I’ve been screaming to the high heavens about Aussie hardware for about a decade, I’ve had occasion to drive some nice examples in their natural habitat. They just do great, useful vehicles. Tons of interior room, more than any American car (even FWD ones) of similar size. Outstanding real-world chassis. The 5.4L Falcon GT I rented a couple years back had the best eight-hour seats of any car I’ve ever driven – super-comfy but still aggressively bolstered.

I’ve gotten BMW and Acura owners to drive the G8. They all come away impressed with the car but they won’t buy a Pontiac.

In response: The begged question is, WHY NOT? Is it Dealer, or Brand, or Manufacturer-related? Buying a G8 GT for close to half the price of a 540 shouldn’t be difficult to rationalize, unless these folks are terribly concerned with their golfing partners’ opinions… I suspect if less TARP-bucks went to bonuses, the G8’s “place” would broaden…

This harkens back to the Catera, an Opel with another badge, and the fact it was NOT considered a “Cadillac” initially. Could have been marketed as anything, at a slightly reduced price, and sold more units. Instead, it was the precurser to the CTS, sold as a Caddy to establish an entry-level, “near-Luxury” market presence. The CTS took over, thankfully, and the rest is history.

As to earning higher margins, price DOES play a part in the marketplace. Lower price (and lower margin) equates to higher volume, higher penetration and therefore higher market share, with all its attendant service/parts opportunities. We currently see what the reverse shows with BMW, who are now showing lo$$e$ in this dreadful marketplace with their “smarter” lower volume/higher margin lines. And the vaunted world-slaying Toyota, now with 4 “Divisions” (Toyota/Scion/Lexus/Trucks) like the “GM-Revised”, is racking up lo$$e$ that make GM look downright fiscally responsible and/or more market-correct… Of course Buick CAN attain higher margins…just build ‘em all someplace other than the U.S….that’s the route “all successful multinationals” are using… The trouble with THAT scenario is, there’ll be many thousands of fewer potential Buick buyers, here…but there’s ALWAYS China to broaden Buick’s horizon…

Back to topic:

My original point, and it’s not-so-obvious irony (to some) was Y2K…”G8″ et al in its many guises and THEN-market potential…and Aztek…(roughly equal development dollars, at that time), and what might have been, had someone “zagged”… The Commodore, then, was a no-brainer (gee, I even saw that…), fully ‘WAY overdue, come MY 2009… Instead of “party time at Pontiac”, it was more like an “Irish wake”…

Sad…

But back in the ’60s (maybe late ’50s) GM started emphasizing sales volume over per-unit margin; in the end all the upmarket brands moved down until by the late ’70s there was barely a whiff of differentiation between them and Chevy, Pontiac, Buick, Oldsmobile, even Cadillac were all competing against each other more than they were competing with anyone else.

Then came the big FWD catastrophe, and GM’s big cars became jokes. Maybe they felt they were forced into it by CAFE, whatever. It didn’t work. And the Germans, Swedes, and Japanese ate the profitable end of the market and left all the GM brands to chase the rentacar business.

The Holdens (and the Australian Fords) are an alternative-universe American car, what American cars would have evolved into had the US auto industry not been hobbled by CAFE and headquartered in the snow belt. The G8 and the rest of the Commodore line are the ultimate refinement of everything that was good about ’60s American iron (big unfussy powertrains, roomy, more car per dollar) merged with modern design and chassis engineering (at least as much as one can do on GM Holden’s capital budget.)

The G8 is a better car than anything built in the US save maybe the CTS (and maybe the late Lincoln LS, but then Ford’s got the same problem with the Lincoln brand and Lincoln dealer image as GM’s had with many of its nameplates.)

But you can’t claim “we’re the Performance Brand” and then stick utter trash like the G3, G5, and G6 in the showrooms, and you most certainly can’t expect to sell something like the G8 next to that fleet-quality garbage.

I’ve gotten BMW and Acura owners to drive the G8. They all come away impressed with the car but they won’t buy a Pontiac.

WHASSUP with the Aztek comparison? That car is totally a counterpart of Honda Element did you know that

The comparison was for “What might have been” vs. “What was”…

In fact, the “concept” used to create the Aztek, the “Pontiac Thunder”, was also on display at Woodward 2000…with a lower cowl, lower roofline, and MUCH better proportions, but GM mandated the Aztek MUST be derived from the U-Van chassis.

Why would I have the nerve to say this?

I’ve been associated with a very successful Pontiac-Buick-GMC dealership for 31 years…in CANADA…where these 3 lines were “tripled” since Christ was in shortpants, and often outsold Chev-Olds stores through the ’80’s-’90’s-’00’s in the very same markets, at the retail level. Nationally, on occasion…

Been there, done that…NOW we’re losing the t-shirts…

Too Bad Americans are just Stereo Type.
I mean look at this car looks better than a Subaru, Lancer or a Civic.

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I would prefer any Subaru (except the flying vagina) and Honda over any Pontiac, in terms of style.

My local dealer is selling Imprezas at full sticker.

The only Nationality who doesn’t appreciate Pontiac are Americans. So, sad to see that the an America car are more respected overseas than the country where it came from.

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It’s more respected overseas because people there don’t know enough about it.

You know, it’s like that sweet girl next door. You don’t what kind of b*tch she really is until she moves in.

I guess the rumours are right that Americans are _______.

Nay you feel in the blank not me?

WHASSUP with the Aztek comparison? That car is totally a counterpart of Honda Element did you know that

Yup…the AZTEK…

Go figure…

At the 2000 Woodward Dream Cruise I was introduced to some members of the “original” GTO Club of Australia who came to see the spectacle. They had in their possession a Holden Commadore brochure (MY 2000) featuring a 4-dr (can you say “future G8″?), 5-dr (nice there, maybe not-so here…), Ute (can you say the stillborn “G8 ST”?), Wagon (which would swamp Volvo’s boat), and Coupe (Monaro…or “GTO”), with Base 3.8 V6, optional 3.8 Supercharged V6, top-line optional LS1 5.7L V8, and RWD.

To a nearby GM mid-manager I asked, “WOW! Why don’t WE have these?!”

“Because they weren’t conceived in the U.S.”, came the reply from the equally perplexed Pontiac person.

Enter Lutz, a year or two later, who at least had a “worldly” perspective. But, even then, the die was cast… Too little, far too late…

Spending BILLION$ “recreating the wheel” when other subsidiaries had world-class platforms available, HAD to take a toll eventually…and Holden and Opel (and others) HAVE had world-class architecture to work from…as good as and/or better than the “competition”… Add N/A amenities and certified drivetrains, and “away we go…”

Far too parochial for far too long…

Where ‘ya ‘bin at?

If Ford can only design a car like this but it’s too late.

Goodbye my dear Pontiac the Father of the Big Block engines.

No, Pontiac will be remembered for the last truly famous vehicle they built, and its famous for all the wrong reasons…the Aztek. I’m actually kind of surprised that in all the posts here no one’s mentioned the Champion of Champions when it comes to modern follies by the domestics.

As a sad prediction of future, the impression I get from Uncle Obama and Co. is their ideal GM product of the future will be another Aztek-type ride; but smashed into the volume of a Mini Cooper with a lawn-mower engine and a couple Die-Hards for the hybrid-part. Oh, and don’t forget the carbo-meter running up the tax bill that they’ve installed on the lawn-mower engine’s tailpipe. Brave new world my friends, brave new world.

So, I wanted to check out this G8. Really interested in it. Guess what. In the entire state of Florida, there was not ONE in stock, and obviously not from exuberant demand. Just another way GM continually screws up and is the cause of there own Titanic-like sinking. You can’t buy them if you don’t make/stock them.

Buick died in 1996 with the Roadmaster.

Saturn was finished with release of the Relay.

A decade of Bob Putz RWD overpriced niche crap, fifteen years of FWD rental cars, their trucks/SUVs first-and-last product planning (or lack thereof), and the now legendary GM FWD rebadge rename game are what’s killed GM.

As with the GTO, the G8 never had a chance thanks to ten year old styling, and whatever retard at a Bingo tournament thought up Pontiac’s current naming scheme.

And whomever thinks the gubment is going to fix GM’s product lineup better wake up, get ready for all the environazi-mobiles you can stand and then some.

As far as the G8 vs. Charger lineup, the LX platform is the winner, I’m going to pass about ten of them on my 3 mile commute home that say so.

I love the Pontiac better than Honda Civic,the ugly Toyota Corolla and Nissan Sentra.

Gees who killed Pontiac? the American consumers because they buy Japanese cars like Honda,Toyota and Nissan even they look so ugly for them they still buy them because of the common misconception.

The renegade crab has been dragged back into the bucket, and now the crabs satisfied with the bucket “respect” the renegade crab.

Not everyone is consumed with what others think about them-contrary to current popular opinion, imagery isn’t everything, though our American political Idol president is mesmerizing, for many.

Right or Left, the lesser of two evils.

Glad you’re happy with your evil.

A classic case of better watch what you hope for.
The world has turned its back on the greatest civilizing force it has ever known, and calls it progress. Take your stand Pete, and good luck with that. I can see you’ve thought about all of this very deeply.

Only a childish people need a nanny state; The kids have the house for the long weekend; we’ll all see how that works out.

Time will tell.

Gracious and very generous.

“…no doubt we are heading in the right direction.”

Yes, of course you are, now, finally.

Quoting from the above: 48% think the country is headed in the right direction, compared to 44% who believe it is not. In October, the final days before the election, only 17% believed the country was going in the right direction, with 78% taking the opposite view.

Those Conservative Right Liars are just too much on the nose aren’t they?

A grateful world community thanks the USA. I expect you’re all very excited about retrieving some respect.

Yes, agreed Pete. If they all thought as deeply about it as us, undoubtedly they would come to the same conclusion as we have. And as a majority, (or even if not), our determination of what is in the best interest of the community must necessarily be the correct determination. I mean, the greatest examples of civilization are obviously those great nations that have brought this type of thinking to its greatest extent in guiding their subjects, I mean citizens, to correct thought and behavior. But you’ve been a bit gracious in extending privilege inside of one’s front door; our dear leader in the states is looking to remedy that sloppy thinking by deciding what temperature one’s abode should be/the portions of food we should be eating/the thoughts we should be thinking in & out of our homes..no doubt we are heading in the right direction. Hope you approve.

I had one of our company board member’s HSV Commodore Clubsport R8s for 1 month while he was away and I was car-less in Australia between assignments.

Rocketship on rails, seriously sorted piece of near-race equipment, but ultimately I preferred something else, less …. scary.

I would dearly like to see these great cars survive in Australia. I know many people who’s jobs depend on it, and I know the work that went into this skunkworks non-GMNA project here in Australia.

The minute you (or I) step outside our front door, we’re actors in our world community. We’d all do well to think harder on that topic.

Person A’s rights are not greater than Person B’s rights so as a majority we might decide that in the interests of community, certain selfish individual choices are less desirable than others.

What’s the word for it again …. help me out?

Civilisation.

Yes, PeteMo, I’m with you; how can Jack not realize it is correct-thinking people like us who have the right to determine not only what we drive but what Jack drives as well? His lack of enlightenment is simply astonishing.