By on September 2, 2021

Genesis presented its vision a sustainable future on Thursday and settled upon total electrification, just like every other automaker. Hyundai’s luxury component plans to become a “100-percent zero-emission vehicle brand by 2030” but foresees the need to wait until 2025 to transition its fleet entirely over to battery and hydrogen power.

Does it mean anything? If the automotive industry’s prior promises of automated driving and EV sales are anything to go by, probably not. However, electrification has gotten a major kick in the pants over the last few years as governments have ramped up regulator pressures and the sector has been flooded with money to help the cause. So there’s certainly a chance, just like when you play the lottery. 

“Genesis has been on an intensive, bold and successful journey, successfully establishing itself as a truly global luxury brand,” stated Hyundai Motor Group Chairman Euisun Chung in a release. “Genesis is once again at the starting point of another audacious journey — the journey towards a sustainable future.”

But the hydrogen fuel cell aspect makes me worried. Hydrogen stations are few and far between, likely resulting in a future where Genesis has to sell a large portion of those vehicles to Californians, South Koreans, and the Japanese. Barring a sudden explosion in hydrogen refineries and fueling stations across the globe, FCEVs don’t have a chance of becoming mass-market automobiles. While the same could be said about battery electric vehicles, the charging infrastructure is growing beyond the confines of urban hubs and customers have the ability to recoup lost energy at home.

Though the company claims to be serious and has confirmed that 2025 will be the year that it drops the internal combustion engine entirely. It even provided a video experience to give us a taste of what that might look like.

 

Based on prior statements, the G80 sedan will be the first EV in Genesis’ lineup. It’s likely to be followed by the GV60 crossover, which is due by the end of 2022. There are also a few new designs in the video. But we cannot say whether they’re indicative of anything that might someday go on sale — even if Genesis hinted that they probably would be.

[Image: Genesis]

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74 Comments on “Genesis Going All Electric in 2025...”


  • avatar
    cwa107

    Will it then be called the Exodus? If they decide to spin another Hyundai brand, I vote for Deuteronomy for the name.

  • avatar
    28-Cars-Later

    “Though the company claims to be serious and has confirmed that 2025 will be the year that it drops the internal combustion engine entirely.”

    They are not unless they seek bankruptcy in 2026. They likely picked 2025 because it will allow them to see how the 2024 [s]election plays out.

    • 0 avatar
      FreedMike

      Well, not surprisingly, the article got that somewhat wrong – all new vehicles introduced after 2025 will be EVs. Presumably they current models will finish their production runs. So it’s not “we’re making nothing but EVs in 2025” at all.

      But I think Hyundai has a good idea here. They’re talking about doing 400,000 units per year, and that’s doable, particularly in the luxury space.

      • 0 avatar
        28-Cars-Later

        Globally, 400K units would be tough the way things are going. In USDM at present, 50K units would almost be a miracle.

        • 0 avatar
          FreedMike

          Someone is going to be the first brand that really gives Tesla a run for its’ money. Of course, it depends on the product, but I wouldn’t bet against Hyundai/Genesis. They already have some pretty solid EV offerings (particularly the Kia Niro, which is a nice piece).

          I think they will have a better shot than, say, Cadillac (particularly given how butt-ugly that whatever-iq they’re going to try and sell is).

          • 0 avatar
            ajla

            Eventually, yes.
            Tesla is so many miles ahead of everyone right now though that it could be awhile. It isn’t quite like Ford in the 1920s, but it isn’t that far off either.

            In the US only one nonTelsa (the heavily discounted Bolt) vehicle even managed to break into 5-fgure sales numbers for 2020. Meanwhile, Tesla sold almost 300K cars in the US at relatively high prices with no discounts and no dealer network.

            Globally, two micro cars (the Renault Zoe and Wuling Hongguang mini ev), have the best nonTesla EV volume, but VW seems best positioned of the legacy automakers. Then again, they are VW and the ID.4 isn’t even that good.

          • 0 avatar

            Had to take a look at this. Found numbers for the first half of the year. If we double them here is what we have for top US EVs

            Model Y 140k
            Model 3 100k
            Bolt 40k
            Mach E 25k
            Leaf 14k
            E-tron 13k
            ID-4 12k
            Model x 12k
            Taycan 10k
            Model S 10k

            So Tesla is losing ground on the top end but man they control lets call the low middle end with a staggering lead.

    • 0 avatar
      jalop1991

      “They are not unless they seek bankruptcy in 2026.”

      My thoughts exactly. The headline that immediately went through my mind was, “Genesis to Exit Business in 2025”.

    • 0 avatar

      “to see how the 2024 [s]election plays out”

      There is no secret here – they will go as planned. So it will be EV-only in 2025.

    • 0 avatar
      stuki

      Not sure about “bankruptcy.” Noone connected who do what Massa says, does that anymore. In financialized dystopias, central banks and government instead simply redistribute wealth from productive people, to keep the value-subtractors flush. Look at Tesla. What mediocrity wouldn’t want to be like Musk? He’s what the indoctrinati is being told being a “Great Businessman” is all about these days. One centralbank-and-government-mandate-theft funded, value destroying, childish publicity stunt after another. (He’s honestly not a bad guy. Just a very visible artifact of a completely broken once-was society)

      South Korea, judging by military procurement programmed, are going the way of the US. And previously Soviets: All outcomes dictated by closeness to Dear Leader and his institutions of crass theft and redistribution.

      But while not bankrupt, definitely irrelevant. Again, like their Soviet forebears, like Lada. And the US ones, like Cadillac.

  • avatar
    ajla

    “Though the company claims to be serious and has confirmed that 2025 will be the year that it drops the internal combustion engine entirely.”

    That’s not completely accurate. Any *new* Genesis after 2025 would be BEV or hydrogen but legacy ICE could go on until 2030. Check out 4:24 of the video.

    • 0 avatar
      FreedMike

      Good catch. Kind of pathetic that a reader has to do a journalist’s basic job, but there you have it.

      In any case, I find Genesis’ EV-fleet claims a lot more credible than Stellantis’. Hyundai is doing a ton of electrification.

      • 0 avatar
        Lynchenstein

        There’s a very big difference between a blogger and a journalist.

        • 0 avatar
          FreedMike

          Both are in the business of disseminating news. I don’t see the difference.

          The only difference is whether the blogger wants to have a reputation for truth, or for bulls**t.

      • 0 avatar
        ajla

        As you know, I put very little faith behind these kind of announcements. While Hyundai is further along than Stellantis, the company still has to yet to offer a 50-state BEV. But, in the next 3-4 years Genesis will *NEVER* sell an updated ICE vehicle again and in 2030 ICE will be dropped entirely from the brand? It’s possible, but I have big doubts.

        What BMW announced today (40% emission reduction and half of sales being electric by 2030) still seems aggressive but much more feasible. BMW has been in the EV game for some time now, they know success is a lot harder than press releases and a teaser video.

        reuters.com/business/sustainable-business/bmw-reduce-carbon-
        emissions-car-life-cycle-40-by-2030-2021-09-02/

        Aside from maybe Tesla every automaker is banking on a major commercially-viable sodium-ion solid state battery breakthrough to occur in the next 5 years. If it happens then everyone looks like oracles, but if it doesn’t “all electric” will become “some electric and some 48V mild hybrids”.

  • avatar
    dukeisduke

    “Hyundai’s luxury component plans to become a ‘100-percent zero-emission vehicle brand by 2030’ but foresees the need to wait until 2025 to transition its fleet entirely over to battery and hydrogen power.”

    Huh? That sounds like 2030 will be here before 2025.

  • avatar
    dukeisduke

    “Futuring”? Dictionary, shmictionary.

    • 0 avatar
      28-Cars-Later

      Futuring is a perfectly cromulent word.

      Example: Hyundai better hope they don’t run into Corey-level issues while they are futuring the Genesis marque.

      • 0 avatar

        Don’t bring me into this!

        I think all these EV proclamations will be pulled back. The media will focus on the new date(s) later, and not much attention will be paid to the delay in launch of products and former promises made. There is everything to gain by stating EV future and nothing to lose.

        For examples of this process see Tesla, who has just delayed the “better than Ford Lightning” Cybertruck, yet again.

        • 0 avatar
          stuki

          + a million.

          Financlialized dystopias reward selling hype to the mediocrities which central banks transferred control of all assets to.

          Hence why selling mindless hype to rank mediocrities (I’m honestly being generous) is; by now, 50 years past Nixon severing the Dollar’s last remaining tie to Gold; infinitely more lucrative, than being competent enough to build or do something useful.

          It goes waaaaay beyond just EV proclamations. They’re just one of the more currently visible tips of the iceberg. It’s idiocy for idiots al the way down.

  • avatar
    Car61

    I won’t buy an electric car until the batteries are certified to be free of child labor, union made and manufactured under carbon free processes.

    And all of this from the mining of the raw materials to the mandated environmentally sustainable recycling of the used batteries.

    How can we be sure that children and people of color have not been used to satisfy the selfish ego of rich people?

    How can we be sure that the labor used to produce and recycle them is fully protected by a union?

    How can we be free that no carbon has been consumed in the manufacturing and recycling processes?

    Other than that we are just exchanging one evil for another.

    No blood for oil! No exploitation, of the planet or of people, for lithium!

    • 0 avatar
      FreedMike

      I’m sure you have the same standards about everything else you buy.

      • 0 avatar
        Car61

        OK, so what will YOU do to make sure your electric car is not made from child labor? I’m sure you can make a pledge!

        Really, I’m sure you want to save the planet from global warming right? But will you simply ignore the distinct possibility that your car was made with child labor?

        Why would you not support a certification regime to make sure that batteries are ethically sourced, manufactured and disposed of?

        • 0 avatar
          FreedMike

          So, unless everything I buy is 100% ethically sourced, I shouldn’t buy it?

          Sounds like a good way to not buy anything to me…or a backdoor argument against buying electric cars, which I’ve heard before from the “Death Before EV” crowd.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            I’ve seen the ethics of the people who get their panties in a twist about “ethically sourced” items. Just ignore the NPCs and move on.

          • 0 avatar
            mcs

            @FreedMike: If they want ethically sourced batteries, they are available. LiFE doesn’t have nickel or cobalt and sodium-ion doesn’t have lithium. Both those technologies are here and soon you’ll be able to get a Tesla in the US with LiFE.

            For carbon neutral lithium, there are places like the Salton Sea and Britain that have geothermal sites that can produce lithium.

            https://www.autoevolution.com/news/vast-supply-of-lithium-discovered-in-uk-it-is-renewable-and-carbon-neutral-168386.html#:~:text=A%20geothermal%20power%20plant%20in,per%20liter%20(1.05%20qt).

            The batteries aren’t carbon neutral argument is dead. There are clean sources and new techologies entering mass production that eliminate the issues.

          • 0 avatar
            Car61

            Yes, that’s right. You should not buy it.

            Rich corporations exploit children in third world nations, children who should be going to school and getting educated, all for what? So that rich people can drive around in fancy electric cars?

            Why do you want to be a part of that? Why would you want to enslave children through your devotion to electric cars? Blood is on your hands, the blood of disadvantaged children in exploited countries.

            You need to examine your conscience.

            Nobody is calling for banning electric cars. That is a straw man argument presented by people who want to continue the fossil fuel economy. Don’t ally with them!

            Instead you could support the creation of a certification regime that makes sure that electric cars, batteries, are ethically sourced, produced and disposed of. Take action!

            I’ve declared my commitment.

            You’re either part of the problem, or part of the solution. People all over are waking up and taking a stand. Will you?

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            “Nobody is calling for banning electric cars.”

            Actually I am :D

            Nah, but I am calling for the agenda to be dropped and govtards redeployed (ideally to the unemployment line for most of them) and let the technology evolve on its own.

          • 0 avatar
            jalop1991

            FreedMike: “So, unless everything I buy is 100% ethically sourced, I shouldn’t buy it?”

            I don’t think he’s saying that. He’s pointing out that you’ll all smug your way around with “lookie me, no gasoline, no tailpipe!” while driving around a car that is potentially WORSE for the world than an ICE that consumes gasoline.

            This mad rush to BEVs is being done in a vacuum. And morons are declaring victory over the evil ICE while sticking their heads in the sand about the other problems they’ve created.

            Squeeze the balloon, and it’ll pop out on the other side. Don’t just stare at the part you’ve squeezed, ignore the other side, and declare some sort of victory.

        • 0 avatar
          aja8888

          The clothes on your body are probably made using child labor.

          • 0 avatar
            FreedMike

            Exactly. Curious where this newbie is coming from. Is this a “only buy ethically sourced products” type, or is he the in the “but, but, but…the pieces in your EV are made by child/slave laborers, so EVs are unethical products” anti-EV crowd? Time will tell. But the anti-EV folks usually say stuff like that right after they fill up their Ram Super Duty with fuel that originated in Saudi Arabia or Sudan.

          • 0 avatar
            slavuta

            When I was a child, I’ve spent some school days working in collective farms, picking up potatoes that machinery left behind. I’ve spent some after school hours working at one of the factories I was assigned to. I swept streets and limewashed trees during subbotniks. I’ve built wood pallets during labor and skill hours, I’ve loaded coal into school’s boiler room, I’ve collected by quota – metals, papers, fresh grass or pine branches.
            As result, by age of 16 I was able to do almost anything using tools, etc.

        • 0 avatar
          stuki

          “OK, so what will YOU do to make sure your electric car is not made from child labor?”

          Ehh, buy a real car?

          • 0 avatar
            mcs

            “OK, so what will YOU do to make sure your electric car is not made from child labor?”

            Make sure the products, EVs or anything else you buy uses the Responsible Minerals Initiative. Check the companies SEC reports for a statement. I have a link to Teslas. Ford uses RMI as well, but I don’t have a link. As for your phone, laptop or anything else that might have an issue including jewelry, makeup etc, check it out. Ethically sourced minerals shouldn’t be required only for EVs.

            https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/files/about/legal/2018-conflict-minerals-report.pdf

            http://www.responsiblemineralsinitiative.org/

            https://www.forbes.com/sites/rachelwolfson/2019/01/16/ford-motor-company-launches-blockchain-pilot-on-ibm-platform-to-ensure-ethical-sourcing-of-cobalt/?sh=7851a8445a1d

          • 0 avatar
            mcs

            Oil is a mineral too. So, next time you go for gas, make sure they have ethically sourced gasoline. Maybe there will be a sticker on the pump? You don’t want any gasoline made from Saudi Oil. Probably not from any place causing environmental damage from its extraction.

            “https://www.texastribune.org/2016/12/21/texas-abandoned-oil-wells-seen-ticking-time-bombs-/”

            https://media.business-humanrights.org/media/documents/files/documents/Oil_and_Gas_Scoping_Paper_19012015.pdf

            https://www.researchgate.net/publication/51615465_Take_home_lead_exposure_in_children_of_oil_field_workers

            https://borgenproject.org/10-facts-about-child-labor-in-saudi-arabia/

            https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-42168902

    • 0 avatar
      dwford

      The same crowd pushing EVs doesn’t want us to mine the necessary materials here in the US, so good luck in your future purchases.

      NO: Us drilled oil, US mined materials
      YES: Chinese made solar panels of questionable production practices (subsidized by the US government)

    • 0 avatar
      jalop1991

      Car61, you’ve nailed it. In the words of PT Barnum himself, there is a sucker born every minute.

      And mark my words, this whole mania for “we must make all cars electric!” is just going to be another way to separate the haves from the have-nots. All cars will be high end/expensive Tesla cars and equivalent, and if the proles have to walk to work, well, screw ’em, that’s their problem.

    • 0 avatar
      DrSandman

      The best tactic is one that your people enjoy.
      Make your targets live up to their own rules.
      Pick a target, freeze it, personalize it.

      Bravo, Car61!

    • 0 avatar
      ToolGuy

      @Car61, My associates and I applaud your initiative and are eager to join you, BUT would like to suggest one revision before we can get on board with our consciences unbesmirched.

      Can we amend
      “…certified to be free of child labor, union made and manufactured under carbon free processes”
      to read as
      “…certified to be free of child labor, corruption-free union made and manufactured under carbon free processes”

      TL;DR: Like your proposal, but it doesn’t go far enough. One evil for another, yada yada.

      Thanks in advance.

  • avatar
    Jeff_M

    I’ve never been less excited about anything automotive than EV’s. I find them to be a total, crashing bore. If this is the future of automobiles, I guess I’ll take up pinochle.

    • 0 avatar
      FreedMike

      Just curious…have you driven one?

      • 0 avatar
        Car61

        Again, nobody is against electric vehicles.

        I’ve made my commitment. How about you?

        We are against child labor involved in their production.

        We are against the environmentally irresponsible disposal of batteries when they are used up.

        We don’t trust corporations that they will do the right thing unless they are held fully accountable, at least by a certification regime, and regulation.

        Will you support this movement, or will you continue to evade your responsibility?

        No more exploitation for electric vehicles and batteries, of people of color, of children or of the environment!

        FreedMike, if you do not heed this call you will be complicit in terrible things! That’s not who you are! I know you can do the right thing!

        • 0 avatar
          28-Cars-Later

          “We are against the environmentally irresponsible disposal of batteries when they are used up.”

          I’m on board with this, the rest m’eh.

        • 0 avatar
          mcs

          “We are against child labor involved in their production.”

          There is no child labor needed for EV production. I doubt any EVs sold in the US use any sort of child labor. The only child labor I’ve ever heard about was D.R. Congo cobalt. Manufacturers are eliminating cobalt because of the cost. You can even get a Tesla with LFP batteries that not only doesn’t contain cobalt, but they don’t have nickel either. What is the problem? Where is the child labor? Where?

          • 0 avatar
            Car61

            Here it is:

            https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jan/03/child-labour-toxic-leaks-the-price-we-could-pay-for-a-greener-future

            There’s more if you look for it.

            You cannot be sure that there is no child labor, that there are no environmentally harmful processes involved in the rush for rich people to drive electric cars until there is a certification process in place, with regulation to enforce it.

            Who would believe the corporations that they are actually not exploiting the planet and people of color? There must be strict regulation of this industry from the very beginning to avoid the same mistakes that were made with the horrible internal combustion engine.

            What age do we live in? Somewhere out there is a child who suffers for every mile you drive in your electric car. A better, greener future is not without its costs. Those costs should be paid for remediation of environmental and social injustice, not further exploitation.

            How could you possible argue against prevention and remediation of social and environmental injustice?

          • 0 avatar
            FreedMike

            We don’t want to use unethically sourced stuff in the products we buy. No argument there.

            Problem is, you’re lecturing me and others for not being ethical about this, but 1) you’re not telling us how ethical YOU are, and 2) if we truly don’t buy products that have an “unethical whiff” about them, then what range of products do we really have to choose from? Seems to me sniffing out unethical products can be a full time job. And I’m pretty sure the “ethically sourced” stuff is all going to come with a price premium, which means that getting rid of the unethically sourced stuff typically punishes consumers with less to spend.

            We can talk all we want about the “unethical” products being used to make EVS. It’s a legit conversation to have. But you can make that argument while sitting on your phone (which most likely contains raw materials or manufacture via child/slave labor), while you’re in the driver’s seat of your car (which most likely contains raw materials or manufacture via child/slave labor), waiting for your gas tank to be filled up (using oil sourced from countries with horrible human rights records). I don’t know if hypocritical is the right term to use for this – maybe “morally inconsistent”?

            Your concerns are not off base. But it’s all to easy to say “just say no,” when we likely “just say yes” dozens of times a week with other products. In other words, if we choose to die on the “ethically sourced” hill, we’re gonna die a lot.

            What’s your plan for how to ensure the problem doesn’t continue? I’m all ears.

        • 0 avatar
          Car61

          So, the replies seem to have a limit on each post, so I am posting here.

          I have publicly declared for all to see my sincere commitment to not buy any EV until it has been verified by a third party certification regime to be free of human and natural resource exploitation, from the sourcing of raw materials to recycling of end of life batteries.

          I DEMAND the following:

          – No blood for lithium!

          – Union labor only! (Corruption in unions is a separate fight. We must remain focused here)

          – No child labor in EV manufacturing, at any level.

          – Carbon free manufacturing processes only! Otherwise, what’s the point of EV’s if they are made by spewing more CO2 into our biosphere? You know, the biosphere that keeps us alive???

          – Strict government regulation of the EV industry to insure these demands are met! Corporations are NOT to be trusted. They must be held accountable by government! Don’t let these criminals get away with trashing the planet AGAIN!

          How could any moral, decent person not support these demands? Is it a full time job? Of course it is! But, we can be the change we seek.

          Look at Greenpeace, MADD, hell, even movies need to certify that no animals are harmed in their creation! Have we less compassion for our Earth Mother than for animals???

          The earth is burning as we speak! There is not time to evade our responsibility to society and the planet!

          FreedMike, I know you have the decency to join us in these demands, in this movement. Take a stand! We can repent and make amends together, as a collective!

          Ask yourself, What would Greta do?

          Yes you can be cynical and turn away, but it’s the committed dreamers who change the world!!!

          Say it with me, “No blood for lithium!”

      • 0 avatar
        Jeff_M

        I’ve ridden in a Bolt and received the ubiquitous acceleration demo, which was impressive. However, I’d trade three seconds off the 0-60 time for an additional 100 miles of range. In truth, the Bolt was (for me) a yawner.

      • 0 avatar
        Jeff_M

        I’ve ridden in a Bolt and received the ubiquitous acceleration demo, which was impressive. However, I’d trade three seconds off the 0-60 time for an additional 100 miles of range. In truth, the Bolt was (for me) a yawner.

    • 0 avatar
      stuki

      “If this is the future of automobiles,”

      It’s not.

      All it is, is yet another mechanism for handing other people’s earnings to connected dilettantes too incompetent to compete at making real cars.

      Like all else in totalitarian, financialized dystopias.

  • avatar
    BSttac

    Was excited for Genesis, now I’m not. Really dislike the styling of the GV60 previewed. Not attractive

  • avatar
    Jimf

    They are clearly seeking to become a niche vehicle supplier…although they will not be able to support economies of scale as such and vanishing of the brand beckons.

  • avatar
    dwford

    I can’t wait until 2030. Seems like multiple automakers think they will be 100% EV by then. The car buying public is going to have to undergo a massive paradigm shift in only 8 years. Color me skeptical, but I see way too many people who still think pairing their phones is too much work, and Bluetooth have been around for 15 years.

  • avatar
    Imagefont

    So every Genesis is going to cost $15$ more than it does now. Sure, that’s a formula for success. Adjust your sales forecast accordingly.
    Literally everything is about price.

  • avatar

    Avoiding the future is the most counterproductive strategy. All Hyundai tries to do with Genesis is to continue marque into the future. GM follows the same strategy with Cadillac.

    • 0 avatar
      slavuta

      PA (PA democrats) now are trying to join CO2 reducing energy coalition of northeastern states. Energy plants will have to buy co2 credits. Energy will be more costly. I wonder, if some plants will close and possible energy blackouts will become common, and the people, businesses will start using their diesel generators, how is this going to help co2?

  • avatar
    pmirp1

    Unless the electric charging process can improve to be as quick and plentiful as gas stations, we’ll just keep fixing our old vehicles like in Cuba and keep driving them. They can keep their expensive electric cars for cities.

    • 0 avatar
      dougjp

      Exactly what I was going to say :)

      And of course both the infrastructure and recharging speed are impossible to be in place by the time any of these manufacturers exponentially expand the demand – for BOTH.

      I can see a huge sales increase for new and upscale ICE cars in the short/medium term future, people saying they are going to buy their final vehicle and keep it. Which is exactly what I’m going to do.

  • avatar
    jmo2

    “ However, electrification has gotten a major kick in the pants over the last few years as governments have ramped up regulator pressures and the sector has been flooded with money to help the cause.”

    Well that and much cheaper batteries, vastly expanded charging infrastructure, much higher performance…. But you knew that…

    • 0 avatar
      stuki

      “governments have ramped up regulator pressures and the sector has been flooded with money”

      Just like Lada! The original Tesla!

      No matter how much pressure a government 5 year planner ramps up, he is still just a clueless apparatchik.

      And ditto, no matter how much freshly printed money a rank idiot on Fed welfare distributes to his equally rank idiot class-mates (an integral part of being an idiot, is the inability to discern that other idiots are also in fact so…), it will still all be wasted on nothing but rank idiocies.

      Like battery cars.

      Economics isn’t just some parlor game nor PR babble spouted by rank idiots wearing Adam Smith ties. It may sure look that way, but underneath all the rank idiocy, there is some very simple logic. Simple at least, for those who aren’t rank idiots….. And, as any (non rank idiot) economist will tell you, neither “government pressure” nor “crass theft and redistribution to rank idiots” are proper mechanisms for successful and lasting development. Of anything. At least anything other than ever more elaborate rank idiocies.

  • avatar
    Jeff S

    @pmirp1–Agree and that is one reason I ordered a new Maverick. I don’t plan on getting a new vehicle or any vehicle for at least 10 years and maybe by then the infrastructure and less expensive and better batteries will be available. Also give it time for my affordable EVs which I believe over time will happen. I will keep what I have and run my other 2 low mileage vehicles for another 10 years and eventually downsize to 1 or 2 vehicles.

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