By on May 4, 2018

2017 Chevrolet Volt - Image: Chevrolet

Jason writes:

Dear Sajeev,

This isn’t so much a Piston Slap question, but rather a “what would Sajeev do (WWSD)?”

My father recently approached me and said that he and my mother are interested in getting a pre-owned electric to replace one of their aging cars. My father drives a 2009 Hyundai Sonata GLS (w/ popular pkg) with 65k on the odometer and my mother drives a 2008 Honda Civic EX Sedan with 85k. Both cars are close in age and miles, however, the Honda bests the Hyundai in resale value, hands down. Whatever they end up selling, my dad will keep to drive as an everyday car and my mom will get the electric. My dad is adamant about selling the Hyundai due to some shortcomings like the interior build quality (dashboard makes noises during hot climate) and the fuel tank has an odd evaporation issue where it forces the car not fill properly. However, I’m more for selling the Civic because the Sonata overall is a quieter and plush car for someone his age. In the past, he has complained the Civic is too low and I see him struggle to get in and out of my stock ILX. It’s a tough decision for us because both cars were purchased brand new and if you saw them today, you’d think they qualify as certified pre-owned vehicles.

The second question is the car they intend to purchase. My mom really likes the look and shape of the Nissan Leaf, but I introduced the Chevy Volt as an alternative and she approves. Both are completely different from one another but are a few thousands a part on the certified pre-owned market. My mother has a few years left until retirement and commutes (30 miles round-trip) for work, so both cars will suit her current and future lifestyle.

I know it might sound crazy to you (and readers) to sell any Asian car in such prime of their lives to get an electric car, but my parents are aging and at the end of the day, it’s whatever makes them happy that matters to me. So which makes more sense, selling the Sonata or Civic? Leaf or Volt? Or are we crazy and just keep the set up as is?

Sajeev answers:

Let’s address the elephant in the room:

“I know it might sound crazy to you (and readers) to sell any Asian car in such prime of their lives…are we crazy and just keep the set up as is?”

Son, take it from this countrified Tex-Asian autowriter who — before this Piston Slap gig — was frequently (mis)cited for an Anti-GM bias: nobody thinks you’re crazy for considering a GM or Nissan electric car.

While GM made a huge mistake with those ignition barrels, Toyota’s recent gooey dashboards and Honda’s transmission bearing failures prove nobody’s perfect. I stand behind my reviews — especially that shameful 2008 Cadillac STS — but even I admit purchasing decisions are now dependent on a buyer’s brand perception, styling preferences, incentives, specifications, performance numbers, etc. and not reliability/durability metrics.

So go electric, either the certified pre-owned Chevrolet Volt or similar Nissan Leaf will suffice and both have fantastic depreciation. If Mom thinks the Leaf’s range is unacceptable for her occasional need for wanderlust, the Volt is the clear winner. If not, a test-drive will help her out.

And if I’ve learned anything about aging relatives’ car preferences, let your father decide which car to sell. Both sound fine: he must come to his own conclusion about his struggles of vehicle ingress.

Off to you, Best and Brightest!

Send your queries to [email protected]com. Spare no details and ask for a speedy resolution if you’re in a hurry…but be realistic, and use your make/model specific forums instead of TTAC for more timely advice. 

Get the latest TTAC e-Newsletter!

38 Comments on “Piston Slap: Truly a Re-volting Notion?...”

  • avatar

    I’m going to skip over what you buy and talk about what you sell: Don’t make the mistake of lumping together a Hyundai and a Honda as “Asian.”

    There’s a very good reason why the Honda has much higher resale value: because the repair history of the two makes points to the likelihood that the Honda has much more trouble-free life left in it. See the Consumer Reports owner reliability survey for independent confirmation of this.

    • 0 avatar

      If they overpaid for the Honda as they are expensive and some believe you have to to drink the Kool-aid, then they will never see that Honda excellent residuals as it’ll never pay off in a decade or two.

    • 0 avatar

      I was going to say definitely sell the Honda. They are overvalued for what they are while hyundais are undervalued. The hyundai is better quality and is a better car… so why not sell the overvalued instead of the undervalued? makes a lot of sense to me.

      The ingress/egress issue will only get “worse”.

    • 0 avatar

      We have a 2008 Sonata in the family with over 160k miles. It has had only slightly more repair needs than our two Honda products have needed. Certainly more, but not horrible.

    • 0 avatar

      A customer of mine a few years ago told me that he and his wife had gotten new cars–him a Hyundai, hers a Honda. His words: “We know which one has a longer warranty. We also know which one is a better car.”

      The voice of the owner.

    • 0 avatar

      I did check Consumer Reports, and for the 2008 Civic, it got a 69 score for reliability compared to other 2008 cars where 50 would be the average car (Corolla top of the segment at 86). The 2009 Sonata got a 72 compared to other 2009 cars (Camry stop at 82). The 2008 Elantra got an 80; the 2009 Accord got a 78. I’d have to say your statement cannot be confirmed independently.

  • avatar
    SCE to AUX

    Naturally, I’ll bite…

    Sell the Civic; ingress and egress will not get any easier for Dad.

    Keep the Sonata – it sits higher, and it has a lot of paid-for life left in it.

    Leaf… I had a 12 Leaf (lease), but I would not buy one used.

    First advice for EV shoppers: Do NOT assume the claimed range of your prospective EV will actually work for your commute. If you live in a cold climate, the actual range of the Leaf (or other EV) could be cut in half (yes, 50%). As for the Leaf’s range: Mine never once matched the EPA claim, and it decreased by 15% in 3 years (26k miles). The Leaf’s battery capacity is measured in ‘bars’, and most used Leafs are already missing at least one bar (out of 12), which means their capacity is below 85% of whatever they used to be.

    I had an 18-mile round trip commute with my Leaf. In the winter, a few side trips added to my commute meant that I barely made it home some days. BTW, you also need to deduct safety range from your ‘fuel tank’. You absolutely can’t run it to zero, and the car will give you warnings below about 10 miles. This is no fun.

    Also, filling an EV to 100% is inadvisable for battery health, so you effectively lose range at the upper end also. So for older Leafs with a 73- or 84-mile claimed EPA range, you’re effectively left with maybe 50 miles of usable range before things get dicey.

    Having said all that, my Leaf was exceptionally reliable, quiet, economical, and fun to drive. A used one for short commutes would be great.

    Don’t get snookered into spending $2000 on a charger, either. Some people use only the 110V charger that comes with the car, but even Nissan doesn’t recommend that for everyday use. I installed my own Level 2 220V charger for $800 back then, but they are available for $400 today. Any electrician can install one – it’s no harder than installing an extra dedicated receptacle to the garage wall.

    As for the Volt, it’s really a hybrid with a nice all-electric range. It will provide more utility than a Leaf, but I find them to be very cramped inside. You still need to charge it. It’s a safer bet than a Leaf, but I’ve rarely gone with safe bets.

    • 0 avatar

      Thanks for that thorough, unbiased assessment of the Leaf. I respect you for not glossing over its weaknesses despite the fact that you are an EV believer.

    • 0 avatar

      I bought a 2015 leaf used about 18 months ago (the nicer package and 84 mile range, 12K miles on the odo, and $12,000, still a year left on warranty). Amazing depreciation. It’s the first used car I’ve bought.

      I’m a little less pessimistic than you about the range but your numbers aren’t /that/ far off. I feel fine up to about 65 miles in the summertime, and 50 in our relatively mild Pacific NW winters. If I really try to conserve I have gotten over 90 miles on a full charge, but that’s driving like a grandma and without HVAC, nobody wants to make a regular practice of that. I haven’t yet lost a bar, but I understand the newer battery packs are better than your 2012. Range anxiety is real; I live up a steep 1 mile hill, and watch 5-10 miles drop off the range as I drive that last mile.

      I believe if you drive the car frequently there isn’t much of a problem with a full charge. Not good to fill the battery and leave it that way though.

      What I found most astonishing is that, with my Leaf in the garage next to a BMW 4-series, a Focus RS, and an F-150 I almost always chose to drive the Leaf. Despite the slow acceleration and ponderous handling, as a commuter it was just more pleasant. With a ~40 mile round-trip commute I don’t try to milk the range; I’ll drive 80 on the freeway.

      I went with the leaf over a Volt or similar because of the (almost) zero maintenance aspect. In 18 months and 10,000 miles it’s not seen a shop once. Brake pads should last forever thanks to re-gen and oil changes obviously don’t matter. I’ll change the brake fluid eventually, but that’s about it.

      I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend one of the newer 150 mile leafs (leaves?) to anyone as a second car. I’ll probably buy one myself. I’m hoping once the 250 mile leaf comes out the 150 milers will drop substantially in price. I don’t see the value proposition for a 250 mile EV over a 150 mile EV. i’m not sure I’d recommend the 84 mile range version to someone who isn’t amused by the quirks, though.

      • 0 avatar

        But when you regenerate going back down that steep hill you should get back most of the charge you used going up it, with the exception of what you would have used anyway covering 2 miles on flat ground.

        • 0 avatar

          “But when you regenerate going back down that steep hill you should get back most of the charge you used going up it, with the exception of what you would have used anyway covering 2 miles on flat ground.”

          Yes, but not really. First of all, regaining that on the downhill doesn’t help if I have 5 miles range left, and that 1 mile climb takes 10 miles off my range. I’ve never run out, but I have hit “limp home” mode just as I was reaching my driveway. That’s where range anxiety is from.

          And since I always charge at home, when I drive back down the hill I’ve got a full charge. So regen doesn’t help me regain that 10 miles.

          This is the type of quirk that, as an engineer, I can learn to enjoy. Figuring out how to game my EV’s range a little. But for the same reason I wouldn’t recommend a low mileage EV to anyone’s mom

    • 0 avatar

      This is all great owner feedback. I wanted to chime in to say I’ve spoken to several people about their Leaf ownership (lessee) experiences and every single one of them complained of the range not meeting expectations, range degradation, and even batteries having to be replaced under warranty.

      While a 30 mile round trip commute would not be an issue for a used Leaf, I would still not recommend that car to anyone with ambitions to drive the car on any other route.

      Unfortunate scenario: Mom wants to go to OP’s house to see the grand kids, but dad took the Sonata/Civic to meet up with some buddies? Tough luck for mom- she’s landlocked to a 30 mile radius from her house. It becomes a “who’s stuck driving the glorified golf cart?” situation.

    • 0 avatar

      “Also, filling an EV to 100% is inadvisable for battery health, so you effectively lose range at the upper end also.”

      I’ve got to disagree with you on that one. Charging to 100% isn’t an issue with the newer Leaf batteries in my personal experience (along with my robots and numerous other lithium devices). I always charge to 100% and I’m still going strong at 62k or whatever I’m up to and have all 12 bars. That being said, I suspect there is extra hidden capacity in my battery and I may not actually be charging to 100%.

      • 0 avatar
        SCE to AUX

        @mcs: In retrospect, I was conflating two different issues with that awkward statement.

        100% filling is bad for cars that don’t drain it off right away; your high daily mileage discounts this issue, not to mention your better battery chemistry. The other issue is obvious: if you don’t fill to 100%, you don’t start with as much range.

      • 0 avatar

        Tell us more about the robots!

  • avatar
    87 Morgan

    I have spent a lot of time in a Volt, and I seriously considered purchasing one but went with the Lacrosse instead. For the OPs folks, my reasoning may not be an issue for them. The back seat of the Volt is really small and I have 1 and soon another teenage boy. One of which is 6 feet tall already. The Lacrosse has a vastly superior back seat in terms of leg room.

    Other than that, the Volt is a spectacular car. My business partner who had one, had only one issue which was a rock damaging the battery cooler. Perhaps a design flaw of the location of the device, but not a mechanical failure per se’. It is a fast car, drives great, and is super quiet on the freeway. We routinely would knock out 250 miles in a day in it, obviously driving on gasoline powered electricity the bulk of the time.

    My BIL leased a Leaf, first generation. No thank you.

  • avatar

    Logic over emotion first…

    I agree that if the father is more comfortable in the Hyundai, then that’s the one they should keep. Yes, it may have its issues but that fuel tank one could simply be due to trying to refuel too quickly. I almost never set the nozzle at its highest rate of flow in my cars because the tank tends to pressurize faster than the vents release it, causing the nozzle to kick off. Going first or second notch (out of three) almost never sees that happen. As for the heat squeak/rattle… hey, the car’s already 8 years old. If it’s still comfortable and reliable (and low mileage as well) then keep the one that’s easier on the driver.

    As for buying an electric; don’t limit yourselves. The Volt is a nice sedan but its electric-only range is only 50 miles and it starts the engine long before the battery reaches that limit. Depending on mother’s typical drive, that may simply not be enough range to really make ownership worth it. Granted, the Leaf is only 30 miles better so in some ways the two are quite equivalent, barring the fact that the Volt at least has a ‘range extender’ on board.

    Since the previous cars were purchased new, it might not be a bad idea to consider a new EV. The Leaf 2 has double the range of the original Leaf and you’re less likely to get caught out on a battery replacement soon after purchase. The Chevy Bolt has demonstrated an easy 200 miles of range under nearly every driving situation (barring frigid weather) and in some cases has demonstrated over 300 miles of range when speeds are kept to 55mph or below. As an around-town car, that could be a very logical choice. There are others, too, but at least for now I’d avoid any hydrogen-fueled car as there simply aren’t enough stations around to make them practical unless you’re already living close to one (less than five miles would be my personal limit.)

    Emotionally speaking, I honestly can’t answer the question properly. Clearly there’s something about the Hyundai he doesn’t like and I don’t think he’s been able to fully define it. Maybe, to him, it just feels ‘cheap’ or maybe its reliability isn’t as good as the Honda’s. Maybe he simply doesn’t like the way it drives, despite being otherwise a comfortable car. I know if I get to the point I don’t trust a vehicle, I want out from under it as soon as I am able. He might be willing to suffer the lower seating of the Honda if in his opinion the Honda just drives better.

    Similarly, the Volt has both a logical and emotional aspect to it. The Volt is a sedan vs the Leaf’s 5-door design so maybe offers a sense of comfort over utility. The ‘range extender’ engine also offers a sense of comfort as you don’t have to worry about range as much, though that six-gallon tank may get filled more often than expected, depending on how much mom drives.

    Again, I’m no fan of buying used, even when considering electrics… for now. You just don’t know what kind of problems the previous owner might have had. A new one may be more expensive, but it’s also likely to be the last car they own unless they’re younger than I imagine. Get the best you can for the money, even if it means spending a little more.

  • avatar

    Your mother will love the EV, but make sure it is adequate for her driving needs. If your parents live where it gets really cold in winter, assume 40% range loss in cold weather. Also, be sure to check battery degradation on any Leaf you consider buying, since they have no thermal battery management. If it is just your mother driving and the range is adequate, you may want to consider Smart EV, since they can be REALLY cheap used. Having you car always ready in the morning without worrying about getting gas is something I know your mother will absolutely love. Hopefully, they live in a house where you can install a 240V outlet/charger.

    Volt is far more luxurious and pleasant to drive than a Leaf. Keep that in mind, too.

  • avatar
    30-mile fetch

    I’d want the Volt for the flexibility of having a gas engine onboard when needed, and because it doesn’t look like a frog. But it looks like a low-slung driving position so if the Civic is giving fits it would be worth paying attention to that. How’s abouts waiting a year until the Bolt comes down in price? It’s got a crossover-like seating height and seems like a far better Leaf.

    Civic vs. Sonata? A relative had a 2008 Sonata–the seats are terrible and the interior was not aging well. I’d much rather have the Civic. However if Hyundai’s seats work for them, the Civic’s ingress/egress is truly a struggle, and they value a car that can quietly absorb freeway miles (the loud Civic is tiring here), then I’d keep the Hyundai. The extra trade-in value from the Civic would put them closer to the better EV.

  • avatar

    Don’t you get crazy lease deals on the Volt down there in the US of A? I have seen absurd net numbers in some jurisdictions. I would take the Volt over the leaf without even thinking, no brainer.

  • avatar

    If it were my parents I’d recommend them looking at something like a LaCrosse/Regal eAssist or Camry/Accord hybrid instead.

    I’d be worried about range issues on a used full EV and the Volt doesn’t seem to bring enough to the table over a conventional hybrid.

    If they are dead set on something with a plug, I’d check out leasing a new Leaf or Bolt.

  • avatar

    I am a owner of a 2013 Volt since new. I leased it for a song (~250 per month, 15k miles) and bought it for a song after the lease was up (<13k) through negotiating with the bank. The original agreement was 25k, but the depreciation was dramatic enough they wanted to negotiate with me rather than take a risk at the auction block. GM also dropped the MSRP at one point, which hit the used car market dramatically.

    I would completely agree with the response to this post stating that you should only focus on lightly used examples or look for a cheap lease. The depreciation is massive.

    Thoughts on the Pros:

    The nice mistake-proof feature of the Volt when it comes to the electric car life: If your parent(s) forget to plug it in at night? It is a 35-40mpg hybrid. Even higher for gen-2.

    The folding rear seat for a large hatch area is nice, despite being a bit cumbersome.

    Smooth cruiser. Instant torque is intoxicating. Feels like a diesel car, only even more responsive in traffic. These electric cars handle bumper to bumper traffic better than people realize.

    Matting the throttle is easy, as the computer limits torque until you are off and running.

    Solidly built. Knock on wood, but I haven't had a single problem in 60k+ miles. A few oil changes (once a year at the maximum), and one set of tires at 50K. I went with a more comfortable tire, which resulted in losing about 3-5 of its 38-40 mile all-electric range. Still original brakes.

    I am fortunate enough now to have a fun car for the weekends, but I didn't for the first 4 years I had it. I was content given that the vehicle is a purpose-built vehicle and really feels like it was built to a high standard.

    Thoughts on Cons on the Gen-1 Volt:

    The blind spots on these cars almost require a wide angle stick-on mirror for the sides.

    You will scrape often. It doesn't damage the large rubber flap under the front of the car, but it will draw attention to you.

    The volt is a bit cramped in the back. We still manage with it. Young kids would be fine, growing teens wouldn't like a long road trip. Trips for lunch with coworkers are fine.

    The center stack on the Gen-1 Volt takes time to become proficient. The look is nice (Get white, no finger prints) but usability is pretty lousy. Gen-2 is much better.

    The seats in the gen-2 volt are more comfortable if I remember correctly. Gen-1 seats are OK, just firm.

    The Gen-2 Volt is 1+ seconds faster 0-60 due to the vehicle being dramatically lighter. That being said, I feel like my gen-1 has a more stable, heavier feel and I like it.

    Wrap Up and thoughts on Reliability:

    The Volt was pretty ground-breaking when it came out, and GM took their time with it to make sure the battery side is taken care of. The only problems I have heard about from other owners have been associated with the transmission. I think it was more associated with the 2011-2012 model years.

    Get the leather steering wheel and interior if you can. It really improves the overall feel of the car. The interior will match the quality of the ride.

    I would hesitate to trade my Volt in unless it was for the Gen-2 (better seats, acceleration, Android Auto).

    • 0 avatar
      Kyree S. Williams

      Yeah, my friend has a ’17 Volt LT with the leather and heated steering wheel/heated seats.

      My Cruze uses the same basic steering wheel, but his is more padded, has a better grain of leather, and has a stronger heating element. I suspect the latter is to keep you from cranking on the heater and diminishing the battery level. But his entire car is very intuitively designed.

  • avatar
    Kyree S. Williams

    My best friend has a 2017 Volt in Pepperdust Metallic and loves it. The thing is just extremely well-built. And though it doesn’t have the space of his previous Fusion Energi, it drives a lot better and has more than twice the electric range.

    I recommend the Volt.

  • avatar

    If the recall on the Civic’s engine block has not been taken care of, that is the one to get rid of.
    Are your folks in a position to replace both cars with something that’s better suited to their ages/wants? In reading between the lines it seems they don’t want either one of the cars they have.

  • avatar

    The Volt looks like a modernized Chevy Citation… I still hate GM for the ignition barrel issue but that aside the only brand sold in the US who’s products age worse than GM would be FCA. No thanks… Nissan makes good products but loves CVT transmissions which in my opinion turns a significant number of potential customers away from their products. Not an issue for this type of vehicle though.
    If I had to go electric compact non-SUV my money would be on a pre-owned Lexus HS sedan or CT hatch.

  • avatar

    Couldn’t they plan ahead for a situation like that and she takes the gas car for the day?

  • avatar

    I drive an 18-year old Lexus that feels like it will never quit. I said to my wife that I’d like my next car to be another V8 Lexus, which I’ll drive for 10-15 years and then get an electric car (which will have been perfected after 25-years in the market).

  • avatar
    Secret Hi5

    Should consider the Prius too, if the parents are willing to consider a hybrid instead of pure electric. No range anxiety, proven technology & reliability, and spacious.

    As they approach their retirement, perhaps more consideration should be given to the “emotional” component of decision making. Father won’t be happy every time he hears the Sonata’s squeaks and rattles.

  • avatar
    Landau Calrissian

    Re: fueling issues on the Sonata. I used to work at a Hyundai dealership, and most of their cars from that era have a small charcoal filter on the canister close valve, which is located on the filler neck. If you try to “top off” the tank after it clicks off naturally, the filter will get clogged, which can make it difficult to refuel sometimes. Part was like $40 at the dealership last I checked, and about an hour of labor.

  • avatar

    Buy the Volt, drive the Civic, burn* the Sonata.

    The ingress/egress issue with the Civic can be improved somewhat by putting slightly larger tires on when they need replacing. For example, going from a 205/55R16 to 215/60R16 will raise the car 1.3 inches.

    *read: sell.

    • 0 avatar
      The Comedian

      Your math doesn’t work. Your proposed solution only increases ride height by .105″, less than 1/8″.

  • avatar

    I’d look at the Ford C-Max Energi or the Ford Fusion Energi. Both will do about 20 miles all electric but get very good mileage. I know someone with the C-Max Energi and they love it – and they are definitely not electric car type folks.

  • avatar

    I bought a used 2014 Volt last year. I love the thing.

    The car is really fun to drive. Not sportscar fun, but for a commuter car in city driving, it’s fun. The torque is instant and it doesn’t have to shift. It’s really fast to 30 mph. It’s reasonably fast to 60, but it’s that 0-30 speed that makes it a blast to drive around town. It’s almost dead silent. It’s comfortable and it’s pretty loaded with tech for it’s age. The only things I’d really like it to have is Android Auto and blind spot monitoring, but I can deal without it. As others have mentioned, the blind spots are horrible (the stick on blind spot mirrors did the trick for me), and the A pillar makes a big blind spot to the left. I always have to take a second look when making a left across a crosswalk.

    What they say about depreciation is right, and it’s a major reason I bought a used Volt. I paid about $17k for a 3 year old car with 33,000 miles that original had a sticker price just North of $40,000 (Mine has every option that was available). When you consider the engineering that went into the Volt, it’s probably an even better value. The Gen 1 Volt was very overengineered and has proven to be very reliable. If you find one as a Certified Pre-owned vehicle, it comes with 12 months and 12,000 miles of bumper to bumper warranty, and the balance of a 5 year, 60,000 mile powertrain warranty and a 8 year, 100,000 mile warranty on the battery, electric drivetrain, and all equipment that is a part of the electric system (this include many components of the A/C and heating system, since it’s part of the battery management system too. It’s basically a used car with a 5 year warranty on most of the major equipment.

    The thing has been flawless for me. I can go 2 years between oil changes. Other than that, there’s basically no maintenance. My engine has about 6000 gas miles on it at this point, and 37,000 miles of electric. I’m standing at a combined 222 mpg. I’ve gone up to 4000 miles without stopping at a gas station.

    It costs me about $1 of electricity to drive about 40 miles and after that, I get about 37 mpg on gas. Most days I drive on just battery. I’ve put 10,000 miles on it and filled it up 3 times with about 8 gallons of gas. My 8 mile commute to work uses 2kwh, or about 20 cents of power.

    As a commuter car that you can fill up with gas if you need to go on a long trip, it’s about perfect. I also really like the styling of the Gen 1 Volt. It’s different looking than everything else on the road, but it still looks very modern. I like the 2014 and 2015 a bit better, because they stopped doing the black trunk and greenhouse and painted them body color, and the interior trim got a more subdued.

  • avatar

    Have they even considered a used Tesla?

Read all comments

Back to TopLeave a Reply

You must be logged in to post a comment.

Recent Comments

  • Jeff S: Most of us have more than 1 vehicle especially if you are married and have children. Owning any motorized...
  • Jeff S: @ToolGuy–I have noticed fewer gas stations in rural areas as well but I don’t know if that is...
  • RedRocket: Thanks for the laugh. Voice recognition is the most worthless thing ever introduced to the modern software...
  • Art Vandelay: Additionally, the AT itself was IBM’s second gen home PC, following the XT. Prior to that you had...
  • Art Vandelay: If you do so much as disturb the dirt in the dried out portions of the Salton Sea doesn’t a toxic...

New Car Research

Get a Free Dealer Quote

Who We Are

  • Adam Tonge
  • Bozi Tatarevic
  • Corey Lewis
  • Jo Borras
  • Mark Baruth
  • Ronnie Schreiber