By on July 2, 2014

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89% of the pickup trucks sold in the United States in the first half of 2014 were full-size trucks, a segment of the auto market that has risen 4.3% so far this year.

Lost market share among the top pickup sellers in America, Ford and General Motors, has been swallowed up in large part by FCA’s Ram brand and the Toyota Tundra. Already this year, Ram has sold 33,541 more pickups than during the first six months of 2013.

Ford’s F-Series, on the other hand, is down by 1661 units. GM’s twins have combined to rise 1.1%, but their share of the full-size category, not even including the now extinct Chevrolet Avalanche and Cadillac Escalade EXT, has fallen by more than a percentage point.

June 2014 was in large part a stronger example of this trend. F-Series sales dropped 11% to 60,560 units, the first time since February that Ford sold fewer than 63,000 F-Series trucks. We expect lower F-Series sales these days, as a number of customers will wait for a new 2015 F-150 and forego the discounted outgoing model. Ford dealers didn’t just miss out on a large number of F-Series sales in June, however, as utility vehicle volume was down 8%.

Meanwhile, Ram’s 20.4% market share in June was par for the course. Ram owned 20.3% in May, 21.4% in April, 22.9% in March, 20.2% in February, and 20.8% in January, a great deal better than the 18.3% Ram managed during the first half of 2013.

Unlike the Ford Motor Company, most of Ram’s relations performed above last year’s pace in June 2014, as well. Fiat sales jumped 11%, Jeep shot up 28% (thanks to Cherokee), and Dodge moved up 1%. Chrysler Group car sales continue to underperform, yet with 68% of the automaker’s sales coming from Ram pickups, Jeep, and minivans, the overall figures tend to impress.

We’re no longer seeing the kinds of decreasing market share figures from GM’s twins that we were earlier in the year – their February share slid by more than four percentage points – but the half-year numbers hark back to those especially disappointing days. Despite their freshness, GM’s full-size truck market share fell to 34.5% over the last six months from 35.6% during the equivalent period one year earlier. June volume was also down 1.5%. (Taking the fewer available selling days into account, the Silverado and Sierra were up 7.7%.)

At Toyota, the Tundra and better-selling Tacoma were responsible for 11.4% of all Toyota U.S. sales so far this year, including Lexus and Scion. Although the Tacoma consistently leads all small/midsize trucks, the Tundra’s steady improvements came to an abrupt halt in june after eight consecutive year-over-year monthly sales increases.

Clearly pickup trucks aren’t the essential motivating forces at Toyota that they are at Ford, GM, and Chrysler. The Ram P/U range is the Chrysler Group’s top seller in the U.S., accounting for 20% of first-half sales. Including the Avalanche, Escalade EXT, Colorado, and Canyon, pickup trucks have pulled in 22.9% of GM’s U.S. volume in 2014. (Full-size, body-on-frame SUVs generated one in ten GM sales in June.) At Ford MoCo, the F-Series, with no help from a Ranger, attracts 28.8% of the automaker’s sales.

Nissan? Sales are booming, but of the 704,477 new vehicles sold by Nissan and Infiniti over the last six months, only 5.1% have been Frontiers; only 0.9% have been Titans.

Truck
June
2014
June
2013
%
Change
6 mos.
2014
6 mos.
2013
%
Change
Ford F-Series
60,560 68,009 -11.0% 365,825 367,486 -0.5%
Chevrolet Silverado
43,519 43,259 +0.6% 240,679 242,586 -0.8%
Ram P/U
33,149 29,644 +11.8% 203,860 170,319 +19.7%
GMC Sierra
15,406 16,568 -7.0% 93,191 87,633 +6.3%
Toyota Tundra
8977 9759 -8.0% 57,987 51,565 +12.5%
Nissan Titan
976 1300 -24.9% 6416 8852 -27.5%
Total
162,587 168,539 -3.5% 967,958 928,441 4.3%

 

Truck
June
2014
Share
June
2013
Share
6 mos.
2014
Share
6 mos.
2013
Share
Ford F-Series
37.2% 40.4% 37.8% 39.6%
Chevrolet Silverado/GMC Sierra
36.2% 35.5% 34.5% 35.6%
Ram P/U
20.4% 17.6% 21.1% 18.3%
Toyota Tundra
5.5% 5.8% 6.0% 5.6%
Nissan Titan
0.6% 0.8% 0.7% 1.0%
Full-Size Share Of
Total Pickup Truck Market
89.4% 87.9% 89.0% 87.1%
Full-Size Pickup Share
Of Total Industry
11.4% 12.0% 11.8% 11.9%
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45 Comments on “Cain’s Segments, July 2014: Trucks...”


  • avatar
    jim brewer

    I wonder how Nissan even keeps an assembly line running for the titan.

  • avatar
    Vulpine

    I expect the full-size truck share to start falling as soon as a better selection of smaller trucks comes available.

    • 0 avatar
      Shane Rimmer

      I don’t think it’ll happen until easy, long-term, financing goes away. For many consumers, the full-size appears to be a better “value” when stacked up against smaller trucks where the payment differs by 10-20 a month. We know it’s a poor value proposition to buy more truck than one needs and finance it until the end of time to pay for it, but that’s exactly what the majority of people do.

      • 0 avatar
        Lorenzo

        I don’t know – I see a lot of 4-door trucks and there’s often a whole family in them! They seem to have replaced the full sized car, with the trunk turned into an open bed for versatility. With a reputation for durability and high resale value, what can go wrong?

        • 0 avatar
          Vulpine

          Don’t EVER ask that question, Lorenzo. The minute you ask, “what can go wrong”, something WILL go wrong. And what I expect is a significant jump in fuel costs… enough to make a lot of those full-sized pickup/family SUVs with balcony head to the used car lots.

          • 0 avatar
            DenverMike

            Every time fuel spikes upward, a few folks panic and dump their large pickups and SUVs, but for the most part they adjust their driving and spending habits. Large vehicles are rarely used for long commutes, but if they are, drivers maybe can afford it. And it’s often cheaper to keep the gas hog than buy something economical. But if they do look for something economical, it may not be a small truck.

          • 0 avatar
            Vulpine

            “Large vehicles are rarely used for long commutes,”
            Maybe that is true, but we all know that long distances at reasonable speeds (meaning minimal stop-and-go) is where the large vehicles get their best fuel mileage, so someone working the night shift actually comes out better than a day-shift worker using the same truck. And when you consider the price someone is paying for that big gas hog in monthly payments, something brand new but smaller may actually reduce more than fuel costs in the process. After all, HOW many big trucks have been sold in the last 18 months? At an average price of over $35K, a typical CUV could cut $10,000 off the top and have the truck pay more than 50% of the retail price in trade.

          • 0 avatar
            DenverMike

            @Vulpine – Agreed, night/3rd shift and ‘graveyard’ jobs are the best. Vs the same crumby job while the sun’s out, of course.

            But it’d be a huge lifestyle change to go from a fullsize crew cab 4X4 to a regular cab midsize 2wd pickup, CUV or similar. The savings had better be tremendous or why take the lifestyle hit? Most would rather take a ‘hit’ on something else. Like Starbucks.

            Ask Lou_BC how high fuel prices need to climb (and for how long) before he has to take a huge downgrade?

          • 0 avatar
            Vulpine

            There you go, making assumptions again, Denver. “But it’d be a huge lifestyle change to go from a fullsize crew cab 4X4 to a regular cab midsize 2wd pickup,…” Please clarify this statement; just HOW would it be a huge lifestyle change. For instance, why would they have to go from a 4×4 to a 2wd midsize? Why would they have to go from crew cab to regular cab midsize? Your argument makes no logical sense. Are you trying to say 4×4 crew cab midsized trucks don’t exist? Everybody knows that such vehicles DO exist, so that completely invalidates that part of your argument.

            And yes, the savings can be “tremendous”. The typical full-sized crew cab as you describe it approaches $40K. The typical mid-sized crew cab equipped almost identically may be as much as $7K cheaper and a compact version could be from $10K to $12K cheaper. The trade-in value of a full sized truck as it sits could easily pull another $10-$20K off the purchase price of said smaller vehicle. So, your monthly payment would be more like $150 rather than $550 or higher. Then, if you add in the fuel savings from a more economical drivetrain you might see another $50-$100 savings per month in fuel costs. So right there we see a potential $500 or more saved per month by simply trading in a one-to-two-year-old full sized truck for a smaller one.

        • 0 avatar
          SaulTigh

          I’ve long maintained that Americans never gave up their love affair with large, powerful vehicles. Government regulations in the late 70’s applied to cars, not trucks, so as cars shrank and the power died, people migrated to full sized trucks and SUV’s. If the government had let the market alone, I predict that full size, rear drive cars never would have gone away and that trucks would still largely be the purview of contractors and cowboys.

          I grew up an enthusiast of early 70’s Lincoln’s and Cadillac’s, yet today I own a 2014 F150 Crew Cab with a 5.0 V8. Gas prices don’t bother me, because I don’t commute in the thing, and with a 36 gallon tank, I can wait out many short price spikes.

  • avatar
    DenverMike

    @Vulpine – New selection of midsize pickups may steal more market share from everything from sedans to SUVs (including compact brown diesel station wagons with the manual trans), than fullsize trucks. Never mind other midsize pickups.

    And you’re still not gonna buy one (new).

    • 0 avatar
      Vulpine

      Don’t write checks you can’t cash, Denver. But while I’m waiting, I’m getting a pretty pristine ’94 Ranger for free. Only 30K miles or so. And yes, those are original miles; I personally know the owner.

      • 0 avatar
        DenverMike

        That’s for sure a keeper. I’d want it too. But it sounds like now you DEFINITELY won’t be buying an new midsize pickup! For decades. Or ever.

        • 0 avatar
          Vulpine

          You’d be surprised, Denver. That old Ranger has a couple drawbacks, one of which is its older drivetrain which means a relatively slight improvement over my slightly older F-150 AND, it’s a ‘stripper’. I’d be aiming at the highest possible trade-in value I could get on a newer compact or sell it outright for original retail or better–as long as I can keep salt out from under it.

          That’s right–no rust, either.

          • 0 avatar
            DenverMike

            A 4 cylinder compact stripper should get almost 2X the mpg as the V8 fullsize (of the same era) or something’s seriously wrong.

            But why do you guys insist on torturing yourselves with exactly the trucks you despise? Life’s too short. I’m a big fan of strippers for I’m a cheapskate, but immediately upgrade them. I go nutz at the junk yard with cloth buckets/split bench, power windows, etc.

            Improve your situation or change it. Or not.

  • avatar
    Lou_BC

    I could of saved myself 20 ft of scratches bilaterally on my truck over this weekend if it was a small truck. I can live with it since there isn’t really anything on the market from the small truck camp that meets my needs.

    That in itself is the problem and why small trucks aren’t selling well.

    The Tacoma double cab doesn’t quite have the capabilities I want and MPG isn’t there. When I purchased my 2010 F150 due to year end discounts it was cheaper than the Tacoma.

    • 0 avatar
      Hummer

      I’m sure with as many F150s sold you shouldn’t have a hard time finding scratch armour, pretty much sheets of magnetic materials that attaches to the body to take all of the scratches that happen.
      Usually ~$150-250
      Kinda depends what a scratch free truck is worth I suppose, I gave up caring on all my trucks that I take offroad.

    • 0 avatar
      DenverMike

      @Lou_BC – What exactly would you change about small trucks to meet your “needs”?

      Are they so far off the mark, that you’ll resort to fullsize crew cabs instead?

      It sounds like you bought exactly what you wanted, but like to hear yourself whine. Me, if I don’t like, I don’t buy.

      So state for the record, what’s specifically wrong with small trucks so OEMs can continue ignoring you.

      • 0 avatar
        jim brewer

        1. Expensive

        2. Obsolescent.

        3. Relatively poor gas mileage.

        Other than that they are terrific.

        • 0 avatar
          Vulpine

          4. They’re still TOO BIG.

          • 0 avatar
            DenverMike

            They’re TOO BIG so you buy a BIGGER ONE???

          • 0 avatar
            Vulpine

            Not if I can help it–and I can. I wait til they come down in size, and if they don’t, I don’t buy.

          • 0 avatar
            DenverMike

            You go ahead and wait. Small pickup OEMs aren’t looking for Vulpine to save them when he shops for a used 2018 pickup in 2027.

          • 0 avatar
            Vulpine

            @Denver: I can now legitimately call you a LIAR, since I have made it abundantly clear that I do NOT buy used unless I have no other option. If I’m shopping for a 2018 pickup truck, it’s probably either 2017 or 2018, when the model is NEW.

          • 0 avatar
            DenverMike

            How am I a liar, if you do NOT buy used UNLESS you have NO other option? That’s most consumer’s situation. That’s my situation too, when talking my primary vehicles.

            But typically, small pickups make a great addition to most consumers primary vehicles or family fleet. This also typically means the small pickup is going to be parked most of the week so buying it used is the only way it’s going to happen.

            Part of the reason small and midsize trucks don’t make the cut as primary vehicles is their limited 2+2 seating. Not a true people hauler or family truckster, like fullsize trucks. It’s like what a Mustang is to a Taurus, seating wise. That’s likely one of the major cripes Lou_BC has against midsize trucks, among others.

          • 0 avatar
            Vulpine

            Simple, Denver. Because you used MY name as your “example”, you specifically stated that I would do something I would NOT do. As such, you are a LIAR.

            Had you said, “You go ahead and wait. Small pickup OEMs aren’t looking for Denver Mike to save them when he shops for a used 2018 pickup in 2027,” you would have been telling the truth–maybe.

      • 0 avatar
        Lou_BC

        @DenverMike – Once again, real short on comprehension.

        I said that I can live with the scratches because my F150 fits my needs best and it is a truck.

        What is wrong with small trucks?

        All of a sudden you forgot your usual shtick?

        I’ve said it before as to why I went with a full sized truck, but I’ll repeat it for you:

        1. Capacity – not enough. I like around 1,500 lb. cargo.
        2. Towing – 5-7K even though I won’t go much larger than 5k that is getting close to the limit for small trucks. You keep on harping about being better off with excess capacity, I like that too.
        3. Fuel economy – again, you’ve harped on about this one too – the gap isn’t big enough to make the smaller truck worth while.
        4. Cost – I can get a full sizer for less if one buys at the right time.

        If price is close I’ll go with what ever meets my needs better. Same can be said for capacity and fuel economy.

        I’ve owned a few small trucks in my life and they fit my needs at the time of purchase.

        You can turn this into a small truck love in but at the end of the day, I buy what best fits my priorities at the time of purchase.

        The Tacoma doublecab TRD 6ft box 4×4 was close but my F150 was closer to my wish list.

        If I were to list the pecking order of trucks when I was buying in 2010 this is how it looked at purchase time:

        1. F150
        2. Tundra
        3. Tacoma
        4. Sierra
        5. Ram
        6. Silverado
        7. Frontier
        8. Titan
        9. Ridgeline

        • 0 avatar
          DenverMike

          @Lou_BC – Thanks for that. You’ve laid out exactly why the small truck market has been shrinking exponentially since the mid ’80s. I couldn’t have said it better myself!

          Not that we were ever big fans of small pickups in America in the 1st place. Perfect storm and whatnot. Please forward this info to BAFO and the others. Turns out it’s not a conspiracy by the CIA? Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaat??????????????????

        • 0 avatar
          Vulpine

          @Lou: I like your list and you are exactly right–it’s what meet the needs *at the time of purchase*. For me, that list would look entirely different.

          1. Tacoma
          2. Frontier
          3. Colorado (I’d wait long enough for it to come out)
          4. Canyon (I don’t like the looks as much)
          5. F-150
          6. Ram
          7. Silverado

          For all that I dislike Ford products, the ONLY reason I would put the F-150 ahead of the Ram or Silverado is the way the doors for the extended cab are made. Both Ram and Silverado/Sierra decided to make their extended cab access look like a full 4 doors which completely kills their utility for me and to me is more dangerous than the ‘suicide door’ design by forcing you to walk around it whenever you transfer materials from the front seat to the back area. Interestingly, the Colorado/Canyon fall back to the ‘suicide door’ extended cab which makes them more appealing even if they are too big for my needs and wants.

          • 0 avatar
            Lou_BC

            @Vulpine – the part the DenverMike gets totally confused about is the fact that I defend small trucks. I also don’t like trade barriers. Trade barriers limit my choice and if they did not exist i.e. chicken tax, I might be able to find a truck that actually meets ALL of my wants and needs.
            On PUTC one of the bloggers mentioned the legal GVW for small trucks and 1/2 tons. If that applied to the global Ranger the max it could be rated for in the USA would be around 1,500 lb. That would be perfect along with a 5-7 k tow rating.

            Denver has no problems pointing out why small trucks don’t sell more than they do and then argues vehemently that tariffs and other limitations don’t affect what we buy.

          • 0 avatar
            DenverMike

            @Lou_BC – You act like pickup GVW is some arbitrary number. It’s not a CIA conspiracy. Small components get you a small GVW. Small brakes and other small stuff. Like wheel bearings, axles, bushings, U-joint, ball joints, tie rods, A-arms, radius arms, leafs, etc.

            Outside of America, ratings may be different.

            And this shouldn’t stop anyone from buying them. Not all jobs are big. Many tend to overbuy for safety sake and longevity, but what ever.

  • avatar
    Truckducken

    Market share is interesting, but margins are what matter. Any insights, Mr. Cain?

  • avatar
    DenverMike

    @Lou_BC – If small pickups won’t work for you and you’re a huge fan of, how can you expect the general pop to put up with all their shortcomings and disappointments.

    But when you refuse to expand on all the problems you have with them and lack of so called “capabilities”, how do you expect OEMs to listen and fix them???

    • 0 avatar
      Lou_BC

      @DenverMike – I’ve owned several small trucks. They didn’t fit my wants and needs this time around.

      I’m not a huge fan of any specific size of truck.

      I’ve owned all sizes, all purchased based on what fit my wants and needs best.

      I’m not sure why that is so hard to comprehend.

      • 0 avatar
        DenverMike

        I’ve owned several small pickups also. But they didn’t serve the same purpose as my fullsize pickups. Some here feel they’re a perfect substitute for fullsize deficiencies. MPG and size. Not really.

        The sooner OEMs comprehend this, the better. They still think they can capture a good fraction of the enormous and ever growing fullsize pickup market simply because midsize pickups have a bed too. But let’s not oversimplify. Different animals.

        Like offering a cat (and nothing against cats) in place of your Labrador. Hey it’s furry, has 4 legs and a tail too…

        But there’s some about ‘dogs and trucks’.

        youtube.com/watch?v=vx4PE4DxuYU

        • 0 avatar
          Vulpine

          “Some here feel they’re a perfect substitute for fullsize deficiencies. MPG and size.” You say, “not really” and I say DEFINITELY. Why, because they DO serve the same purpose as their full-size pickups. I have NEVER, NOT ONCE absolutely needed a full-sized truck for what it is. The only reason I own one now is that nothing smaller was available for the price. Even now, in a 150-mile radius, there are only TWO mid-sized trucks for sale for less than $10K and they are both at the same dealership, 123 miles away ( http://www.cars.com/for-sale/searchresults.action?PMmt=0-0-0&bsId=20209&bsId=20218&bsId=20210&crSrtFlds=stkTypId-feedSegId-bsId-pseudoPrice-kw&feedSegId=28705&isDealerGrouping=false&kw=midsize&kwm=ANY&prMn=0&prMx=10000&rd=150&requestorTrackingInfo=RTB_SEARCH&rn=0&rpp=50&sf1Dir=DESC&sf1Nm=price&sf2Dir=ASC&sf2Nm=miles&stkTypId=28881&zc=21921&searchSource=NO_RESULTS)

          Of the two, I would choose the Dakota because of the extended cab and manual transmission, were I looking for such a vehicle for the same reasons I purchased the F-150. On the other hand, since I am not in that ‘must have now’ situation and have the time to wait for what I really want, it also means I can put aside money to place a down payment on a future brand-new vehicle of my choice. For me, even the Fiat Strada is a better choice than any available American-branded truck.

          Oh, and my cat plays ‘fetch’ just as well as my dog–and can chase the ball under the bed where the dog can’t.

          • 0 avatar
            DenverMike

            @Vulpine

            “…they DO serve the same purpose as their full-size pickups…”

            Most consumers that DO buy new pickup trucks would have a HUGE problem with that statement. Never mind what Lou_BC, myself, and others here have said repeatedly. Yes they both have pickup beds, but that’s where the similarities begin and end.

            For YOU they may serve the same purpose, but you don’t need any fullsize specific capabilities.

            Yes there are times when I would appreciate better mpg and smaller dimensions, but unless you’re talking a regular cab, short bed midesize, there’s not much difference in mpg and size. Is owning a fullsize pickup worth it? Ask any of the million+ yearly, new fullsize 1/2 ton pickup buyers

            And it’s no one’s fault but your own, you choose to live in the Toolies. If you cannot drive (or take a canoe, airboat, puddle hopper), to the city for a decent choice of used pickups, again, your own fault.

            But most certainly, OEMs aren’t concerned in the slightest, with the used pickup market.

            have NEVER, NOT ONCE absolutely needed a full-sized truck for what it is. The only reason I own one now is that nothing smaller was available for the price. Even now, in a 150-mile radius, there are only TWO mid-sized trucks for sale for less than $10K and they are both at the same dealership, 123 miles away

            ( http://www.cars.com/for-sale/searchresults.action?PMmt=0-0-0&bsId=20209&bsId=20218&bsId=20210&crSrtFlds=stkTypId-feedSegId-bsId-pseudoPrice-kw&feedSegId=28705&isDealerGrouping=false&kw=midsize&kwm=ANY&prMn=0&prMx=10000&rd=150&requestorTrackingInfo=RTB_SEARCH&rn=0&rpp=50&sf1Dir=DESC&sf1Nm=price&sf2Dir=ASC&sf2Nm=miles&stkTypId=28881&zc=21921&searchSource=NO_RESULTS)

          • 0 avatar
            Vulpine

            @Denver: For my purposes, “…they DO serve the same purpose as their full-size pickups…” and I am certainly not alone, no matter how much you refuse to believe that. Many, even if not most, would agree with me. That is WHY a compact truck would see a bigger market.

            “And it’s no one’s fault but your own, you choose to live in the Toolies. If you cannot drive (or take a canoe, airboat, puddle hopper), to the city for a decent choice of used pickups, again, your own fault.”
            You don’t even know what you’re talking about here. “Choose to live in the Toolies”. Really? How many times do I have to tell you I DON”T BUY USED–unless there is no other choice? I DON’T WANT USED because they end up costing me more than they’re worth, EVERY SINGLE TIME. So when I’m looking for a “decent choice of … pickups”, I’m looking for NEW, not used. How about I engrave that into a nail and drive it into your skull, would you remember it then?

          • 0 avatar
            DenverMike

            @Vulpine – You like to assume most consumers, inclined to buy new pickups, have your specific needs, or lack thereof. In short, those pickup minded consumers, that don’t need 1/2 ton pickup specific capabilities are usually better served with CUVs or Cube/Fit/Xb type of “trucks”.

            In a perfect (small pickup) world, we’d be living forever in the early ’80s, before all these current batch of automotive choices, helped shrink the small pickup market to almost nothing.

            Sorry, small pickups were a trend that couldn’t last forever. It was the Perfect Storm and likely won’t happen again. There just wasn’t much else to buy at the time. Hell, they still sold El Caminos, fullsize Broncos and Blazers. Small pickups blew most other car segments out of the water, with Quality/Reliability, Style AND Price. A Trifecta! Oops MPG too! Did I mention they were sold at cut-rate pricing????

          • 0 avatar
            Vulpine

            No, Denver. You like to assume you know what I’m thinking and so far you have been 100% WRONG. For instance:

            “You like to assume most consumers, inclined to buy new pickups, have your specific needs, or lack thereof. ”
            — FALSE. I know SOME consumers–enough to warrant a ‘market niche’–have needs and desires similar to mine when it comes to pickup trucks. Why do I know this? Because people are still using them where they can find them AND people have flat told me they don’t like today’s full size OR mid-size trucks simply because they are too big. I never used the word “MOST” when talking about this group, but I have said there are enough to make it worthwhile for the OEMs.

            “those pickup minded consumers, that don’t need 1/2 ton pickup specific capabilities are usually better served with CUVs or Cube/Fit/Xb type of “trucks”.”
            –FALSE. While I don’t deny many of them MAY be better served with CUVs and compact SUVs, NOT ALL are. Many of these compact CUV/SUV owners WANT a pickup truck but DON’T want something as large as a 25-year-old full sized pickup; they want something the size of a 30-year-old COMPACT pickup truck. Like me, they are forced to buy what is available, NOT what they want.

            That’s why sometimes you see where somebody has taken it into their head to modify said small SUV into a pickup truck on their own and in some few cases actually make it look decent. There’s a reason why even Jeep has made a customizing kit for the JKU to turn it into a sort of pickup truck and AEV has gone even farther to make a full-on crew-cab conversion of the JKU into a pickup truck. The drawback in both cases is the cost of the modification and the skills required to make those conversions.

            The market is waiting, but the OEMs don’t yet know how to address that market; they’re afraid that by giving these people what they really want, some other, potentially more profitable product will get cannibalized. But eventually they will HAVE to address it; they can’t make full-sized trucks much larger without having them jump classes right out of the consumer market.

          • 0 avatar
            Vulpine

            The problem with you, Denver, is that you don’t know how to see the “big picture”.

        • 0 avatar
          DenverMike

          @Vulpine – Your friends all agree with you so you will shut thee Hell UP!!!

          And your anecdotal research is just that. Guess what? OEMs have done their own research. And have acted accordingly. They know there’s a small army or “Many” mullet guys stuck in the ’80s, but you’re not worth their time. Too “Many” consumers have move on…

          Just look at how the Miata has evolved from the 1st one. Bigger, heavier and way more technically advanced. Too much so. But you can’t go back in time. Those chintzy early ’80s mini trucks were death traps compared to Today’s midsize pickups.

          But you’re crazy if you think current midsizers are the size of a 1990 fullsize pickup. Midsizers still don’t have 3 across seating and a 1990 fullsize cab-over camper will not fit a midsizer. It would look ridiculous if you did mod it to fit the bed. And dangerously top heavy. Nutz…

          Industrious consumers have always modified when what’s for sale doesn’t suit their exact needs. But “many” of those have time to waste and money to burn. And love to be different. OEMs are fully aware and do sometimes build to suite those “needs”. Like the Subaru BAJA and GM Avalanche. Commercially, they fell somewhere between weak and disaster. Aftermarket efforts don’t prove a thing. You’re still talking about niche markets, far removed from the mainstream.

          Bottom line, OEMS aren’t STUP!D. If there’s BIG enough demand, it will be met. Otherwise it’s no different than consumers demanding brown compact diesel station wagons with the manual trans.

          I want Pizza for breakfast, so millions must…

          Wrong. OEMs don’t HAVE to address anything. Your “needs” will continue to be irrelevant.

          But what do you mean by “jumping classes”? Half tons are far from 3/4 tons and midsizers are far from 1/2 tons. All have evolved/improved/safer/added features/more capacity/ more passengers. But it’s all relative. But why does everything have to stay the same? Get out of the ’80s, Mullet Man!!!!!!!

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