The nominal range of the vehicle (probably including what’s in the neck) is about 450 miles. On a number of occasions, when we stopped, fueling wasn’t convenient or seemed expensive and got skipped. 5 of our fillups were at 340-plus miles. All of those were slightly nerve-wracking. One fillup went to 13.3 gallons.

One shorter-range fillup was driven by poor fuel economy related to weather . We should have been able to get to our overnight but shoving aside all that rain killed our fuel economy.

It would probably help if our fuel gauge was more accurate. It’s too pessimistic. When it dropped below E, we actually have almost 3 gallons left but lack the confidence to use it.

Of the fillups at 340+, we could, convniently, have gone longer, but fuel was the principal consideration in stopping. A couple times we refueled when it wasn’t really necessary so we could stretch the next leg of the trip, if we wanted.

So, yeah, I consider sub-300 mile range to be too short. This won’t be huge but it will be a factor for people.

The Volt is not OUT, so we can’t say ANYTHING about it, good or bad. The Volt is being criticized because GM acts *as if* the Volt is already in production, when it’s far from it. The Volt is also criticized because Volt supporters act as if the vehicle is already in production, using and arguing with specific numbers that we don’t know will stay the same with the production model.

You can hype and talk positively about the Volt all you want, but it’s NOT OUT YET.

The Prius on the other hand is out. It’s been on-sale for years now. With the Prius, we have cold, hard targets with which to measure the Volt against when it comes out.

The Volt won’t be out until late 2010 at the earliest. The next-gen Prius is coming in 2009. Toyota has confirmed this 100%. We know this to be a fact.

Also since we have cold hard numbers from the current Prius, using logic and common sense the next-gen Prius would improve on the current Prius in most metrics.

So by the time the Volt comes out, it will NOT be compared to the current dated Prius, it will be compared to the next-gen Prius that will have already been out on the market for over a year by the time the Volt comes to market.

For at least 95% of us out here we need our car to be a REAL car capable of traveling long distance if needed.

Yeah! A REAL car! Like a truck! Or an SUV! Raaaah! I have a small penis! I let TV dictate what kind of car I buy! Hurururh1!!11one

but the reality is the 95% of us do NOT wish to deal with the extra hassle of a plug-in Hybrid.

Why, did you take a poll?

Plug-in hybrids don’t work for people who don’t have access to a plug at night. That will take out a good chunk of people, maybe 30% to 50% of Americans. That’s fine.

but the reality is the 95% of us do NOT wish to deal with the extra hassle of a plug-in Hybrid.

Do you know what RAV4 EV’s go for on eBay? This is a car that can’t take gasoline.

There are lots of cars being sold in the tens of thousands right now that don’t have a 400-mile range. Check out Bankrate.

GM will have no problem selling the first 10,000 at $40K or even $50K, if they can just ship a car that basically works and they aren’t beaten to the punch. I fully realize that those are both very big “if”s as long as we’re talking about GM.

Let’s hope the GM skunkworks keeps whittling away at the VOLT, until they have something that really optimizes weight/power/handling.

I would actually buy something that looked like the Saab 9x concept, and which ran on the VOLT principle. I’d be elbowing my way to the front of the line.
But an oversized, too heavy, “make it look like a regular car” version is not for me.

I worried the Volt would be some sort of bloated oversized parody of a Prius when I first saw it. Hopefully the real car and the concept car are only vaguely related or at least hopefully the GM product doesn’t sacrifice utility for the muscle car looks. That’s GM typical though – build a CUV and it’s huge and heavy. Build a “small” truck and it’s bigger than everybody else’s. Big tires, big wheels, etc. etc.

Never mind…

Its a non-issue, don’t even know why it’s being discussed.

There are 240 miles between service stations between Coldfoot and Deadhorse on the way to Prudhoe Bay AK. I have a hard time imagining there is a longer distance between gas stations anywhere in the US, so this is a non issue.

Yes it might not be what GM promised, but if brings Santa Lutz closer to having an operational vehicle under the tree for us let is slide!

If the blog is guessing correctly and the tank is only about 7 gallons, then that means that the highway range will probably be 200-250 miles.

Since most people don’t want to run on fumes, that means that drivers will be hunting for gas about every 150 miles or so. That will annoy the hell out of a lot of people.

In order to make buyers happy, there needs to be a balance between urban use and highway use. (Of course, this assumes that the car is ever launched as anything more than a low-production test, something that I seriously doubt.)

This kind of thinking is why GM is all but broke today!

I will bet that maybe 3% of the potential market for the Volt will be willing to accept such a compromise with their “car”. For at least 95% of us out here we need our car to be a REAL car capable of traveling long distance if needed. A Honda Fit or Toyota Corolla will take you across the USA with no compromise, you fill it up and go and fill it up again getting the same mileage.

Hint: the Prius works in the same manner.

More to the point someone will need to make a very convincing arguement as to why a $40,000 Volt will be worth $15,000 more than even the current generation Prius?

Why is GM trying to make it look like some kind of muscle car? It is an “electric hybrid” supposedly desgined to be extremely economical. Whats with the big wheels and other stuff that aint gonna make it into production anyway?
Why the long hood? The engine will not be mounted length wise.

A price of $40,000, are you kidding me! This makes about zero sense! Folks that can afford a $40,000 car (were not even talking $30,000 but $40,000!)have many options available to them.
For instance they could forgo a 335i and get a 328i and spend the difference on gas!

Not seeing a conspiracy here just seeing good sense, lets not be so quick to beat GM with a stick.

Think, SELF-CONTAINED!

Maybe there are a few of you enviornmental junkies that desire to plug in their car every night but the reality is the 95% of us do NOT wish to deal with the extra hassle of a plug-in Hybrid.

The biggest question is WHO is going to buy the Volt from GM in the first place?

Not for nothing but GM does NOT have a reputation for doing “high-tech” very well. GM is that company that wants to sell you a BOF throw-back as though it is a modern passanger car today.

Considering that by the time GM does (IF) has the Volt ready for market there WILL be other alternative available. It doesn’t even matter if the Volt is better, folks DO NOT trust GM today like they do HOnda or Toyota.

Sorry, Brent. The Volt is the very defintion of vaporware. It’s in commercials, they tout it at every auto show, but they keep pushing up the price and downplaying the battery range and charge times so much. Others here, including me, believe that GM will never make this because they’ll have either gone bankrupt or gas prices will go down and they’ll stop bothering.

Sorry, CarShark, but your comment refutes only the aside in mine (and not its main point), so I’m puzzled as to why you’re “sorry.”

vaporware: a computer-related product that has been widely advertised but has not and may never become available

Sorry, Brent. The Volt is the very defintion of vaporware. It’s in commercials, they tout it at every auto show, but they keep pushing up the price and downplaying the battery range and charge times so much. Others here, including me, believe that GM will never make this because they’ll have either gone bankrupt or gas prices will go down and they’ll stop bothering.

Tells you something, doesn’t it?
I think we’ll end up with a Volt that looks pretty much like this:

http://www.autounleashed.com/images/saab_9-x_concept_geneva.jpg

Which, a few years later, became this:

http://www.webwombat.com.au/motoring/car-photos/saab-9-x-biohybrid-concept-3.jpg

Note that the only difference is that it’s now a Bio-Hybrid Concept. In other words, not just any regular car.

But with Saab waning as a brand, expect the Volt to be slimmed and trimmed, until it looks like this:

http://www.webwombat.com.au/motoring/car-photos/saab-9-x-biohybrid-concept-1.jpg

Nevertheless, if people such as you insist on putting it down, then there’s really no compelling argument coming from someone such as you (or Johnson, or anyone else) that says someone like me can’t take the other position; an objective voice, however — of which there seem to be precious few here — could make the compelling argument that we both ought to pipe down.

I suppose someone will have some sort of sarcastic, pessimistic comeback to this that will make him/her feel good. I don’t care. My point remains.

All this assumes that the car launches on time, of course. If they are still sorting out stuff like this at the moment, I don’t think that they’ll be meeting their target release date.

In other words, we dismiss the Volt as vaporware until such time as we can actually go to the Chevy dealer and buy one? I’ll do that if Bob Lutz does that. Do we have a deal?

—

shaker said, “With this move, GM shaved 35 pounds of weight (gas + tank materials and supports). Engineers froth over that kind of thing.”

Engineers froth over removing weight so that they can add payload, increase performance, fuel economy or range. In this case, they reduced range in direct and dramatic proportion to the reduction and increased payload, performance or whatever by ngeligible amounts.

Why did GM do this? Why is this small amount of weight and space important enough to let the Prius have at least 50% greater range to empty and almost double the real effective range?

Some floated the idea of “Just $30 to fill the tank” as bragging rights. Anyone can see that making a tank smaller accomplishes that without doing anything useful. I could have $30 max filups if I filled my tank with pebbles and just put fuel in the spaces between.

By the way, if the Gen 3 Prius hits 50mpg highway (fairly likely), it’s 11.9 * 50 or as-near-as-dammit 600 miles. If they boost tank size to 12 gallons, they’re there. If they can claim 51mpg, they’re there with the tank they have. It’s probably a psychological milestone.

Those who are waiting for GM to perfect this new technology would be well advised to continue breathing (don’t hold your breath).

Their past performance suggests anyone foolish enough to be a GM “early adopter” will likely be part of the test program for a very long time, and there will be tears.

Aside from GM’s marketing department and engineers tripping over themselves, and fumbling over what the targets they intend to meet are, it’ll be inevitable the Volt will be compared to the Prius, the 3rd generation Prius at that.

What’s the volt’s projected driving range going to be for city, highway, and mixed?

I think it is an interesting idea, although the price point is completely wrong.

1st generation (right?) mass produced plug in for $40k…how could that possibly go wrong?

I’ll wait until they get the kinks worked out and offer a hatch for a price within 10-20% of a new yaris.

I trust, then, that bloggers and those who comment on blogs will also stop putting down the numbers for products that haven’t even been released yet. For all the grist that these announcements apparently generate for the sarcastic and pessimistic among us, by your own words we must not make presumptions about range, etc., until products are actually out on the market.

I know you were trying to shut me up with your words, but they kinda shut you up, too.