I figure after they go bankrupt and take alot of paychecks and suppliers down with them, they’ll lobby the gov’ts to remove union-shop rules blaming their failure on the unions (which is partially true but far most of their problems).

The problem, at least in the USA, is that too many Americans don’t know a good vehicle when it runs over their toe and thus the reason Saturn has competitive vehicles but fewer customers than I would have expected. If the Zafira could be a best seller here I would expect the Mazda5 to be a bigger player than it is.

FWIW I think high gas prices will be good for us in the long run b/c the American consumer is getting an education in needs vs wants vs blind consumerism. I just wish some of the huge profits were financing something enduring like alt.energy.

Still wondering if the rising price and big profits don’t represent big oil’s last big profit grab as gasoline becomes obsolete in the next 10-15 years replaced by electric commuter cars.

Here’s a constructive thought for the CAW and GM.

What do you guys think of this one?

CAW has a contract with GM, so doesn’t need to strike (and use strike fund monies), GM can’t sell trucks and wants to lay off the workforce at 1/2 of Oshawa.

OK CAW, now it’s time to consider putting money where mouth is. GM, it’s time to look at the workforce represented by the CAW as an asset.

CAW – take your strike fund monies – all of them – and sit down with GM, a dying company, and try to save your men’s jobs by offering the money to help re-tool the truck plant in Oshawa to build something they think they can sell.

How about setting up Opel Zafira production and selling them as Chevrolet Zafira’s, as GM does in Brazil? A worthy competitor to the Kia Rhondo, which seems to be a pretty good success story and selling well.

The Zafira is a good choice because the already-in-production Ecotech four cylinder engine can be used; the vehicle is considered a “truck” so should be relatively easy to “federalize” for sale in the US; it’s considered a modern crashworthy vehicle and has passed the Euro-NCAP crash tests with good results.

Well, that’s my constructive suggestion.

What say you, TTAC’ers? Good? Bad? Indifferent? Any alternative ideas?

I agree GM needs to shed workers. My point was that if Oshawa needs to close for whatever reason, close the plant, but try to keep the workers. Remove workers from lower quality facility, put higher quality workforce in place. At the end of the day, a highly talented motivated workforce will produce a better car.

I know it’s not that simple, but treating personel as assets rather than liabilities is one of the things that Toyota and Honda seem to get.

And manufacturing quality should be job 1 for the domestics. North America contains a very highly skilled workforce along with talented engineers. However, it seems that the talent is going to the transplants.

sit down strikes are illegal in the US and I presume canada

Good point, however, while Quality is a factor, it’s never been an overriding concern for the domestics – more like a pleasant unintended consequence of better manufacturing and design practices.

Regarding moving people from one plant to another, that’s kind of the whole point – GM has too many employees – there is no place to put everyone.

As for moving cross country (or anywhere for that matter) Canada has a long tradition of not encouraging labor mobility. For example it’s been 20 some odd years when the fishing industry hit the skids and only now are people migrating to the Alberta oil patch.

Also, when you have employees you like, you don’t let them go if you don’t have to. I’ve seen a group get “cuts”, where the headcount goes down, but the company doesn’t want to lose the employee, so they’re transferred to another open position. Granted, that was software, but I also know engineers who have moved cross country for the same job.

Bottom line, if Oshawa and the employee base is that good, GM should be either be A) shutting down another facility somewhere else, or B) offering to move Oshawa workers elsewhere, and making the cuts (which in this climate, do get made) from factories that don’t stack up as well.

Then again, that would assume that GM saw employees as an asset. I hope someone there does, for Mikey and everyone in Oshawa’s sake.

And the Americans thought we only spoke 2 languages

Mike:
I almost spit out my coffee.

I’m a true bluenoser, from Cape Breton and I’m actually on The Rock now.

I’m probably the only person in Canada who moved East for a job

Now what T. F. do we do?Do we shut Impala down?
NO way too f—en valuable.How about truck?Not a real good time eh?

So guess what? We picket the main office,the media comes out of the woodwork,and we get our point across.

Menno:apoligy accepted your forgiven.
revolver:lord tunderin jesus me son we gotta bluenoser. Me best buddy is a by from the rock.

And the Americans thought we only spoke 2 languages

Since half of Atlantic Canada (where I’m from) is now in Alberta, you will no doubt run into a few Maritimers and Newfoundlanders. Do yourself a favour. Have a beer with them. We are some of the most fun loving people in Canada.

@Katie: I agree; sounds like a reasonable right-to-assembly (for our friends to the South!).

@CarShark: when somebody tells you that you are going to lose your livelihood, I can certainly understand the desire to protest; rolling over isn’t always a palateable answer, regardless of the outcome.

I’ve sometimes wondered if there isn’t reason to keep these plants going -IF- and only -IF- the quality is higher then all other plants. If part of the problem with GM product is their assembly, it would seem to me that it might be worth investing in a better made product (even if it causes some bleeding) in order to regain marget share.

@Menno (again!): Sounds like a fun trip. I’m but a few hours from you – have always wanted to do the drive, but the misses has always preferred to fly – we’ve done the Rocky Mountain trip a bunch of times (every other summer for the last 6 years) – beautiful landscape. If you happen to stay at B&Bs (and probably in any event) you can easily meet people from all over the world trekking around the Rockies….

Nothing personal. I do like Canada and Canadians too, BTW. In fact, Mrs and I are going to have the vacation of a lifetime and go to Alberta (Banff, Lake Louise, Jasper, etc) and we’re driving there. Go north, over two bridges, and turn left…. (we’re in Michigan).

Taking the Sonata (so as to keep the miles off the Prius / to make it last 15 years) since the Sonata gets so few miles and we have 12k mpy on the lease – and we’re not even close.

Unless gas is $5 a gallon when we leave in mid-July, then we’ll take the Prius. That’s my tipping point for the trip.

But then we’re talking thousands of miles.

As for WWII, yep the Brits, Canadians, Aussies and Kiwis were in there first, all right. Not forgetting though, that the US “arsenal of democracy” started ramping up “lend-lease” equipment literally by the boat-loads by 1940.

All they are doing is fighting for their jobs. What’s wrong with that? In fact, it may even help them.

A few years ago, GM told GM UK, Germany, Sweden and, I think, Hungary that they were going to build the new 2010 Astra. This left GM Belgium redundant and was going to be closed. GM Belgium workers went on strike until GM management caved in and gave them 2 new models to build.

So, nothing unusual here, as far as I can see…..

menno: I respect your opinion,however as a Canadian I do not comment on American politics ever.I trust you will give us the same respect.

Why aren’t they driving to Aliston or Cambridge and putting in their applications at Honda or Toyota?

This is not an option for ex GM employees. When Honda set up the plant in Aliston, they specifically excluded anyone with any prior automotive industry experience. They did not want to have to “unteach” employees with preconceived ideas of how cars should be built. It also helps prevent employees from trying to initiate ridiculous CAW-style work rules and makes sure that the supervisor/line worker hostility and mistrust that is prevalent in the D3 does not infect Honda.

Also: The US only entered the war over 2 years after the British empire. So I would put Britian and Canada etc before the US on that list.