Just paid $4.37 per gallon this morning for premium. Oy. While patiently waiting for (another) $60 to leave my wallet a lady pulled up in a Smart Roadster. I haven't driven a Smart yet, but from I'm told, it blows. However, it really doesn't weigh very much. A few days ago, a dear friend called me and asked if she and her one-year-old should buy a used Audi. Let me rephrase that: she wanted to buy a used A4. I tried explaining that when new, the A4 sold for three times what a Mazda Protege went for. Today the Mazda is worth more. She wasn't hearing it. I then touched on the fact that she could well be paying $400 a month in bizzaro repair bills, like CV joints and a new electrical system. And the (relatively) poor mileage. "But Jonny, it's so cute! My friend has one– I love it" I finally talked her out of it by mentioning that the auto-dimming rearview mirror will eventually leak mercury all over her infant. That worked. Long story short, she's got about $15k to spend. I told her to get a Honda Fit. "Oh no! My friend says they're death traps." Based on what? Her friend– a TV actor– test drove one and thought it was a death trap. From the test drive. Long story short, even though she wants a clean, high mileage car, she ain't going small. Because of her baby. You?
86 Comments on “Question of the Day: Are You Ready To Buy Small?...”
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I’ve already gone small. I have a Fit and a Yaris, both with ABS and side curtain airbags. Plenty safe for me and when we have kids I’ll have no problem putting them in either one. I’m actually disappointed in the Fit’s mileage, but the Yaris has been awesome so far.
Ready to go small? Already did, sort of. VW GTI. But I honestly think it’s too big. Next time around for my commuter, I’m going B-segment – MINI Cooper or ideally, the new Fiat 500 if it’s on sale here ever. Otherwise the new Fit looks good.
@polpo:
What kind of mileage are you seeing with the Fit?
Good one, Jonny: “the auto-dimming rearview mirror will eventually leak mercury all over her infant.” Keep ‘em coming!
Unless you really need a new(er) car, it doesn’t make financial sense in these crazy times to trade in your guzzler for a fuel-sipper. You can buy a lot of gas with the money you’d lose, even at $5 per gallon.
As for me, no, I’m keeping my 2 Camrys and older Frontier, all 4-cylinder models, the Camrys with side airbags and ABS, the truck with a manual tranny.
1996 chevy s-10 pickup with a 4 banger and a 5 speed manual tranny. 2005 honda civic. been buying small all my life. the harley’s a different story, but it gets 40mpg.
JL, you have the patience of a saint.
I actually have been fielding similar questions sans annoying friends’ opinions. While the Fit is very safe for a small car, there’s always that qualifier. Yes, with less SUVs on the road it’s safer out there for a subcompact, but weight is still important. And to give up peace of mind when driving your family is a lot to ask for.
I recommended moving up to a base Accord or Altima.
Personally, I have a Mazda3, which is a great size. I wouldn’t want to go any smaller. Or much larger at that.
My 2002 Saab 9-3 is the largest vehicle I have owned. I have had no mechanical problems with it and it averages around 27 mpg on a tank of gas. My commute is about 20 minutes each way. Taking public transportation would take about 90 minutes due to the bus schedule. As more and more people trade in their giant SUVs, my car just gets safer and more practical.
Nope. No small cars, just not gonna fly.
Larger cars are safer (I said cars, not SUVs) at least according to this:
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/surprise-small-cars-still-more-dangerous-than-big-ones/
For my money, you just can’t beat the Grand Marquis/Crown Victoria siblings. That much comfort, storage space and decent fuel efficiency (for such a large car). I got 28.5 mpg in my old ‘88 years ago.
Of course my commute is only about 2 miles each way, and I bike it when the weather permits. So yeah, no need for a suicide sardine box (Smart) or any other of those cars. It’s gotta have a V8 and seat six, minimum.
Plus there’s the excellent reliability.
I already have a 1st gen Xb and have put on 57K miles. I can carry all sorts of things like air conditioners lawn mowers etc that my old accord coudn’t carry.
Justin Berkowitz: I have no problems getting mid-high 30s on the highway, and I even saw 40 once while driving across Wyoming. The city mileage is where it falls apart, though. I get mid-20s. It looks like the revised 2008 EPA MPG figures agree with this; the 2007 numbers were a very optimistic 33/38.
We Americans just can’t seem to shake the “bigger is better” premise, even in the face of rising fuel costs. We say we “want” better fuel economy, but not at the expense of driving our large and/or “cute” cars. Until we truly come to grips with the reality that (right now) smaller cars really do get better mileage and we haven’t totally reversed the laws of physics, the full swing to smaller cars won’t happen here. It’s a shame, because with creativity, small cars can offer an amazing amount of practicality and fun. Witness the abundance of hatchbacks overseas. I know, I know…hatchbacks tend to be the scurge of the automotive world here in the US, seen as being one step above mopeds on the scale of desireability, but the days of the roaming SUV are (hopefully) coming to an end and people might want to get used to “right-sizing” their automotive purchases.
I wouldn’t go any way but small. I drove an ‘85 LeSabre for about a year (18mpg, woo!), but the rest of my driving existence has been in small cars. I have a feeling because of model bloat, my ‘07 Civic is the biggest car I’ve ever owned.
I hate the feeling of large cars anyway – I’d rather try to avoid an accident than just let isaac newton take the wheel. And if push does come to shove, I have full faith in my car’s frame to keep the big baddies out.
Eventually I’ll downsize, but for now it doesn’t make any financial sense to get rid of car and buy another one to save on gas. I drive a total of 12 miles a week, on average. So my V8 Cadillac burns one gallon of regular gas every week, unless I’m taking it on a trip.
Regarding subcompact death traps, a friend of mine rolled his Yaris (with me riding shotgun) and there were no injuries. See a picture of it here: http://tinyurl.com/6rt7m9
I recently went from a ‘94 Mazda MPV to a a 350Z. In some circles, that’s going small. It even gets better gas mileage. In any case, I’m ready to buy small because I see no reason not to.
Ok, this might be a heroically stupid question, but has anyone done the math on buying cheap 87 and adding Toulene (inexpensive if you buy through industrial supply outfits)?
I grind my teeth buying 87 but the cost difference can be fairly staggering.
Or is this kind of thing just too third world?
I have been for forty years.
I’m ready for my next two Hondas – One large (Fit) and one small (Zest).
when will the new Fit be on sale???
I went small back in late December when I was able to pick up a nice 2002 Ford Focus priced at wholesale. I’m still hanging on to the minivan and the 97 Yukon though. They are not driven enough for their lower mpg to be a problem.
2009 Fit arrives this fall, I believe.
If they bring over the just-introduced Fit-derived Honda Freed, a little microvan with 3 rows, I’d seriously consider getting it when we have to replace a vehicle. It makes the larger Mazda5 look like a wasteful guzzler.
I would consider smaller cars if their city or overall mpg were better. If it’s 20-23mpg or so it’s not enough of an improvement for the trade-off in interior space, performance and pretty much everything else to make it worth it.
Not going small, but staying with the same car despite gaining more kids. I now fit three across the back of my WRX.
Things are changing so fast, and will continue to do so unless gas prices crash, that IMO this is a poor time to downsize. Wait a couple of years, or maybe a 3-4, for new more efficient stuff to come out. Hasn’t Honda announced a hybrid Fit? And today Norway’s Think Global announced that a small electric car is coming to the US.
Gas hits $6/gal and I will buy a smaller vehicle than my 9-5 wagon which gets 33 mpg on the highway portion of my commute, and 22 mpg on backroads if I am really easy on the throttle.
That smaller vehicle will be a nice commuting bicycle which I should be able to use about 8 months out of the year here in MA, or year-round if I am tough enough.
radimus:
How’s your radiator overflow tank holding up?
In about 1998 I got turned side-ways (NASCAR style) and T-boned by a semi doing 70 miles an hour while driving my Festiva. Drove the car home and parked it. The car got handed down to friends needing cheap transportation and now has over 300K on it making a daily 120 mi round trip commute. Anyone ever see a smashed up Surf Blue Festiva plying I-71 between Mansfield and Columbus?
Having said all that, I just got done running errands in the 81 VW diesel pickup at 52 MPG. What a tin can….
I get 30 MPG in my Accord, which I paid $17K for new. The trade-off from going smaller (and less safe) just isn’t worth it for an extra 5-10 MPG and a couple of grand.
Now, if small meant safe and 50 MPG and fun to drive (Sorry, Prius), then I’m in.
The wife’s new 2008 Accord is the biggest car we’ve ever owned. Mileage is (so far) very similar to my 2003 Protege.
Smaller? Eventually. If I had to replace the Slowtege today, I’d look at a Yaris or maybe an Elantra (I don’t like the looks of the Fit).
Although I am willing to buy another tiny car (I had a Ford Aspire), I do not think I would buy another tiny car that I felt was unsafe (like a Ford Aspire – I almost never drove it on the freeway).
I think a Smart would be OK in terms of safety but it’s too expensive for what you get and the improvement in fuel economy is unimpressive. At $12K or so, the Smart might look like a deal.
We’ll probably get a Prius… safe, similar fuel economy, more seats, only slightly more expensive than a Smart, much more versatile.
And maybe, someday, a Miata for the weekends.
No automotive engineer (or any engineer, for that matter) can rewrite the basic laws of physics.
Therefore, my next daily driver is going to be large(-ish), but since I’ll probably be doing 30 mpg at $4.00 per gallon rather than 25 miles at $5.00+ per gallon, it really won’t be that painful.
Not much smaller than currently: Mazda3 wagon. Once the family starts growing, something slightly larger wagon would be preferred.
Something like an Escape, Outback, or used XC70.
And, I’d like to get us down to 1 vehicle when the 240 dies (if it ever does). Work is less than 7 miles, I have a road and mtn. bike to use. Of course that depends on what the main vehicle would be…
Does an RS4 convertible count as small?
Why worry? The government will make SUVs get 35mpg and then we’ll be fine. Hehe.
I drive a 2002 Miata right now, and I’ll be honest – when funds allow, I’d rather have a car with better side-impact safety. Like the current-generation Miata. (Older Miatas do pretty well in frontal crashes.) btw your friend should just get a used Accord and be done with it. Or, show her the IIHS death rates table. I remember the Rav4 did surprisingly well on it.
Regarding subcompact death traps, a friend of mine rolled his Yaris (with me riding shotgun) and there were no injuries.
Rolling a small car is very different from being hit in a small car by another vehicle.
I couldn’t trade now if I wanted to due to being upside down. It just wouldn’t make sense. Having said that, I doubt I will ever buy a very small car, but it just depends on what’s available. I buy what I want, not what gets the best mileage…
Absolutely – I have a Mazda3 and a Mini Cooper and both a perfect for what my family needs. It’s not even the money but I just prefer smaller cars for city driving. If BMW would ever bring the 120d or 130 hatch to the US, I would be first in line for it.
KixStart: Haha! I had an Aspire, too, a sexy red 2-door heat & keys model; it didn’t even come with a clock. Also, it had a 1.3 liter engine, something I always think about when I fire up the 1400cc motor of my motorcycle…
One thing that really told me that small cars have arrived is that my wife, a North Dakotan through and through (anything smaller than a Grand Marquis is suspect and silly in her eyes) turned to me and said, “Maybe the next car we get can be a little one, like a Civic or something.”
I want very much to go small, but the NVH is what scares me off. If they come out with a car that’ll give me 40+ mpg on the highway and a quiet, smooth and comfortable ride I’ll pay good money for it. I can’t afford to care about 0-60 times or luxurious appointments, I just want something reliable, comfortable, and efficient.
Boy, talk about missing the point.
Don’t need a small car to get good MPG. I have a mid-sized station wagon that gets 35 city/ 40 hwy.
I went small several years ago. I traded in a less than reliable and thirsty Grand Marquis for a well equipped (but high freeway miles) Cavalier. At the time, my kids were done with Scouts, volleyball etc., and I really didn’t need the capacity any longer.
It has a pushrod 2.2 with plenty of torque for city driving and if I don’t play Speed Racer, it will return 25-27 in town and 35-37 on the freeway. Since gasoline has reached $4/gallon I drive like grandma these days, but even if I flog the dumb thing in city traffic, I’m still getting 20-22 MPG. I could never ever hope to reach those kinds of numbers with the Marquis de Sade…
Safety? Bunch of mamby-pamby sissies I say. Oh yes have to protect the children. Geez, when I was a kid, one of my dads cars didn’t even have seatbelts and no one wore the ones that did. Soon you won’t let your kids walk to the corner store unless they have body armor and a helmet.
My last 3 cars have been light, 4cyl, 5speeds. I don’t spend time worrying about what is safer than what. Small light weight cars are toss-able and fun to drive.
I find the ongoing sissification disturbing.
I hope fuel prices go higher so I get more nice light cars to choose from.
Well I like midsized cars. So my PRius is just doing great. Averages mid 40’s. Wish the XB had a hybrid. The new Cube may offer some options too.
A hybrid Xb would be the Cats Pajamas right now. Not a good as the Prius on the freeway, but just a good in stop n’ go.
love my GTI. big enough for 4 people to fit just fine. and gets +33mpg on a highway trip. Tons of airbags and safety acronyms.
I had to register just to reply to this. My last car was a 2004 WRX (sedan), and I traded it in for a 2008 Honda Fit Sport (automatic). I got around 20mpg on my best days with the WRX, and would mix in E85 for autocross days (STX class, but with a modified boost map for daily driving). My Fit gets around 30mpg with city driving and the A/C blasting most of the time (I’m in AZ). I got the auto because I developed problems with my knees, which was a major player in why I got rid of the WRX.
As for safety, I have no problems with it. It handles quite well (although this Sunday might be its first run through the cones) and has great braking. But then again, I prefer to avoid issues possible accidents so I lean toward better handling.
It’s a very efficient car, in terms of space inside, space outside, and fuel. My only issue has been taking it on the interstate, but I am learning to just go slower (I’m used to cruising at much higher speeds ;-)) and the car is fine.
So for you folks out there that are more expert in this area, what would be a good car for a growing family. Considering things like safety, reliability, and value. What’s a young growing (non-wealthy) family to do?
Right now our little family of 3 is fine (I think) in our ‘06 Sonata 4cyl and ‘00 Saturn SL1. But as we’re about to enlarge and the Saturn is nearing death, what type of vehichle should I consider? We certainly don’t need anything like a big ol’ Yukon, but can we get by with another regular sedan or should I look at something like a small SUV or wagon?
Just looking for some wisdom from the other family car heads out there… :)
My wife is a rare breed of American woman: she prefers tiny, twisty little cars to behemoth tanks. I should count my lucky stars (as well as the thousands of dollars in sticker price and gas we’ll be saving).
As I mentioned in another comment, our 180k-mile Saturn SL is on the clock.
The Fit towers over the current field, especially since its one HUGE Achilles’ heel (lack of left foot rest) is solved with the new generation. Following that are the Yaris, Civic, Corolla (willing to give it a test drive), Sentra, Versa, 3, and Prius (she’s willing to go mid-size for 50 mpg).
Of course, my wife is 25 years old and thinks she’s indestructible. I’m having a hard time talking her out of a motorcycle to commute to grad school. A Fit is a freakin’ vault by comparison.
@Covert: We have 3 (1 year old) in the 06 Mazda3 wagon and it’s fine now that the stroller has gotten smaller…but we can take long trips just fine in it with plenty of room for us and the cargo.
I hate trunked cars (sedans, coupes) as they eat away the useability and flexibility of a vehicle.
Like I said above, I’d like to consider something slightly larger and with some more capability for Idaho (winter, camping, whatever). I usually stick with FoMoCo due to excellent deals, service, and (so far) reliability. I think the Escape or a used V70 XC would be our preference, but even an Outback will be considered.
My mom went small and safe. MINI Cooper S. It has a fully boxed frame and a but load of standard features, gets ok milage 33 on the highway) the city milage will make you loose your lunch! 25 mpg city. thats from personal experience. There is one down side to this car, PRICE! Try finding a smaller car for more money per pound!
Covert7…I’m a big guy and with twins I required a car that would allow two rear facing infant carriers in the back which narrowed down my choices.
My wife and I just went through the car buying experience recently, and the best I could find that was reasonably priced (20K or less), decent mileage (EPA city 20+) and could have me drive and carry two kids and some cargo was a Mazda5.
Anything else that fit the bill was large sedans (300/Charger/Magnum) or SUVs, and those failed in the mileage department.
The 5 is, surprisingly, fun to drive and an excellent value for the money. We paid 20.3 for a 2008 Touring automatic.
Wife and baby drive in a Grand Marquis – wonderful vehicle that is overlooked by most. I commute in a Corolla, which I hate.
If gas was cheap, I’d be driving the Grand Marquis, and the wife would probably have an SUV like a Grand Cherokee. Call us throwbacks, but I much prefer larger vehicles, but I’m not stupid about money and the cost of gas.
I just accept it as the fact our standard of living is dropping in this country, so we are now driving vehicles better suited to 3rd world countries.
Already drive “small” thanks.
Don’t care if gas went to $2.50 again. We’re already driving what we like.
Wouldn’t mind a Eurovan Weekender for trips though.
MINI Cooper S here. Funny how the mileage isn’t stellar for the size (as a previous poster mentioned) but you automatically get a pass from the green police based on size. Around town it’s BARELY more fuel efficient than my old M3.
We’re looking at replacing our ‘02 X5 (I6, 5spd) here shortly, and are really scratching our heads on what to replace it with. Can an average American nuclear family cope with TWO small cars? :-)
Another cheap and cheerful way to boost cargo capacity on small(er) vehicles is to get a trailer hitch with a cargo shelf like this:
http://www.sportomotoring.com/everthere-folding-carrier.html
It won’t tank you highway mileage will like putting something on the roof.
Now if Honda would just offer the new Accord as a Wagon. It would be the reincarnation of the Griswold family truckster.