By on June 6, 2016

20160604_203845

Okay, I admit: I subscribe to the Wall Street Journal. It’s not really for me; Mrs. Baruth works in finance. (Without which, as you pimps and players out there should know, there’s no romance.) Rarely do I read the whole thing. This past Saturday afternoon, however, I broke the pull-cord of my son’s TopKart. Then he ran out of gas for his motorcycle. Which consigned us both to an early afternoon inside the house, because I was too lazy to address either situation.

Imagine my surprise to find an advertisement for an independent leasing agent in the last of the Saturday sections, back among the lifestyle articles and the usual Dan Neil attempt to sound like a more fey version of Oscar Wilde. Those members of the B&B who were born prior to the release of “Appetite For Destruction” will remember that stand-alone leasing shops were once very big business. They bought their cars from franchised dealers, often well after they’d obtained the customer’s signature on their own paperwork, and they relentlessly cross-shopped banks for rate and residual deals.

Often, these firms focused exclusively on members of the professional class; the big hitter in central Ohio during the ’80s was un-self-consciously titled “Physicians Leasing Co.” They were largely driven from the field by the beginning of this century by aggressive captive finance providers like BMW Financial. The tendency on the part of most banks to view the end-of-lease termination process as an additional and very lucrative profit center, a tendency that became more exaggerated as the prime rate fell and banking profits sank accordingly, didn’t help their business model one bit.

Nevertheless, here we are, in $THE_CURRENT_YEAR, with a manufacturer-agnostic leasing company advertising in the WSJ. So let’s see what the deals are, and what lessons we can learn from looking at them.

All of the rates listed in the newspaper ad are supposedly for the same basic terms of 39 months, 10,000 miles a year, $0 down, with gap insurance. That doesn’t mean you’ll “Sign and Drive” like you would at a VW dealer; be prepared to pay the first month and a security deposit equal to or slightly greater than the first month’s payment. Its website offers quite a few more leases. It’s not explicitly stated whether all of these leases are under the same terms. For right now, we’ll assume that most of them are, since the rates quoted in the paper tend to match the ones quoted on the website. If you call, as I did, you’ll be told that they are sample rates and that they vary somewhat depending on the specific vehicle you choose.

The blessing and the curse of dealing with shops like this is that they really don’t care what car you lease, as long as it’s with them. It’s a curse because they don’t have a manufacturer aggressively pushing the metal, the way BMW Financial does, but it’s a blessing because their agnostic approach allows us to see which vehicles really do lease well. In order to “lease well,” a car needs a high residual and a reasonable amount of up-front discount. So, what can we learn from looking at the advertisement and the website?

Big performance sedans and trucks are residual cancer. Note that the entries for “Audi RS7” and the AMG Benzes are expressed in terms of cash discount, not rate. That’s because leasing an RS-series Audi or an AMG is an utter nightmare. The banks hate them. Not only do used AMG Benzes and the like have the residual value of porta-john toilet paper after a week on a construction site, they attract the most credit-challenged and shady customers possible. The same is true for the Nissan GT-R, another “cash off” listing on its website. They do have a lease price listed; it’s over $1,400 a month. Betcha it’ll do a new S-Class for less. Quite a bit less.

Suburbans lease cheaper than Tahoes! Just look at the website. LT Suburbans are $499, while the Tahoes are $579. Go up to LTZ trim on both, and they level out. But when you consider that a Burb stickers for more than a Hoe, that means that the banks would rather take a long-wheelbase model back at the end of a lease. The same isn’t true for the Denali XL and Escalade ESV, both of which cost more to lease than their SWB cousins. So what gives? Only this: There’s a strong contingent of people who buy used Suburbans for work in the building and hauling trades. Base-level Suburbans are a great residual bet. Something to consider, if you’re buying a full-size SUV.

The Lexus GX460 is the deal of the century. Lease a GXS460 for the same price as an Audi Q5? Where do I sign up? The same truck with a Toyota badge is even cheaper, like $200/month cheaper! Obviously, the banks would rather run a three-year-old Lexus across the block than a three-year-old Audi. It gives you a sense of how strongly the German manufacturers have to incentivize their in-house leases to compete with Lexus. But be careful; a few years ago, Lexus added a kind of loss-leader version of the GX to its lineup in order to keep the base sticker below $50,000. Make sure you can live with that relatively sane trim level before you sign on the line that is dotted.

Love That Land Cruiser residual. A new Land Cruiser costs… wait for it… $83,825. The Lexus version, yclept LX570, is $88,880. A six percent difference, give or take. But the lease? $999 for the Toyota, $1,259 for the Lexus. What gives? It can’t be that Toyota dealers are showing extra love to the independent lease shops, because they never do. Trust me. I worked in captive finance for a few years. It has to be down to residual. The extra payment, which adds up to slightly over ten grand, looks suspiciously like the five-grand price difference plus interest and a few extra bucks on top. Which makes me think that the Toyota and Lexus variants of this truck fetch the same money at auction. That’s confirmed for me by some quick searches of used Land Cruisers and Lexus LXes from ten years ago, which indicate that the “L” badge doesn’t add a penny’s worth of resale. So if you’re buying new, get the Toyota, but if you’re shopping used, the Lexus offers a few extras at no charge.

Of all these cars, the one I like is… Probably the Mercedes C63. $799 a month. That’s a pretty good deal. If you bought one on a five-year loan, you’d pay $1,300 a month. Over the term of this lease, you’d save close to $22,000, even once you throw in tax. At the end of 39 months, would I rather have a C-class with 21 months’ worth of payments left to cover, or twenty-two grand in my pocket and an empty driveway? You see? Sometimes leasing really does make sense.

The question that remains unanswered, however, is this: Should I lease with an independent? With very few exceptions, my answer to that question is always “haha fuck no.” Given a choice, you always want to deal with the captive finance company. They are easier to deal with all the way through the lease — and when the lease is over, its concern is getting you into another new car from that same maker, not screwing you out of five grand in charges for hairline scratches and worn trim. The best customer for an independent lease company is somebody who values convenience and choice over cost. You know, the kind of person who likes to just pick up a phone, say the car make and model, and have one show up at his office building later on that week. In other words, the kind of person who reads the Wall Street Journal. But that leads to one final question: Why do they bother delivering this paper to Ohio?

Get the latest TTAC e-Newsletter!

Recommended

82 Comments on “In Electric Leasey-Land, Up Is Down And Suburbans Are Cheaper Than Tahoes...”


  • avatar

    I beat BTSR again!

  • avatar
    PrincipalDan

    Why do they bother delivering this paper to Ohio?

    lol Even being a history and newsgeek the only time I can remember a large percentage of the population of Ohio wanting to pick up the WSJ is when Reagan did his whistle stop tour in ’84. The WSJ sent a reporter to follow him and naturally the reporter had something to say about every little town the train stopped in for one of Reagan’s speeches.

    If it weren’t for job related travel and free copies in hotel lobby’s, I wouldn’t have had an interaction with the WSJ in more than a decade.

    • 0 avatar
      Truckducken

      Dan, not to pick on you, but I gotta represent the heartland here for a moment. Like much of my family, I believe your bread is baked in the public sector. So long as the Libertarians don’t sweep the race this fall and privatize schools nationwide, the day-to-day chatter about little outfits like Apple, Google or GM in the commercial paper of record really doesn’t affect your world. Yet there still remains a business world between the coasts, New Yorker map notwithstanding, and the WSJ is a pretty useful way to keep up as I bank on a Midwest resurgence in the coming decade. When Musk sees the light and gets the hell out of California, I will declare victory.

    • 0 avatar
      JimZ

      “Why do they bother delivering this paper to Ohio?”

      because- whether you want to believe it or not- there’s a lot more to this country than DC, NYC, and SoCal.

      Jon Stewart has it right when he says those regions are the only ones arrogant enough to believe their vaporous bulls**t is somehow “currency.”

      • 0 avatar
        windnsea00

        I am always amazed living in LA how many people can only consider two places in this country to live in, the other being NYC. I somewhat understand it for certain industries that are heavily rooted in either city but it’s a bit comical how many people ignore the rest of this huge country.

        • 0 avatar
          319583076

          “…it’s *myopic and stupid* how many people ignore…”

          Now it works for everything.

        • 0 avatar
          krhodes1

          Having spent the last 20 years going all over the middle of the country for work, they are called the “flyover states” for a reason. Not to say there aren’t nice/interesting places in-between the coasts, but there is a whole lot of nothing out there. And a LOT of closed minds/Bible thumpers. Nobody on either coast has ever asked me if I had a “personal relationship with JAY-ZUHS”.

          • 0 avatar
            Jack Baruth

            No, they just explain to you how critical it is for your five-year-old daughter to see a man with his wang out in the bathroom and treat you like a simpleton if you object to the essential rightness of that behavior.

          • 0 avatar
            brenschluss

            Sounds like you’re going to the wrong meetings.

          • 0 avatar
            smartascii

            People in very large cities are exposed to people of all kinds and colors on a daily basis, form relationships with those people, and come to realize that their prejudices aren’t necessarily borne out by reality.
            And, Jack, to say that… well, anyone besides genuine sexual predators (who don’t seem overly concerned with the law anyway) wants to show their genitals to children in restrooms tells me you probably don’t really know anyone who’s not comfortable with using a public restroom at odds with their identity.
            Ohio is pretty homogeneous, which makes it hard for people who don’t fit for whatever reason to go happily about their business there. And whether you recognize it or not, there’s a herd mentality that says, “Conform or be gone,” and that can be downright scary to the outsider, be they atheist or gay or transgender or non-white.

          • 0 avatar
            64andahalf

            Hey, Krhodes1, I work in CT and used to live in Boston and NYC, so I’m familiar with the “Real New England” that you refer to. And I’ve also lived in San Francisco, London, Melbourne, Dubai, and other “cool” cities, so I feel like I’m well-grounded in living in different places. And I’d like you to consider the possibility that when you say “there is a whole lot of nothing out there” (meaning the non-coastal parts of the USA) that not only could you be wrong, but that it could be the result of your being embarrassingly closed-minded. Seriously.

        • 0 avatar
          JimZ

          thanks to “reality” TV, we as a society have decided that the measure of a person’s worth is how much attention and fame he/she can get. so yeah, attention whores want to live in places where they have a better chance at getting noticed.

          • 0 avatar
            DeadWeight

            “We’ve all been raised on television to believe that one day we’d all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars. But we won’t. And we’re slowly learning that fact. And we’re very, very pissed off.”

            – Some may think it cliche, or overstated, or even not necessarily true, but I fear that, unfortunately, it has already come to pass, and simply getting worse, at an accelerating pace.

            I know people of many generations and a wide range of financial means, and despite growing wealth inequality gaining some attention as of late, it’s still relatively scarcely discussed, and rarely discussed in any real sense of substantive depth and/or critical analyses, and it’s become a real, entrenched, huge crisis with real, deep and lasting consequences and poses a threat to the stability of the American future.

      • 0 avatar
        cimarron typeR

        Shhhhh…don’t let out the secret that life’s better in fly-over territory (I live in KC), my parents are east coast transplants

        • 0 avatar
          bball40dtw

          I was in KC a few weeks ago. I really enjoyed myself. Flights between Detroit and KC are pretty cheap too.

        • 0 avatar
          vtnoah

          Just spent some time in KC. Really cool little place. Definitely seems like a solid place to live.

          • 0 avatar
            Liger

            I’m from KC and miss the food. KC is a liveable town. I’m in DC now and the food sucks, they serve salsa warm here (not spicy warm, but fresh off the burner warm), and it has cucumbers in it? WTF?

  • avatar
    energetik9

    “Love That Land Cruiser residual. A new Land Cruiser costs… wait for it… $83,825. The Lexus version, yclept(?) LX570, is $88,880. ”

    I didn’t know these were all that popular. I actually talked my way into a rental of a Land Cruiser a couple months ago. It was a nice ride, but I certainly wouldn’t want to own it and I was happy to return that thing. That price is absolutely ridiculous; they really need to scrap it and release a retro model. I never see them, but I guess in mommy, luxury soccer suburbia, they are selling.

    • 0 avatar

      The Land Cruiser has a following among a certain group of wealthy people who only want to signal that they are wealthy to other wealthy people.

      They do also have a well-deserved reputation for being pretty much indestructible.

      • 0 avatar
        krhodes1

        Other than the rampant rust. Hopefully the latest ones are better in that regard.

        • 0 avatar

          I haven’t seen any of the current gen with any rust and the vast majorrity of the 98 on up models seem pretty rust free as well. I’m guessing they solved it. On a side note the previous generation (I forget the model numbers) but later 90’s early 2000’s sold really well here in New England and I still see many on the road the current gen are in short supply on the ground but demand huge residual numbers when they come up at local dealers. The only people I personally know who own new ones are Doctors and medium size business owners.

          • 0 avatar
            krhodes1

            Up here in real New England, I see rusty 10yo ones. Anything newer isn’t new old enough to tell yet. Of course, most of them have probably done serious time on the beach or in the mountains, which can’t help.

          • 0 avatar

            I usually travel to Maine several times a year for work but I can’t say I’ve seen a cruiser up there lately (last time was in March). The ones from the mid 90’s here tend to be getting rusty the ones from 99 or so on up are usually pretty solid but part of it is their value seems to encourage people to take care of them. I see quite a few in the Boston area when I go up there and on 84 here in CT I see a few every week.

            When I lived in Eastport some once told me “everything south of Augusta was just North Boston not real Maine”. And conversely while working for a couple weeks in the Kennebunkport area years ago some one told me “North of Portland hell that’s just southern Canada”.

          • 0 avatar
            krhodes1

            If you spend time in the “right” towns around Portland (Yarmouth, Cumberland Foreside and Falmouth Foreside, Cape Elizabeth) you will see plenty of them, in both Toyota and Lexus flavors. And in ski country, of course. Ultimately great trucks in places that have never heard of road salt – e. g. Africa and Afghanistan. The prices for them are just stupid though – you can buy *3-4* much nicer condition P38 Rovers for what a 15yo Land Cruiser goes for, and while the LCs ARE pretty reliable, at 15yo they most definitely break, and they are every bit as expensive as a Rover to fix, if not more so. I looked at them pretty hard, and decided to just stick to P38s.

            I would say both of those descriptions of Maine are completely true! I am also pretty sure there is a wormhole connecting Northern and Eastern Maine with West Virginia and rural Kentucky.

            I would be curious to hear anyone’s opinion of the Lexus GX470. Which I believe is kinda-sorta the Lexus 4Runner? I haven’t driven one yet, but they seem to be a nice size compromise and the pricing is a lot more realistic.

          • 0 avatar
            ToddAtlasF1

            The truly wealthy of Western Albemarle drive Land Cruisers that are beat up looking. Horses have rubbed up against them, and they’ve probably slid into a ditch or two on the way home from Wintergreen. There is nothing better you can be seen in.

    • 0 avatar
      TMA1

      83 grand, and you get a whopping 6 colors to choose from (4 of which are grayscale). That’s how you know it’s luxury.

      • 0 avatar

        You don’t buy a Land Cruiser to get noticed, except by the kind of people who notice Land Cruisers. So no need for flashy colors.

        Besides, it’s not like dealers are going to stock more than 1 or 2, so they don’t need a full lineup of colors.

        • 0 avatar
          CoreyDL

          The correct color for a Land Cruiser is pearl white anyway.

          • 0 avatar
            ToddAtlasF1

            NOOO!!! That’s blasphemous. The best color is dark green, but for that you had to be landed long enough ago to have had your LC for several years. Today, mica is probably as gentry as it gets.

    • 0 avatar
      pipedown

      Having spent a lot of time in Third World countries in the last 5 years, I can claim first-hand witness to why the Land Cruiser is valuable. I do think $80k is a lot to spend, but I think $80k is a lot to spend on most anything. At the same time, the Third World conditions that these LC’s operate in with minimal/deferred maintenance with almost zero advanced diagnostic tools and yet continue to truck on, is extremely impressive. I don’t think anyone on our relatively well-groomed US roads is ever going to experience the true magic of the Land Cruiser .. but you can bet that the 25 years service life that was engineered in means that it could well bring you a lifetime of service in a First World country like the US. It may not be the best offroad vehicle but I would bet that in most sane cases (read: not deliberately going well off the path the does not exist), it’s nearly ALWAYS going to get you where you NEED to be. Fun? Depends on your definition of fun. Fuel efficient? No. Good tow vehicle? No. Good inside space efficiency? No. A dependable workhorse with a relatively comfortable suspension for poor roads that can pack mule a lot of stuff and people (aftermarket safari rack needed)? I really don’t think there’s anything better. I never understood the Land Cruiser until I saw it operating in the types of conditions it was designed for. If you put aside all of the tarted up versions and features we First Worlders love and look at the capability, I think you’d be hard pressed to not at least have a little respect if not outright regard for said Land Cruiser.

      • 0 avatar
        dal20402

        Correct. In the US, the Land Cruiser and LX have the best reliability records on the market. They are overengineered for this application, and that’s really their strongest selling point. They’re not quite as comfortable as some of the competition and you certainly aren’t going to find any “fun-to-drive” quality, but you will know that the car will outlive you.

        The Land Cruiser, as madanthony pointed out, is also a subtle yet very effective signal that you have REAL MONEY. Normal people can’t even afford a used one.

        • 0 avatar
          gtemnykh

          I’m sitting in Sheremetyevo international right now, on my way home from Siberia. I’ve blabbed about this before but it is worth revisiting with another trip fresh in my mind. Land cruisers and land cruiser Prados utterly dominate the SUV and altogether luxury car scene past the Urals, and stretching to Vladivostok, where local production of Landcruiser Prado 150s (gx460 without the v8 and available in a myriad of lower trim levels) has been going for a few years. When you see the roads out in Siberia, you begin to understand the logic. If 1.8 million rubles buys a loaded compact crossover and 2 million buys a decently equipped 4.0L Prado, the choice is obvious. For reference, the local road to the village was so bad the local DOT structure simply graded the shoulders and people started using that. A family friend who drives a lada as a taxi says he simply rebuilds his entire front end every year (control arm bushings, ball joints, tie rod ends).

          80 series, Prado 90 (3rd gen 4runner underpinnings), Prado 120 (gx470 body) 100 and 105 series, but most of all 200 series in 4.7L guise and more expensive Lexus 5.7L trim are all over the place. Very strange to see a brand new ’16 200 series cruising through my grandma’s village where the average salary has most folks driving used rwd ladas or beaten to death 20 year old rhd Japanese imports, but there’s apparently a steady appetite for these very expensive, very durable trucks. Range rover’s are not as durable, not as serviceable, and not as reliable, full stop. To krhodes rust claims, yes in climates with a ton of road salt and heated indoor garages older cruisers might rust, but no worse than contemporary US domestic. For what it’s worth, of the literal hundreds of LCs I saw in the last two weeks, I never saw one with body corrosion, not even an 80 series. Cars do rust there, a litany of japanese sedans had rocker panel rot, to say nothing f Russian makes. I certainly have seen rust on 80 and 100 series in the states, but again they are no worse protected than the average car of that age, and in many cases better.

    • 0 avatar

      I have to guess that the LCs get exported elsewhere in the world. I believe the GX faces a similar scenario, since it’s a Toyota Prado.

      • 0 avatar
        ToddAtlasF1

        GXs do get exported when they’re on salvage titles, but LCs stick around. The US ones are too complicated and thirsty for developing countries anyway.

        • 0 avatar
          gtemnykh

          I saw quite a few US grade gxs, lx470s, and Lc100s in both Novosibirsk and Biysk. Many people with big gas V8s run natural gas conversions, cutting fuel costs in half for an initial investment of $1500 or so. There isn’t too much complicated about an LC100 aside from the outdated GPS which people will either not use when it breaks or will rip it out anyhow. AHC load leveling in the Lexus can either be repaired or replaced with conventional springs and disabled. Despite the gingerbread, the underpinnings of all land cruisers are the same sturdy and simple to work on stuff (torsion bar front end, coil sprung solid rear axle). But hands down the most interesting used import from America to folks in this part of Russia are Toyota Highlanders. 100 and 105 series looked mostly to come from Europe, 80 series from Japan in rhd guise, and 200s and Prado 150s bought new in Russian dealerships.

          • 0 avatar
            ToddAtlasF1

            Interesting. Around here, it seems like every LC sold since they adopted fuel injection is still accounted for. The 4-speed carbureted LCs are a rare sight though.

  • avatar
    seth1065

    The WSJ is a great paper and I read it every chance I get, as for leasing I do not get it for me but if it helps folks get in a nicer ride they do not own good for them.

  • avatar
    06V66speed

    There’s no shortage of ‘Hoes out in the ‘Burbs.

    Sorry. It’s Monday morning. And “‘Hoe” is just far too tempting to not play around with.

  • avatar
    cwallace

    In today’s WSJ there’s an article about how Cadillac is going to solve its problem of too many dealers by not allowing some of them to have actual cars on the lot. You literally strap on some VR goggles to see the cars, and then wait to take delivery since there isn’t any inventory.

    So, no cars at the car dealership, but you’ll still get to talk to the salesogre who reeks of Winstons and the F&I guy you wouldn’t trust to walk your trash out to the curb.

    G’job, Cadillac!

    • 0 avatar

      I like the idea of dealerships returning to the old model of having a couple cars on the lot, but being able to special-order exactly what you want (and actually having a variety of options and colors to special order). Having no cars, however… not so much.

      It’s kind of funny that as JIT manufacturing and the internet have custom-configuring pretty much everything possible, cars are the one exception.

      • 0 avatar
        sportyaccordy

        In a country where a Hot Pocket™ is acceptable for all 3 meals, the idea of going to a dealership, signing paperwork and then waiting even a few weeks for a car to arrive is unacceptable for someone who hates driving in the first place. JIT manufacturing is largely to optimize the manufacturing process for manufacturers, not customers.

        • 0 avatar
          dal20402

          This. People in the US expect to go to the dealership and drive home a Fancy New Car the same day. Ordering is something only car nuts and weirdos do. Both the dealers and the manufacturers hate it, except for Porsche and BMW.

          • 0 avatar
            Frylock350

            @dal20402,

            That’s not always true; my Chevy dealer was very happy to order the Silverado I wanted when they couldn’t find one with the options/color I wanted. I wasn’t pressured to accept one of their lot at all.

      • 0 avatar
        orenwolf

        I’ve had to order in every car I ever purchased. Same for both my parents and all but one friend I can think of.

        Often, this was just a dealer cross-ship, but sometimes it was a “wait for them to build it” situation.

        I don’t know if it’s the law of small sample sizes at work, or just a different mindset in Canada, though.

        • 0 avatar
          Shipwright

          I’m Canadian also and had my current car ordered (’08 Shelby GT500 convertible). Ordered it in Oct. ’07, Confirmed (VIN # issued) in Nov., Built in Dec. and delivered in Jan.’08. I’d do it again if I had to, I’m patient and can wait.

          • 0 avatar

            Back when I had that Mazda3, I went in to the dealer closest to my house. Lo and behold they had the *exact* car/colour/equipment I wanted, with a manual, right on the lot. And I still had to wait a few days to take delivery.

          • 0 avatar
            mike978

            Derek – sounds like you switched cars. What do you have now? A Hyundai perhaps?

    • 0 avatar
      indi500fan

      I stopped by my local Caddy dealer here in Indiana to get the ignition key “fix” for my old SRX. It seemed like almost every employee not a service tech was over 60 yrs old.

      But I did have an enjoyable time in the waiting room talking to an NFL “baller” who had his ‘Sclade in for service.

  • avatar
    FreedMike

    Enterprise used to do a big business in leasing as well.

  • avatar
    ajla

    I dont think I’d lease a 4Runner, GX460, or Land Cruiser.

    The whole fun of owning those is to have an old-school SUV that will roll until the sun explodes.

  • avatar
    Domestic Hearse

    Meh. I’m going for the 2015 Viking 70′ enclosed flybridge. What’s that per month?

    • 0 avatar

      If you could find someone to lease it to you likely around 40k a month. But really it’s better to finance so you can write off the interest on it as your 2nd house. It’s amazing how well Viking has done almost all their competitors are out now and they kind have a last man standing thing going on in their market.

      • 0 avatar
        Hogie roll

        It’s all center consoles all the time now. The old school and backwards type sport boat fans are also lamenting the collapse in popularity of the cigarette style V-hulls and catamarans. Cigarette and outerlimits are almost the a last players in the market, but they charge handsomely. Everyone else switched to center console or died.

        • 0 avatar

          True under 45′ fish boats are almost all center consoles. The sheer number in Florida is mind boggling. But the over 50′ convertible market is still booming and Viking owns most of it followed by Hatteras and all the custom builders.
          The sport boat market has really slowed since about the mid 90’s most of the Donzi’s and Fountains you see listed on Yacht world made after 2000 are center consoles and walkarounds.

  • avatar
    bikegoesbaa

    “At the end of 39 months, would I rather have a C-class with 21 months’ worth of payments left to cover, or twenty-two grand in my pocket and an empty driveway?”

    By my math that empty driveway just cost you $31k.

    So, I vote paid-for Fusion Titanium (or equivalent) that I can drive for another 5 years.

    • 0 avatar
      Maymar

      Only the B&B would think an AMG Benz and a rental grade Ford are a valid comparison.

    • 0 avatar
      yamahog

      Yeah well I vote for a paid for daewoo lanos you can finance your fusion like a CHUMP.

    • 0 avatar
      krhodes1

      You could also pay off the Mercedes in a reasonable timeframe of 48 months or so and have a nice car to drive until the depreciation is but a distant memory.

      And in my state, save a small fortune in sales and excise tax vs. leasing over and over and over. On a $50K car, you will save enough on taxes to pay for most if not all of the maintenance and repairs over a good 10 years or more.

  • avatar

    “Which makes me think that the Toyota and Lexus variants of this truck fetch the same money at auction.”

    Nope.

    A LX570 brings about ~$4-5k over a comparable Land Cruiser. Its still ‘a Lexus’ for whatever that’s worth.

    • 0 avatar
      Jack Baruth

      Alright — so why don’t sale listings for the trucks have that same gap?

      • 0 avatar

        I looked at MMR for a 2013 LC vs a 2013 LX and it appears that on average the Lexus will run through the sale with 37k miles while the LC will run through with 48k miles so I am sure that skews the auction averages a bit. Looking at individual results, low mileage examples show a gap of about $3-4k for similar models but as mileage grows they get pretty close. For example, 42k mile LC going at $50k vs 43k mile LX570 going at $49.2k

        • 0 avatar
          28-Cars-Later

          Mileage means nothing on the block when they are newer, condition is of far greater importance.

          I have seen in the past where Lexus always keeps its cushion over the equivalent Toyota model, even if those models are nearly identical as opposed to shared platform. I have too wondered as too why, the answers I come up with are branding, financing, and possibly demand. A bank in its forumulas might write a larger or longer note for a Lexus vs Toyota product. A buyer in that price range might more often be willing to spend more for the Lex branding vs Toyota as opposed to a buyer in a lower price bracket. Maybe a combination? Not one hundred percent sure.

    • 0 avatar

      Yeah I find that odd t0o in the listing prices of the used ones here in New England the Toyota and Lexus seem to be listed at the same price most of the time. At least once they are 2-3 years old.

  • avatar

    “Why do they bother delivering this paper to Ohio?”

    Have you seen the Cincinnati skyline lately? The whole stretch from Dayton to the Kentucky border looks pretty prosperous, at least from the perspective of driving through on I-75.

    BTW, my cousin is a plumber and he’s subscribed to the WSJ for years.

    • 0 avatar
      dal20402

      Go north to Cleveland and you’ll find the single city in the country with the very lowest housing prices (yes, lower than Detroit). With the exception of a narrow swath of downtown and a few isolated ritzy areas, the market isn’t expecting a renaissance there any time soon.

      For the down payment on my little Seattle-suburb condo, I could have bought a block of Cleveland outright and become a slumlord.

    • 0 avatar
      CoreyDL

      As long as you close your eyes for the Middletown poorness bit, you’ll be alright.

  • avatar
    spreadsheet monkey

    Thought I had a pretty good knowledge of obscure words, but had to Google “yclept”.

    Every day’s a school day!

Read all comments

Back to TopLeave a Reply

You must be logged in to post a comment.

Recent Comments

  • slavuta: God recalls only the best. All other trash he leaves on earth
  • slavuta: “Russian disinformation bureau” I want examples
  • golden2husky: “God will protect us”…yep, we are foolish for putting all those safety devices in our...
  • Lie2me: What exactly did RHD say that was wrong?… we’ll wait
  • Old_WRX: @RHD, “You’re spouting the official Fox News party line,” And, you’re spouting the...

New Car Research

Get a Free Dealer Quote

Who We Are

  • Matthew Guy
  • Timothy Cain
  • Adam Tonge
  • Bozi Tatarevic
  • Chris Tonn
  • Corey Lewis
  • Mark Baruth
  • Ronnie Schreiber