By on August 28, 2009

Chrysler has removed Hyundai and Mitusbishi logos from the joint Global Engine Manufacturing Alliance plant in Dundee, Michigan, reports the Freep. Plant employees anonymously confirm ChryCo’s executive desire to be rid of the alliance, and GEMA reps tell Automotive News [sub] that “there are discussions about that going on at the highest levels.” The Dundee plant manufactures 1.8-, 2.0- and 2.4-liter Hyundai-designed engines for Chrysler’s small cars, and internationally the alliance builds engines for over twenty models. The obvious motivation is the same as all of Chrysler’s recent announcements, namely moving into a tighter orbit around planet Fiat. Chrysler is proving to be more useful to Fiat as a tool to screw with Fiat’s international competitors than as a way of making inroads on the American market. Meanwhile, Fiat’s actual plan for Chrysler in the US seems to be limited to creating a client for Fiat’s engines and platforms. So much so that Fiat CEO Sergio Marchionne is reportedly considering replacing Cummins diesel engines with Fiat oil burners in upcoming Ram 1500 models.

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29 Comments on “Chrysler Ditching Global Engine Manufacturing Alliance...”


  • avatar
    lw

    So Fiat paid nothing and even if all they do is screw their competitors, they win?

    As a capitalist, I’m proud.

  • avatar
    superbadd75

    Half the reason people buy the Ram HD pickups is for the Cummins diesel. Removing that from the model line is asking for trouble. Big time.

  • avatar
    lw

    superbadd75:

    And if the goal is to screw Cummins, mission accomplished if they sell half as many trucks per year.

    Heck it’s a win-win at 50% of the current volume since Fiat sells more of their engines.

    I can’t imagine any other major automaker signing a deal with Cummins, but then again my diesel engine supply chain knowledge is limited.

  • avatar
    John Horner

    Of course Fiat would prefer to use its own production output instead of buying these high value items outside. Nothing surprising about that.

  • avatar
    akear

    Soon American engineering and innovation will contribute little or nothing in the global automotive landscape.

  • avatar
    Sutures

    superbadd75 & lw, not trying to call you out, but reread the last statement of the article…

    The vehicle in discussion is the RAM 1500, which does not have a diesel option (was supposed to, but was delayed). Also, if memory servers, the 1500 was going to get a newer/different Cummings diesel engine for emissions compliance. Granted, the delay was Chrysler’s decision, but was (or even, is) the Cummings motor ready for release?

  • avatar
    Stingray

    I said it before, and I say it again now.

    See what IVECO do with the companies they purchase…

    See Chrysler in that same mirror.

  • avatar
    Stingray

    So much so that Fiat CEO Sergio Marchionne is reportedly considering replacing Cummins diesel engines with Fiat oil burners in upcoming Ram 1500 models

    Edward, I worked for IVECO, Fiat Group’s truck division.

    The Tector I-6 5.9 lts engine is based, has shared engineering or something similar with the Cummins ISB engine. This one is used on medium duty trucks (or class 6-7 up there)

    For the Daily range, they use a 3.0 4 banger with all the toys which makes about 170-180 HP if my memory doesn’t fail. This is an engine more appropriate for a RAM1500.

    But don’t know.

  • avatar
    superbadd75

    The vehicle in discussion is the RAM 1500, which does not have a diesel option (was supposed to, but was delayed). Also, if memory servers, the 1500 was going to get a newer/different Cummings diesel engine for emissions compliance. Granted, the delay was Chrysler’s decision, but was (or even, is) the Cummings motor ready for release?

    First of all, it’s a Cummins, there is no “g” in it.

    Secondly, it stands to reason that if Fiat is going to cancel one Cummins diesel program to install their own powerplant, that eventually the other Cummins would be axed as well. Fiat has demonstrated, to this point, their plans to further decimate Chrysler for their own purpose, and attempt replace Chrysler’s market share with their own products.

    I wonder if Ford would be interested in Cummins if Dodge is off the table.

  • avatar
    lw

    Sutures: Good catch.. I skimmed that part and should have paid closer attention.

    Superbadd75: Regarding the Ford comment.. Navistar Powerstroke vs. Cummins… Not sure what the pros/cons would be.

    Powerstroke is the brand name that everyone knows.. I wonder if the Cummins brand name is stronger than Powerstroke…

  • avatar
    kowsnofskia

    Powerstroke is the brand name that everyone knows.. I wonder if the Cummins brand name is stronger than Powerstroke…

    Are you kidding? Most Dodge HD trucks are sold on the Cummins name alone, and have been ever since Cummins engines were debuted in those trucks. It’s absolutely stronger than the Powerstroke brand name, and Fiatsler would be beyond stupid to ditch it.

  • avatar
    texlovera

    @lw:

    I (NOT being a truck expert) can tell you, that I’ve known the name “Cummins” for many years, but have NEVER heard of Powerstroke.

  • avatar
    James2

    I believe Ford has had it up to here with the Navistar engine (aka Power Stroke) and is building its own diesel for the F-Series. There was supposed to be a small, 4.4-litre V8 for the F-150, but that’s been either cancelled/delayed (pick one), while a 6.7 (?) litre V8 is in the works for the Super Duty line.

  • avatar
    lw

    Go figure.. I must be the odd one..

    Powerstroke is well known in my world… Cummins too…

    Maybe Ford does a deal with Cummins and has a Win-Win…

  • avatar
    John Horner

    “Maybe Ford does a deal with Cummins and has a Win-Win…”

    I doubt it. Ford has been pretty clear about its intention to bring diesel engine production in house.

  • avatar

    kowsnofskia :Are you kidding? Most Dodge HD trucks are sold on the Cummins name alone, and have been ever since Cummins engines were debuted in those trucks. It’s absolutely stronger than the Powerstroke brand name, and Fiatsler would be beyond stupid to ditch it.

    Exactly. Plus, Ford would be out of their minds if they didn’t grab Cummins while they can.

    We don’t have “I’d rather be C–ming than Stroking” stickers in Texas for no reason.

  • avatar
    Juniper

    Cummins and Fiat (via CNH) have been building diesels together at Consolidated Diesel since 1980. This recently broke up and is now a Cummins division. But they have a long working relationship.
    I have to believe it will continue in some form

  • avatar
    OldWingGuy

    Ford used Navistar for light-duty diesels since about 1987. I own a 1990 F250 diesel (7.3L, IDI, no turbo).
    Ford started using the “Powerstroke” brand in around 1994, when they added a turbo to the engine.
    I’m not sure who owns the Powerstroke name, but I would guess Ford.
    Ford parted company with Navistar early this year. There was a big lawsuit over some engine problems. Ford blamed Navistar and sued. In the end, Ford paid to walk from their contract.
    Ford is currently developing their own diesel for use in the 2011 SuperDuty trucks.
    I was surprised Ford did not go with the Cat engine. Cat makes a nice 7L diesel. Only problem is the Cat engine is a I6 instead of a V8.
    The engine branding sells a lot of these trucks. Dodge owners love the “Cummins” brand.
    GM owners love the “Duramax/Allison” brands.
    Ford owners loved the “Powerstroke” brand.
    Me, I don’t care. I’m just happy when the old girl actually starts…

  • avatar
    Patrickj

    Is Chrysler so delusional as to plan a sufficient increase in business that there will be no engines left for Mitsubishi or Hyundai?

  • avatar
    Canucknucklehead

    The Liberty diesel uses (or used?) a Fiat diesel so it is not a great stretch to use their engines in Dodge trucks. Owners love the Cummins but the engine is so expensive that Chrysler never made any money on them.

  • avatar
    famar

    Bringing Fiat into the American market would be a mistake. Those who are old enough should remember the “Bravada” case or “Lancia” case during the late 70’s and early 80’s. “European car feeling” is a myth. The problem with the Chrysler is reliability and quality (see Cinsumer Reports). Technology wise Fiat will not bring anything new into American market. With correct marketing strategy and increased reliability and quality without increasing the cost is the solution. Hyundai did that and they did that while they were in the GEMA together with the Chrysler. Howcome Hyndai increased its product quality and reliability but Chrysler products went worse? Cutting short european due to their saturated market rely on selling more new products. henceforth their products are not long lasting. Even german products barely can match with Japanese products. Taking Fiat, or any european car maker for this purpose, would be a mistake.

  • avatar
    Autojunkie

    It only makes sense since Hyundai and Mitsubishi haven’t held up their end of the bargain. GEMA has two twin plants right next to each other. The second plant was moth balled becasue Hyundai and Mistubishi have not ordered engines that were part of the production agreement with Chrysler. Now the plant just sits there with all it’s machines wrapped in plastic and unused.

  • avatar
    Autojunkie

    As for the Cummins deal… Fiat is apossibly planning to use its Diesel in the 1/2 ton truck only. The 3/4 ton and higher trucks will continue to use the Cummins. Daimler had intentions to replace the Cummins with a M-B Diesel V8 when they took over Chrysler, but Cummins came to the table with a completely reworked, and competetive, engine.

    On the plus side, it was a win-win for Chrysler and Cummins because customers have preferred the Cummins Diesel. In fact, not to long ago, Dodge outsold the F-series in medium duty sales primarily becasue of the Cummins Diesel.

  • avatar
    BuzzDog

    It seems as though Chrysler is going to have quite a bit of engine manufacturing capacity very soon. In additon to the GEMA plant mentioned in this article, isn’t the Phoenix engine plant about to come on line?

    Haven’t heard much lately about the Phoenix V6’s future, but there have been rumors that it is efficient, quiet and refined. However, much of that information came from allpar.com, which isn’t exactly an unbiased source!

  • avatar
    Accords

    This deal with Mitsu and Hyundai.. smells of rotten fish.. and this was 4-5ys ago.

    Can someone assist me in truthfully telling me that Chrysler actually put forth some engineering time for this motor…

    Or did they actually just dump a shit load of cash on Hyundais lap.. and say .. oh its ours also…

  • avatar
    AICfan

    Given pickup truck owners are a loyal bunch, and the Dodge ones seem to be the most loyal, Fiat shouldn’t try messing with around under the hood unless they’re _sure_ they know what they’re doing.

    About 1/2 the Dodge pickups here are Cummins powered, and at least 1/2 of those have at least one, generally multiple stickers on the back to remind the world of it.

    Fiat doesn’t have that brand loyalty here, and a Fiat diesel? About all it’ll do is prop up the resale value of the Cummins models, no matter how good it is.

    Given the recent stuff from Fiat w.r.t. the 500 in the US, it’s pretty obvious they have no clue what the US market is like. The 500’s a total unknown here, and the Fiat nameplate has negative equity. And yet, they think they can sell it, in large numbers…

  • avatar
    Autojunkie

    Buzzdog –

    Actually, believe it or not, Chrysler had to change a ton of stuff when they got that engine. There was quite a bit of engineering done on Chrysler’s side. I saw it myself.

  • avatar
    v7rmp7li

    GEMA is a next NUMMI.

  • avatar
    BuzzDog

    Autojunkie –

    It wasn’t me who doubted DaimlerChrysler’s (as it was known at the time) contribution to the World Engine project…I think you confused my post with the one made by the following poster!

    And since it sounds as though you may have an inside track on such things, do you happen to have any current news or thoughts regarding the new Chrysler V6?

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