By on August 13, 2015

 

About three years ago, a friend of mine who lives in Dallas called me to ask my opinion on cars he should buy.

He was cross-shopping a C-Class and 3-Series before the inevitable question came up:

“What do you know about the Cadillac ATS?” he asked.

“I like them. It’s a good start for Cadillac,” I said.

“But isn’t it just a glorified Cavalier or something?” he replied.

Joe (that’s his real name, screw protecting the innocent) may not know as much about cars as the rest of you, but he’s indicative of a typical car buyer who may not be well versed in verticals, corporate structure or Johan de Nysschen. But he does know enough to know there’s a relationship between Cadillac, Chevrolet and GM

The Cadillac CEO yesterday said the luxury arm of General Motors would have more autonomy in the next few years, including sales reporting and presumably profits that it would like to keep behind the Cadillac family crest.

I didn’t bother going into where the ATS came from, or why it’s around, global sales goals and overall platform. Cadillac hasn’t outrun the Cimarron shadow, according to Joe.

In that respect, a further separation from GM would help the brand succeed in becoming a larger, global luxury carmaker.

But it’s undeniable that Cadillac wouldn’t be where it is today without the Escalade — firmly a GM product, first — and the profit it provides. Furthermore, Cadillac gains much from GM’s economy of scale and global reach. On its own, Cadillac wouldn’t have direct access to the same resources without GM — even if it were to contract build every single car from GM.

It’s clear that GM wouldn’t be as profitable without Cadillac, but is it possible that GM is what’s holding Cadillac back from sales success in Europe and beyond?

As de Nysschen pushes Cadillac further from the GM model, a split could come into view, but for Cadillac — a brand that was weaving on the ropes only a few years ago — would breaking away from the mothership be a good thing?

Would Joe, our new luxury car buyer, be tempted into buying a new Cadillac if he knew the flagship luxury brand for GM was a brand all by itself?

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65 Comments on “QOTD: Could Cadillac Make It on Its Own?...”


  • avatar
    IHateCars

    Gee….I wonder if DeadWeight will post on this subject?

  • avatar
    Joss

    Cadillac doesn’t enjoy the engineering & quality perception in Europe. It’s still seen as a chrome – plated barge or pizza with all the topping for gaudy fat yanks.

    • 0 avatar
      energetik9

      That’s OK. Plenty of us here in the US feel the same.

    • 0 avatar
      stuki

      If only they would get back to focusing on being the standard of the world for something, Chrome Plated Barges or not. Beats the heck out of wanting to be just another also-ran at something absolutely everyone else is also trying to be.

      • 0 avatar
        Les

        There was a time, it was ever so long ago though, when ‘Cadillac’ was considered ‘The American Rolls-Royce’.

        Now it’s, “Cadillac.. we’re ‘almost’ a BMW.”

    • 0 avatar
      DeadWeight

      Cadillac is a POS brand now permanently & irreparably damaged, never to be taken as a serious rival to BMW, Lexus, Audi, let alone Mercedes, again, having horrid design, unrefined motors, being unreliable, being overpriced, having horrid dealership sales/service experience, having harsh, jittery ride quality, dreadful interior materials and gauges, cramped cabins, rear seats & trunks in most of their vehicles (especially ATS & CTS), and having a hood rat image.

      The best way to project stupidity in vehicle purchasing IQ is to buy/lease a new Cadillac with one’s own $$$.

      A Chrysler 300 is 300% more plush, quiet, roomy than any Cadillac at 1/2 the price, and the new Hyundai Genesis is more plush, roomy, and light years ahead in technology, build quality and reliability than anything Cadillac at 1/2 to 2/3 the price.

      Cadillac should try to keep up with Hyundai, because any claim of matching Mercedes or Lexus is LAUGHABLE.

  • avatar
    Mr. Orange

    Hasn’t GM’s habit of cutting cost the main reason why Cadillac is where it is. We have story after story of GM squeezing dollars, dimes, and pennies out of components in the case of Cadillac. Giving us cars like the Cimarron and Catera. A history that has led Cadillac to suffering the mass perceptions it has today.

    So if Cadillac’s present management is capable of getting rid of that mindset and corporate culture of doing things as cheaply as possible instead of engineering to a high standard. It would obviously improve perceptions.

    Taking Cadillac back to an independent management structure, free of those trifling managers who cut and cut quality would be a tremendous start. The Cadillac’s that we romanticize today were not created by a Cadillac that had to jutify every component, piece and part on purely cost basis to the same department that was responsible for mainstream and budget models. Not having those people in the same building as you is a decent start.

  • avatar
    tomLU86

    Cadillac’s move to “out-BMW BMW” may appeal to enthusiasts, but was strategically wrong.

    It’s a big shift from BIG, which is what Cadillac stood for. Huge strategic mistake. The Lexus LS400 is what Cadillac should have aimed for, not (older and better) BMW 3 and 5 series. The LS400 also is philosophically closer to an Escalade (or an LX500)

    DeNyschere’s massive ego will simply cause GM employees a lot of grief and turmoil, and cost GM a lot of money (exhibit A, moving a lot of staff to Manhattan to “learn” about luxury), without any MEANINGFUL improvment.

    While BMWs are not as sharp as they used to be, and Mercedes long ago ceased to be “engineered like no other car”, at least they are both original. You won’t find your BMW or Mercedes engine in any other car, unlike Lexus, Infiniti, and Cadillac, who share their powertrains with the more plebeian Toyotas, Nissans, and Chevrolets.

    Audi is the only one who has succeeded in peddling fancier VWs as entry-level luxury. However, Audi did have the all-wheel-drive differentiator. Also, pricier Audis have V8s that VWs don’t.

    Cadillac will be “independent” in the sense that it will be separate enough to warrant Mr. DeNyschere’s, and other high-level GM execs, excessive compensation

    • 0 avatar
      mcs

      >> You won’t find your BMW or Mercedes engine in any other car, unlike Lexus, Infiniti, and Cadillac, who share their powertrains with the more plebeian Toyotas, Nissans, and Chevrolets.

      You might want to read this article:

      ❝Nissan also will produce Mercedes’ 1.8L turbocharged 4-cyl. gasoline engines at its Decherd, TN, factory beginning in 2014 for installation in both Mercedes and Infiniti models, and the two have additional engine-sharing and development programs under way.❞

      http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa/releases/cooperation-of-daimler-and-renault-nissan-alliance-continues-to-accelerate?query=and+daimler+ag+engine

    • 0 avatar
      Dan

      There’s little enough before or since that’s as embarrassing as the Cimarron but you don’t have to go back anything like thirty years to see Cadillac cheerily urinating over any brand value that they may have had left.

      The Catera looked like a big Neon. It had nothing to do with Cadillac. It wasn’t even American. GM decided that they were going to sell it as a Cadillac and its spokesman would be a cartoon duck. I’m about as much of a GM fan as DeadWeight and if you’d told me that they were going to do something that stupid I wouldn’t have believed you. That was 15 years ago.

      The G-body was a nice car for its day. Build quality was atrocious but they had presence, they rode well, the Northstar was sweet before the headbolts gave out. Its day was 1998 and GM was still selling fundamentally and recognizably the same thing to Hertz and the livery companies four years ago.

      Putting your name on crap has consequences.

      • 0 avatar
        Mr. Orange

        They used ducks and now everyone assumes the birds in Cadillac’s former logo were ducks. The fact that the birds were actually merlettes, songbirds, is not known to most because of such misinforming ads.

  • avatar
    28-Cars-Later

    I’m tired of hearing about Cadillac, its was dead and buried a long time ago.

    • 0 avatar

      Neither Cadillac more linking know what they want to be.

      The lack of V8 engines, the lack of physical size, and the lack of V8 engines has killed most interest in their cars.

      It’s really the XTS and Escalade that come the closest to being real “Cadillacs”.

      The interiors are the best that GM has ever fielded but they still go to cheaply on certain parts of the car . These are old men who don’t know what they’re doing to sell to my generation and it just so happens that we are the ones with the new money while the retirees aim for Mercedes BMW and Audi .

      No self-respecting pimp or maffia hood whatever want to find himself dead one of these boredom boxes because the styling get so dated so quickly.

      iI you want to kill Phil Leotardo in style you have to buy a Chrysler 300.

      • 0 avatar
        Daniel J

        Who care’s about what is a “real” Cadillac. Grandma and Grandpa? Personally, I’d take a CTS or an ATS just about over any other car in their classes. If I want large full size car, I agree, the 300 it is. Outside of that…

      • 0 avatar
        MrGreenMan

        Agreeing to suspend disbelief – since there was that Imperial show car that looked like they dipped an entire 300C in Chrome, and since the Fiat part of FCA sees no point in it – what would a modern Imperial look like?

        Nobody pines for De Soto, few pine for Plymouth, but Imperial had some revived interest with the Green Hornet revival a couple years back.

        Could they still stretch the existing 300? Wider as well as longer? Tune the Hemi to be still massive yet smoother? (I haven’t driven one lately so don’t know if they’re already as smooth as butter or if the new 9-speed is pleasant or not.)

        Because, well, who cares about Cadillac.

        Edit: On reviewing the concepts, there also was a taller profile, which would be quite nice. Looked like plenty of driving visibility, maybe about the same stature as the Pacifica but still a car.

    • 0 avatar
      CoreyDL

      *it was DeadWeights and buried a long time ago.

  • avatar
    geozinger

    I think it would be very difficult to separate GM from Cadillac.

    When Saturn launched, there was very little mention about it’s GM roots, at least to the general public. I don’t think the separation would be that easy for Cadillac.

    FWIW, I think that GM should let Cadillac build whatever the hell it likes, i.e., an S-Class competitor, free of the bounds of the rest of the General’s limitations. Screw CAFE, if it’s big enough and equipped well enough the folks will see the value. CAFE and kowtowing to what the rest of GM was forced to do brought us products like the Cimarron and Catera, not good Cadillacs.

    I think this is where Johan is trying to go. Good luck to him, I hope it actually happens. I would love to see something akin to the Voyage concept or the Ciel concept in actual production, CAFE and the rest of GM be damned. I know the ‘Slade and maybe the XTS pay the bills right now, but they have to break through this ceiling to truly compete with the other higher marques.

  • avatar
    tomLU86

    Thanks for bursting my bubble, MCS!

    I appreciate it.

    Soooo…Not only does Mercedes COPY other carmakers in their pursuit of saving money (aka the ubiquitous 3.5 liter 24-valve V6 making approx 300 hp, a variation of the basic design used by every other carmaker of note–must be the optimal cost/benefit pick), but now they will use a Nissan/Infiniti…

    At least BMW still offers a in-line six…and you can only get it in a genuine BMW. Too bad BMWs don’t handle and ride as well as the new Cadillacs (with their plebeian engines…)

    • 0 avatar
      heavy handle

      “now they will use a Nissan/Infiniti…”

      Tom,

      You should re-read what MCS wrote. It’s the other way around, Infinity will use a Mercedes engine.

    • 0 avatar
      SaulTigh

      While I agree that the 3.5L or thereabouts 24-valve V6 has become somewhat ubiquitous (and I enjoy one every single day in my Lincoln), I believe I read that Mercedes is bringing back the straight-6 as part of a modular engine family that will include a new 4-banger.

      Always wanted to own a super-smooth straight-6, so I’m going to be in the market when this comes out.

  • avatar
    87 Morgan

    If it were possible for someone to answer the following questions, I believe we would have our answer.

    How many cars does Cadillac sell annually? How many Escalades do they sell a year? Subtract the former from the latter. *IF* Cadillac can be profitable with out the Escalade, than go for it.

    It is my belief, no proof, that the Chevy architecture under the escalade is what keeps them in the black. It is not all that costly to take a suburban and jab a bigger motor and AWD into it with some nicer interior appointments. I will concede that their is some engineering dollars spent building the molds for the front clip, which is different.

    The Escalade, to me, represents a freebie to Cadillac. Little cost input with a cash cow output. Except, it is the new town car….

    • 0 avatar
      Crazyman

      I’d be willing to say that the ATS and CTS are probably a bit profitable, but not a lot. The SRX probably turns a tidy profit per unit. The XTS is probably their most profitable car outside of the escalade, it’s based on the same platform as the impala (which I’m assuming is profitable) and probably only costs 2k more to make, it wouldn’t surprise me at all to hear that Cadillac makes 15k on every XTS they sell in the US, and 25k on every one they sell in china.

    • 0 avatar
      MrGreenMan

      GoodCarBadCar numbers:

      Cadillac moves between 150-185k units a year. They are on somewhat of a growth trajectory, but so is the entire market. The Escalade and the SRX are around 45% of the total number Cadillac moves.

      NYTimes Auto: Cadillac SUV sales were up 18% year-over-year and incentives were way down in 2014.

      When it came time to decide what BOF SUV to make, as GM was at a capacity problem in May, USA Today reports they chose to emphasize building Escalades instead of Suburbans and Tahoes – because it is one of GM’s most profitable models (probably right after the corvette, but that’s a guess).

      Earlier this year, GM beat earnings estimates of $1.08 per share achieving $1.29 per share on very strong BOF SUV sales, which means Escalade sales.

      As of 11/14, Forbes was questioning the profitability and transaction price on the ATS, and how GM was experiencing downward pressure on these.

      TrueCar as of today is telling me that 10% below invoice is possible and 10% below MSRP is standard for a new CTS. he ATS is similarly experiencing offsets from the factory invoice.

      No, Cadillac cannot survive without the mighty Escalade and its little LaSalle companion, the SRX.

  • avatar
    TW5

    Cadillac could probably survive on their own, but I’m not sure they need to. Plus, CAFE poses complexities. The ELR didn’t exactly set the market ablaze with sales figures. Cadillac will have to sell lots of plug-ins, if they spin-off.

    Cadillac is stronger for using GM powertrains. GM is known for building reliable engines that run forever, particularly V8s and V6s. Cadillac is dragged down by GM’s reputation for building Duplo plastic interiors as cheaply as possible. Even the Chinese blush at GM’s ability to go cheap.

    The move to NY was a decent idea. They have access to marketing and advertising people to help the Cadillac brand. However, DeNysschen also needs to hire in the garment and textile district. They need stylists to help GM woeful interior work, which continues to affect Cadillac. Break free of GM interior work, and the company will be fine, even if they remain attached to GM.

    • 0 avatar
      heavy handle

      The other GM-inherited problem is the lack of parts support for anything that’s not in current production, which absolutely kills residuals. Sure, there’s aftermarket for some basic stuff, but that just means that every 8 year old Cadillac has Pep-Boy brake pads and Monroe shocks. In other words, it drives like a used Sonata.

      GM interiors are so bad it’s funny. Rented a CTS on vacation. The first thing my wife says when we sit inside is “this is a cheap car pretending to be a luxury car.” There’s fake leather stitching everywhere, but the controls are crap and the seats feel like they are made from recycled plastic bottles. It’s just like buying a 5 piece “designer” leather living room set for $499 from the outlet mall: it looks similar to the real thing from 20 feet away, but there’s absolutely no comparison when you get any nearer.

      • 0 avatar
        28-Cars-Later

        “which absolutely kills residuals”

        They have demonstrated for years they do not care about resale on their products.

        “In other words, it drives like a used Sonata.”

        I thought it already did?

        • 0 avatar
          heavy handle

          New Cadillacs drive OK. They have decent brakes, decent suspension, they are relatively tight. One may or may not like the suspension tuning, but you’ll figure that out during the test drive.

          The thing is, I can go to an Audi, BMW, Mercedes, or even Volvo dealer and get pads, rotors, struts, etc that will make a 1998 drive like new (at a price). Can’t do that with GM products, even official Delco rotors don’t fit like the ones that were installed on the line.

  • avatar
    Pch101

    “It’s clear that GM wouldn’t be as profitable without Cadillac”

    I have my doubts that GM has been rewarded handsomely for its investments in the ATS and CTS. The Escalade must be a financial home run in terms of the margins, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that the brand pulls its weight.

  • avatar
    dwford

    This level of consumer ignorance is why it is such a chore to rehab a brand image in this country. To have a buyer in 2015 reference the Chevy Cavalier as the base for a Cadillac when that hasn’t been the case in 30 YEARS must be very frustrating for Cadillac.

    Everyone says that Cadillac is about 10 years into their overhaul, but in reality it is more like 25 years, starting with the Seville STS and the Northstar V8 back in the early 90’s.

    The real problem is that for all the money spent, Cadillac has yet to produce that blockbuster model that is really top of class to change people’s mindsets. Each model has been better than the last, but they are still, after all this time, chasing the best in class, so there is no reason for consumers to make the switch.

    • 0 avatar
      Gardiner Westbound

      “Cadillac Northstar Engine Problems”

      http://www.ehow.com/about_6637955_cadillac-northstar-engine-problems.html

      • 0 avatar
        dwford

        Yes the Northstar is famous for it’s problems, but it was a major investment and change for Cadillac meant to change people’s perceptions. It was much more high tech than the previous motor and had much more horsepower. That was really the start of Cadillac trying to lure import buyers and change people’s minds.

        • 0 avatar
          28-Cars-Later

          The Northstar was a Takata airbag to the wallets of new car owners. Simultaneously it was both revolutionary and disposable junk (literally designed to be disposable and not rebuildable). Although of course the LS did not yet exist, Cadillac would have been wise to switch too it soon after became available (which is ironic because they did offer a transverse LS in the form of the LS4 but just not for Cadillac models).

  • avatar
    Gardiner Westbound

    “Your premium brand had better be delivering something special, or it’s not going to get the business.” – Warren Buffett

    There’s nothing special about a Cadillac. The brand has been nickel and dimed to death. Customer care is governed by the same shortsighted cost restraints and attitudes applicable to the least expensive car in the GM line-up.

    Notwithstanding rapid depreciation a Cadillac is even worse value on the used car market. The second owner is faced with the daunting prospect of correcting the defects that flow from rigid cost accounting.

    If Cadillac wants to turn it around it could offer a warranty at least as good as a $15,000 Hyundai Accent. Better still, offer a superior warranty. Make owners feel special, treat them with respect, allow them the benefit of the doubt.

    Will it work? I don’t know, but nothing else has – or is likely to. It’s certainly a better use of precious funds than moving to Manhattan.

    • 0 avatar
      duffman13

      The worst part about the “nothing special” is that they don’t pick the right nothing special to use. Chevy sells a crate iron-block LS for $4-5k, and aluminum block LS3 for $7k. Comparatively, the LTG 2.0T is also sold as a crate motor for $9k. Hell, the new LT1 is $11k.

      I know working in economy of scale means that none of these are necessarily the price anything actually costs the manufacturer to build, but I’d much rather use a $2k cheaper V8 and have that money put toward a nicer interior. Hell, this is a Cadillac, weight and balance don’t matter, give me the iron block truck engine and $4k in real aluminum in the cockpit.

      • 0 avatar
        Dan

        In a world where a 1998cc inline turbo goes into everything from from a $20,000 Kia to a $75,000 5 series the LS3 is exactly special. Hell, the LS1 from 20 years ago would be special.

        Yeah CAFE, yeah trendy and sustainable urbanites who don’t buy 4 cylinder Cadillacs either, yeah I’m a dinosaur, but what do they have to lose? Store brand BMW is an abject failure.

  • avatar
    Dirk Stigler

    Cadillac may not be badge-engineered Chevys anymore (except the Escalade) but under the skin all major components are shared with the rest of GM. So to make an independent Cadillac, you’d need new engines, transmissions (well, you could buy those from ZF and Getrag like ze Germans do) as well as all new vehicle platforms and factories to build them.

    After putting all that on the credit card, independent Caddy would still have several decades–if ever–to live down the public perception of being tarted-up versions of GM cars, no matter how much advertising they threw at that issue.

    So no, there’s no reasonable chance Cadillac could go out on its own.

  • avatar
    Arthur Dailey

    1) Offer a no mileage, lifetime warranty to the original owner. With maintenance included for a reasonable period.
    2) Free pick-up and delivery and use of an upmarket loaner car for all service at the dealer for at least a 5 year period. And make the dealership area for Caddy’s more upscale. I know of one dealer who actually installed a fitness area for his customers who wish to wait for their vehicles.
    3) Create a a ‘halo’ effect car. Even if like other halo cars it costs the General money for each car sold. Make it at least a v-8 (preferably more cylinders), possibly with a hybrid option. Something truly outrageous and expensive
    4) Don’t try to compete in the market with German coupes. Instead with the mass market vehicles go for the Lexus market. Reliable, comfortable, luxurious highway cruisers. The Genesis or the Equus R spec would be good starting points.

    • 0 avatar
      MrGreenMan

      Your first two items would probably go quite a long way. They could try a “hit them where they ain’t” strategy and try to get the luxury car sales across fly over country, and having a very nice experience with the dealership would go a long way in that regard. It would be quite similar to the Lincoln Black Label idea.

      You can sell a lot if you make friends and you treat people very well, and you are selling at least a B-.

  • avatar
    CoreyDL

    ““What do you know about the Cadillac ATS?” he asked.

    “I like them. It’s a good start for Cadillac,” I said.

    “But isn’t it just a glorified Cavalier or something?” he replied.”

    *Incredulous look at idiot friend.*

  • avatar

    Cadillac Motor Division is NOT leaving GM.

    But greater autonomy – the way ALL GM DIVISIONS operated 60 years ago – would be a plus. I really think that’s what JDN is ultimately referring to.

    • 0 avatar
      CoreyDL

      Your autonomy statement has caused me to think there should be an Oldsmobile and/or Trofeo package for Buicks, which receives an exterior/interior trim appearance package, as well as all tech package options as standard.

      :)

  • avatar
    dal20402

    The problem with Cadillac is the product mix. It’s all wrong, and the issue is not enough trucks.

    They need more CUVs for volume. The XT5 is a good start but they also need an XT3 and a three-row XT7.

    At the same time they need a full-size SUV that’s not just a Silverado with MRC and some fancy trim inside. The Escalade is insanely profitable but it’s just not a brand-builder. It can’t change the perception that Caddies are based on Chevies, for obvious reasons, and it doesn’t have a hope of being as prestigious as a Range Rover or even a GL550. In today’s market, the single thing they could do to boost their brand the most would be a full-size SUV that really takes the wind out of Land Rover’s sails. That, not a CT8, is where they should be spending their crazy flagship dollars.

    They have spent way more time than they should on sedans, but now with Alpha/Omega they are set for a three-sedan lineup for awhile. And they shouldn’t spend any more time on that shrinking part of the market.

    • 0 avatar
      Frylock350

      Meh the “Silverado with MRC” part is why the Escalade is appealing to me. Range Rovers are scrap metal before Silverados are even broken in.

      Cadillac could boost their brand image by building a modern 1975 Fleetwood (you know the one with a 502). Build an 80″ wide 220″ long behemoth of a car with bold styling powered by a massive V8 and the automotive world will take notice. I was always taken aback at how small and insignificant a Mercedes s-class would look when I parked one of my b-body wagons next to one. Give it competent handling with a serene ride and “whale penis leather” levels of interior decadence. Sell it at a loss and enjoy Cadillac being the talk of the town.

  • avatar
    bullnuke

    On its own, Cadillac would go away as did Packard – both marques making the same mistakes. Packard, without a sugar-daddy like GM, couldn’t make it. Packard struggled with market share 80-years ago and brought the jr. Packard to market to build share and lost the old “Ask the Man Who Own One” mystique. Cadillac was considered “Standard of the World” for several years long ago as they were the only US luxury-marque really left standing; the Imperial tried and failed, Lincoln tried and faded to dolled-up Ford it is today. Cadillac seemed to be doing fairly well and was pretty much the de facto standard of the luxury vehicle class until they downsized, went FWD, built Cavalierillacs, etc. to attempt to make the numbers required by GM. Lost focus, as it were, as did Packard when it stopped being an exclusive upper-class snob-mobile to be lusted after by the unwashed masses and became a lot less exclusive and more “me too” chasing trends set by others. Without sugar-daddy GM and the communal parts bin they’ll be history within five or six years.

  • avatar
    VenomV12

    As I have said before the vast majority of Cadillac’s problems come from their dealerships and the people that work there, they are not even remotely on par with something like Lexus in that department. Those godawful giant, tacky LED light front ends don’t help either. The CTS could be a great car if it had proper interior volume, especially the backseat. When I test drove the 3.6L V6 top of the line CTS it was a pretty nice car and drove well however it lacked features that it really should have at that price point.

    GM quality is still GM quality though, go get a new CTS and a new Genesis and put them side by side and do this simple test, grab the door pulls and open the doors. The Genesis will be smooth and premium like it should be for a luxury car while the CTS’s will be rough and kind of unpleasant, not to mention more than once I have seen brand new CTSs on the lots where the cover for the door pulls have come off.

    The Escalade does well because it really has no competitor especially in ESV guise, but stylewise it is a disappointment, 90% of the vehicle looks exactly like a Tahoe or Suburban and for some reason the material they made the headlights and taillights out of looks very cheap. The previous gen Escalade seemed more distinctive from its cheaper brethren than this gen does for some reason.

  • avatar
    xtoyota

    After test driving several Cads, Infin, Lex cars I ended up buyng 2015 Genesis AWD sedan…… IMHO It was lightyears ahead of those cars. The Hyundai Genesis is probably the most unknown value out their

  • avatar
    cartunez

    The Equus blows away anything Cadillac could attempt to do. Fully loaded at 65K. Amazing value.

  • avatar
    el scotto

    Was Cadillac “The Standard of the World? Maybe, before WWII. The veterans came home from WWII, got on with their lives. some got rich, and some of those guys bought Cadillacs. Then a truck driver from Tupelo, MS got famous for buying them and giving them away. Another singer from Montgomery, AL passed away in the back of a Cadillac. During the 50’s and 60’s Cadillac was The Car to show you’d made it. Sadly, the singer from Tupelo became a caricature of his former slim, good-looking self complete with a DEA badge from a bogus president. Sadly the singer passed away and Cadillac peaked around that time; although the singer, his career, and Cadillacs will always be intertwined. The other singer is known for cowboy boots and Nudie suits. Cadillac has lost the swagger and confidence both these singers had. They’re not European, they shouldn’t try to be

  • avatar
    jthorner

    No, it does not make any sense for Cadillac to go it alone.

  • avatar
    tjh8402

    “I didn’t bother going into where the ATS came from, or why it’s around, global sales goals and overall platform. Cadillac hasn’t outrun the Cimarron shadow, according to Joe.

    In that respect, a further separation from GM would help the brand succeed in becoming a larger, global luxury carmaker.

    But it’s undeniable that Cadillac wouldn’t be where it is today without the Escalade — firmly a GM product, first — and the profit it provides. Furthermore, Cadillac gains much from GM’s economy of scale and global reach. On its own, Cadillac wouldn’t have direct access to the same resources without GM — even if it were to contract build every single car from GM.

    It’s clear that GM wouldn’t be as profitable without Cadillac, but is it possible that GM is what’s holding Cadillac back from sales success in Europe and beyond?”

    It’s interesting. Plenty of highly successful luxury vehicles are (or were) mechanical twins of their lesser downmarket brethren – Acura MDX, Audi A4 and Q7, Lexus ES and RX, Lincoln Navigator, aforementioned Cadillac Escalade, etc, and their connections to their respective parental brands have not always been a big secret. The question is would your friend Joe have the same attitude towards something like a Lexus ES, and if not, why? The ES has actually been getting further and further away from its Toyota roots. The 2002 generation was the first one that did not obviously share its body with the Camry and who’s interior was not just a Camry with extra wood, leather, and an electroluminescent gauge cluster.

  • avatar

    I did not know that Chevy still makes Cavalier. Another proof that Merc/BMW owners are clueless about cars and buy car based on badge and gauges/interior with the only difference from Camry owners that Camry owners have less money to spend and do not care about gauges/interior either.

  • avatar
    Frylock350

    I will say this; the Camaro will go a long way in paying for the ATS’s development.

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