By on August 22, 2019

The year is 1990, and you live in Utah or someplace similar and find yourself with plentiful offspring. The only solution here is a full-size van that seats 15. Which extra-long BOF box goes home with the Buy?

Dodge Ram Wagon

The Ram Van remained in its second-generation format between 1979 and 1993. Upper-trim family Wagons wore quad headlamps, while poverty-spec cargo Vans had single round ones. Though new for ’79, the Van was a reskin of the first-generation version that debuted in 1971. The dash from 1978 carried all the way through to 1993. At that point, a third generation soldiered on until 2003 with the same body shell and most of the same equipment. In 1990, our selection is the largest displacement 5.9-liter (360) V8. A total of 155 horsepower travels to the rear via a four-speed automatic. Overall length: 222.9 inches.

Ford Club Wagon

More commonly known as Econoline, Ford’s American people hauler entered its third generation in 1975 and continued with small changes through 1991. For the first time, Econoline was body-on-frame instead of unibody. This lead to popularity as a cutaway chassis, and the Econoline was transformed into various buses, trucks, and ambulances across the country. In 1992 the fourth generation Econoline bowed, and is still being produced as a cutaway chassis today. In luxurious Club Wagon XLT trim, the 226.8-inch Super Van has the largest Ford gasoline V8: It’s the 5.8-liter (351) Windsor. Some 250 horsepower was sent through the van’s four-speed automatic, and no manuals were available.

Chevrolet G

The Chevrolet Van (now G) entered a third generation in 1971, and remained largely unchanged through model year 1995. GM chased Ford’s Econoline and moved away from the cab forward design of the second generation Van. 1996 saw the introduction of new Express vans that remain in production to this day. General Motors was late to the 15-passenger game, as 1990 was the introductory year for the extended wheelbase 223.2-inch G van. In top-trim, extended-length Beauville guise, the 5.7-liter (350) V8 made 195 horsepower and carried a standard four-speed automatic.

You need many rows of seats for many children, so which van goes home to the compound?

Images: Dodge, seller, Wikipedia]

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43 Comments on “Buy/Drive/Burn: Full-size Van Time in 1990...”

  • avatar

    I like vans but can I burn all of these choices? The issue I have is at 6’3″ all of these are uncomfortable as hell to drive. I had a 78 Econoline when I was in high school (351w 3 on the tree manual)hated that thing.
    If we disregard the comfort issue.

    Dodge, easy to fix durable I still see more of these on the road then I think possible.

    This is a tossup for me I seem to remember the chevy driving a bit better then the Ford (a friend drove a red one in high school for a bit and another friends father had a diesel one) but they rust quickly and seemed to have disappeared off the roads quicker.

    Again tossup but Econoline they were also pretty easy to keep running rusted less then the Chevy, but I really hated the one I had. so Burn it is.

    A side note a friend with a large family recently bought a low mileage 2003 dodge van and so far it’s worked very well for them.

  • avatar

    Buy: Whichever one has no side windows and a sweet wizard/dragon/amazon warrior mural airbrushed on both sides. This will be my LeMons tow vehicle. Hopefully it’s the Ford but this is LeMons so “beggars and choosers” applies.

    Drive: Whichever one has “FREE CANDY” painted by a rural meth-head on the side. Will drive only once and only to my friend’s place so we can have a laugh.

    Burn: Whichever one is left.

    • 0 avatar

      Love the “sweet wizard/dragon/amazon warrior mural airbrushed on both sides”. I’m old enough to remember when having a “cool” mural was quite a thing. One of my best friends had a 70’s era Dodge van that he totally customized himself. Yes, it had a bed in the back and a “If this Van’s a-rockin’…” sticker on it. But the best thing he did was totally rework the engine and suspension. It had a 360 engine, probably not much different than the one offered in today’s B/D/B. Headers, 4-bbl Holley carb. The thing looked slow but it was a rocket-ship. At least in the terms of the mid-70s malaise era.

      • 0 avatar

        When we were stationed in Mannheim, Germany a young SGT and his wife came over with their Econoline van…painted in full flake metal green glory with a large airbrush of a Wookie on the side. Not related, but funny, their last name was Walkie, and the wife’s name (I am NOT making this up)…Millie!

        What was the question again? Oh, yeah…Buy/Burn/Drive. No opinion, as they all seemed kind of interchangeable to me. My only experience was borrowing my late mother-in-law’s fully decked out Econoline with the raised roof, leather seats and fully reclining rear bench/bed that we took from Detroit down to Orlando when my son was about 9 years old. He watched movie after movie and we pulled over at a rest stop intending to get a quick rest in, and wound up sleeping for four hours on the converted bed! Have to say…that was about the best long-distance drive mode ever.

    • 0 avatar
      Mike Beranek

      My son wanted a van with the “Fly By Night” owl from the Rush album cover all over the sides.

  • avatar

    Buy the Ford, drive the GM, burn the Dodge.

    Fords of that era were really ill-handling due to the front axle. Alignment had to be done just right or they wandered all over the road. I think that the Ford was overall the best van, however.

    • 0 avatar

      We loved our 77 Ford Chateau Club Wagon, bought it with low mileage used in 82 ($5k ) drove it for 10 years, 2 tone green with factory aluminum wheels, I had installed a table with side mounted bench seats in the rear for our 4 children, my wife and I absolutely loved the front captain chairs with dual arm rest! Such a pleasure to take on a trip.

    • 0 avatar

      This, a family friend owned a body shop and did alignments. All our friends with Fords of that era had issues driving straight. The Dodge and GM weren’t an issue.

      On a side note, that Dodge is not the 15 passenger version. Those have wrap around rear windows.

      Like this:

      • 0 avatar

        Yeah the Chevy van isn’t a longest one either as it’s an 89.

        Finding usable photos of the correct size -and not cargo style- was not easy at all. So I got close as I could.

        • 0 avatar

          I would think that pictures of the long Dodge wouldn’t be that hard to find as they were popular with churches and they didn’t rack up that many miles in them. Of course they are also the most likely to be wrecked and rolled.

  • avatar
    Arthur Dailey

    Buy: The Chev because it was probably made at the Scarborough Van Plant and I would love to have one of those for nostalgia reasons. So many people that I know/knew worked there. They did however have issues with their power steering.
    Drive: The Dodge. Because I did have one. Captains’ chairs. Customized interior. A ‘pig’ to drive in the snow/ice. Also kept the HVAC system working overtime to cool/heat it.
    Burn: The Ford. Even though we had a number of these in our work fleet and they were nearly indestructible.

  • avatar

    Buy: Dodge. Their torsion spring front ends were reported to handle quite well for such large vans. Riding in them as a youth I know I preferred the comfort of the Dodges and one buddy’s dad could hustle the heck out of their B250. Another buddy’s dad had one with a 4-on-the-floor manual.

    Drive: Chevy. Because I’ve never ridden in or driven a Chevy van of this era. I did steer one for a few miles as it was being rope-towed behind a tractor as the straight-6 was seized and the 3-on-the-tree linkage was missing. Motivating under its own power I’m sure is more enjoyable.

    Burn: Ford. Because I’ve ridden in and driven Ford vans of this era. My FIL had a small RV on a Ford chassis of this era. Couldn’t cross a state line without breaking down.

  • avatar

    I had a Chevy in the 70s as my SCCA tow/pit vehicle.
    It was handy because a canopy could be hung off one side and room to carry all the stuff you took to a race.
    The heater was below par in frigid Cleveland winters, I had to hang a blanket behind the front seats. Traction in snow was no problem with a couple spare 4 cyl engines riding over the rear axle.
    Then Paul Newman and his Datsun 510 showed up with the first 18 wheeler I’d seen at a club race and I knew it was time to retire.

  • avatar

    All of these are pretty good IMO, we had a 15 passenger Ford with dual AC and a 460 V8 that roared, it was dangerously fast and swilled gasoline like a drunken Sailor .

    To buy I’m torn between The Chvy/GMC or Dodge having driven and worked on both .

    The Dodges had a tendency to rip the steering idler right out of the frame, luckily an easy fix , you just weld in an oversized fish plate gusset and forgeddaboutit .

    The long wheel based Dodges were the sturdiest i think but I really prefer Generous Motors products .


    • 0 avatar

      Dad had many Dodge vans for his work and never had an issue with idler arms here in the rusty midwest and he ran them to 150k miles on average. Timing chains with the nylon gear however…

      When he worked for a different commercial flooring place he was given a Chevy as a company van so he didn’t have to buy them any more. He still liked the Dodge better than any he drove. The big Chevy took two states to do a u turn and rode rougher.

      Even our die hard Ford guys that had vans in the post above got rid of their Fords. The twin I beam didn’t work well on those.

      I would burn the Ford. Drive the Dodge because they were much nicer and buy the Chevy because I don’t want to drive it.

      On a side note, we took a pack of ten on a trip and averaged better than 17mpg back in the early 90s so seat miles per gallon wasn’t bad at all.

      • 0 avatar
        87 Morgan

        My old mans 318 at the end. You could hear the timing chain slapping the cover at the end. It was totaled before we had the joy of it skipping a gear. 199K + though.

        • 0 avatar

          They weren’t too bad to swap out on the vans once you got in there. The LA motors are pretty easy to work on.

          Dad had a 1978 Dodge that he sold with 189k miles. The person he sold it to sold it with 250k miles to a newspaper delivery service. Last I saw it has over 300k miles on it. The third owner did have to replace the valve cover gaskets. Did had already done the timing chain and water pump. The water pump because it is off anyway for the chain.

          That van had the 360, Doug Thorley headers (how many remember those?), posi and some other work.

  • avatar

    Dajiban or nothing. I have an ’86 B250 camper that’s been everywhere through everything and just won’t die.

    Burn the Ford. E-vans are wandering tire wear wonders with their TIB front suspensions. Sold forever to with little changes to cheap fleets because lowest bidder.

    Chev; Drive it, I guess.

  • avatar

    The only one of these I have been in are the Fords.

    1. Lots and lots of trips from the hotel to the airport and back at many american cities. Seems like most hotel shuttles are Ford vans.

    2. On the first day of my high performance driving school the head instructor threw all 8 of us into a ford van and ran a hot lap on the road coarse just to show us it is 90% driver and 10% vehicle.

    So I would buy the Dodge (don’t know anything about them but they seemed to be favored by the trades), drive the Ford and burn pretty much any GM product from 1970-2000.

  • avatar

    Chevy’s TBI 350 and Turbo 700-R4 transmission were all but indestructible by this point.

    Most if not all SBCs were running hydraulic roller cams by this point; performance and durability were improved on an already-proven design.

    The TH700-R4 was originally a HARD pass but massive improvements were made for the 1987 model year and this trans was transformed into about as bulletproof an automatic as could be found in those days.

    Plus fuel efficiency would have been a plus over either Ford or Dodge.

    All the above statements come from years of personal experience.

    So I’ll buy AND drive the Chevy. Burn both Dodge and Ford.

  • avatar
    87 Morgan

    Too easy…We had an 87′ Dodge 250 van growing up, 318 CID and a 4 speed MT on the floor. My old man drove that thing to 199,9… something and my little brother slid on ice in Jersey one night in HS and drove it into a telephone pole, game over.

    Buy/Drive: the Dodge specifically with the 318 CID. Great engine will run forever will little to no issues: couple of tune ups and a starter + alternator along the way and you are set. Be sure to get the LE package as they you get the upgraded front captains chairs which were pretty much equal to a lazy boy arm chair. The front seats made this rig the easy go to choice to lay down some miles. The rear bench seats, well that is another story. With Barn doors on the side and one large swing door for the back you might surprise yourself with what you can haul in one of these, the bench seats popped right out. Family of four, so my old man did not worry himself with getting a hernia moving the benches, that is what teenage boys were to do….

    Ford/Chevy: Burn Just because you have to pick. All are a good choice really and perform the same functions almost equally. Really comes down to which brand you like best.

  • avatar
    R Henry

    I spent quite a few summers as a fleet mechanic for a huge children’s summer camp operation. We ran a 45 unit fleet, with the majority well used/abused 1986-1988 Dodge 15 pax Maxi vans–all with the 360 engines. We had about 10 E350 Fords running either 460s or 351s. My service truck was an old GMC van.

    Overall, I favored the Dodges. I found them easiest to maintain/repair. I found the 1988 model year best—that was the year the 360 was upgraded with TBI and the overdrive trans was introduced. In general, the Dodges were favored by drivers too. The rear A/C seemed to keep the kids coolest in back, and we where able to lay long sailboat masts diagonally across the floor….the Fords were too short. Also, the Dodge’s rear seats had a great view out the wrap-around rear windows, while last row passengers in the Fords got no window at all!

    As a technical point, the Dodge vans were not BOF.

  • avatar

    The Buy is easy, Ford by a mile. There is a reason that the Nantucket quickly became the best selling van and eventually sold more than Chevy, GMC and Dodge combined. Durability and lowest cost of ownership.

    The Drive and Burn isn’t nearly as easy. Both have bodies that just don’t hold up to heavy use, particularly the sliding doors, which is a must if you are hauling a lot of people. Brakes, steering and suspension are also much more problematic than the Ford.

    I guess maybe the Burn goes to the Dodge if for no other reason than the god awful starter noise it makes when you try to start it. But I still wouldn’t want to drive the Chevy, unless it is off a cliff. Which may not be that unlikely with the worn out and wandering front end and crappy brakes.

    • 0 avatar
      R Henry

      “bodies that just don’t hold up to heavy use, particularly the sliding doors, which is a must if you are hauling a lot of people. Brakes, steering and suspension are also much more problematic than the Ford.”

      This is a common impression, but my years as fleet mechanic proved otherwise.

      With regard to sliding doors, the hinged Dodge side doors (sliders were available on Dodges, but ours had the two hinged side doors) proved more popular than the sliders on our Fords–both drivers and our youthful passengers found the sliders heavy and a bit intimidating to shut–they needed to be slammed.

      With regard to brakes, steering, and front suspension, I give the Dodge the advantage. The torsion bar setup proved trouble free. Brakes could be replaced in under 30 mins–DEAD simple. Our tires generally wore evenly on the Dodges, and we didn’t spend much for alignments. Ford…well, different story with the twin I-beam set up. Tires wore unevenly, and there wasn’t much we could do about it other than frequent tire rotations.

      I HATED how Ford used weird self-locking and reverse thread lug nuts on the E350s in the 80s. Changing a flat on the side of the road was nearly impossible without a service truck with air compressor/impact tools. I noted that the lug studs didn’t like the locking nuts much either.

      As for body integrity, I have no experience with corrosion (in SoCal). The only thing I remember related to body is hinges on the Dodge driver doors…they could wear and cause the door to sag. Beyond that, I rarely addressed body related issues.

  • avatar

    Looking back at the pictures, this Chevy has been converted to 4wd, so yeah it becomes the drive if we are talking these 3 particular vans.

  • avatar

    Drive – Dodge Ram Wagon. Just for the nostalgia factor. My college used these to transport my debate team throughout the Midwest and the South. Got one going fast enough on I-70 to make the radar speed sign just outside Indianapolis flash double-eights rolling into Indiana University-Purdue University of Indianapolis, forever known as Ooey-Pooey.

    Buy – Ford Econoline. Had one for a race hauler with 300ci straight six and four-speed. Impossible to kill. And I tried mightily.

    Burn – Chevy G Van, just because I strive to be efficient and my brother burned one to the ground. So all I’ll have to do is wait for it to fix the glitch.

  • avatar

    Why no shots of the seats? Probably velour “captains chairs” up front. The shuttle van I drove was an E-350 XLT extended with the big-block 460/7.5 and captain chairs. Loved it. 80 series tires so it rode nice too. Dual tanks on the driver’s but I was glade fill ups were on the company’s tab.

    Anyway, speaking of those awesome velour seats with flip-up armrests, it was the only time I’ve fallen asleep at the wheel. The “braille” woke me up, I was a quarter way into the outside lane before as I realized where I was, fought off the panic and simply completed the “lane change”. I checked my rear-view and customers were gazing out the windows, half asleep themselves, thankfully!

  • avatar

    I drove a lot of Tradesman Dodge vans as they were what BC Ambulance service was buying. Gutless wonders that on one occasion left me stranded on the side of the highway. Fortunately we had no patient’s on board. Because of that, I’d say burn the Dodge.
    We had the occasional Ford and ironically a lot of guys claimed they had sh!tty brakes. In actual fact it was because all of the units we had came with the 460 ci big block. Compared to the Tradesman, they were flat out hot rods. Drivers would mash the pedal and be going much faster than expected. The longer snout meant they had more leg room and the seats were more comfortable than the Tradesman. In this case, I’d say drive or buy.
    I never drove any Chevy/GM vans. A few buddies had them as “shaggin’ wagon’s”. They loved the way they drove. The also appeared to be reasonably reliable for a malaise era vehicle. They were more comfortable than the Tradesman. I’d say buy or drive.

  • avatar

    Burn the Dodge. I still haven’t gotten over “Van 51,” the unbelievably clapped-out state-owned ’82 Ram I had to drive for work in college. I mean, 106,000 miles added two at a time by college students isn’t going to be easy on any vehicle, but this thing was really super-bad.

    Drive the Chevy. It looks nicer than either of the others IMO, with the wheelbase stretch, and has the typically astute GM pre-computer automatic.

    Buy the Ford. They just seemed to last the longest of this generation of vans. But I’d really prefer to find a few extra pennies and get one of the rare Chateau vans that they made in the first few years of the following generation. Those were about the nicest 15-passenger vehicles an OEM has produced.

  • avatar
    Art Vandelay

    Buy – Whichever one has the coolest mural painted on it. I was fond of one that had a cowboy on a horse staring off into the desert which faded to the jungle of Vietnam that I’d see around my neighborhood in the 80’s. Martian murals work too.

    Drive – Whichever one has the “Gas, Grass or A$$…nobody rides for free bumper sticker.

    Burn – The one with the circle window and the “If this van’s rockin don’t bother knockin\'” bumper sticker. That one is probably a biohazard. For the love of God don’t take a blacklight near it.

  • avatar

    Burn the Chevy
    Buy the Ferd
    Drive the Dodge
    Had a well used 1983 C class Chevy based motorhome. The original 400 was replaced by a goodwrench 350. Gutless was an understatement. Getting passed by vw busses going over the pass was fun. Also, in the summer, the temperature by my right foot was hot enough to start melting my shoe. A/C didn’t work of course, and I was too broke to fix it.
    I worked as a mechanic one summer, and the 6 cylinder ford delivery vans we worked on were well into the triple digit mileage. I think the lowest I remember was 250k. Easy to work on too.
    Growing up, my best friend’s parents had a dodge van that was pretty fun and easy to drive. but it was almost new. so not really a fair comparison.

  • avatar

    We bought a used ’93 Ford 15-passenger van in 1996. We’ve taken a few family vacations in it; the one-bench-per-child seating has been a blessing. Handling is mediocre, ride sux, maneuvering is cumbersome (it’s huge). But my kids grew up riding in it, and it’s “part of the family.”

    Over the years, our Ford has been hit twice in the rear (broke two bumpers, one trailer hitch), and once in the front (broke our bumper + grille). Our van drove away from all three accidents. All three other vehicles had to be towed away. This vehicle is so massive that airbags aren’t needed (unless you’re hit by a semi, or a train).

    It seems our experience was opposite everyone else’s: the torque converter locked up at about 100Kmi, and the engine (5.8L) burnt a valve at 120Kmi. Both of the replacements (both free under warranty) are still going at 200Kmi. ISTR the differential bearings failed around 80-90Kmi, but that was cheap to fix. Disclaimer: we have towed a boat on a few occasions.

    A/C has been a challenge, but I have it working now. The rear A/C is effective.

    Aside from a huge hassle to replace the front upper ball joints around 150Kmi (took the steering knuckles to a qualified machine shop), the dual-I-beam front-end has been trouble-free. True, it has eaten too many sway-bar bushings… but our van holds an alignment, and tires wear evenly.

    Current hassles include the cruise control, and some door-latch-control-cables. Various plastic fittings in the cooling system are failing due to age. Parts are becoming problematic, as the van is 26 years old.

    All-in-all, it’s been O.K. for us, but given our drivetrain breakages, I wouldn’t recommend it to others.

  • avatar

    Buy the Dodge. I have very fond memories of the extended Dodge that replaced the disgusting, series of blue full-sized station wagons that were the family vehicle for a lot of my childhood. Especially, seeing my brother tumble out of the door from the front passenger seat onto the street when the door latch failed as my mom tried her best to put the van on 2 wheels whilst making a left-hander. Happy Days!

    Drive the Chevy. Uncle Bob drove a sweet-assed custom Chevy panel van with a window on the sliding door and he was by far the coolest guy my mother ever dated…meanwhile…

    Burn that Ford! I’ve been given enough free rides to The Cooler, courtesy of The Man, in galvanized metal lined Econolines/E-Series.

  • avatar

    Whichever one you choose, you better have off-street parking for it. Cities are passing laws against people sleeping in cars, and windowless vans have to keep moving if parked on the street. In some cities, just 24 hours parked in one spot earns a tow.

  • avatar

    My only behind-the-wheel exposure to this class was driving a friends’ borrowed ’94 Ram 150 short-box windowed van with the base 3.9L V6 to fetch a motorcycle an hour away. In a weird way, that was more memorable and enjoyable than any number of sporty modern car’s I’ve driven. This one was an ex-fleet vehicle that spent its life in Central NY so it was a total rot box, with what felt like 15 degrees of steering slop in either direction. But I did the job just fine, I loved how you could feel the kickdown detent in the accelerator.

  • avatar

    Buy the Ford out of bias:My folks had an 84 Econoline 150 with an “Elk Van” of Elkhart Indiana converison. Before the days of high roofs and TV’s. It was a 351 (and it was 150hp believe, at that time) with a 3 speed automatic ( 4 speed auto only with the 302 in 84). Only real knock against it was no rear air, so sitting in the way back could be warm.

    We had it for a long time, went to Myrtle Beach from Pittsburgh as a kid many times with it. Had a high school “senior skip day” adventure with 7 friends before the folks traded it on a 94 CPO Deville Concours around 95 or 96 with only about 65k on it.

    Just found the invoice cleaning out the folks house. It was 21k in 1984, my parents traded an 82 Buick Electra on it. I remember the Electra, black with red interior.

    Burn the Chevy. Never been a fan of GM trucks and vans.

    I drove the last generation B vans as a car washer for Enterprise in the late 90’s, early 2000’s. They were really cramped up front, but other than that, it wasn’t any worse to drive than the E-series and the GM twins. The 3.9 V6 and a 3spd auto were awful in them. I drove one on the highway in the rain from Morgantown to Pittsburgh once. It was loud.

  • avatar

    Drive the Dodge. It would ride and handle the best of the three. Styling wise, I’m a sucker for the curved rear windows on the extendo version, I like the large easily visible taillights, and it’s the only one with a snoot that could be called handsome. Also: swap in a junkyard 440. That thing was a BEAST.

    Buy the Chevy, pimp it out, and sell it to whoever’s looking for a van conversion. They’ll appreciate the okay MPG and okay ride.

    Burn the Ford. I have nothing against a body-on-frame van that wanders like a drunken hobo, with an engine that delivers neither power nor fuel economy, but something’s gotta give.

    I do have a bias. My mom bought a van for her business when I was a kid, but it wasn’t a white strangers-with-candy panel van, it was a used Dodge conversion van that apparently had been built for a Nevada lady of the evening. The rear sofa folded down into a remarkably comfortable bed. The front captains were suitably 70s-tastic. And the 440 was equipped with a 4-barrel and an exhaust the size of a water main. I’d load that thing to its vinyl padded ceiling with boxes, slide the dolly under the sofabed, and off we’d go. Good memories.

  • avatar

    I might a month late and a hundred short, but I like and respect em all!
    Kinda hurts a little to see examples of these generations disappearing from the roads. Personally, I’m non-denominational when it comes to American makes. These vans, every single one had their strong points as well as their quirks. There is no perfect beast! Properly taken care of ANY one is good. Mopar: I have a soft spot for the earlier “Tradesmen” or Plymouth version with shark tooth grille. I’ll take mine with a 318 or 360 4v.

    GM : I have a soft spot for the ’83-’84 they had a nice looking front end that was unique to only those 2 years. (Quad headlight version) I’ll take mine with the LE9 5.0 V8.

    Ford : Like a friendly old neighbor that moved or passed away… I kinda miss seeing these econolines roaming the streets. They used to be EVERYWHERE! I’ve never heard of a bad one. The front ends reminded you that..Yes!! You are in fact driving a utility van. Every one I’ve ever encountered and drove did so faithfully even if it was on its last leg. Coolest one in my experiences was a big, yellow 1 ton 4×4 “Quadravan” of my aunt and uncles. We called it the “Yellowbird”. We all went on many a road trip in it. It was a ’79 I believe. First year for square headlights. Had a 460. Good Times.

    Burn: None of em!!

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