By on March 27, 2020

Image: GM

One should never pay too close attention to social media, but sadly, that’s where a lot of diplomacy takes place these days. Especially today.

Since dawn broke over the nation Friday, President Donald Trump has chastised General Motors and Ford for their perceived foot-dragging in getting much-needed ventilators into production, urging them to pick up the pace and suggesting that he might invoke the Defense Production Act — a wartime measure aimed at aligning industrial output with America’s immediate defense needs. In this case, the enemy is microscopic, but packs a punch.

We’re already on it, Ford and GM replied.

As you’ve read here, both GM and Ford have partnered up to boost the supply of ventilators headed to understocked intensive care units across the country. For now, the most pressing need is in hard-hit New York City. Getting those units, as well as other personal protective equipment, into production takes time, and much of the roadblocks are ironed out behind the scenes.

The use of “this” is interesting, if nothing else. Word broke Thursday night that unit cost had arisen as a sticking point, but Trump’s Friday morning tweet confirmed it. (“Invoke ‘P'” means the Defense Production Act.)

After trashing GM CEO Mary Barra, Trump continued.

“General Motors MUST immediately open their stupidly abandoned Lordstown plant in Ohio, or some other plant, and START MAKING VENTILATORS, NOW!!!!!!” he tweeted.  “FORD, GET GOING ON VENTILATORS, FAST!!!!!!”

Shortly after that blast of online grapeshot, GM and Ventec Life Systems released details of their plans. While GM can’t buy back the Ohio plant it sold off last November, it does aim to build VOCSN critical care ventilators at its Kokomo, Indiana components plant, with deliveries beginning as early as April. One thousand GM workers are tapped to help in that effort.

Meanwhile, FDA-approved Level 1 surgical masks will flow out of a Warren “manufacturing facility” (the recently shuttered transmission plant?), with production starting next week, GM said. After a two-week ramp-up, the automaker expects production to hit 50,000 masks per day. That output could hit 100,000 per day, it added.

Meanwhile, Ford has plans of its own. Goaded into a response by Trump’s tirade, the automaker issued a statement:

As this is a rapidly evolving story, expect updates sooner rather than later. New York Governor Andrew Cuomo has pressed Trump to invoke the DPA.

[Image: General Motors]

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144 Comments on “Trump Edges Closer to Invoking Defense Production Act...”


  • avatar
    Arthur Dailey

    Demonstrating again why ‘free market’ capitalists of the Friedman variety are wrong.

    The Allies won WWII largely due to the manufacturing capacity of the USA.

    Nations without manufacturing capabilities are at the mercy of their supply chains and the nations that they purchase from.

    We know that publicly traded multi-national corporations have no national loyalties. Their only loyalty is to their shareholders, and unfortunately to executive bonuses.

    1st world democracies should never have entered into ‘free trade’ agreements with dictatorships/autocracies/3rd world nations.

    Despite my personal feelings regarding him, Trump was right in trying to renegotiate/end these agreements and return manufacturing capacity.

    Hopefully we will learn from this recent crisis.

    • 0 avatar
      JimZ

      “The Allies won WWII largely due to the manufacturing capacity of the USA.”

      that, and Stalin being willing to throw as many bodies as needed to the Eastern Front.

      • 0 avatar
        Arthur Dailey

        @JimZ: I didn’t want to post that in a site primarily read by Americans. :-) There is already enough controversy.

        • 0 avatar
          JimZ

          “@JimZ: I didn’t want to post that in a site primarily read by Americans. :-) There is already enough controversy.”

          Any American who insists on believing we single-handedly won WWII is worth p!ssing off.

          • 0 avatar
            jetcal

            We provided over 500,000 trucks and jeeps. About 1500 locomotives and at least ten thousand pieces of rolling stock.
            We gave the Soviets the ability to move stuff around.
            We provided over 51% of their gunpowder and most of their wartime chemicals. That would kinda’ hamper the Russian love massed artillery.

            Fully 40% of German industrial capacity was dedicated to fighting RAF Bomber Command and the 8th air force.

            Lend-Lease to Russia was a mistake.

            The Russians won because of the profligate and callous use of soldiers in a manner little different than the banzai charges of the IJN. They were contemplating drafting 15-16 boys at the time of the surrender. But, Zukhov’s white horse was problably better fed than the average soldier.

            Love your passion, but you might want to read a few archival sourced books.

          • 0 avatar
            Art Vandelay

            I don’t get it. We would have been less likely to win were it not for what was going on on the Eastern Front, but the Soviets survived by the skin of their teeth… something equally less likely were we not supplying them materially while they moved plants to the East and forcing Hitler to leave a massive force in Western Europe waiting for us to cross the English Channel.

            The aliens defeated Hitler and it is doubtful that even had you removed the Brits from that equation it would have happened.

          • 0 avatar
            Art Vandelay

            Lol…alies…not aliens, though that would have been a real twist.

          • 0 avatar
            bumpy ii

            “Lol…alies…not aliens, though that would have been a real twist.”

            The Alien Space Bats are obviously running a deep, long-arc conspiracy.

          • 0 avatar
            Lie2me

            Verses the live or solid rear axle, I mean axis ;-)

      • 0 avatar
        Lou_BC

        @Arthur Dailey
        “The Allies won WWII largely due to the manufacturing capacity of the USA.”

        That is true but since the European industrial capacity had been bombed into oblivion, it was left to any country that had any capacity at all. Arguably that is why the USA ended up being such a powerful country. Europe and Japan had to rebuild post WW2. That gave the USA a tremendous advantage.

        In relation to your comment about entering into FTA’s with autocracies and/or dictatorships, I fully agree. Friedman neoliberal orthodoxy dictates capitalism above all else. Businesses set up shop in those countries because it costs money to maintain worker safety, worker human rights and to practice sound environmental stewardship.
        In relation to setting up shop in 3rd world countries, i don’t have a problem with that as long as it isn’t done for the same reasons as setting up shop with autocracies and/or dictatorships.
        Third world countries tend to be used for natural resource extraction. Rape and pillage, bribe the government and the populace gets minimal benefits.

        • 0 avatar
          FreedMike

          Fun fact: German war materiel output actually INCREASED steadily as the war went on. The big dropoff happened between 1944 and 1945.

          https://ww2-weapons.com/german-arms-production/

          I’d argue what really killed them was lack of access to natural resources. Good example: they literally ran out of gas during the Battle of the Bulge, and that’s mainly why the operation failed.

        • 0 avatar
          Arthur Dailey

          If Britain had surrendered prior to the USA entering the war, then the US would not have had a base to invade Europe. Either the Germans would have won, or all of Europe would be under Soviet control.

          However if Britain had surrendered, then there would have been no way to get American production to the Soviets.

          If Britain had surrendered, then the Germans would probably have had unfettered access to the Middle Eastern oil fields controlled by Britain.

          If Britain had surrendered then there would have been no strategic bombing of Germany. The Soviets engaged in tactical rather than strategic bombing. That could have resulted in Germany being able to stop or defeat the Soviets. Or Germany completing their trials/testing on nuclear weapons, which if successful they could have place on their V2 rockets and launched at the USA.

          If Britain had surrendered the Axis could have committed more troops and materials to their war on the Eastern Front.

          If Britain had surrendered then the situation for the Japanese would have been much improved as they would not have had to allocate their primary resources to the land war in Asia.

          So many variables, which primarily did not come into play because of leadership of one man!

      • 0 avatar
        bullnuke

        Stalin threw bodies using Studebaker trucks, Bell Airacobra aircraft,etc. manufactured through the manufacturing capacity of…wait for it… the USA. Crack a few history books and then get back to us.

        • 0 avatar
          JimZ

          that’s why I said “and.” Try reading the one sentence I wrote thoroughly before telling me to go read history books.

          • 0 avatar
            Arthur Dailey

            The ability of the USA to quickly produce massive numbers of ships both civilian (transport) and military allowed the Allies to move men and materiel in unprecedented numbers.

            Aircraft, firearm and munitions production was also crucial.

            Yes the ‘ground war’ in Europe was largely won by the Soviets.
            And both the Soviets and the Brits (counting their their Dominion and Imperial troops) outnumbered the number of American troops facing the Japanese Empire.

            But without American production, all might have been for naught.

            Which is one reason why so many nations insisted upon or still insist upon maintaining a domestic auto (and aircraft) manufacturer, even if it requires government ownership or subsidies.

          • 0 avatar
            bullnuke

            I did read your sentence. You may parse away with it in retrospect as you wish. Succeeding comments made by you indicate a level of if not ignorance then deliberate manipulation of history to make your “point”. Go read a history book, pal.

        • 0 avatar
          Arthur Dailey

          @Bullnuke, As I have a relative who served on escorts of the Murmansk convoys, I will not disparage the material provided to the Soviets.

          However the Russians were quite capable of producing superior equipment and lots of it. For example their T-34 was probably the best all around tank of WWII. Certainly far superior to the Sherman cranked out by American and Canadian auto manufacturers.

          And the Airacobra was also an inferior product. Greatly disliked by Western pilots and therefore shipped to the Soviets.

          • 0 avatar
            jetcal

            The Airacobra was preferred by the Soviets over the Spitfire, Mustang, and Thunderbolt, Hurricane, etc.
            The P-39 was used by the Soviets in the mission it was intended for. Not dogfighting a Zero at 15,000 feet.

          • 0 avatar

            And don’t forget Katusha missile launches.

          • 0 avatar
            Arthur Dailey

            @jetcal: Yes the P39 was a good tankbuster. But not as good as the Thunderbolt or Tempest/Typhoon.

            And the Soviets still used the P39 in air combat as demonstrated by the number of ‘kills’ recorded by its pilots.

            The Soviets proved themselves masterful at ‘making do’.

            Ironically post-war Soviet propaganda required that their schools taught their students that the west held back material and sent shoddy or sabotaged equipment that the Soviets had to take time to repair. I work with a number of ex-Soviets of near retirement age and they were all taught this.

      • 0 avatar
        Victor

        Whereas you do have a point in that commies have such a deep disdain for proletariat’s lives, America’s industrial might is in fact what secured WW2 for the so-called free world. If – and personally I love playing “what-if-games” about WW2 – Hitler had kept Molotov-Ribbentrop terms, or if Stalin was not so keen to throw all those bodies to the Eastern Front, then Germany would have received a couple A-Bombs before being kneeling into submission.

        Allowing the Reds to race to Berlin saved at least 100k lives, according to projections attributed to General Patton. But that never meant the US Army couldn’t advance all the way to Berlin and beyond. Precisely because of America’s industrial capacity.

        • 0 avatar
          Arthur Dailey

          @Victor, not just the Soviets. The Japanese had a similar disdain for casualties. Thus the occupying forces after the war forced the Japanese to change major tenets of their religion.

          When we speak of ‘religious fanatics’ dying for their religion, this is not just a modern concept or one observed only by one religion. Communists, Shintoists. Christian Crusaders, and Viking pagans all died on behalf of their religious beliefs.

          As for ‘what ifs’, what if the Allies had listened to Patton and continued the war eastward? Our ground troops were outnumbered and probably outgunned. But we had superior air power and access to nuclear weapons.

          Churchill advocated strongly for landings in the Balkans to thwart Soviet influence and was successful in ensuring that Greece defeated a communist insurgency and remained in the west’s sphere of influence.

          • 0 avatar
            Victor

            In the end Communism is just another form of religion.

            I don’t think the Allies would suddenly find themselves with a shortage of infantrymen. It would take some time and financing, but ground troops could be provided in bigger numbers by Brazil, for example, and India. Both countries took pat in the war, and both countries had young populations. As it became clear that the Reich was faded to fall, other countries such as Argentina would also show some degree of eagerness to join the war effort.

            But that could turn into a secondary issue with the availability of nuclear weapons.

            We could argue about the possible ramifications of a more widespread use of atomic bombs in WW2, specially in Continental Europe, or if America had the means to produce more warheads in 1945. Maybe America could even nuke the way to Moscow. The Soviet Union wouldn’t test their first bomb until 1949.

          • 0 avatar
            Arthur Dailey

            @Victor: India was already contributing more than there share of troops. And Argentina although coerced to join the Allies late in the war had a regime that was much more friendly to the fascists and indeed assisted many to escape to their nation.

            The Soviets would have had a perhaps overwhelming numerical superiority of ground troops. Particularly if they were able to move their troops facing the Japanese from Asia to Europe. The Soviets had over 1.5 million troops involved in the invasion of Manchuria.

    • 0 avatar
      PandaBear

      Nope, it is because the Axis ran out of fuel.

      • 0 avatar
        Art Vandelay

        “Nope, it is because the Axis ran out of fuel.”

        Well that tends to happen when several world powers spend years bombing your supply infrastructure and refineries. It isn’t like Hitler just pulled up to the pump in his Benz and they happened to be out of fuel. They were out of fuel because denying it was Central to the allied strategy.

        • 0 avatar
          FreedMike

          Well, yes, German fuel infrastructure did get bombed to hell, but the more basic problem was that Germany didn’t have much in the way of proven petroleum reserves to begin with. There’s a reason why they went all in on Stalingrad – it was to secure the oil fields in the Caucasus.

    • 0 avatar
      ect

      “Nations without manufacturing capabilities are at the mercy of their supply chains and the nations that they purchase from”
      “1st world democracies should never have entered into ‘free trade’ agreements with dictatorships/autocracies/3rd world nations”

      With all due respect, Arthur, reality is that trade agreements have been good for all parties. In the US, for example, output of manufactured goods (per BEA) has doubled since NAFTA was signed, even as direct manufacturing employment (per BLS) has dropped by 1/3. Automation has killed a LOT of unskilled and low-skilled jobs, but US manufacturing is bigger than ever.

    • 0 avatar
      EGSE

      “Trump was right in trying to renegotiate/end these agreements and return manufacturing capacity.”

      It was a good-faith effort, but the fly in the ointment is that a lot of those jobs left N/A as manual processes. When they come back (if they do), a lot will return as automated processes. It won’t be Lunchbox Joe working a punch press, it will be a well-trained technician supervising three machines under numeric control. having the ability to make those widgets here is the big gain.

      China has lost more “jobs” to automation than any other country so they’re not insulated from the march of technology either.

      • 0 avatar
        Arthur Dailey

        My employer competes directly with imports from China. We are the largest organization in our industry still manufacturing in Canada.

        We can compete because we can manufacture, to order, and ship within 3 days of receiving an order.

        Obviously Asian manufacturers cannot do this.

        And our quality control is thankfully still much higher than that of our Asian competitors.

        However production in our industry still exists in Germany. Where we might have 2 or 3 workers on each production machine. The Germans have 1 technician controlling 2 machines. Their machines are obviously newer and more high tech than ours and their technician probably earns double what one of our machine operators makes, but their labour costs are still much lower.

        Historically technology has always replaced manual labour. And mechanization increases output.

        As long as consumers make purchase decisions based primarily on ‘cost’ then manufacturing locally will be problematic. Higher fuel and transportation costs could assist. Until then tariffs are the primary way of leveling the playing field.

      • 0 avatar
        Lie2me

        “China has lost more “jobs” to automation than any other country so they’re not insulated from the march of technology either.”

        That’s interesting, because I never really thought of that, so as labor costs become less and less of an issue, manufacturing in China should also become less of a cost issue. In theory, anyway

        • 0 avatar
          EGSE

          @Lie2me – “so as labor costs become less and less of an issue, manufacturing in China should also become less of a cost issue. In theory, anyway”

          There is that, but for consumer products the supply chain for parts and services is better developed there than it is here. When the end item (the completed product) is manufactured off-shore, many of the companies that supported the NA manufacturer went out of business or into other fields. The Wally World shopper buys on price above all else.

          For higher-end commercial products and government/military/aerospace which was my playground before retiring, there’s still a NA-based ecosystem supporting the manufacturer. Even so, electronic components (as in passive parts, transistors, ICs etc) are made all over the world except for most extremely hi-rel or any restricted items such as anything covered by International Traffic in Arms Regulations or ITAR for short.

          As Arther succinctly pointed out, being “local” can confer an advantage that cannot be equaled. Quick-turn jobs, robust after-sale support and overall response times are harder to duplicate at a distance. Being of the same culture improves communication without differences causing confusion. And “customer intimacy” or having a close personal relationship with your customers can be an overwhelming influence to have them reflexively think of you as the “go-to guy” for their needs.

          • 0 avatar
            Lie2me

            EGSE, thanks for pointing out that the really important goods where quality and service is still a top priority are still manufactured in North America. I guess those items become invisible in a sea of throwaway consumer crap made in China

    • 0 avatar
      Luke42

      > The Allies won WWII largely due to the manufacturing capacity of the USA.

      And we win WWIII by making war terrible for business.

      Without the trade relationship, the US and China would have a new cold war.

      With the trade relationship, hostilities are bad for business. Plus, we all get the benefits of buying and selling cheap consumer goods.

      Win-win-win. The only downside is that the gains of trade are not evenly distributed throughout our society. In order to fix that the US has to stop defunding education (and has to make it easy to go back to school while supporting a family). This isn’t rocket science, folks.

      The only thing that’s shocking is that us liberals are now the pro-business party — now that the Republicans have chased out the economists and other intellectuals.

      • 0 avatar

        “economists and other intellectuals” has nothing to do with business. They are ideologically motivated. These are people who admired Soviet Union. The last thing I would do is to take advice from “economists and other intellectuals” about where economy is moving and what to do with my business and money.

        • 0 avatar
          Arthur Dailey

          @Inside has perfectly summed up the problem with America. By definition 50% of the population is below average intelligence.

          In most other societies, those with education,expertise and/or training are admired and acknowledged as the experts in their subject.

          For some reason anti-intellectualism has taken hold with a significant proportion of the American population.

          Rather than listening to those who have spent their lives in research or studies on specific topic, they prefer to ‘go with their instinct’ or trust someone who claims to ‘just know this stuff’.

          Therefore statistics, logic and reasoning don’t apply. They prefer conspiracy theories.

          Con men, snake oil salesmen, and fake evangelicals love such an environment. It provide a large flock of sheep to be fleeced.

          • 0 avatar
            Lou_BC

            @Arthur Dailey – There are simple reasons why Trumpian populism and the current bastardized version of conservatism is rare in large metropolitan centres and/or areas of higher education. It is hard to be willfully ignorant when you are exposed to multiple cultures, multiple view points, sexual orientations et cetera. Higher education also exposes people to multiple view points and teach people critical thinking skills. There is a very weak correlation between a lower level of intelligence and Trumpism. There is a strong correlation between a low level of knowledge/education and Trumpism.

            Ironically, and we see it very often on this very site, those that score extremely low on Myers-Briggs agreeableness are more likely to lock in on sketchy ideology like Trumpism.

          • 0 avatar
            Lie2me

            I don’t know, Lou, some of the most racist, bigoted people are in the biggest cities, however I will agree that the more educated people are the more understanding and accepting they are of other cultures and beliefs

            It’s difficult for prejudice and intelligence to coexist, like oil and water

          • 0 avatar

            “By definition 50% of the population is below average intelligence.”

            And somehow America put men on the Moon, won Cold War and is a world leader in new technologies and science last 100 years. I have PhD BTW if you wonder about my IQ and why I am in America and not in Canada.

          • 0 avatar
            Arthur Dailey

            @Inside: If you do have a doctorate, then why would you mention it after you have derided the usefulness of a higher education?

            What is the use of bragging about something that you declared is not useful?

          • 0 avatar
            Lou_BC

            @Lie2me – I agree that there are racists and bigots in big cities. Education does change attitudes overall. Close contact with people different than you can be viewed as a form of education too.

        • 0 avatar

          “What is the use of bragging about something that you declared is not useful?”

          Because economists are not scientists, they cannot predict even will happen next year let alone next decade or two. They are more like idealogues.

          My PhD is in Theoretical Physics which a science. E.g. QED prediction of electron’s magnetic moment agrees with the experimentally measured value to more than 10 significant figures. If you think about it it is a mind boggling precision.

    • 0 avatar
      threeer

      A nation that cannot provide for itself becomes slave to those that can. China knows this. China also knows that when this over, we will run back to stores and resume our purchasing of goods made from China. We will have learned nothing and will only have validated we have ceded our place in the world order. To think we once were able to rally and save the world. Now we can’t even save ourselves.

      • 0 avatar
        Lie2me

        I hope you’re wrong and that this whole mess turns out to be the wake-up call we needed, but it will take strong legislation to reel in corporations who are only interested in profits

  • avatar
    JimZ

    y’know, if he wants ventilators now, he can roll up his sleeves and start making some. but no.

    Typical Boomer. “I WANT IT NOW NOW NOW!”

    • 0 avatar
      Daniel J

      Please. Any generation.

    • 0 avatar
      PandaBear

      They can buy it from China and Taiwan (but since Trump calling it a China Virus I bet China will send them all to Italy and Spain instead).

      • 0 avatar

        “They can buy it from China ”

        That’s the problem USA has. You cannot be superpower and depend in everything on your enemy. USA look rather like a manufacturing dwarf. China is not anyone’s friend by any means.

        • 0 avatar
          Luke42

          @Inside Looking Out:

          American is still one of the top manufacturers in the world, in terms of the value of good sold.

          It’s manufacturing JOBS that have been decimated.

          The statistics are right there on the St. Louis Fed’s FRED system for anyone who cares to look.

          This is an important distinction for anyone who wants to actually solve the problem, because it points to automation as being a major cause of manufacturing job losses.

          This is why a lot of technologists (Silicon Valley tends to be business-libertarian and socially-liberal) have gotten behind the Universal Basic Income (UBI). Automating things provides so many benefits in terms of economic efficiency, but it costs jobs and it concentrates the wealth generated in the hands of those who own the factories. So how do you have your cake and eat it too? The UBI is one answer. Yes, it’s leftist wealth redistribution and a lot of us are uncomfortable with that — but that’s a good way to resolve the libertarian/liberal conflict I mentioned above. The UBI can fix the problem of reduced demand for unskilled labor. If you have a better way to keep the gains of technology&trade while providing a decent living for those who aren’t skilled/knowledge workers than the UBI, let’s hear it!

          • 0 avatar
            Arthur Dailey

            @Luke42: if the governments in North America had instituted a universal basic income, then there would be no need for emergency benefits/aid for our citizens. Anyone who is laid off or who loses their job would automatically qualify for the UBI.

            This would eliminate all the other programs and therefore reduce administrative overhead and costs, while simplifying the system.

            The success of UBI has been demonstrated in both of the experiments conducted with it in Canada.

            Unfortunately it is too logical a solution to be implemented.

          • 0 avatar
            Daniel J

            Luke42

            Nothing about a UBI is libertarian
            …at all. Libertarians are against minimum wage and a UBI. Many small businesses would be crushed.

            I’m all for local economies to decide wages. Minimum wage in Alabama would be different than Miami.

          • 0 avatar

            If EBI so good why Canada did not adapt UBI? I heard that 100% of Canadians have high IQ so it would be natural to try it first in Canada. Or in worst case scenario in Britain.

          • 0 avatar
            Arthur Dailey

            @Inside it has been tried twice in Canada. Both times the program was cancelled after an election. As you realize the data involving it was not fully analyzed until well after the program was cancelled. The data on the first program in Manitoba demonstrated success beyond what was even hoped for. Decrease in crime, broken marriages and healthcare costs, while not incentivizing unemployment.

            The data from the 2nd, in Ontario has not been fully summarized as it was ended relatively recently.

            As for average intelligence of the population, the difference is that Canada statistically has only 10% of the number of below average people as the USA. As we have seen with the growth of alternative social media, a critical mass is required for a group to exert power.

            More importantly anti-intellectualism is not a creed in Canada the way it is in the USA. Our Public Health officials hold separate regular press conferences and set government policy. We value expertise and education. Hence many of those who do not support our current PM do so on the basis that he does not have the academic or ‘intellectual’ credentials required for the role.

          • 0 avatar

            Arthur, the phrases like “Low IQ” “below average people” remind me Adolf Hitler. Do not know why but there is something ominous in your approach to humanity.

            UBI is well described in “Childhood’s End” by Sir Arthur C. Clarke. BTW he is high IQ Englishman not a stupid American. The novel does not does not have happy ending. There are other Utopian SciFi novels regarding the same subject and the result is alwayss tragic.

            It is not just fiction.There are real life examples. Take Soviet Union e.g. – it was a real UBI society that existed 70 years before ugly collapsing. Or Cuba.

            Don’t you think that there might be a reason why Canadian government canceled UBI experiment every single time?

      • 0 avatar
        jetcal

        70% of the tests provided to Spain, Ukraine, and the Czech Republic by China are defective.

        • 0 avatar
          Arthur Dailey

          @Inside: There are a myriad of social safety nets in both Canada and the USA. For example the growing number of Americans on disability. All of these require administration and bureaucracy.

          A UBI replaces all of them. It ensures that every citizen has enough. Anything more than enough, they have to work for.

          It does not replace the requirement to work to get ahead. Or preventing others from getting ahead.

          And it reduces government size and intrusion. For example in a case such as the current pandemic, rather than implementing new emergency measures, those who are ‘out of work’ would merely receive the UBI until they again were earning an income above that level.

          As for your other remarks, I will ignore them as they are not worth responding to.

      • 0 avatar
        woodywrkng

        He called it a Chinese virus. There’s a difference. China is a country, Chinese are its people, who he is insulting.

        • 0 avatar
          markf

          Be sure to clutch and pearls and be near the fainting couch/ “Chinese virus, my goodness so insulting”

          Chinese doesn’t just mean the ethnic Chinese people, it is also a way to describe anything that originated in a country like a Chinese car, Chinese products, etc.

          Grow up.

        • 0 avatar
          Art Vandelay

          In his defense, the last press conference with him I saw, he definitely said “China Virus”…not Chinese.

    • 0 avatar

      ““I WANT IT NOW NOW NOW!””

      I don’t know. In every project I was working on I was told that whatever deadline was it was always “YESTERDAY” not “now” or “tomorrow”. Talk about time travel.

      • 0 avatar
        Arthur Dailey

        Well then your organizations were dysfunctional.

        Most of the organizations that I have worked with/for/managed/owned planned in advance.

        Anything else was just fighting fires. For example we have had a pandemic plan in place since 2003 and merely activated it and used the store of supplies that we maintained, once the current pandemic struck and until we were ordered to close.

  • avatar
    JMII

    Why didn’t he snap his fingers or wiggle his nose, that’s how it works… right? I’ve seen it on TV – poof – the magic genie just wishes things into existence. Maybe Santa Claus can help?

    • 0 avatar
      Peter Gazis

      JMII

      Trump sent a letter to Santa Claus weeks ago, asking Santa to build ventilators at his North Pole workshop. Using low cost elf labor, and deliver them to hospitals using his raindeer delivery service.
      Meanwhile Democrats have been working with the Easter Bunny to hide these ventilators opon delivery.

  • avatar
    FreedMike

    He should have edged himself into this about a week ago. I have no idea what the delay accomplishes.

  • avatar
    Lou_BC

    Cheeto-in-chief obviously doesn’t understand that an assembly line designed to crank out brodozers isn’t quickly converted to building medical products.

    But then again, this is the same bozo that fired the CDC envoy to China a few months prior to SARS-CoV 2 becoming a “thing”. He is also the bozo that dismantled the Pandemic Response Team because Obama had thought it was a good idea to create. Oh and one last one, he seems to think that sending the military to guard the border between Canada and the USA will save the USA from SARS-CoV 2.

    Sigh!

    • 0 avatar
      Lie2me

      Brow-beating and intimidation is what he does best, might as well get something good out of it

      • 0 avatar
        golden2husky

        And yet – YET – Trump is getting a 52% approval rating of his handling of the Corona crisis. How is beyond me. He lied, denied, called it a hoax, and delayed. And still a slight majority of Americans approve of his handling of this pandemic. That’s significantly more than the base of MAGAs. I guess the power of Trump TV news is partially to blame but jeeze, America, engage those critical thinking skills…do some non-partisan fact checking after each of those TV briefings and see for yourself the lies and distortions…

        • 0 avatar
          Zipster

          Probably all of us know of some college or even high school kid who could bring more dignity and wisdom to the presidency than him. As demonstrated everyday, he is a person of awesome ignorance and behavior that reaches new levels of depravity.

          • 0 avatar
            Lie2me

            You know what makes it worse? Everyday when I see Cuomo’s briefings, I think to myself, “That’s responsible leadership”, and then I * Sigh *

        • 0 avatar
          JimZ

          a huge chunk of that is the ~40-43% of respondents who will approve of anything he does ever, no matter what.

          And I’m shaking my head listening to him talking about Michigan.

          “The other stuff was Trump speaking with Sean Hannity on FOX News about Whitmer, a Democrat who has said very pointed things about the federal government’s lack of coordinated response to the coronavirus crisis. Trump said of Whitmer, “She is a new governor, and it’s not been pleasant … “We’ve had a big problem with the young — a woman governor. You know who I’m talking about — from Michigan. We don’t like to see the complaints.” ”

          Jesus Christ. “We’ve had a big problem…” “We don’t like to see the complaints.” At what point does he start expecting state governors to pay tribute? ‘cos that’s the kind of talk I’d expect to hear out of a mob boss.

          • 0 avatar
            Luke42

            > ‘cos that’s the kind of talk I’d expect to hear out of a mob boss.

            Trump’s always been like that.

            I’m just saddened by how many Americans seem to think that’s acceptable.

            Electing mob-boss types is a Slavic-culture thing, much to their detriment. American culture isn’t supposed to be in to that. But, here we are. SMH.

        • 0 avatar
          Art Vandelay

          Because the last news cycle was full of all of the crap Pelosi wanted to fund in the house Democrat’s proposed bailout after coming in and threatening to stop the one that was nearing passage.

          Yeah, the current bill has a ton of pork I’m sure and yes, Trump’s response has been far less than ideal, but his polling numbers can, IMHO be attributed to the perception, again right or wrong, that house democrats were going to hold up aid to families to fund their unrelated priorities.

          Again, wright or wrong…doesn’t matter, that is the perception.

        • 0 avatar
          FreedMike

          I don’t think it’s all that hard to understand why Trumps approval rating is up, personally…

          1) People tend to rally behind the president during the early stages of a crisis.
          2) There are a lot of uninformed people out there.
          3) We haven’t seen anything really horrifying…yet.

          If you doubt what I’m saying about 1), check this link:

          https://news.gallup.com/poll/116677/presidential-approval-ratings-gallup-historical-statistics-trends.aspx

          Good example: Jimmy Carter’s term is largely remembered as a bust, but scroll down to his job approval trend. Notice that huge uptick around the end of 1979? That was the Iran hostage crisis, believe it or not. Now, by any measure, that affair made this country look like a monkey f**king a football (shout out to the writer of “Days of Thunder” for that classic line, btw), but it initially did wonders for his approval rating. And then look at what happened to that rating as the crisis wore on.

          Another good example: Bush after 9/11. I mean, a bunch of religious nutbags with box cutters somehow managed to kill more Americans in one morning than the Japanese did at Pearl Harbor, and it happened under Bush’s watch? Monkey f**cking football, once again. But look at what happened to his approval rating. And once it became apparent that Bush was going to use that to justify a war we should have never fought (or at least never fought the way we did), the graph trends downwards.

          Bottom line: people are “approving” of Trump because it’s a time of crisis. Keep in mind that nothing truly horrifying has happened yet; if and when it does, that graph will drop like a rock.

          We will see.

          • 0 avatar
            Arthur Dailey

            Margaret Thatcher was widely reviled and on her way to being a one term PM with even her own party turning on her. Then the Argentines invaded the Falklands. Presto chango, ‘the Iron Lady’ and the nation rallies behind her.

          • 0 avatar
            markf

            “I mean, a bunch of religious nutbags with box cutters somehow managed to kill more Americans in one morning than the Japanese did at Pearl Harbor”

            Just general purpose religious “nutbags” eh? Like from any religion?

          • 0 avatar
            FreedMike

            The general purpose religious nutbags were Islamic terorrists, markf.

            Anything else?

        • 0 avatar
          jkross22

          It’s very difficult to get someone to change their mind when they believe it’s not possible that they’re wrong.

          That’s the starting point for many Trump supporters. You can point out the tweets and crap he talked about this being a hoax, it’s not a big deal, etc., but it won’t matter.

          People have to reach their own conclusions. Sadly, they’re treating their political loyalties the same way they treat religious loyalties or loyalties to their sports teams.

          • 0 avatar
            JMII

            My experience echos this. Its not even worth the effort – the orange one is always correct, everyone else is wrong. Fox News and NewsMax told me so.

          • 0 avatar
            Daniel J

            Jmii,

            It’s not always about Trump being right. It’s about how far off the deep end the left has gotten.

        • 0 avatar
          ajla

          I think the biggest thing that helps Trump is that while (AFAIK) other world leaders weren’t engaged in so much early denial about the situation they were obviously also extremely under-prepared for what was coming. Aside from SK and maybe Japan.

        • 0 avatar
          Peter Gazis

          golden2huskey

          The election is still 7 months away. When people see their friends, family members & neighbors dying in the center of the country, Trump’s approval rating won’t be worth a dime.

          • 0 avatar
            Lie2me

            Exactly, Peter, right now it’s still something that happens to “other people”, but as soon as it starts happening to them…

        • 0 avatar
          markf

          “He lied, denied, called it a hoax”

          no he never called the virus a hoax, stop spreading fake news.

          • 0 avatar
            dal20402

            markf: https://factba.se/transcript/donald-trump-speech-kag-rally-north-charleston-south-carolina-february-28-2020

            The “it” that is the subject of the sentence clearly refers to the virus. His later attempt to claim he was talking about Democratic reactions to the virus is laughable revisionism. He called it a hoax, as did Sean Hannity, from whom he gets most of his news.

    • 0 avatar
      PandaBear

      People still went to Miami for Spring Break, so there you go, what crisis?

    • 0 avatar
      markf

      “But then again, this is the same bozo that fired the CDC envoy to China a few months prior to SARS-CoV 2 becoming a “thing”. He is also the bozo that dismantled the Pandemic Response Team because Obama had thought it was a good idea to create.”

      False and false.

      Perhaps after this panic is over the hospitals can treat your TDS

      • 0 avatar
        Lie2me

        Do you know what’s really hard to do markf? Rewrite history when there’s a recorded timeline of specific events

        The only real “fake news” these days is the appalling garbage coming out of Faux News, so markf why don’t you take your claims of “fake news” to your overcrowded fundie church this Easter Sunday

        • 0 avatar
          markf

          I don’t go to church.

          https://legalinsurrection.com/2020/03/media-hoaxes-no-trump-did-not-disband-wh-pandemic-office-cut-cdc-work-from-49-to-10-countries-or-refuse-who-testing-kits/

          • 0 avatar
            JimZ

            well, we can see why you say the things you do. You read nothing but that garbage.

            I do love the headlines at the top of their main page:

            “Trump Press Conferences a Massive Ratings Hit”

            “Anti-Trump Finds its New McDreamy”

            yeah, what a s**tpile.

          • 0 avatar
            FreedMike

            “I don’t go to church.”

            Good thing too…if I were your pastor, I’d tell you to stop trolling.

          • 0 avatar
            Lie2me

            Fundie churches don’t work that way, FreedMike, they encourage trolling and worse, because of a deranged belief that God is on their side :(

        • 0 avatar
          markf

          “Fundie churches don’t work that way, FreedMike, they encourage trolling and worse, because of a deranged belief that God is on their side”

          Let me know when you two are done sucking each other off.

          • 0 avatar
            Lou_BC

            “Let me know when you two are done sucking each other off.”

            He wants the left overs

          • 0 avatar
            Lie2me

            For a guy who “doesn’t go to church”, markf, you sure get your feathers ruffled when someone picks on the bible-thumpers

          • 0 avatar
            markf

            “For a guy who “doesn’t go to church”, markf, you sure get your feathers ruffled when someone picks on the bible-thumpers”

            My feathers are not “ruffled” I simply don’t attend church, I know this upsets you very much.

            You have a very strange obsession with church attending Christians.

          • 0 avatar
            Lie2me

            There’s a big difference between “church attending Christians” and cultist fringe groups who have accepted the Kool-aid without question to the point of being harmful to themselves and others

        • 0 avatar
          markf

          “There’s a big difference between “church attending Christians” and cultist fringe groups who have accepted the Kool-aid without question to the point of being harmful to themselves and others”

          Like flying planes into building? Those “Christians”?

          You Atheist are all the same, just ant-Christian bigot who claim to be atheist but there is only one religion you hate and insult and it doesn’t start with an “I” and end is “slam”

          • 0 avatar
            OverHypedVirusVSTheB&B

            Enjoy four more years, clique crew. The baby rage reeeing never gets old does it.
            Its okay zoomers, you can still have your participation ribbons.

  • avatar
    Arthur Dailey

    As a Canadian I endorse Canada increasing scrutiny/security along the border with the USA.

    During times of crisis, it is customary for people to emigrate or ‘flee’ to Canada from the USA.

    a)Refugee and asylum seekers are still trying to cross into Canada from the US.
    b) The so called ‘draft dodgers’ refusing to serve in the Vietnam War
    c) Those volunteering to fight against Nazism during the two years that Canada was at war and the USA was not
    d) Settlers coming to ‘the last best west’ of Alberta and Saskatchewan
    e) Escaped slaves using the Underground Railroad
    f) Indigenous People including Tecumseh and Sitting Bull escaping American encroachment, wars, etc
    g) The United Empire Loyalists who preferred remaining loyal to England and were largely responsible for founding and ‘running’ Ontario for generations.

    So will we soon start to see ‘pandemic’ refugees?

    • 0 avatar
      Lou_BC

      @Arthur Dailey – All indications are that things are going to get really really ugly in the USA very soon. I was hoping that Canada would deploy the military to our side of the border once COVID refugees started streaming north. I’ll be more surprised if COVID refugees don’t head our way. I wonder if asking for health care asylum is a legitimate request?

      • 0 avatar
        EGSE

        You know guys, it works both ways. In the late’90s it looked like I was going to move to Ontario (my sweetie was a Doctoral student at University of Waterloo). I interviewed at a few places and they seemed interested but we never got to *yes*.

        While talking with the recruiter at Research in Motion (the Blackberry people) I got the same stand-offish vibe. So figuring I had nothing to lose I just asked…”what”? She demurred and finally said “we’ve never had this happen, an engineer from the U.S. that wants to move here. It’s always the other way around….they leave here to go to California, or Research Triangle or Austin. And lately they leave, and then the rest of the engineering department follows them. We think you’ll do the same after your fiance finishes her Doc.” I told her we were looking at houses near Saint Jacobs a few miles north of K-W but there was no convincing her. Or anyone else.

        A few years later I ran into an ex-pat Canadian engineer and recounted the saga to him. He said (in effect) “No $h1t Sherlock, I can make more than double down here and there’s way more places to work at. And in the U.S., taxes on stock bought with incentive options are taxable only when you *sell* the stock. In Canada you pay tax when you *buy* the stock, not when you sell it.” He said he was recruiting some of his former colleagues to come work with him.

        Sooo, you won’t need those troops to stop U.S. engineers from invading.

        • 0 avatar
          Arthur Dailey

          Biil Gates actually personally visited the Waterloo campus numerous times to recruit engineers. Its engineering program is one of the best in the world. I recruit actively there for our organization.

          One issue is that your ‘partner’ took advantage of our highly subsidized education system and then took her skills south. Getting a comparable education in the USA would probably have cost her 4x or more what it cost at Waterloo.

          There have been some attempts to place repayment requirements on those doing this.

          And while they can make more money during good times in Silicon Valley, you should check to see how many return or retire to Canada after making their money. Although most go to the west coast, where the winters are much less severe.

          St Jacobs for those who do not know it is a very nice little town with a large conservative Mennonite population. It is not unusual to see a horse drawn buggy in the line-up at the local Tim Horton’s (coffee chain) drive through.

          • 0 avatar
            EGSE

            Yes, UW is a world-class engineering school. The hydrogeology program (her course of study) is considered by many to be *the* best in the world. And the MAPLE math engine, a staple in engineering came from UW. It was explained that for degree programs in the arts, Wilfrid Laurier is where you went as if there was a de facto agreement between the two schools but I have no direct knowledge of that.

            She wasn’t skimming as you implied however; she was a U.S. citizen and paid more than a Canadian (and as a non-citizen student she was barred from having a job). When we’d go to Loose Change Louie’s or Moose Winooski’s with her friends from school, a large percentage of them were foreign so UW depends on students from other countries. It is unlikely UW could maintain the quality level they enjoy if that were not the case. The same is true for “name” U.S. schools; they are a cosmopolitan universe with students and instructors from all continents and cultures. In my opinion that is a huge benefit to the student in itself and something that others can’t understand if they’ve haven’t experienced it, and they are the poorer for it.

            Canadian engineers look for opportunity and if they can’t get it at home they look elsewhere; this is also true in large parts of the U.S. It’s not their fault; when companies like Nortel implode, where are they going to go? Where the jobs are. The high-tech corridor in central Ontario doesn’t (or at least *didn’t*, my information is dated) have the capacity to offer them something comparable in numbers of positions and compensation. And of course a lot would then go back “home” once they’re done with their career. It’s true in the U.S. as well. Silicon Valley is no place to retire to.

            I really liked Canada, the people, being in a “college town” and felt at home there. But for the reasons detailed above, both of us had to work where it was to be found. And while our lives turned out OK (we’re not together anymore) I do wonder what it would have been like if we had been able to stay. Yes St. Jacobs has a lot of charm in a wider area that is very appealing. Very fond memories indeed.

  • avatar
    spookiness

    I thought GM sold Lordstown.

  • avatar
    Znueni

    Invoking DPA in non-wartime situations sets uneasy precedent. However something seems broken when there is so much talk without much to show for it. Have been reading about efforts of two vacuum cleaner companies in UK (Dyson and Gtech) having production design done in 10 days and already geared up to start deliveries perhaps next week. Done expediently without war powers acts. Hmm.

    • 0 avatar
      JimZ

      yeah, that’s what they *say.*

    • 0 avatar

      If they are so prompt and smart where is Dyson electric car it promised to design and build like many years ago? How much that ventilator cost? As much as Chinese?

    • 0 avatar
      jetcal

      The DPA priority rating system is (DPAS) is used with every order. It gives the mfr the ability to get higher priorities from their vendors.

      Or in some cases to tell a gorilla like customer to back off on their orders without taking a hit on their vendor rating system.

      For example a test set repair from a army mobile hospital would take priority over a test set from Apple’s Flight Department.

    • 0 avatar

      “having production design done in 10 days and already geared up to start deliveries perhaps next week.”

      Any engineer knows that it is a BS. Unfortunately in reality it takes much more time to come up with market requirements, specs, design and development, tests, QA process production process with its own test suites, bug and defect fixes. You cannot do all that in month let alone 10 days. We are not talking here about toys -it is a medical equipment for God’s sake, you are risking killing people because of defects.

      • 0 avatar
        jetcal

        Dyson could specify a change in the color of the plastic, add or subtract the quantity of standard accessories give it a different part number for Macy’s and call it a new product.

        In the real world? Using existing parts with no change in general fit, form, or function?
        It’s possible. But it ain’t like tooling up for a product you’ve never made before on a crash basis.

        Anyone berating GM has never been in a manufacturing environment or dealt with government contracting.

  • avatar
    ToolGuy

    “Always a mess with Mary B.”

    Four words: War on Women.

  • avatar
    Peter Gazis

    Hey GM,

    Illinois still needs ventilators. And our Governor is willing to pay reasonable price for those ventilators.

    It’s a better deal than you’ll ever get from Trump.

  • avatar
    SharkDiver

    Sounds like a lot of you girls are going to struggle getting through the next 5 years with President Trump. So unpopular in your eyes, yet he will win in a landslide. The weather is nice out here, try getting out of your bubbles more often.

    • 0 avatar
      PandaBear

      Depends on how many people die because of the crisis unfold, and how the economy tank.

      Still asking things to open by Easter is just stupid, so is the Texas Lt Gov saying many seniors willing to die to prop up the economy so their grand children have jobs.

      • 0 avatar
        markf

        “Depends on how many people die because of the crisis unfold, and how the economy tank.”

        The whole point of the media induced panic was to tank the stock market and economy because the Dems/media knew that is the only way to defeat Trump.

        Yet, like all the other schemes they backfired spectacularly and only made him stronger. 52% approval

        • 0 avatar
          Lie2me

          Enjoy the Easter service markf and be sure there’s plenty of hand shakes and hugs during the peace. God will protect you, I promise

          – D Trump

          • 0 avatar
            markf

            I don’t go to church but nice try trying to stereotype people.

          • 0 avatar
            Luke42

            Endorsing Trump’s salesey and faith-based epidemiology does lump you in with a certain category of people.

            Real numbers suggest the US peak will be around Tax Day, just a bit after Trump wants to return to business-as-usual. Those numbers are based on confirmed cases only (many cases are likely undetected), and are based on the assumption that social distancing measures will remain in place.

            Trump can swagger and pound the table as much as he wants hoping to change the numbers, but the only thing that will make an impact beyond the social distancing measures that are already in place would be a Korean-style testing-and-treatment response, scaled up to the United States. Clueless bloviating doesn’t help with any of this.

        • 0 avatar
          Lou_BC

          “The whole point of the media induced panic was to tank the stock market and economy because the Dems/media knew that is the only way to defeat Trump.”

          Oh and how did the Dem’s convince the rest of the planet to join in on the plot?

          Occam’s Razor – the simplest explanation is the correct one.

          Anything uttered by someone mentally constrained by ideologically driven willful ignorance is bound to be incorrect!

  • avatar

    Heck I could not find popcorn in grocery store. Because in election year as this one I need it, even at TTAC.

  • avatar
    Jeff S

    “Cheeto-in-chief” I like that. Someone needs to put some duck tape on his mouth and let Pence and the medical professionals handle the coronavirus.

  • avatar
    jetcal

    Will respectfully have to disagree. The Russians had the P-47 and relegated it to the Navy.
    I can’t speak to the Hawker products as their total production was only about 35% of the P-39/63 production. They may never have even been offered or requested by the Soviets.
    And please don’t think me rude, but the airplane is no good if it can’t get to the fight. (As I used to remind the F-18 pilots on my boat.)
    OTH, the Bell production lines were specifically kept open at the request of the Soviet Union.

    There are a couple of new books out on the P-39 and the Russian Lend-Lease experience by contemporary Russian authors and they are very kind to the P-39/63 and the A-20/B-25. The other airplanes? No so much. For the Russians, if it wasn’t ground attack it wasn’t ch-it.

    • 0 avatar
      Arthur Dailey

      @Jet: no problem. The Soviets have always preferred cheap and simple. When I first started with my employer the ex-Soviet military people in the organization took me to lunch and provided the perhaps apocryphal story of the difference in the Soviet and American space programs. The story is that the Americans spent tens of thousands of dollars to invent an pen that worked in zero gravity (the Astronaut pen of Seinfeld fame), while the Soviets used pencils.

      The Soviets had little to no strategic bombing capabilities. The Eastern Front, particularly on the steppes was a tank war. So tank busters were particularly useful. And in large numbers

      Still if the Allies had been able to provide them with superior aircraft in sufficient numbers, then the Soviets would have found a use for them.

      As for Stalin ‘throwing bodies’, the same tactic was used by by the Chinese Communists with considerable success in Korea against UN troops. The story of the Princess Patricia battalion at Kapyong is one well known by those who have studied that conflict. And an ex-US serviceman in that war, who we got to know as a prominent Teamster leader, told us stories of piling bodies of fallen Chinese Communist soldiers to build parapets. First he said you had to make sure that they were actually dead.

  • avatar
    jetcal

    The Soviets liked cheap and simple simply due to the fact that they were incapable of building anything complex until Stalin’s TU-4 moonshot to reverse engineer the B-29. (Having said that,their VDK-1 jet engine was very good and mostly an indigenous design.)

    One nice thing about democracies The US learned about mass casualties in 1861, Canada at Vimy Ridge.
    The Russians and Chinese still haven’t.

    • 0 avatar
      Arthur Dailey

      Cheap and simple remained a mantra right until the end of the Soviet Union. From the AK-47 to the ‘consumer’ vehicles like the Lada Niva that they manufactured.

      Tolerances were loose to allow for quick and simple repairs.
      Creature comforts were lacking.

      But they worked under extreme conditions.

      @Gtem seems to be busy but he can provide more details regarding this. Much of my information comes from my many co-workers who are ex-Soviet military, and engineers.

      In the Soviet Union for most, their income was based on their contribution to society. Engineers were relatively well paid. Lawyers were generally far down on the income scale as it was believed that their contribution to society was minimal.

    • 0 avatar
      Arthur Dailey

      Actually the Canadians learned about mass casualties long before Vimy. That is why it was so carefully planned, and executed in a manner not previously seen by any of the western powers.

      General Currie was perhaps unique among his peers in working to ensure minimal casualties and trusting his troops with information and personal initiative.

  • avatar
    jetcal

    To L2M,
    BTW, the vast majority of the reservists being called up are people you would call “Trump Christians” from “fly-over country”. And the best part? Most of them have enough points to retire, in other words 60-80% of them could just quit the Reserves right now. Instead, they’re voluntarily risking their own health and taking a whopping pay cut to do it.
    Yes sir, those “Trump Christians” sure are some bad people.

    • 0 avatar
      Lie2me

      I would sure like a reputable link to those facts of yours

      I was speaking more to the fundie Christian Dan Patrick (R) Lt. Gov. of Texas who would like to see grandma take one for the economy

      https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/25/politics/dan-patrick-texas/index.html

  • avatar
    jetcal

    It’s okay, I administered Reservists for 16 years before I retired from the Navy.
    Three of my employees are reservists or National Guard, and guess what? While they’re not “Holy Roller” they like many others are quietly evangelical.

    They’re very typical of your 15-30 year service members.

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