By on November 27, 2019

The new CT5-V arriving for 2020 is not the departing CTS-V, that much is clear.

Cadillac’s one-time wildest offering has morphed into a similar-sized sedan with less than half the displacement and significantly less potency, though we can now report that it’s way cheaper than the outgoing midsize V.

Announced just in time to be discussed over Thanksgiving dinners across the country, Cadillac’s CT5-V carries a starting price of $48,695 after destination. For that sum, buyers get a rear-drive sedan outfitted with a twin-turbocharged 3.0-liter V6, good for some 360 horsepower and 405 lb-ft of torque.

That output happens to be a 5 hp and 5 lb-ft bump over what GM’s luxury division estimated during the model’s launch, which maybe counts for something? You be the judge. At the time, many pundits were too engrossed in the model’s questionable rear-end styling and base 2.0-liter turbo four-cylinder.

If the idea of tackling weather and twisties without all-wheel grip leaves you anxious, adding AWD to the CT5-V pushes its price to $51,290.

Not surprisingly, Cadillac’s midsize V offering isn’t that much dearer than an optioned-up CT5 Premium Luxury model, which starts at $45,190 when equipped with the available twin-turbo V6. That engine is simply a detuned version of the one found in the CT5-V. While it lacks the sport trappings of the V, this model represents a more affordable way to get six-cylinder punch and added content.

And it’s because of the close positioning of the CT5 Premium Luxury V6 and the CT5-V that makes this V designation feel far less special than the CTS-V. While the CTS-V boasted an eye-popping price tag of $87,990 after destination, the 640 horses and 630 lb-ft of torque generated by its supercharged 6.2-liter V8 represented a major leap from lesser trims, rather than just another step up the ladder. It was something special.

It’s now up to consumers to decide whether the (admittedly far more attainable) CT5-V fits that bill. Sales commence early next year.

[Images: General Motors]

Get the latest TTAC e-Newsletter!

Recommended

81 Comments on “Bargain or Downgrade? Cadillac Prices Its CT5-V...”


  • avatar
    Hummer

    Of course it’s cheaper, only a dope buys a V6 “luxury” car, let alone one that’s supposed to be the “fast” model. This car is one in a long line of embarrassments from GM.

    Frankly V6 or 4 cylinder should never be in the same sentence as “Luxury” there’s nothing luxurious about having an engine that small.

    • 0 avatar
      FreedMike

      I can think of any number of TTACers who drive V-6 performance cars. There are a few I’d buy.

      So we’re all dopes. Got it.

      • 0 avatar
        ToddAtlasF1

        I used to drive Audis with the 3.0T V6s. They were big, luxurious cars with plenty of power. The 8A transmissions are over-rated garbage, but the V6s were far from objectionable in that context. Would I have rather had a V8 or an inline 6? Absolutely, but at least it wasn’t a turbo four and I could refuel in a couple of minutes.

      • 0 avatar
        ajla

        I’m obviously not biased against the V6 engine (bought a Stinger GT and would marry the 3800 if it was legal), but I am bothered with Cadillac using their V6T here when the LT1 exists. They went with merely competitive when they could have been amazing.

        • 0 avatar
          FreedMike

          I think the idea here is move the V down in price, which makes sense – they probably sold like 10 of the old V every year. But, yeah, it’s competitive but not amazing. I’d go for your car or a G70 over this because of the styling.

          And it’s a damn shame that they apparently won’t even offer a hotter version with the Blackwing engine – what a waste of time and money that was. Between this, and the warmed-over ATS they’re bringing out, and the wholly lame CUV lineup, it’s obvious the whole brand is just floundering.

          • 0 avatar
            ajla

            I expect a $48K CT5-V with the LT1 would have given GM equal (and likely better) margins compared to this V6T version. A CT5-V with the Blackwing would probably be in the $70K+ range but it would be a more powerful, more premium engine.

          • 0 avatar
            NormSV650

            Lexus is mum…

        • 0 avatar
          Lie2me

          ” They went with merely competitive when they could have been amazing.”

          As written on Cadillac’s tombstone

          -or-

          “I could have had a V8”

          • 0 avatar
            ToddAtlasF1

            Does a luxury car need a V8? No. Does a Cadillac need a V8? Well, they certainly haven’t gotten any traction in the market with their various 4s and V6s. Why not hit the competition where they aren’t and where GM is competent?

      • 0 avatar
        ttiguy

        I drive an ATS-V with an “embarrassing” tt-v6 that will absolutely destroy anything he drives. But yeah, OK Booker

        • 0 avatar
          ttiguy

          Errr auto correct.

          Ok Boomer

          • 0 avatar
            2manycars

            Bring it on, snowflake.

            I don’t care what young idiots say or “think” – it’s not a luxury car, and certainly not a Cadillac, unless it has at least a V8 engine.

          • 0 avatar
            ToddAtlasF1

            I don’t think you need to put embarrassing in quotes when you’re talking about driving an ATS.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            We in X think your antagonism of the Boomers simply reinforces all of the Millennial negative stereotypes. With a simple phrase you look foolish and draw attention away from all of the legitimate issues you raise about them (most if not all of which are accurate).

          • 0 avatar
            JimZ

            “We in X think your antagonism of the Boomers simply reinforces all of the Millennial negative stereotypes.”

            no we don’t. The idiot Boomers call us “millennials” too.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            But… you are Millennials just as they are Boomers. I don’t really know how you’d prefer to be referred.

            My point is the antagonism does not help your case. I would also point out many of today’s economic problems can be traced to the Nixon Shock of 1971. You could certainly focus your angst on him, but he was put in that position by LBJ’s dual Vietnam War/Great Society spending so really it all can be traced back to the clique who assassinated President Kennedy. They lit the fuse to blow it up.

        • 0 avatar
          Hummer

          “ I drive an ATS-V with an “embarrassing” tt-v6”

          You said it.

    • 0 avatar
      SPPPP

      I dunno, over 400 lb-ft and 350 HP in a midsize seems fine to me. There’s no public road where this will not be an adequate amount of power.

      I actually like this car. But then, I may be a weirdo.

    • 0 avatar
      White Shadow

      Try not to be a Luddite. It’s almost 2020. Lots of luxury cars have something with less than 8 cylinders under the hood. In fact, I’d guess the majority have less than 8 cylinders.

    • 0 avatar
      Gregg

      Ok boomer. And apparently you are oondemning Audi, BMW, Mercedes, Lexus, Infiniti, Maserati, etc. for using 6 cylinders in their luxury cars. Jaguar has a tradition of six cylinders in their luxury saloons going back to maybe older than you are. But if it’s V8 or more cylinders, you still have choices. It’s all good.

      • 0 avatar
        ttiguy

        The reality is that people like Hummer probably aren’t buying luxury sedans/coupes anyhow so their opinion truly is irrelevant. Anyone who thinks it’s v8-or-bust is clearly an ignorant fool.

        At the end of the day this car isn’t for them, they are stuck in the past

        • 0 avatar
          JimZ

          “stuck in the past” describes a depressingly large segment of our society.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            No snark, but do you really think there is a “future”?

            When I was young I really did, the Millennium was coming and pretty soon we’d start to see the future we were promised. Didn’t happen, not going to happen. I will be truly amazed if devolution does not occur in my lifetime and the Union remains intact.

      • 0 avatar
        Hummer

        Best part about all of this everyone calling me a Boomer is that they are likely older than I, and yes I am condemning all those other manufacturers that don’t take the segment seriously. However, Cadillac gets extra hate since they were once on top of the world and they have the parts bin to provide a good source of engines for all of these cars. Instead we get the already-embarrassing-for-the-Malibu-engine 2.0T in these cars as well.

        Get with the times Grandpa.

        • 0 avatar
          ajla

          I’m on your side and I’m 33 AND I bought a new TTV6 ‘sedan’ in 2018.
          The LT1 is an extremely good engine, it already exists, it isn’t expensive to build, and GM should be putting it in cars with the Cadillac badge.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            There are two things which truly amaze me:

            The continuing series of poor management decisions coming from Cadillac management since the mid-70s

            AND

            The fact GM just does not want to sell you an LS motor.

            I realize the LS is offered in trucks and a handful of other applications including Corvette, but why even have the 3.6 engine family in the first place when you have LS and its probably cheaper too due to economies of scale.

            I mean seriously folks, they are pushing turbo hamster junk in all the transverse stuff as it is, you’d only need a small 4.0L LS V8 for a a little bit of FWD stuff which needs grunt like the Lambda junk they sold forever and everything else can be Trifeca Tune. GM made a 4.0 from the Northstar and mounted it transversely before, this is not that hard. One “V” engine family and many variants. Geez take advantage of what you already have.

    • 0 avatar
      Peter Gazis

      Hummer

      But Great for weaving in and out of traffic at highway speeds.
      The moral of the story is: If you got a big enough Johnson you don’t need a V8.

    • 0 avatar
      MoDo

      I’d rather an LT1 and they use those savings over the V6TT to make the interior even better. I thought they were done trying to be a German brand and were going back to “out American” the Germans? Guess not.

      • 0 avatar
        bumpy ii

        Yes they should and it’s easy money, but it’s also a small pile of money and GM is demonstrably not interested in small piles of money. There’s just not much of a market for Hammers anymore.

        • 0 avatar
          28-Cars-Later

          I hardly doubt if they engineered a platform which could accept a V8 and said instead of this 3.0 V6 TT you’re getting an LS V8 that a majority of customers would object or care. The complainers in that scenario are of the same breed who prefer manuals, in other words niche buyers. What is actually happening is GM uses Cadillac as its beta testing ground for new technologies and has been since the early 80s. The smarter play is to do the same but do it in top trims, ok so you want this V6TT, you pay, which is how everything new exotic was done up until the 80s. My guess is other than sheer idiocy Cadillac would not get the test data they need from buyers/dealers with such a small pool, so their response is f*** you to a larger audience of customers. See also, V4-6-8, 4100, Northstar, the entire Catera model line through Sigma II.

          Additional: I’m not sure what the emissions data is like for an LS with mulitport FI vs whatever DI garbage they are using now but unless its just too high using a cheaper and more reliable LS motor would do wonders for the brand in two to three years.

    • 0 avatar
      Art Vandelay

      Laughs in 850i. Plebes drive 8 cylinders.

  • avatar
    mmreeses

    Daylight opening fail. Shaking my head.

    And downgrading the V trim is dumb da dum dumb

    • 0 avatar
      Gregg

      Not if they are planning a more powerful trim above.

      • 0 avatar
        whynot

        It’s still dumb when they had the perfectly acceptable “V-sport” trim for their mid power range engine option. Now they are dumbing down the known -V trim while having to eventually educate buyers about the new more powerful trim.

        All that negative hoopla earlier this year would have been completely avoided if they introduced them as the new CT4 V-Sport and CT5 V-Sport instead of CT4/5-Vs.

  • avatar
    FreedMike

    It’s certainly priced more sanely, but that doesn’t make it a better car.

    • 0 avatar
      Gregg

      Lincoln is leaving the sedan arena. At least Cadillac is still fielding some 4 door sedans. There no longer are buyers in big numbers as luxury SUVs and non-luxury crossovers handle better, are more efficient, and buyers in general are less enthusiast oriented.

      • 0 avatar
        ajla

        “crossovers handle better”

        I assume you meant *ride* better.
        But other than that you are correct. However, that is why:
        1. Offering both a CT4 and a CT5 is unnecessary.
        2. There is little reason to not go full c*ck out on remaining sedans. You don’t need to appeal to the masses anymore because they are buying CUVs.

  • avatar
    thornmark

    is melody lee secretly still there?

    Cadillac is a severely damaged brand that should become the value luxury leader – they can’t command a premium

    wonder how much GM loses on Cadillac when the chevy escalade is taken out of the mix

    • 0 avatar
      FreedMike

      I think “value luxury leader” is where it’s headed, at least as far as the sedans are concerned. We can bag on this sedan all we want – and I have – but as a $55,000 performance sedan with a twin-turbo six, it’s not a bad deal per se – that’s the same money as a loaded-up Stinger GT or Genesis G70. It’s just a letdown compared to the old V, and that rear three quarter styling is just indefensible.

      • 0 avatar
        Nick_515

        “It’s just a letdown compared to the old V.”

        Just because Hummer is stuck repeating this, doesn’t make it true. The old V is a fringe car. I look at the new V as an attempt to democratize power. I like that.

        • 0 avatar
          FreedMike

          At the end of the day, this is a $55,000 sedan with silly styling. What sells it versus, say, a Genesis G70 or Kia Stinger? A couple grand more puts you in a S5 Sportback, which is one of the best looking cars you can buy. Seems to me excessive performance was the only real shot this car has.

          • 0 avatar
            ttiguy

            Reserve judgement until you see one in person. The CT5 photographs very poorly for some reason. I have seen a few in person, parked and in motion, and it looks really good. The CT4 on the other hand looks like rework of an ATS that it is and looks butchered

        • 0 avatar
          SPPPP

          “The old V is a fringe car. I look at the new V as an attempt to democratize power. I like that.”

          +1

          “At the end of the day, this is a $55,000 sedan with silly styling.”

          I think it actually looks pretty nice, and maybe better than the S5 Sportback, which seems bland to me. Also, it starts under $49k USD (and we know GM will discount eventually).

  • avatar
    dal20402

    If they had just called this a Vsport instead of a V, no one would have been upset in the slightest.

    • 0 avatar
      dwford

      Exactly.

    • 0 avatar

      Bingo. I looked for a VSport before I bought my CTS. The closest two were one in NYC, and one in Ohio. Period. I think they made one production run. You’d never trip over one at a dealer, and you had to order and wait if you really cared.

      A few years later I was again in the market after VW bought back my TDi, and looked for an ATS-V. Almost as bad. Pretty much zero in stock, if they had one, full price plus market adjustment. They though they had Ferrari halo cars….it’s an ATS with a big motor, guys…..get real.

      They should have produced a lot more VSport and made it a real presence, like M Sport or AMG lite. Then V could have been ///M and AMG hardcore. Instead, no real segmentation, little actual product. No wonder it didn’t sell.

  • avatar
    Detroit-X

    So much fuss about a dying, near-irrelevant brand.

    Cadillacs are only good when you get them two years old, low miles, at half-list price, and buy an extended warranty to cover all the future GM defects.

    Even then, you have the daily risk of looking like a automotive-yokel who was conned by the dealer and manic TV commercials into owning it.

    • 0 avatar
      SPPPP

      If you buy this CT5-V new at MSRP, you would probably do fairly well as compared to someone who bought a new BMW 440i. I think this car has some potential for success. Given, GM can’t seem to put a foot right lately. But I think this could be a bright spot.

  • avatar
    Lie2me

    I wish Cadillac would do something interesting with one of their crossovers

    Oh, who am I kidding?

  • avatar
    sgeffe

    The Cadillac Accord!

    Some of ‘em even come with a 2.0T!

    I’ll stick with the Honda, thanks!

    • 0 avatar
      Hydromatic

      Cadillac Cruze, because this thing looks like a Chevy Cruze.

      Nice work, GM.

      • 0 avatar
        sgeffe

        It does, a little bit; the last Cruze looks good. The little (black) chrome tweak at the back end of the upper C-Pillar garnish on this “Cadillac” is straight-up Civic Coupe/Sedan/Accord, however!

        IMHO, it looks OK in the Honda application, of which the Radiant Red Accord Touring 2.0T in my garage is proof. Not so much on a car from the former “Standard of the World,” ringing in at a minimum $20K above said Accord!

  • avatar
    monkeydelmagico

    That is one bland sedan. Make it silver and it would be invisible. Some may like that. I prefer the g70. It has just a touch more visual appeal without being boy racer.

  • avatar
    dwford

    Every step Cadillac takes down market is another step onto Buick’s toes. If GM was capable of making real premium cars, Cadillac would remain in the $50-100k range, giving Buick room to have it’s own lineup.

  • avatar
    Jeff S

    I have reached the point where I don’t pay any attention to what Cadillac offers and therefore they might as well be dead. Cadillac is no longer an aspirational brand and few would even miss it if it disappears and fewer would even notice if it went away. Maybe in the next GM bailout it will disappear. The Chinese will keep Buick alive.

    • 0 avatar
      whynotaztec

      Sadly enough I am at the same point, and I always was a GM guy. Now it just doesn’t figure into my plans in any way, regardless of how much I may or may not have to spend.

  • avatar
    Jeff S

    I got the idea for a perfect new Cadillac a turbo 3 cylinder CVT crossover based on the Trax and Encore called the Cadillac Allante with a starting price of 39,999 with heated pleather seats. Make it in China or Vietnam. This would have a huge profit margin.

  • avatar

    A true Cadillac should have V12. V6 and V8 are not good enough. And be larger than S class.

  • avatar
    28-Cars-Later

    You know it strikes me I can spend the same imaginary dollars on a Model 3 and get nearly the same performance for slightly less money, or spend a bit more and get superior performance. Both models are resale nightmares* and either the possibility of serious problems, so it seems to me Tesla is the superior buy here. Did RenCen just not contemplate this?

    CT5 AWD, $51,290: 360 horsepower and 405 lb-ft of torque.

    Model 3 LR AWD, US$48,490: 412 hp / 376 lb⋅ft
    Model 3 LR AWD Performance, US$56,990,: 473 hp / 471 lb⋅ft

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_Model_3

    *In certain conditions.

    • 0 avatar
      bumpy ii

      I think they certainly did not. In their heart of heats, I expect most of GM management still thinks of Tesla as Elon’s goofball hippie calliope.

      • 0 avatar
        28-Cars-Later

        I agree. I think in the near future GM is going to be in big trouble if they don’t face the stark reality that Tesla, as much as it should have failed a dozen times, is TBTF and is going to be eating their lunch in the premium/near luxury segment. I assume most of their buyers are older X/Boomer types even though they sought the young hip image and they may be EV adverse, but even those buyers may be persuaded as time goes on with the dollars and sense argument. Even I, if I were to be p!ssing money away, would probably buy the Tesla over Cadillac with AWD and just install the charger – and I am no fan of these things.

    • 0 avatar
      ajla

      The Model 3 is starting to become an elephant in the room for this class. Among ICE cars (especially wearing a premium badge) you’re generally needing to spend $65K+ on a full-whack performance trim to get something that matches the M3P for performance and outside of I guess the G70 you’ll be spending ~$10K over a M3LR to get the same performance. ICE can still give higher RPM thrills and cool sounds, but a lot of the entry and mid-level trims on these ICE cars don’t like to rev and don’t have thrilling exhaust notes so replacing them with a battery isn’t an emotional loss.

      I have some going concern fears with Tesla and on EV infrastructure in general, but the Model 3 is an impressive offering.

      • 0 avatar
        Sceptic

        Agree with Ajla. For $40K Model 3 is a compelling offering in the entry level luxury class competing with Mercedes C-class and BMW 3-series. Has cool tech and snob appeal too. The only problem is that Tesla is not making money on them.

        • 0 avatar
          mcs

          “The only problem is that Tesla is not making money on them.”

          That’s a myth. The gross margins on the Model 3s are actually pretty good. 20% for Q3.

          In fact, Volkswagen says that price parity with ICE vehicles is near.

          https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/cars/1165209/Electric-cars-price-parity-petrol-diesel-cars-VW-ID-Volkswagen

          Time for these myths to go away. It’s not 2012 anymore.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            I saw that article, I’m not convinced.

          • 0 avatar
            ajla

            Time for Telsa to post a full-year GAAP profit. It’s not 2012 anymore.

          • 0 avatar
            mcs

            @ajil: Then don’t invest in them. BTW, WTF is this then: https://ir.tesla.com/static-files/47313d21-3cac-4f69-9497-d161bce15da4

          • 0 avatar
            ajla

            It’s them recording a loss of nearly $1B in 2018 and on their way to another likely financial loss in 2019 despite dominating sales volume within the EV market and claiming enviable product margins and regular talk about falling battery prices.

          • 0 avatar
            ToolGuy

            mcs,

            Thank you for the Q3 2019 Update pdf link. Only 10 months to go from dirt to trial production (page 19) is impressive. [There are home additions in my neighborhood that take longer than that.]

          • 0 avatar
            mcs

            To survive, you need to grow a company to a certain size. They’ve got factories to build and products to design. It all takes money. Musk is far from perfect, but he’s accomplished a lot. You have to move fast, grow fast, or get eaten alive by the competition. I’ve also known a lot a guys over the years that dream big, but never do anything about it. Musk is going all out and is accomplishing a lot. Not perfect, but he’s getting it done.

  • avatar
    Jeff S

    You win, Cimarron Calais it is. I can hear all turbo charged cylinders in their splendor shifting ever so smoothly with that Chinese made CVT. Second thought just make the whole thing in China with a “Hecho en China” proudly displayed under the Cadillac emblem.

  • avatar
    07NodnarB

    who cares about the price, ugly is ugly is ugly is, guess what? ugly.

Read all comments

Back to TopLeave a Reply

You must be logged in to post a comment.

Recent Comments

  • NoID: Way past the “best by” date.
  • Mike Beranek: Another one that’s too easy. Buy the Toyota because it’s a Toyota. Drive the Honda because...
  • MeJ: Well Mr. Lewis, as I’m sure you know, the internet brings out he best behavior in people… ;)
  • JimZ: ah, so saying we shouldn’t worship billionaires means I have “socialist heroes.” just more...
  • ponchoman49: Not in the slightest bit no

New Car Research

Get a Free Dealer Quote

Staff

  • Contributors

  • Timothy Cain, Canada
  • Matthew Guy, Canada
  • Ronnie Schreiber, United States
  • Bozi Tatarevic, United States
  • Chris Tonn, United States
  • Corey Lewis, United States
  • Mark Baruth, United States