By on June 13, 2016

Money (Frankleleon/Flickr)

When a police cruiser lights up behind you, a driver usually fears two things: a costly speeding ticket, or a roadside breathalyzer test.

The driver probably isn’t worrying about having the contents of his or her bank account seized, followed by a long and possibly fruitless journey to recoup their lost cash, but that’s the power local law enforcement has over its citizens.

And technology is now making it easier to use that power more and more often.

If you’re nervous, look shady, or give police any reason to suspect you could be involved in a crime, civil asset forfeiture (CAF) laws allow law enforcement officers to seize your cash and bank account — even without a criminal charge. Under the federal equitable sharing program, the bulk of those assets can then be spread to local law enforcement, giving officers an incentive to find something wrong with your car, your behavior, and your story.

Only two states — Nebraska and Wisconsin — require officers to prove potential criminal activity “beyond a reasonable doubt” before going through with CAF. And because it’s a federal program, equitable sharing allows law enforcement to side-step state laws on money gathered through forfeiture.

The Oklahoma Highway Patrol has a new tool to help them separate a driver from their assets. Their troopers are already using an Electronic Recovery and Access to Data Machine (ERAD), which gives them easy access to funds on drivers’ bank cards and prepaid cards. OHP began using 16 ERAD devices in May, according to News9 (via The Free Thought Project).

“We’re gonna look for different factors in the way that you’re acting,” Oklahoma Highway Patrol Lt. John Vincent told the news station. “We’re gonna look for if there’s a difference in your story. If there’s some way that we can prove that you’re falsifying information to us about your business.”

Vincent added that if a driver can prove they have a “legitimate reason” for having the money — be it in their glove box or bank account, they’ll get it back.

It isn’t just local law enforcement that benefits from the funds gained through asset forfeiture and equitable sharing. News9 found that the maker of the scanner devices, ERAD Group, Inc., signed a contract to be paid $5,000 for the purchase of each device and related software, and 7.7 percent of all the money the OHP seized.

Critics say the practice amounts to theft, as law enforcement doesn’t have to prove a driver’s assets were tied to criminal activity. Because police can seize assets without a criminal charge, the case amounts to a civil procedure — a dispute between law enforcement and a person’s property. Getting the money back can be difficult.

Oklahoma Senator Kyle Loveless (R) is fighting the practice, telling the news station that abuse has already occurred. He pointed to cases where single mothers, a cancer survivor, a Christian band and others had their assets seized.

According to the Washington Post, the U.S. Department of Justice suspended equitable sharing in December of last year, but restarted the program in April. The newspaper’s editorial board slammed the program, stating, “Any link between the volume of seizures and the windfall to police departments must be broken. Otherwise police departments will be tempted to push the rules as far as they can.”

Asset forfeiture funds at the Justice Department and U.S. Treasury ballooned during and after the recession, growing from under $1 billion dollars in 2006 to about $4.5 billion in 2014.

Even if the feds scrap the program, state CAF laws remain with the potential for abuse. Brad Cates, a former director of the Justice Department’s Asset Forfeiture Office, wrote in the Wall Street Journal earlier this year that CAF laws had turned into “policing for profit.”

Telling any group to ditch their cash cow always leads to resistance, so expect this battle to play out in the long-term. In the meantime, drivers — in Oklahoma especially — will continue to fear an officer’s ERAD machine as much their sidearm.

[Image: Frankieleon/Flickr]

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79 Comments on “‘License, Registration, and Assets, Please’: How Oklahoma Cops Swipe Away Your Money During a Traffic Stop...”


  • avatar
    CoreyDL

    “ERAD Group, Inc., signed a contract to be paid $5,000 for the purchase of each device and related software, and 7.7 percent of all the money the OHP seized.”

    This part really bothers me. The private company will be profiting directly from crime and/or seizures of property. It’s thus in their best interests if there’s more crime and illegal activity.

    What’s that other thing which is happiest and makes the most money when there’s more crime? Oh yeah, the mafia.

    • 0 avatar
      28-Cars-Later

      The traffic camera criminals pulled the same thing, what’s worrisome is local government openly is involved in what they know are racketeering scams. Government at all levels is supposed to be the neutral umpire performing certain functions and enforcing codified law, now it has no issue colluding with private companies for a percentage of loot given to the private organization. This is the sort of thing which happens in banana republics…

      • 0 avatar
        MrGreenMan

        It’s why people of goodwill everywhere should have jumped on the anti-red-light-camera bandwagon. These are just as crooked as the stereotype of the old Southern sheriff waiting at the bottom of a hill with a 25 mph speed sign.

        It’s all over the spectrum of political party. In the ballad of the collapse of Michigan, old Jenny G was the first to spend more on prisons than on education, and then Super Nerd Rick not only continued her practice of guaranteed payments to the private prison operators expecting a 90% occupancy but extended the terms far into the future.

        Why so many prisoners? It would be bad for the taxpayer if those bunks they were already paying for were not occupied.

        Regarding banana republics – if we’re at the point where it all looks like it, I think the US has become one. At least we’re not Canada and still have some vestiges of a bill of rights that could theoretically be enforced.

        • 0 avatar
          28-Cars-Later

          Without a doubt. Being away from it for the past two weeks really drives the point home to me.

        • 0 avatar
          bball40dtw

          He can assure that the private prisons hit 90% occupancy by closing the state run prisons. The state is closing a prison in Kingsley, MI and transferring the prisoners to private facilities. That area of Michigan already has a lack of good jobs. The switch to private prisons have been hurting small towns in the state.

          • 0 avatar
            Piston Slap Yo Mama

            bball: Private prisons are a perfect example of capitalism gone wrong, incentivizing nuisance laws and overly harsh prosecutions as the lobbyists for this industry have very deep pockets.
            The roadside thieving of people’s assets is more of the same – this is the most illuminating / distressing article I’ve found on the subject.
            http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2013/08/12/taken
            On a related note, on November 8th I’m voting for whichever candidates are the least cozy with the police as they’ve become too powerful.

          • 0 avatar
            bball40dtw

            You are correct. Private prisons are everything that’s wrong with government and corporations all mashed together in one evil entity.

          • 0 avatar
            redav

            Govt & corporations mashed together isn’t capitalism; it’s corporatism, or possibly socialism.

            Capitalism & prisons implies competing private prisons.

        • 0 avatar
          ect

          “At least we’re not Canada and still have some vestiges of a bill of rights that could theoretically be enforced.”

          What is this supposed to mean?

          On the real topic of this article, I can’t see how any law that allows law enforcement to seize a person’s assets without a criminal conviction can be in any way constitutional.

      • 0 avatar
        CoreyDL

        I agree.

        Same issue here recently, when the city of Cincinnati’s corrupt and terrible (now former) mayor Mark Mallory leased the city’s parking meters and public garages to a private company in 2013. For 40 years.

        It was Xerox.

        That was cancelled in 2015, and now they’re maintaining control in city hall instead. Xerox is still getting a piece somehow, and thus far I’ve not been able to determine why/how.

      • 0 avatar
        rudiger

        ^This. Privately-funded (which is all of them) redlight/speed cameras are the first thing that sprang immediately to mind when I read this.

        The sad thing is, if they had been used as intended (lengthened yellow lights for redlight cameras/speed cameras installed ‘only’ in school zones), they actually work out okay. The problem is, when installed and maintained properly, the cameras then don’t make enough money to justify their existence.

        That’s when the whole ‘we’re only using them for safety’ argument falls completely apart. There’s a long history of the only way the cameras ever get yanked is when they fail to make money for the jurisdiction in which they were installed. For proof, just google ‘redlight cameras’ and ‘Haines City, Florida’. Haines City was raking in the cash until a television station figured out that yellow light time had to be lengthened, by Florida law, when the cameras were installed in any Florida locale. When that happened, suddenly, the violations dropped to a fraction of what they were, the cameras started costing Haines City big money, and the contract with the company that supplied them and sent out the tickets (and subsequently got a big chunk of the violation profit) was dropped.

        So much for safety.

        • 0 avatar

          Baltimore had a similar issue. The state law said that red light and speed cameras could only be set up in school zones. Baltimore decided that a school included everything from a preschool to a hospital that had nursing students. Some of them also included places where the school had shut down.

          They ended up suspending the program after people were able to demonstrate that many of the readings were physically impossible based on fixed objects in the pictures. It’s supposed to come back eventually.

        • 0 avatar
          default

          Long live the correlation=causation fallacy, false premises, the Dunning-Kruger effect, and victim mentality based on each or all.

          Your search terms return no credible sources.

          Credible sources returned allege “The city and ATS worked out a proposed amendment to the contract [2 years] and with the extension through Sept. 30, 2017”, and make no secret that among the motivations is revenue enhancement.

          IIRC, the Haines City “investigation” video included obvious editing discrepancies… and/or the yellow intervals had to actually be shortened to meet ITE guidelines.

          Be that as it may, the very vast majority of motorists, including children at the controls for their first miles, and the elderly their last, somehow, manage to not run red lights at RLC intersections (or rear-end preceding vehicles after wrongly guessing that motorist will hammer the throttle upon display of a yellow signal).

          Actually intending to avoid a rant, once upon a time in this country revenue from traffic violations was utterly insignificant to state and municipal budgets.

          The current rage of being elected on the basis of cutting taxes even as populations have exploded, consequently starving federal and thereby state and city budgets have forced the paltry revenue from traffic tickets into a major consideration of maintaining their existence.

    • 0 avatar
      bball40dtw

      It’s like privately run prisons. If the prison is making money off inmates being housed there, they have no reason to rehabilitate prisoners or let people with smallish drug crimes out early.

    • 0 avatar
      KixStart

      Corey (and 28 and bball), I was thinking along the same lines. Bad enough that the government has a “profit” motive here.

      However, things like this are one aspect of the GOP’s intransigence on “taxes.” It’s not like various levels of government won’t go beating the bushes to extract revenue but instead of doing it “honestly” via taxation, they are tempted to turn to more underhanded means that please the base, civil liberties be damned.

      • 0 avatar
        28-Cars-Later

        General food for thought, as of last year I was told it cost our local city about $60/hour to operate a police car including officer pay, fuel, insurance, and amortized vehicle purchase cost (assuming 24 hour uptime as the same cars are passed to different shifts). Even when the officers are put on roving revenue patrol (which is technically illegal in this state but I digress) the value of the tickets the city sees is something like 15%. Evidently the state gets the lions share for its slush funds, the county gets a nice size cut for doing nothing, and whats left goes to the municipality. There is no mathematical way for the muni to make up the patrol car cost through code enforcement, they are fully dependent on whatever revenue they raise through taxation (which is always short to fund the bloated budgets) and then from funding from the state and federal government (which always has strings attached in some way).

        I think it varies by region, but many of the local governments I know of are effectively bankrupt. What they need to do is cut liabilities and shrink non-essential spending, but this isn’t politically viable thus munis are engaging in schemes with private enterprise. What happened in Detroit will need to be repeated in many places in the nation, we’re seeing that with Puerto Rico and we may soon be seeing it in Chicago. I’m truly concerned local government, which is the branch most likely to have a direct impact on you, will devolve into corrupt organizations as did the Mexican authorities. I don’t look forward to the day when I have to start handing out small bribes to the local police to not get arrested on trumped up charges.

        • 0 avatar
          bball40dtw

          In Michigan, if your city doesn’t have a district court, you gotta pay the city that the court is in, too. The city I live in tried to get away with it, but now they have to pay 1/3 of the money they get from citations/tickets to the city with the court, for operation and expenses of that court.

        • 0 avatar
          Dirty Dingus McGee

          Small town 30 miles south of where I live figured out a way around that. Minor traffic offenses are treated as a code violation, with a small(ish) fine, paid at the police station. If you contest the citation, it goes to county court and is now a regular citation, which will be reported to the state.

          Ask me how I know.

  • avatar
    JimZ

    This is the world that all of you “law and order, lock ’em all up and throw away the key” old f**ks have given us. Thanks a lot.

    • 0 avatar
      yamahog

      Because old f**ks get the benefit of the doubt. My grandparents have a CCW and routinely swap pills with their friends. If you’re a young black guy packing heat and carrying drugs, you’ll go up against the mandatory minimum (12 years) for it.

      But a pair of 70 year olds isn’t going to get searched in a traffic stop and they can afford a good lawyer in the rare chance that they do get caught up in it.

    • 0 avatar
      rudiger

      Exactly. It falls directly within the three tenants of a totalitarian society:

      1. The law is the law.
      2. I’m only doing my job.
      3. If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear.

      • 0 avatar
        OneAlpha

        “There are three groups of people who have no respect for the law: criminals, politicians and the police.”

        This kind of behavior is why I’m a big believer in the idea of applying the same standards of evidence and procedure to both criminal AND civil cases.

        Since the State is going to be exerting its coercive influence in both instances, the same safeguards should be in place.

      • 0 avatar
        redav

        You forget one of the most important tenets:

        4. You don’t get to disagree.

    • 0 avatar
      bunkie

      It has nothing to do with being “old” and everything to do with being a “f***”. There are an awful lot of them out there regardless of age group, including those who see so many issues as being one generation or group against another.

    • 0 avatar
      DrSandman

      Naw, mate. This scam isn’t about “law-n-order.” This is corruption, straight up. Anytime you get our moral-superiors involved, amoral and unethical corruption is the result.

      I’m still for locking up criminals and throwing away the key. The most successful criminals have a (D) or (R) after their name.

  • avatar
    bikegoesbaa

    Please stop using “slammed” to describe anything that is not in fact an actual, physical WWF-style body slam.

    It is classless language, often misleading to the reader, and introduces an unnecessary element of emotion into purely reasonable criticism.

  • avatar

    if a driver can prove they have a “legitimate reason” for having the money — be it in their glove box or bank account, they’ll get it back.

    How backwards. If the state can prove that I got the money illegitimately, they can have it. Innocent until proven guilty should apply to assets, not just people.

    • 0 avatar
      JimZ

      this is what happens when you get a bunch of old people running things who believe “well, if the police are talking to you, you must have done something wrong!” You’re automatically guilty in their eyes, so what do they care if the police take your money and your car.

      The worst part about these people is that if it is *them* (or their kids) who are in trouble, you know damn well they’ll try to move heaven and earth to get out of it. Nothing but a load of hypocrites.

      • 0 avatar
        Kyree S. Williams

        “well, if the police are talking to you, you must have done something wrong!”

        I don’t even think it’s that. I don’t think that anyone, in good conscience, could say that this is a genuine effort to prevent money laundering or organized crime. It’s clearly a racketeering scam, and that above quite just what they’re telling the public. But don’t think for one second that the people who put this into effect actually believe that sh*t.

        The flip side of it is that I, as a black male and as an Oklahoma resident, will continue to avoid all confrontations or interactions with law enforcement. Not that I’m compelled to break the law in the first place, but the police have made sure that I and my kind feel the need to be *extra* careful.

        Now *that’s* terrorism.

        I’m about ready to leave this godforsaken state. I’m not from here, and I have little family here. The low cost-of-living and suburban comfort of my specific area do not make up for the draconian legislature and law-enforcement organizations.

        • 0 avatar
          yamahog

          Do it. When recruiters from States I don’t like (North Carolina – LGBT, Louisiana – ineffective and corrupt government, New York – bad police force gun laws and taxes, and California – gun laws and motorcycle theft problems for instance) reach out to me, I always tell them I’m thankful for the consideration, but the location is a non-starter because of my beef with the state.

          It can’t be lost on them that their dumb states make it harder for them to attract and retain talent.

          Oklahoma isn’t the only state with a low cost of living. And the job market is good for tech workers like us. Keep this law in mind next time you see another position.

        • 0 avatar
          Piston Slap Yo Mama

          Kyree, your nuanced and diplomatic prose suggested to me a New England heritage, not the epicenter of oppression and blinkered thinking that is Texas’ hat. I don’t know how you do it.
          That The Flaming Lips hail from OK boggles the mind.

          • 0 avatar
            Willyam

            I’ll say this, when you are in, say, Chicago, and want to be Evangelical and Republican, you ARE a true believer.
            Conversely, if you are in the reddest of states, and want to be weird in the face of this much opposition, you get Wayne Coyne weird or give up.

        • 0 avatar

          Where is your preferred area of relocation? PGH or the RDC triangle of NC seem to be my prospects.

        • 0 avatar
          Willyam

          Kyree,
          I’m with you. I’ve been here 6 years now (moved for a contract). The cost is low, the school was good at the time, and so we bought in at the bottom for housing. Things just continue to get more bizarre by the day. I cannot imagine the intimidation you put up with.
          I’ve been tailgated by cops in their new Tahoes, going way faster than traffic with no lights on. Then, when you’re slower than they want, they run your plates. (And, in my case, shook a fist at me. Really. For no infraction at ALL.) Thank goodness my POS isn’t worth much to forfeit I guess.

        • 0 avatar
          Dawnrazor

          Based upon your prior posts here it seems as if you might be my neighbor (live in north Edmond, work near the fairgrounds), and though I have never met you I’d nonetheless prefer you not move! From prior posts, you appear to be an articulate, reasonable, intelligent, and thoughtful individual. These are just the traits needed to pull this state out of the stranglehold resulting from decades of reactionary, fear-mongering leadership, and “brain drain” is the last thing we need at this point in our history. Help us “fight the good fight”, man!

          I have lived here since the 80s, and most of my family is here as well. I have wrestled with the idea of relocating more times than I can count over the years, so I definitely empathize with your dilemma. This state can feel like a very lonely place if one deviates at all from the hyper-conservative status quo, but you will find there are some positive things happening if you look for them. Although it seems fairly bleak now, I can assure you it was much worse just 10-15 years ago. There is now mainstream discussion and increasing widespread support for such “liberal” causes as adequate mental health and addiction services, reduced prison population and criminal justice reforms (notwithstanding the asset forfeiture nonsense of course), legalization of medical MJ, and meaningful reform of the public education system. Also, do not dismiss the significance of Sanders beating Clinton in the primary.

          • 0 avatar
            lon888

            Dawnrazor – I’m a 3rd generation Okie and while I’m proud to myself an Okie I truly get embarrassed by the actions of our ultra-conservative politicians and judges. I’m amazed that politicans like Jim Inhofe keep getting re-elected. Its like no in this state watches him being mocked by Bill Maher and his real wickedness being exposed by various episodes of “Vice”. Being a L-word person (you know liberal) in this state makes me and my wife feel alienated because every stinkin’ politico runs on the premise they’re church-going, conservatives who would suck Reagan’s dick if he were to be alive. I wish just once a politician would have the huevos to say f-you, I’m a liberal so just deal with it – I truly want to do the right thing for the citizens. This person would receive as much financial help as I could afford. BTW – I live around the Lake Hefner area and your comments about Kyree are exactly spot on.

      • 0 avatar
        dukeisduke

        Don’t go all “old people” on us. I’m a baby boomer, and I think all this banana republic-style funds confiscation needs to end. Fortunately, the courts are beginning to strike down some of these laws. Due process ought to mean something.

      • 0 avatar
        KixStart

        JimZ: “The worst part about these people is that if it is *them* (or their kids) who are in trouble, you know damn well they’ll try to move heaven and earth to get out of it. Nothing but a load of hypocrites.”

        Abortion is like that, too. The Missouri Synod Lutherans around here are dead set against it except when it’s their teen girl that gets knocked up. Suddenly they don’t want their “good girl’s life ruined” and they avail themselves of a service they’d deny others.

      • 0 avatar
        redav

        It has little to do with ‘old.’ I suspect it is more about where people fall on the freedom/security spectrum.

        Look at the swaths of young folks who eagerly embrace the “listen and believe” rhetoric of social justice. If you are accused of being racist, sexist, etc., you’re automatically guilty and then an array of injustices can be committed against you because you are guilty. Just ask the frats at UVA how that goes.

    • 0 avatar
      rudiger

      The problem is it will be a long, drawn-out, expensive (read: lawyer needed), legal process to get that money back. In the interim, a lot of bad things can happen by not having a big chunk of money, for which there would be absolutely no compensation, nor any type of penalty to the cop(s) that seized the money, even if there was no real probable cause to seize it (including having the ability to prove it was legitimate to have the money on the spot, i.e., in the glove box).

  • avatar
    yamahog

    This is such bologna. I know a lot of people threaten to leave America, but I’m seriously considering it. If the government is going to take my money, I’d prefer that it goes to welfare than buying SUVs and ammo for a bunch of guys who want people to respect their authority.

    And so many police officers are so out of touch – they don’t know how hard people work for their money at minimum wage as opposed to collecting a decent salary and a defined benefit pension for writing speeding tickets. And they tell us that they impartially enforce the law but when a police officer does something questionable, they get the full benefit of reasonable doubt or have even higher standards of guilt. A police officer is only guilty of lying to obtain a warrant in my state if they demonstrate a willful and reckless disregard for the truth. mischaracterizing and selective omission are non-criminal ways to get warrants.

    I’d just like to see a world where police are as afraid of doing something dumb or making a mistake as us citizens are afraid of being the victim of a personal police vendetta / mistake.

    • 0 avatar
      Testacles Megalos

      Sorry Yamahog, the postFDR/WWII world is one in which the Government/military/industrial complex has won.

      No matter where you live on Earth (and presumeably beyond), you’ll still have to pay US taxes.

      Want to renounce your citizenship? You have to pay an exit fee.

      Eisenhower warned against the Mil/Ind complex, usually taken to mean don’t let the big boys beat us up. What he was really saying is, don’t fergit to include Uncle Sam in the complex.

      Liberty and Freedom are hollow words we make our school children parrot, and have no expectation of assuming the responsibility nor realizing the rights behind these ideas.

  • avatar
    Carrera

    I think most of us are safe from having our vacation funds, located in a bank envelope, all in fresh bills, seized after being pulled over for speeding. This refers mostly to the 3,5 million dollars, or occasionally much less than that hidden in the car’s door panels, seat cushions, air filter box, false bottom gas tanks, false bottom coolant or window washer reservoirs and such other places. Don’t know about you all but the very little funds I have on me are not hidden in false bottom gas tanks.

    • 0 avatar
      28-Cars-Later

      See the trick is to have no money at all, then you’re safe from having it stolen :)

    • 0 avatar
      yamahog

      Do you want an officer who has an incentive to seize the cash to be the one who gets to decide whether or not your money is suspicious.

      • 0 avatar
        JK43123

        That’s just it, courts are supposed to decide guilt and punishment. A machine to take your money? Are you kidding me? We really are living in a totalitarian state.

        • 0 avatar
          Carrera

          Now, that’s a little weird..a machine that can read your cards and empty your accounts. I was talking about the 1,5 million stashed in the door panels like any average citizen would have. :)

          • 0 avatar
            Hydromatic

            You’ll hear less about the $1.5 million stashed in a door panel and more about the $25,000 seized from someone trying to buy a car or business equipment in cash or on their way to deposit it in the bank. I’ve heard too many stories of wrongful civil forfeitures to be naive about what’ll happen with ERAD.

            Maybe we should just store all of our bank account information in a national database that LEOs can access at will, just so they’ll be able to keep tabs on what and how we’re spending our own money. You know, just in case. It’s not like you have anything to hide, right?

    • 0 avatar
      bryanska

      In the false-positive occurrences, these weren’t the places cash was found.

      • 0 avatar
        cirats

        Right, and one of the big points here is that the ERAD machine apparently lets the cops take money you don’t even have in cash with you by swiping your ATM card, which is nuts. I’ve seen a number of previous articles about law enforcement being able to confiscate cash and its abuses but was sort of able to put it in the “that will never happen to me” category of things since I don’t carry thousands of dollars of cash around, but this new ability to confiscate from your bank account is pretty terrifying, unless I’m misunderstanding the story.

  • avatar
    bunkie

    To quote the Firesign Theatre:

    “Help! It’s the police!”

  • avatar
    Waaghals

    The fact that the money that is impounded goes to the various police departments and local governments seems like an incredibly dumb idea.

    You should never make hard for public employees (or really anyone) to be honest.

  • avatar
    -Nate

    *Subscribed* .
    .
    -Nate

  • avatar
    Driver8

    Jeez. Speech, right to bear arms (wait for it), search and seizure, a press hardly worth having a right to…
    How far we have fallen.
    I guess I should set up that spare bedroom for troop-quartering.

  • avatar

    I heard urban myths and wives tales that pimps had all of their gold chains not only to show off, but to have physical assets rather than cash to use as capital after an arrest if their money was commandeered by the police.

    Makes sense. Cops take cash and stick all personal effects in a box. Spend a day in jail until your hoes post your bail, and obtain all your goodies back. Then ditch a $10k chain at a pawn shop to recoup some of your funds.

    Also, aren’t there a bunch of people fighting RICO forfeiture? http://cjonline.com/news/2015-10-15/forfeiture-reform-aligns-likes-billionaire-charles-koch-aclu

    Those ERAD devices? Yeah, they’re so you are required to forfeit the funds on gift cards too.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/oklahoma-police-erad_us_57584060e4b0e39a28ac2083

    They should have gone into cahoots with SQUARE or something. 2.5-3% charge rather than 7.7%…..

  • avatar
    bryanska

    Funny; when I was a kid, we were taught to seek out police for help. I’m not really sure I want my own kid to be talking to police.

    I had a cop in my immediate family, and after a couple years I understood their thought pattern to be:

    “If we decide we like you, our relationship is actually going to be fun. If we decide we don’t like you, making your life very unpleasant is laughably easy for us… it makes no difference to us, really. We’re going to forget about you in the morning either way.”

    So in essence, to protect their psyche, they externalize any negative interaction. It’s all very distanced. So don’t think for a moment these cops are your friends. They want to be, but because any relationship with the public is very painful, you’re not about to be “seen”.

  • avatar
    Hoon Goon

    They are fighting for our freedoms. lol

  • avatar
    zip89105

    Illegal search & seizure here. The true criminals are the cops.

    • 0 avatar
      brn

      Nope. It’s the legislators that make these laws.

      • 0 avatar
        zip89105

        The only folks benefitting are the cops, so they’re the true criminals. Even worse they use taxpayer monies to defend they’re lawlessness.

        • 0 avatar
          brn

          Cops may not be benefiting. Maybe it goes into the city’s general fund. The wouldn’t be able to do anything if the law didn’t exist.

          Most law enforcement agencies behave the way their municipality instructs them to behave.

          • 0 avatar
            darkwing

            Don’t forget that money is fungible. (Government money tends to be extra-fungible — still not quite sure how they pull that off.)

            And “I was just following orders” tends to play poorly.

  • avatar
    burnbomber

    Civil forfeiture isn’t just a problem here in Okie land. My workmate and friend (black, too) complains it’s a problem in California, too. That’s where he came from, before moving back home to Tulsa.

    When he travels, he doesn’t EVER take his own car, but instead rents one. He’s afraid of losing his personal ride to bogus traffic stops. That’s how the local governments survive in southern California.

  • avatar
    brn

    I despise laws that violate rights as much as the next guy, but what does this have to do with automotive news? Because something “could” happen during a traffic stop? I looked at the referenced articles and didn’t find any references to traffic stops.

    Keep it auto related. Want to look at possession laws, let’s look at vehicle seizure during a DWI stop.

  • avatar
    Jeff S

    This sounds like it is a violation of the Constitution. This appears to be illegal search and seizure. Wasn’t it Thomas Jefferson that said “the power to tax is the power to destroy.” This law should be challenged.

  • avatar
    John

    So, American citizens are terrified by an organized group of armed robbers who can seize their assets with impunity – if that isn’t domestic terrorism, I don’t know what is.

  • avatar
    MK

    The façade was really taken down with Kelo vs City of New London, everything after that is just penny-ante shakedown.

    Enjoy your freedom!

  • avatar
    PentastarPride

    May any officer that willfully and wrongfully takes what is not theirs have their entire pension (and any semblance of a retirement) evaporated by a multibillionaire hedge fund guy/Wall Streeter type looking for a Ferrari for every day of the week, their third megayacht and their sixth summer home.

  • avatar
    default

    Where in the hell have you guys been since 1981 when the Rehnquist SCOTUS (co-starring Rehnquist clerk Ted Cruz) gutted the 4th Amendment for Ronnie Reagan’s participation in the War on Drugs, blessing us with no-knock search warrants issued on anonymous tips, and civil forfeitures sans charge, trial or conviction… what only us old-timers can remember what used to be known in the US as “due process”…?


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