give you a Canadian ownership and plates unless you have the proper form and it is stamped by CBS”

        Without a stamp from US CBP showing that you exported it? No agency in Canada has given the most remote care to what the US CBP policy was in these situations. Yes, you need to complete the paperwork on the Canadian side to get it registered.

        As for Crappy Tire, they do the RIV inspections. Whatcha gonna do?

        • 0 avatar
          BigOldChryslers

          > As for Crappy Tire, they do the RIV inspections. Whatcha gonna do?

          Yes, if you need a RIV inspection you’re stuck dealing with them. I mostly threw that out there as a rule for Americans coming to Canada: Don’t take your car to Crappy Tire.

    • 0 avatar
      TDIGuy

      … and a 6.1% duty unless the car was built in North America.

      Last time I checked, inspection can be done by Canadian Tire unless it’s an Audi or BMW. THose have to be done at the dealership to (screw the customer), I mean ensure the correct parts are used. And BMW actually tries to tell you that a metric gauge cluster must be installed. Like the little KM/h numbers under the MPH are no good enough?

  • avatar
    Zackman

    This is hilarious!

    So-called “celebrities”, do you actually think anyone in the world cares? You have absolutely NO VALUE – your movies stink 95% of the time. So does your music and TV shows. See ya! Now you’ll drive Canada into the ground.

    I love my life, and it will get much better. Now I need to cancel my newspaper, too…

  • avatar
    CoreyDL

    Canadians buy much more Kraft Dinner as well.

  • avatar
    Arthur Dailey

    We have had previous mass migrations to Canada from the USA.

    The United Empire Loyalists. Their descendants still view themselves much like the descendants of those who landed at Plymouth Rock do in the USA.

    The Underground Railroad and its freed slaves.

    A mass migration of farming folk from the Midwest to the free land offered on our Prairies. This is one reason why Alberta has historically had a more populist/conservative political climate than the rest of Canada.

    The ‘draft dodgers’ of the Vietnam War era. The number who ended up teaching on our high schools and universities is staggering, as most did not leave the USA until their deferment as university students ended.

    This time I believe that it is mostly empty threats and hot air. Will not see a significant increase in immigration from the USA. Celebrities are after all ‘citizens of the world’.

    • 0 avatar
      Steve Biro

      Drat! My wife and I have Canadian friends and really enjoy Canada during our frequent visits. No country is perfect but Canada is oretty darn nice – and very civilized. We’ve talked about moving there for non-political reasons for a while. Now we’ll have to deal with a flood of fellow Yankees making things more complicated.

  • avatar
    Fred

    In my experience moving from California to Texas and soon to move back. No one moves because of politics. I moved to Texas to have a job and I’m moving back to be close to family. Many came out here for the jobs, but went back for family. Or it was just too hot for them.

    • 0 avatar
      Arthur Dailey

      @Fred, Tell that to all the people who left Europe for North America because of ‘politics’ or those who left England for the New World because of ‘politics’.

      Or the mass diaspora in the Middle East or the movement of millions after the partition of India.

      Historically politics is the number one reason for immigrating.

  • avatar
    rpol35

    Interesting analysis!

    Nevertheless if Babs Streisand is truly serious about a move, a one way move, I’ll help get her packed up and drive her deada$$ to wherever in Canada she chooses to be domiciled.

    Thank you.

  • avatar
    Steve Biro

    No doubt about it: Taxes are higher in Canada than the U.S. But, like everything else, one has to take the broad view. For example, sales taxes on cars can be high… but there are no toll roads in Canada.

    If you don’t ever use toll roads in the U.S., this won’t matter to you. But if you live in a major metropolitan area and commute by car, it’s a big deal. To cross the Hudson River from New Jersey to New York, it”s $15. Plus another $40 or so to park for the day. Plus Turnpike tolls from my house… plus gas.

    And, speaking of gas, it’s true: Gasoline prices are generally higher in Canada. But, then again, they have fewer problems with a crumbling infrastructure. So it balances out in the end.

    • 0 avatar
      dal20402

      “There are no toll roads in Canada.”

      Not true. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_toll_roads#Canada

      I cross the Port Mann Bridge almost every time I’m in Vancouver.

      • 0 avatar
        Arthur Dailey

        Highway 407 across the top of the GTA. The most expensive toll road in the world. $1 fee each time you enter the highway plus up to 33 cents per kilometer for a car or light truck.

        Cost about $24 per day for me to drive to and from work. I can do it in 20 minutes at highway cruising speeds or use free public roads and get there in from 45 to 90 minutes of stop and go driving.

        Part of our Conservative ‘commons sense’ revolution. The provincial government sold the highway after building it to private investors. The price increased have been astronomical.

        The government lied after selling it, stating that increases need their approval. The contract did not require that.

        The also sold it for about 1/3 of its actual worth.

        Mike Harris and his party demonstrating that they indeed had zero ‘common sense’. Another example of why private enterprise should not be involved infrastructure.

        • 0 avatar
          dal20402

          The financing scheme you describe is exactly how Trump has proposed to fund his infrastructure investment.

          Toll roads make sense in a lot of crowded places. But only where the toll amounts are set for the purpose of keeping the road free-flowing, and not for the purpose of ensuring a private company gets its desired return on investment.

        • 0 avatar
          86er

          “Another example of why private enterprise should not be involved infrastructure.”

          If that’s the case, somebody forgot to tell the federal government:

          https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2016/11/02/betting-on-infrastructure-amid-economic-gloom-paul-wells.html

        • 0 avatar
          sutherland555

          Arthur Dailey Agreed 100% but just one small correction and some additional details. It was built with public money and the Harris government leased it to a Canadian/Spanish consortium for 99 years for a grand total of $2 billion. All to balance the books for that fiscal year. Harris deserves to rot in hell just for that alone, besides all the other crap he pulled.

          The terms of the lease basically tied the hands of every subsequent government as the consortium has free reign with almost no possibility of government intervention. They are free to raise rates as much and as often as they like without consequence. Also, if you owe them money and come time to renew your license plate sticker, no sticker until you pay up. Have an error on your bill? They don’t care, pay up. You have little recourse to dispute the total.

          There is a reason I never take the 407, I refuse to give those greedy bastards any of money.

          • 0 avatar
            orenwolf

            Ugh. 407.

            I take it because the high tolls mean there’s no one ever there and traffic happily does 130Kph the entire run. Costs me $9 CDN to go 33km just the other day – $1 trip fee (*rolls eyes*) and $8 in tolls. I pay $25/yr for a transponder as well.

    • 0 avatar
      john66ny

      There are toll roads in Canada. Just not as many. But more are coming.

      I am a Canadian, so just for kicks, I just looked at the scoring system for the “Express Entry” program for immigration. As a 50-year-old with one official language strong and the second weak, and only a Bachelor’s degree, I wouldn’t have enough points to qualify unless I had a job offer in hand. Interesting…

  • avatar
    dal20402

    Screw that. Trump won an election. But I still have my constitutional right to yell at him and to tell people why they should vote against his party in 2018 and against him in 2020. And if he tries to take that right away (as he’s threatened to do on several occasions) he’ll find out just how deeply Americans have internalized it and how little fear they have in using it.

  • avatar
    Cactuar

    Get ready to pay a ton of income tax for slow sub-par medical services. Go socialism!

    Protip: Try getting an appointment *without* a family doctor assigned to you. Tons of fun at 6 AM in the clinic parking lot waiting for the doors to open at 9 AM to register for an appointment. If all the daily slots are taken you’re going home; better luck tomorrow! At least you get to wait in your Canada-exclusive Nissan Micra, so there’s always that eh?

    Or pay 120$ in a private clinic to get instant services and wonder why you’re paying so much income tax in the first place…

    • 0 avatar
      IHateCars

      Beats dying or facing financial ruin so you don’t die!

    • 0 avatar
      Arthur Dailey

      Universal health care, time and again show to be one of the things that Canadians most value.

      We have had zero problems with the medical system in Ontario. Including varied specialists and a tragic long term spent by one family member under palliative care.

      And of course Canadians do not have to worry about bankruptcies due to medical costs, which have been the number one cause of bankruptcies in the USA.

      Where do you find private clinics and why have you not got a family doctor?

      The USA is the only first world nation without a system of universal health care. But then all those rich ‘medical professionals’ and executives running private facilities would not want it any other way.

      • 0 avatar
        mikey

        @Arthur ….Ever looked at finding a decent nursing home in Ontario ? If you find one, be prepared to wait 4 -5 years. Or you can go the “private ” route. $7 K a month ! I’m glad you have had zero problems. I wish I could say the same

        • 0 avatar
          86er

          Canada has problems, just different problems.

        • 0 avatar
          Arthur Dailey

          @Mikey, unfortunately yes. And we do have publicly funded ones with wait lists but it took less than 2 years. Private was $4k

          But how does that factor into the discussion. Does the USA offer universal or publicly funded nursing homes that are better than ours?

          • 0 avatar
            mikey

            Arthur ..No the USA does not offer free nursing homes. The Americans do have availability . I could get an excellent “Memory Care ” facility in the USA for $7 -8 K a month.. USD .

          • 0 avatar
            Adam Tonge

            There are “free” skilled nursing beds in the US. However, you have to use all your money first since it is a Medicaid benefit. But the Medicaid Nursing Home shopper is in luck; it has become easier to get one of these beds since people now prefer to have home nursing care instead.

      • 0 avatar
        FormerFF

        For most goods and services, a free market works extremely well. For some reason, health care does not work this way. Out of all the world’s developed countries, the U. S. has the most market based heath care systems, and pays by far the most for its health care. I’ve seen some analysis on this, and the final conclusion has always been that U. S. residents don’t use more health care, but procedures here just cost more.

        Lately, the hospitals in our area have been buying each other up,a nd also buying doctor’s practices. Not only does this decrease consumer choice, but it limits the number of prospectve employers of health care professionals.

        • 0 avatar
          Lou_BC

          FormerFF – “For most goods and services, a free market works extremely well. For some reason, health care does not work this way.”

          The answer is rather simple. Free markets work when the consumer is “free” to refuse to buy the good or service or those goods or services aren’t immediately needed i.e. can be deferred.
          You can’t defer treatment for a heart attack or a broken leg.

          If one looks dispassionately at the USA and Canadian systems, the for profit system excels at low risk high volume procedures like MRI’s, CT scans, hip and knee replacements and even cardiac stenting.
          That same system deteriorates when we look at chronic long term illnesses. Insurance companies can profit with insurance if all you need is a new hip but needing 30 years of hemodialysis will make them loose a ton of money.

      • 0 avatar
        don1967

        “Universal health care, time and again show to be one of the things that Canadians most value.”

        Yeah, according to the CBC/Liberal Party narrative. But any actual Canadian citizen will tell you that the best health care plan up here is a plane ticket to the U.S. More doctors, shorter MRI wait times, and quicker access to the newest cancer treatments.

        Ironically the biggest obstacle in solving these problems has nothing to do with universality. It’s the fact that the Left insists on government administration of the whole thing, which we all know is the quickest way to turn a dollar’s worth of funding into 40 cents’ worth of service.

        • 0 avatar
          Arthur Dailey

          @don, I seriously question your statement and I am a Canadian citizen. The Princess Margaret in Toronto is one of the top 5 cancer care centers in the world.

          Had a couple of friends invest in an MRI clinic in the USA next to the Canadian border hoping to make money from Canadian customers. The money they eventually got did not come from Canadians. Got my MRI for a non-life threatening condition within 2 weeks. My son got his within one day.

          As for service, see the 407 thread. Government run enterprises may be bureaucratic wastes but they do not have to meet shareholder expectations quarterly or make brokers and investment bankers rich(er). Nor do they siphon money to other nations.

          • 0 avatar
            don1967

            @Arthur,

            One toll highway in one city can’t hold a candle to the millions of Ladas, Trabants, and other abominations which various governments have produced over the years. As for your assertion that governments don’t answer to external interests or siphon money away, I don’t know what planet you’re from but I’d like to move there.

        • 0 avatar
          orenwolf

          “Yeah, according to the CBC/Liberal Party narrative. But any actual Canadian citizen will tell you that the best health care plan up here is a plane ticket to the U.S. More doctors, shorter MRI wait times, and quicker access to the newest cancer treatments.”

          Bull. At least not in the GTA. I had a CAT scan last year (non-urgent) and waited four days. My partner waited a whopping 48 hours for her MRI at Mt. Sinai in Toronto.

          Maybe in Rural Ontario the issue is worse (probably less machines and further drives) but certainly not in the urban areas, where 6 million people (where 1/6th of the countries population and half the population of Ontario lives).

          It *used* to be worse, though – much worse. So bad there used to be ads for Buffalo MRI locations on the radio (paid for, interestingly at that time, by our health coverage due to wait times). But no longer, in large part because the machines themselves are way cheaper than they used to be.

        • 0 avatar
          Lou_BC

          don1967 – “More doctors, shorter MRI wait times, and quicker access to the newest cancer treatments.”

          The first 2 are correct. The 3rd one all depends on efficacy of treatment and research analysis.

          ” Researchers tracked 2.4 million cancer patients in Australia, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, the UK and Canada, from 1995 to 2007. They looked at those with breast, lung and colorectal cancers, which are relatively common, and at ovarian cancer, because of its complexity.

          They found that B.C. had the best one- and five-year survival rates for both ovarian cancer (77.6 per cent and 55.8 per cent) and for breast cancer (89.1 per cent). What’s more, B.C. survival rates improved over the study period, by nine per cent for ovarian and by seven per cent for breast cancer.”

        • 0 avatar
          Whatnext

          I’m an “actual Canadian citizen” and say your post is BS.

          • 0 avatar
            ect

            As an “actual Canadian citizen” (and an actual US citizen, for that matter), I fully endorse Whatnext’s comment.

        • 0 avatar
          ect

          “It’s the fact that the Left insists on government administration of the whole thing, which we all know is the quickest way to turn a dollar’s worth of funding into 40 cents’ worth of service.”

          It is well documented that administrative costs in the US health care world are about double the cost in Canada, on a per-capita basis. The biggest difference is that the US companies employ armies of people to carefully examine each invoice to see if it can be passed on to some other organization to pay, or simply denied. That situation does not exist in Canada or other developed countries with universal coverage programs.

      • 0 avatar
        Kendahl

        My wife and I are old enough to be covered by US Medicare. It pays so poorly that, if not for the Medicare supplement insurance we buy from a private insurer, our family doctor would lose money any time we walked in the door.

        I do agree that US medical care is expensive. The last I heard, the average annual cost per person is $10,000. We own a couple of horses, one of which injured an eye this summer. The bill for surgery and two weeks at a university veterinary hospital was $4,500. I recently had outpatient eye surgery to treat severe glaucoma. The bill for 4 hours in the hospital was $17,000. I have yet to receive bills from the surgeon and anesthesiologist. It’s a good thing we have insurance.

    • 0 avatar
      Gardiner Westbound

      I’m at an age where my original equipment is wearing out. In the last 18 months I’ve had a heart attack, two emergency surgeries and an elective surgery. The first three were treated immediately, the last involved a six month wait. I received excellent expert care prepaid by taxes. Drugs were subject to minor co-payments.

      The USA undoubtedly has the finest healthcare system in the world. The problem is affordability, something Canadians don’t even consider much less worry about.

      Don’t know why people get off on disparaging the Canadian healthcare system. It’s not perfect, but having lived and worked in both countries in my view it’s significantly superior to the alternative.

      • 0 avatar
        orenwolf

        What I can never get my head around is the idea that as I understand the US, if I ever got seriously ill or lost my job THEN got ill, I *might* get screwed over by many tens of thousands of dollars in out of pocket costs.

        There is a real, genuine value in just not worrying about that crap, instead of knowing that if you get ill you’re covered, full stop. Focus on other things in life instead!

    • 0 avatar
      sutherland555

      If you ask us Canadians how we feel about our universal health care, 95% would say we love it and would never, ever give it up. Yes, there are problems, specifically long wait times for minor surgeries and long wait times in ERs for non-life threatening injuries/conditions. Yes, there are clear ways the system can and must be improved but what we have is far far more preferable to the system in the US.

  • avatar
    IHateCars

    …and we have bagged milk!

  • avatar
    DevilsRotary86

    As far as I care, Canada is a frozen hell and there is nothing that would make me want to move there. If I were to move because of a candidate, I would pull a John McAfee and join the expat community in Belize, but hopefully without the legal trouble that he had. Much better weather.

    • 0 avatar
      Sooke

      Belize, Much better weather.

      Between hurricanes.

    • 0 avatar
      Kendahl

      The severity of Canadian winter weather depends on your location. The plains are like North Dakota. (My brother-in-law moved from there to Juneau, Alaska. I teased him that the winters in ND were so bad he had to move to Alaska for relief.) Vancouver, BC is like Seattle. I grew up in southern Ontario where temperatures are moderated by the Great Lakes. The coldest two days I can remember were -5° F and -15° F. During my first winter in Omaha, Nebraska in 1974-75, there was snow on the ground from Thanksgiving to Easter. During the entire month of February, the high temperature was below freezing and the low every night was subzero. I thought about moving back to Ontario where it wasn’t so cold.

      • 0 avatar
        dal20402

        Vancouver temps are like Seattle, but they get significantly more rain (44 vs 37 inches, almost all in the winter). It’s often raining there when it’s just cloudy in Seattle. So it’s a bit more miserable. But still nothing like elsewhere in the great frozen north.

  • avatar
    Feds

    Steelies are an opportunity to express your freedom! I’ve had every colour of wheels on my cars over the last 15 winters. Fall tradition here is to break out the pressure washer and the wire wheel, mask off the tire, and add a new rattle can coat of something bright.

    This year I’m breaking from tradition and ordering some moon discs for the Expedition.

  • avatar
    mikey

    Just had a set of Michelin Ice X 13 tires mounted on Mustang OEM alloy wheels. The car still looks good, but I’m not thrilled with the ride , or the noise. I just hope they perform well in the snow.

  • avatar
    HillbillyInBC

    How can you have a whole section about Mazda and not mention the way it’s pronounced up here (first syllable rhymes with ‘jazz’, not ‘blahs’)?

  • avatar
    dariosycco

    Don’t forget that an oil change is north of $90 but as least we have an abundance of manual transmission cars. Like Mazda 5 GT or the current Subaru Outback just to name a few.

  • avatar
    Big Al from Oz

    I did read about the increased interest in Canadians moving north.

    The other countries which interest has had significant interest aare New Zealand and Australia.

    • 0 avatar
      Kendahl

      All three countries are very selective of immigrants. To get in, you must have a valuable skill that is in short supply. Australia and New Zealand won’t take anyone over the age of forty five. For all the complaints about US immigration policies, the country takes in many immigrants who lack the skills to contribute as much as they cost.

  • avatar
    brn

    I thought Canada was going to build a wall and make the US pay for it?

  • avatar
    Kendahl

    Something that wasn’t mentioned is generally lower speed limits in Canada. It’s been fifteen years since I drove on 401 between Windsor (opposite Detroit) and Toronto. The speed limit then was 100 kph (62.5 mph). I was surprised to read orenwolf’s comment about driving 130 kph on 407. I have read elsewhere about being ticketed for 10 kph (6.25 mph) over the limit. In contrast, most US interstate speed limits are at least 65 mph. Some of the western states are 80 mph and one toll road in Texas is 85. (That might have changed had Hillary won the election. When gasoline prices reached $5.00 per gallon a few years ago, she suggested reimposing the 55 mph national speed limit.)

    • 0 avatar
      dal20402

      It used to be that Canada had the higher speed limits, with rural freeways being 110 kph (68 mph) during the double-nickel era in the US and its immediate aftermath when speeds rose only to 60 or 65. Then US limits got higher and Canadian limits didn’t change.

      I don’t know about Ontario, but in BC it’s amazing how cavalier the drivers are toward the limits. Highway 99 between the border and Vancouver is signed at 100 kph (62 mph). If I drive 110 kph, I’m the slowest car on the road, and most cars seem to be averaging about 120 kph (75 mph).

  • avatar
    mikey

    The OPP won’t bother you on the 400 series hi ways , as long as you stay under 130 kph.

  • avatar
    CincyDavid

    I haven’t been to Canada since the 70s, when we were in Detroit and my dad wanted to run us over to Windsor just to say we had done it…

    I was however, in Riviera Maya Mexico this past week and met a bunch of Canadians who were escaping the cold weather. My personal observation is that they French-speaking women tend to be a hell of a lot better looking than the others.

    I have no interest in moving north, and while I enjoyed our week in the sun at an all-inclusive guzzling Johnny Walker Red and club soda all week, I couldn’t wait to get out of Mexico…lots of abject poverty once you leave the resort, and a sea of weird little cars. I did get to ride in several minivans I’d never seen before..a Ford Transit of some sort and a VW Transport, both diesels with 6 sp manuals.

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