While You Were Sleeping: March 11th, 2015

Honestly Lou, I agree with you. The odds of seeing a Wrangler-based or even just Jeep-branded pickup seem pretty slim. You already know there's such a thing as "too big" for me when it comes to pickup trucks, though as yet I haven't seen one "too small" unless you count the Kei-sized trucks which are almost strictly local-delivery types in Asia or the side-by-side John Deere and other brand off-road utility vehicles which are not highway legal in most states. The Hyundai option seems a little closer to reality with the news that Hyundai is looking to expand their Alabama plant released earlier today. Meanwhile, the Renegade is a reality and by the time I'm ready to buy any bugs should be fairly well worked out. The JK-8 kit? No. It's cute and probably capable as far as it goes, but it's little more than an oversized Scrambler that doesn't offer any kind of real pickup truck capability simply because it retains the JK's swing door instead of a drop-down tailgate. That was a poor design intended to appease the demand for a real pickup version--which the AEV modified JKU achieves far more elegantly, albeit the fact that it also doubles the price of the chosen JKU or more when you include engine upgrade. A Wrangler-based truck like the '05 Gladiator concept on the other hand would probably be FAR more appealing (3 doors instead of four with no real back seat) as a factory model. As long as the bed is four feet wide with a full-width tailgate (or at least the tailgate opening a minimum of four feet wide) the Gladiator would be my #1 choice, followed by a true compact truck followed by the Renegade. Then again, I can almost imagine the Renegade made into a compact pickup and succeeding.

@Vulpine - The Jeep shape and width would appeal to many. Everyone in the automotive land has figured out that seating for four is where the sales volumes are at. Jeep clued in to that fact with the Unlimited. Where does that leave the Jeep truck? Seating for 2 means limited sales. Seating for 4-5 means Colorado sized girth. FCA currently does not have a small truck so it would make sense targeting the Tacoma/Colorado sized market since we've seen major growth with the introduction of the Colorado. The only other option is the Strada. I like the looks of it but fall into the need seating for 5 demographic just like the vast majority of pickup buyers. Who will Jeep target? the 85% or the 15%? My money is on the 85% which means Colorado sized seating for 5.

@Lou_BC, Jeep has a large hurdle to overcome. CAFE. I don't see the current SWB Jeep as viable with it's footprint size. FCA really need to do something to resolve the problem. I do foresee a lot of 4 door Jeeps and an extra long wheel base Jeep with a bed out back. The Jeep in it's current guise and size, even as a 4 door isn't long enough for a pickup. Also, if Jeep can't manage it in the US due to regulatory reasons, I've read that China was looked at for their manufacture.

@BigAl - true. Unlike Toyota USA, FCA North America is burdened with a portfolio of gas guzzlers. Toyota could release a V12 powered LandCruiser getting 2 mpg and still not dent it's CAFE/Emissions credit surplus.

@Big Al from Oz As I said above, new factory coming hoping for a wrangler unlimited with a longer wheelbase and a four door gladiator pickup truck with a 6.5 foot bed

@Lou_BC You know, it's hard to correct you Lou, when you contradict yourself so readily. "FCA currently does not have a small truck ... The only other option is the Strada." The Strada is an FCA product, you know. But I do know what you mean. You're trying to say they don't have a compact/mid-sized truck in the US or Canada (though they have the RAM 700 in Mexico). Now, one problem with your overall argument is that with the Jeep, while 4 doors has made the Wrangler more appealing, rarely does the 4-door Wrangler carry more than two people on the trail. Instead, the seats tend to be folded down or the dog will take the back seat while the JKU can carry more gear behind the seat. A pickup version of the Wrangler could offer a 'back seat' for the dog and carry even more in an open bed--as well as probably carrying more than twice as much by weight as the current JKU is rated for. So full-time seating for 2 plus part-time seating for two more will likely make it a favorite version while AEV can go with their Double Cab Brute for the big bucks. That would also keep Jeep itself out of direct competition with one of their aftermarket supplier/mod shops. Of course, a Renegade compact would be fun, too.

@vulpine - where have I contradicted myself? They currently do not have a small truck in the NAFTA zone. Please point one out to me? and WHY do I have to be that specific? YES they have the Strada, they also have the Daily which I think is a better van for the Canadian and USA markets than the Doblo based Promaster. They also have a I6 diesel almost identical to the Cummins 6.7.... it ain't here so why mention it unless it is relevant to the topic or is actually on its way. Part of the reason the Wrangler Unlimited is "2 up" on the trail is because space is at a premium. A pickup version would alleviate part of that problem but as I have pointed out, seating for 2 limits sales volume. Manufacturers want to make profits and at the end of the day fulfilling your needs aren't going to make them any.

@Vulpine Lou, there's a difference between saying, "They don't have one", and "They don't have one in the NAFTA zone". Even GM has a compact truck, but I agree that it's not in the NAFTA zone. That said, the Ram 700 IS in the NAFTA zone, though made in Brazil which disqualifies it for US import without tariffs. If you don't want to be confusing or called out as a liar, you must be specific. "Part of the reason the Wrangler Unlimited is "2 up" on the trail is because space is at a premium. A pickup version would alleviate part of that problem but as I have pointed out, seating for 2 limits sales volume. " Not QUITE true as while I will agree that crew cab trucks are extremely popular, it appears that extended-cab versions sell almost as quickly. PUTC's "Fastest Selling" monthly articles point out that the average lot life of an extended cab (especially the suicide-door brands) is a matter of three weeks or less and in some cases move faster off the lot than their crew cab siblings. And as I said, I find it unlikely that Jeep would put themselves in direct competition with AEV for building a 4-door especially since they already make a 2-door pickup for Egyptian Army use. Granted, it's not built here, but the design is already mostly worked out and would not at all be difficult to add to the existing assembly lines here in the States.

@Vulpine - you the only dude that called me out and I explained it. A 25% tariff on anything outside the NAFTA zone or any FTA for that matter isn't really worth mentioning unless it is specific to the tread. We are talking Jeep truck not El Camino wannabee.

@Vulpine Look at the Chevy Montana, Ram 500 and Fiat Strada again; they're pretty much true compact trucks in actual use, not "el Camino wannabes." You might even want to talk to our local Brazilian, who has more than once discussed these little trucks.

@Vulpine - I'm not anti-small truck. Since when have I been? We can turn this into a Fantasy Football league discussion but I'd rather stick to what is most likely to occur at Jeep. The Strada isn't going to fit the Jeep portfolio.

@Vulpine My point is that things CAN change. "People" said that the Cherokee would be an abject failure for Jeep, yet it actually opened an all-new market for them as it has both increased overall Jeep sales AND has not cannibalized any significant sales from any other model. Now we have the Jeep Renegade coming into inventory with a platform only a little larger than the original Willys Jeeps. Meanwhile, the Fiat Strada has already been modified into the Ram 700 for sales in Mexico, where it appears to be rather popular. Would they bring the Ram 700 into the States as is, or would they be better served by converting it into a small Jeep pickup truck by a bit of cosmetic work and giving it the Renegade's drivetrain? Or, would they attempt to develop an actual Renegade-based truck? The point is that you can't rule out any of these OR an all-new truck based on the '17 Wrangler when it comes out. Yes, I do agree that taken individually any of these is highly unlikely, but not impossible. Taken together, the odds are greatly increased that some one of these will come to fruition. Sergio Marccione and the current CEO of Jeep both want to see a Jeep pickup of some sort and there is obviously significant demand for one--mostly likely one at least as trail-capable as the Wrangler itself, but not necessarily as long as it carries the Jeep badge proudly and lives up to the brand's cachet.