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While TTAC is known for Panther Love above all else, there are some of us here who possess an iconoclastic streak and long for a General Motors B-Body. The LT1 powered Buick Roadmaster is arguably the finest of the bunch, and an essay in today’s edition of The Globe and Mail illustrates why.
Reader Mark Harding, who admittedly uses his bicycle more than his car, professes his love for his 1993 Buick Roadmaster in this essay. While Harding primarily enjoys the Roadmaster on long highway trips, he also seems to take a certain delight in the Roadmaster’s imposing presence, small block V8 engine and overall character, which is at odds with the general ethos of Toronto’s left-leaning downtown neighborhoods, where Harding apparently resides.
It’s nice to know that in a city where car ownership is not always easy thanks to limited parking and high gas prices, one man is keeping the B-Body flame alive.
I know people like these but they are appallingly ugly inside and out in my view. I’ve found a bunch of them on Craigslist but each time I walk on by, despite the LT1 power. I’d take a contemporary H-Body with the 3800 Buick V6 over this any day.
Not going to lie – my first car was supposed to have been a ’96 Collector’s Edition Roadmaster, but a retired couple headed back to Michigan apparently beat me to it. So, I ended up with an Olds Aurora, which was phenomenal in its own right.
I do keep the spirit alive with my ’76 LeSabre. I plan on slowly restoring it to factory-fresh condition one day for no discernible reason aside from my personal pleasure. I know it would be worth the same ‘in the wrapper’ as its worth now – nothing. Its a brown base 4-door hardtop with the biggest possible motor, A/C, and no other options. Not even tilt wheel. But I love it and everything it represents – ‘Murican motordom at its not-giving-a-shit finest.
Long live the B-Bodies which ALWAYS had more distinction, presence, and style than the Panther. Sorry. ;)
‘ “You know, that generation of Roadmasters has a Corvette engine in them,” a neighbour mentioned a few years ago. Oh, I know. ‘
Not until 1994… Through ’93 it had the L05 V8, making a staggering 180 hp. It was a great ‘truck engine’ and I once towed an NA Miata 1600 miles with my ’92 estate, but it was certainly not speedy. The upgrade to the LT1 shaved almost 2.5 seconds off the 0-60 time.
We do need to remember a part of the Panther’s “victory” over the B-body was GM throwing in the towel in 1996, which gave us another decade plus of Panthers. I argue that in 1996 B-body > Panther but GM gave up and Ford kept making refinements. Imagine if Ford had given the Panther the “Marauder” and LX Sport treatment as standard starting in say 2000 until the end of production.
Having said that my most desired GM RWD sled is a well cared for mid 90s Fleetwood Brougham (Technically that would be a C/D-body). Most of the ones I see showing up for sale lately are beat to heck.
I’m a die hard, hardcore Panther guy, but I’d take one of these in a second, no problem–especially the wagon version!
My neighbor inherited the wagon version of this… It doesn’t fit in his garage, It looks silly with a foot and a half sitting outside. But he loves it, especially when he goes for 4X8 plywood sheets in the rain.
Why do so many Americans haul around 4×8 sheets of plywood? I’ve always wondered.
Because we have basements that need paneling… Man Cave
Hmmmmm. That must be a lot of unfinished basements. we don’t have many basements in California as far as I know. Maybe thats why i don’t see 4×8 sheets being lugged home from Home Depot.
California needs more basements! No wonder the state is in the state it’s in: not enough man caves!
What Pebble said.
I am an aficionado of traditional American cars, not of any particular subset.
This writer in the G&M pretty much nails it. He should hang onto that old crocodile for as long as possible, which I don’t see being a problem, as it is basically a truck with a sedan body.
The qualities of wafting and stability from a large footprint, second-nature to people raised in rural areas, is just being discovered and appreciated by Mr. Harding. It was designed for a time when you had to traverse a large continent with diverse and challenging road conditions. As such, it is at ease on grid or paved road alike. He’d be hard-pressed to find a better highway car at the kind of money he probably paid for it.
The last un-apologetic Buick. Never had the opportunity to ride in one but always wished to. Buick tried again with the Lucerne but could never regain that “magic”. One reason was probably that the Lucerne was FWD.
Forget FWD the problem with the Lucerne was that the base engine was such a dog and the Northstar that was optional had many people too worried about reliability to pull the trigger. Now if it had been given the 5.3V8 put in the old W-platform then we would have something.
“Now if it had been given the 5.3V8 put in the old W-platform then we would have something.”
Yea, grenading transmissions, blown seals, and oil consumption.
__________________
I was never in love with my V6 Lucerne, but I’ll take slow and running over fast and broken.
The 3900 powered ones might be more to your liking?
@ajla, The 3900 powered ones might be more to your liking?
It would but riddle me this, Batman?
Why was the 3900V6 installed in Lucernes rated for 227 hp/237 lb ft of torque, while the 3900V6 installed in a similar vintage Impala LTZ made 230 hp/235 lb ft of torque?
I mean, why bother to differentiate? And was it simply a computer chip or a different intake?
FYI Wikipedia lists the 3.9 at 240/240…
@PrincipalDan- GM was not “bothering” to differentiate by such a small amount, it was just a side effect of other design details and precise, SAE certified HP ratings of today.
Different outputs in the case you mention are with the same engine, but different packaging for induction and exhaust systems dependent on vehicle architecture.
We had a special air duct sourced from France used on HO Quad4s The “French duct” cost something like 10 HP, but was necessary to meet noise level targets. Small details can make a surprising difference.
Blasphemy. MY06-MY08 Lucerne has 3800 power.
For the price they were charging for a new Lucerne, GM should have stuck a blower on it.
A Lucerne CXL with a supercharged Series III would be a decent car.
There was a Lucerne Super…
But the Super had the Northstar.
If I had total control over the Lucerne powertrain options, I’d have put the 3900 in the CX, the 3800 S/C in the CXL and CXS, then the 300 hp tune of the Northstar in the Super.
Bah nevermind! Sorry.
I agree, funny why they even bothered to create a Series III 3800 S/C if they were only going to use it in ONE trim in one model.
Was the III SC only in the Park Ave Ultra? Wasn’t it in the last part of the Riviera as well, or was that only a II SC?
The Series III S/C was only used in the ’04+ Grand Prix GTP.
Soo the Ultra in 04/05 had the old series II? Don’t make no sense!
@CoreyDL
Don’t try to make sense of it, will drive you mad.
It all makes perfect sense if you understand the inside story! Sometimes, engine choices were dictated by production capacity, other times by engineering resources available. My point is not that I know the details for these particular(formerly) Flint engineered engines, but that business factors drive decisions.
I can’t speak to the series III Grand Prix as to why it was the only user of the highest output engine. I leased an ’04 GP GTP with the higher performance handling package (can’t remember the RPO now). It was a very quick car for FWD.
@Dr. Olds.
“Sometimes, engine choices were dictated by production capacity, other times by engineering resources available.”
For example the use of the Olds 307V8 in soooooooooo many different cars over sooooooooooo many years when the Chevy 305 would have made the cars quicker with its extra hp.
@PrincipalDan- I don’t recall the Chevy engine as being particularly higher output, though it couldn’t match the Olds in fuel economy or emissions performance. I spec’d a 305V8 company car and was disappointed in its performance. The higher numerical axle ratio made it feel slightly better, but it was thirsty.
I do have a specific memory of the uproar over the LM1 Chevrolet V8 used when we ran out of capacity to build Olds V8s for Oldsmobile cars in the 1977 model year. Even though we ran the engine plant 24/7, it was able to put out only 1.25Million V8s. The Olds was the only GM 350V8 certified for California emissions at the time, so the joke was, If you want an Olds V8, buy a Chevy, Buick, Pontiac in California.
The LM1 had 5 HP more, 5 ft-lb less and weighed 5 lbs different. I can’t remember which was the lighter, but they were very close to one another with regard to capability and specifications. The Chevy was almost as good as the Olds in dependability and warranty, as well.
When I joined BOC-Lansing Powertrain in 1988, I was told of a competitive review that had taken place between the Olds V8 and the Chevy V8. The Olds port fuel version used in the Cadillac Seville won the competition- better in every way, including power. The business decision to discontinue development on the Olds in ’85 or so, with eventual phase out altogether, was based on the fact there were 3 Chevy V8 plants at the time and only one Olds V8 plant. Three plants could handle all the demand by that time.
Better to de-proliferate designs and close the single Olds plant than to keep Olds and close one of the Chevy plants. The Cadillac people sure didn’t like it at first. They rationalized that their owners would accept an Oldsmobile engine much better than a Chevrolet.
That you couldn’t just look at the stone-axe carbs and Flintstones OHV design and resign it to the rubbish bin tell all we need to know about your engineering ‘prowess’.
Really, the Lucerne would have been quite nice if it had lived to see even the MY2012 demise of the 3.9L V6 in favor of the ubiquitous 3.6L V6.
Long live the BOF, RWD V-8 gas sucking American sedan/lavishly wood-grained Brady Bunch station wagon. This sets the standard (says this Town Car owner).
Right on!
One of the first cars I drove was a ’77 Delta 88. That car was a blast. My best friend and I could fit three girls in the front seat with us and two bikes in the back seat. (Thankfully dad never heard that story.)
There is a gentleman in Houston that buys and sells only 1993-1996 Cadillac Fleetwood Broughams.
http://jimsmintcars.com/
NOTE: I have no affiliation with this website. I just occasionally admire the extremely clean cars he seems to find.
Thanks for this link. I am really torn between 93-96 Fleetwood in mint condition or 2012 Impala.
I think the 93-96 Fleetwood is absolutely gorgeous.
I’ve had a couple LT1 powered B-bodies including the baby-LT1, the 4.3L V8. They were great cars, powerful, lots of space, ran forever with regular maintenance and parts are now dirt cheap. Everything the Panther was, but with a better engine. Well, the ’03+ Panthers have better suspension, steering and brakes, but as a daily, I prefer the B-bodies.
Original 96 RMW owner here. It’s still chugging along with 150K on the clock. Can somebody tell me why full-sized, 3 row wagons haven’t made a comeback? Screw this “shooting brake” and “touring” weenie wagon stuff, I need a 4 by 8 plywood sheet in the back of my wagon.
The Roadmaster seems to appeal to the belt + suspenders crowd; comfort and security vs. style and taste. Truly a dinosaur, but to each their own.
“comfort and security vs. style and taste”
Close; change one letter and lose a period.
Comfort and security is style and taste.
There is a little known 4th B-body, called the Oldsmobile Custom Cruiser.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oldsmobile_Custom_Cruiser#Third_generation_.281991.E2.80.931992.29
Lack of a “Corvette motor” is unfortunate, but I would still take one in a heartbeat.
It’s little-known because of the short production run. There was only around 12,000 sold, which is tiny for a mass-production car.
Mmmmmmmmmmmm Custom Cruiser, make mine 350 (not 305) powered please. I don’t care if it is a truck engine, it is a darn durable one.
I saw one last week in the parking lot of a movie theatre. It was baby blue with wood, as it seems 90% of that one were. Beat to hell and rusty.
I remember that. My computer literacy teacher in high school had one. He was a grumpy dude. Probably not because of his Oldsmobile, but because of his 8 kids.
I still remember my excitement at seeing LT1 in the upcoming Oldsmobile product plan, and then the disappointment that it was only in a wagon. If Wikipedia is right, the LT1 never made it to production for the Olds wagon, but I don’t think that was the case.
Does anyone here know if LT1 was produced in the last Olds B wagon?
I suppose B-bodies still have what it takes to be a DD, but I see them as Sunday cars at this point.
My mom’s 1992 Roadmaster sedan is her DD for the 3 seasons that it’s not snowing here.
Cheers to a long and happy ownership experience for your mother and Her Roadmaster.
I still get a chuckle remembering the lead photo when Car and Driver road-tested this LT-1 powered beast.
It has someone in Little Old Lady garb brake-torquing a Roadmaster sedan, smoke boiling off the rear tires. So incongruous, impertinent and perfect, all at the same time.
I’m the original owner of a 1996 Impala SS that I keep as a garage queen. I only take it out once every two years to burn the tank dry, show it, then put it away a few days later.
Although as fast as a squirt gun it drives like a farm implement compared to my 2008 DTS. I think it’s mostly because of the solid rear axle.
I was also the original owner of a 1988 9C1 that was just sublime. In the words of Todd Beamer: “Let’s role!”
As for the Roadmasters, I like them but only with the vinyl roof delete. Few were built that way because vinyl roof was standard (at least here north of 49).
Long live the Killer Bs!
The non-Limited Roadmaster (is Custom?) didn’t have vinyl IIRC.
“…embarrassing, not to mention its oversized engine, its huge, unflattering trunk and its general air of bloated defiance. If this car were a human, it might choose to be a municipal politician. ”
Great reference to Toronto’s very own right-wing, alegded crack-smoking, man-of-the-905-people, Rob Ford.
Yes, I Lol’ed.
However, the Buick would need to be perpetually perspiring and red-faced to truly be like Ford.
I was tempted to get a Roadmaster a few years ago to replace my rear-ended 3800 powered Regal, which was a great car. The problem is the people who own them know what they are and want an arm and a leg for them, especially the wagons, all because they were the last of the B-bodies with the LT1. I ended up getting a Grand Marquis. THanks to less weight the ford mod motor provides it with equal acceleration times, you just gotta brake torque it a little.
How’s it arguably the best of the bunch, when the bunch includes the Impala SS, and the Fleetwood, which is both more likely to have the LT-1, and is superior in size and overall equipment level? Plus the Fleetwood is long-sleek, and the Roadmaster is dumpy and pretty bland looking.
My respects for the B-Body only go out to the old box models, and just 3 out of the 9 or so variants GM milked out of the platform. Decent guzzlers I’m sure but its a bit sad to think that the automotive world is heading the same direction of building 6 or so variants of whats essentially the same car underneath.
Save for a few years of the Caprice I’ve always thought that the 90’s B-bodies were a bit plain to look at and like the Panther clones you’d get a de-tuned CamaroMustang engine, since the sort of guy who buys a Mustang might by a wood trimmed Country Squire instead, I guess.
So which Box B-Bodies tickle your fancy, then?
The first few Impalas and the early Oldsmobile 88 sedans, , thats about it.
I used to often drive my former employer’s B-body. It was a 1978 Pontiac Parisienne 2-door coupe. Black with red velvet upholstery and a 400 4-bbl. This was the days of “Radial Tuned Suspension” and it was really quite good for a land-yaught. It also had the trailering package and surprisingly good brakes, which I needed! My fav B-body would be the 1978 Caprice with wrap-around back window, a very elegant car.
I saw one of those (Caprice Landau) on Saturday. It’s quite a cool look in person.
http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=337362519
I don’t need it. It won’t fit in my driveway, but damn.
Red with flames and skulls? And wood-grain paneling?
Someone needs to buy this thing.
(Clarification: It’s not mine, and I don’t know the guy – but it’s the only Roadmaster within 25 miles of Portland on Autotrader, and it’s a hell of a thing.)
I used to see a Caprice wagon in my neck of the woods done a similar way, maybe just a little more tasteful with the flames.
Look at those big, fat, beautiful meats.
Real tires on a real car.
(ren hoek voice)
Let me go! I just want to eeeeaahhTOUCH THEM!
Had to rent one of these in 1999 or 2000 to haul photo gear when the studio wagon (88 300TE Benz) broke down on location. What a worthless POS. With the spare in the trunk, it held less gear than a Festiva, and the GM auto locking doors closed themselves when it was idling outside (we were working outdoors in bitter cold upstate NY winter). Nothing like walking 10 feet away and hearing the locks go THUNK.
Sorry guys, don’t understand the love for this one, but maybe I was just having a bad day.
I like the Caprice a bit more, but I’m quibbling. These cars, particularly the bubbles of the ’90s, are a wonderful throwback to the ’60s, with all th character–so lacking in most contemporary cars–that this implies. These will be among the few cars of the last 20 years that people will look for at shows like Carlisle and Hershey.
Little Known Trivia:
These cars are direct descendants from GM 73-77 Colonnade A-Bodies. And those were a mash up of the best of each GM division –
Chevy rear ends, Pontiac Front suspension (70 Firebird) , Buick Brakes and strangely I think Oldsmobile body mount hardware. Hard for me to remember.
Toronto’s a Roadmaster of a bloated condo market. More condo construction than any other city in the world. That’s why he’s city cycling cause the traffic is friggin awful with all the construction. 19,000 condo units sit unsold in existing inventory with another 53,000 in the pipeline. America are you laughing?
Laughing?… I guess you’ve never been to Florida
An uncle , a lifetime RWD GM V-8 fan , bought a LT1 equipped Roadmaster sedan for his last car . He was in his late eighties when he bought it and kept driving until he quit driving , IIRC at 91 years old . Often commented that it was his favorite car ever . A boss had , IIRC , a 1993 Roadmaster wagon that I often had to drive at work . One reason she gave for buying it was that a 4′ x 8′ piece of plywood would fit . A number of times I drove it on some out of town errand . She was a total leadfoot and expected me to be as well . One time I was supposed to drive the wagon to meet some guy in a town in east Texas , about 100 miles away , and had to meet him by a certain time . I realized that to meet the guy on time I would have to drive over 100 m.p.h. As I recall I didn’t quite make it by the specified time , due in part to heavy rain and also had to stop for gas . But when I calculated how fast I had driven , I had averaged well over 90 m.p.h. , which the Buick as always handled without a whimper .
The wagon had a nicer looking front end than the sedan. The Olds wagon wasn’t bad looking either.
I would say the opposite. I like the looks of the RM over the Caprice because it’s got more angles and not just bulbous rounded curves everywhere.
The RM sedan had unique front end sheetmetal and grille. The RM wagon had a Caprice front end with a Buick-styled grille. I don’t know why they didn’t use the RM sedan front clip on the RM wagons; I’ve heard that it’s a direct bolt-on swap.
It may bolt on, but the contours in the sheet metal of the front doors wouldn’t line up with the contours of the fenders.
The wagons were lower volume and most of them were Chevrolets. It made sense to put the Buick or Olds face on what was really Chevrolet sheet metal. I expect the interiors were somewhat different, but had identical layouts.
@doctor olds: The Roadmasters shared their front doors and windshield with the Caprice. The contours of the fenders and doors will line-up just fine. Owners have successfully done this swap themselves. For example:
http://s418.photobucket.com/user/chrisandcarapowell/media/Project%20WWW/IMG_0280.jpg.html
http://s187.photobucket.com/user/buickestate/media/93%20roadmaster%20project/DSC01122.jpg.html
@BigOldChryslers- I didn’t mean the cut line of the front edge of the door to the fender, but the side molding / feature line provisions. Thanks for the photos that show two solutions. The wood grain and skirts are good looking!
The funny thing is, the Roadmaster sedan rear end is more or less an upsized version of the 92-98 Skylark rear end, just with some slight angle changes and different tailight shapes.
It’s uncanny.
Ugh, I HATE that Skylark design. It’s just so dated, and nonsensical. Doesn’t flow, makes a mid-size car look very stumpy, and most of them were painted a hideous blue-green color.
I’ve seen a few still driving around lately, even a couple of two door models!
Also, a couple streets away someone has an Achieva SC Gold Edition, which must be one of the more rare 90s Olds vehicles. Don’t think I’ve ever seen another Achieva coupe.
Like the Grand Am of the same vintage, the Skylark design works better as a coupe. My 1995 is a coupe and it looks far better than the handful of sedans I’ve seen driving around. Mine is black and silver, but I have seen two in that ugly blue-green.
Achieva Coupe used to be quite common in these parts years back, the sedan was the rarer of the two. I figure the coupes were sold retail to single or younger folks looking for their first car, and usually didn’t appear very hooptified. When I saw the sedans they always looked in much worse condition, very “fleet” looking.
I might add the Achieva I see has BOTH styles of Olds logo on it – which must up the rarity a little. The front has the plane logo, and on the sides by the special edition wording there’s the modern circular logo.
@Corey,DL – its a “rocket” not a plane. “Oldsmobile Rocket V8”. My old Cutlass had a Rocket hood ornament – lined up with a Rocket on the dash – lined up with the rocket around the lock on the trunk. I always thought that was pretty cool.
“I might add the Achieva I see has BOTH styles of Olds logo on it”
Classic GM.
@PrincipalDan
“its a “rocket” not a plane. “Oldsmobile Rocket V8″.”
How much you want to bet the buyer and the folks who assembled it didn’t know that was a rocket and what it meant?
Sorry sorry, I didn’t think before stating plane!
RE: The SC, according to Wiki was a 92-97 model. I’m guessing 97 with that logo and the special edition to mark the end of production or something. I can’t even find a photo of one online.
Overall I didn’t like that iteration of Skylark, except for one thing.
I adored the grill treatment on the ’92-’95 version, for the way it was sloped to a point in the middle. I’m sure it was intended as a throwback/homage to the late ’60s/early ’70s Skylark, but I immediately connected it with the grill on my ’65 Wildcat.
The title of this article instantly took me back to Red’s Arco in 1972, the Customer Shuttle Car (snicker) was a ’56 Roadmaster Coupe , battered but unbowed , I loved it , everyone else hated it .
-Nate
“While TTAC is known for Panther Love above all else”
Speak for yourself kid. B-body love is strong here. And so is Zeta love.
Interesting article, but full of hypocrisy. He feels guilty for driving a big car from time to time but I am pretty much sure he has a 50+ inches TV, changes his iGadget every 2 years and I could go on and on and on and he doesn’t feel the least amount of guilt for that. WTF? I don’t mind him using his bike for commuting, as parking that car in the city would be a PITA and fuel use would be atrocious. He lost me with his patronizing eco-bullshit.
If he really feels like he’s melting the planet, why he hasn’t slapped a CNG kit to reduce his CO2 emissions by at least a third. He would still have PLENTY of boot free for road trips.
Other than the fuel cost, there’s nothing wrong about using a car like that. Even in this increasingly oppressing PC era.
Nowadays even C-segment cars are behemoths.
I want to buy a 4 cylinda car, maybe a tiny one, but not because I think I’m melting the polar caps. It’s because the bloody petrol is starting to chew me alive and I need to reduce costs. I still need the space as the family is expanding and I’m not a fan of SUV/CUVs, so the car is not going anywhere ATM.
Lol. I’m sorry to tell you this son, but that’s one ugly baby you’ve got there.
I’ll be honest, I never paid much attention to these things and always assumed that was a Cadillac profile going down the road.
Probably shouldn’t be but I’m surprised they chose to plonk it onto both Buick and Caddy.
(shakes head and wanders off)
My 80-year-old mother-in-law’s DD is still a white ’92 Roadmaster sedan. Base model, no vinyl, blue cloth interior. She bought it secondhand in 1998. Damn thing doesn’t rust and just keeps running so there hasn’t been any reason to replace it. I sure wish she’d get the steering fixed though. Last time I had to move it to my driveway when she went on a bus trip I damn near drove the thing into a Jersey barrier leaving the park and ride lot. I’m not used to cars anymore that don’t respond when I turn the wheel.
It replaced an ’87 Caprice. Unfortunately we live in a place where the pre-’91 sedans get hooptied up and trade for big money. But nobody seems to really want the bubble cars, so that’s probably actually a good thing for her. She gets less attention this way.
As far as I’m concerned, for its basic function of hauling people and objects the RM is inferior in all ways to modern front drive full size cars, unless you really need to know there are eight cylinders under the hood. But whatever. She’s used to it.
@28: Funny you say that…the final year of the Skylark and Achieva (1998) was fleet-only, so the very rental-car looking Skylarks and Achievas may have actually BEEN rental cars.
@CoreyDL: That Achieva must be a 1997 or 1998 model, since the Malibu-based Cutlass was one of the first Oldsmobiles to use the circular logo.