Wards Auto World reports that Hyundai won’t be offering a V6 in its much-hyped, next-generation Sonata sedan. A direct-injection version of its Theta four-cylinder is expected to be the only engine option, making Sonata the first DI four-pot midsized sedan on the market. The V6 option will also be yanked from the Tucson cute-ute. Though the Sonata will be one of the few mid-sized sedans on the US market without a V6 option, don’t expect it to be a problem even for ostensibly torque-obsessed Americans. According to Wards, 85 percent of the current generation of Sonatas are built with four cylinder engines. 76 percent of Accords and 90 percent of Camrys on the market are four-bangers as well. With CAFE standards climbing rapidly, the era of the four-cylinder family sedan is clearly upon us.
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Props to Hyundai for calling a cease-fire to the family sedan horsepower wars.
Not even a turbo four?
That’s a gutsy move, if only because it precludes the Sonata from competing in buff-book shootouts. How is C&D or R&T going to give us 0-60 and 1/4 mile times for grocery getters?
Hyundai’s right, factually speaking, and most modern fours are making more power than sixes were not too long ago. And the power-to-weight ratios aren’t suffering. And some makers (VW, Honda) already charge V6 money for their I4s. But still, this is a gutsy move. Either they’re really sure this car is that good, or they’re making a big, dirty marketing misstep.
The other problem is that some modern V6s really are very fuel efficient. Again, the whole car better be really, really good.
How is this really a “gutsy” move when the market has spoken? The vast majority of vehicles in this class are being purchased with four cylinders.
I always thought 6-cylinder midsize sedans were (in the modern world) always a little ridiculous anyway. Using that much power to push a car with little to not sporting intentions seems goofy, especially when the car in question isn’t really that big.
I don’t suppose the actual car will have the Moby Hyundai look to the extent that the pic, which appears to be taken from a foot in front of the car, shows.
How is this really a “gutsy” move when the market has spoken? The vast majority of vehicles in this class are being purchased with four cylinders.
Because marketing your product without being able to claim a competitive maximum number is hard.
Think about the third-generation Altima: despite it’s being a plasticky, torque-steering, rough-riding bastard of a car, it sold because of power numbers—and even it’s sales were chiefly fours. Now, think about the Ford Fusion, which is actually a very good car, but didn’t have a competitive engine: it didn’t sell all that well. There’s other reasons, but power or the lack thereof is such an easy card for marketers and reviewers to play.
Even if it makes up less than a quarter of your sales, it’s important to have the six if only for appearance’s sake.
The era of boring cars begins…
psarhjinian :
September 28th, 2009 at 11:15 am
That’s a gutsy move, if only because it precludes the Sonata from competing in buff-book shootouts. How is C&D or R&T going to give us 0-60 and 1/4 mile times for grocery getters?
Actually, I just read a C/D comparison of cars like this, and they put them through their full battery of tests.
We had an Accord 4 banger and while a V6 would have been a little more fun, the power was more than adequate for the car’s purpose.
I was helping a friend shop for a coupe recently. We looked at the Altima and Accord coupes. Neither dealer had a V6 model on the lot. The Honda dealer said they can’t move V6s, so of the 50 of so Accords on the lot, not one was a V6.
@psarhjinian: The 3rd gen. Altima was also the V6 that started the horsepower wars among family sedans, and unlike the Fusion, it was not introduced during the era of $3 gas. Also the 3rd gen. Altima was a lot larger inside than the previous generation, that could have has something to do with it’s sales success as well.
Granted the Fusion’s engine choices were subpar, but power is not a determining factor anymore. I think people were reluctant to buy a Fusion because it was a new model from Ford. People either didn’t know it existed, or didn’t want to “gamble” on a Ford.
Even when gas was cheaper, not many people opted for the V6. It’s an interesting move on Hyundai’s part, but I don’t think it will backfire given the volatility of gas prices.
It makes a whole lot of sense. Consumers in the US have changed considerably from the mindless buyers of Explorer V8 POS SUVs, (Explorer alone sold 400,000 a year less than a decade ago!), and now the Explorer was the most DUMPED vehicle in the Clunkers fiasco, while the owners bought FAR more fuel efficient and inexpensive vehicles instead.
This will only be good, not only for the buyers of the 4 cylinder econoboxes, but to all the rest of us, since these people will make gas prices lower than what they would Otherwise be for all the rest of us.
BTW, who needs a v6 when the 4s, even without super/turbocharging, now make well over 200 HP??
In the old days (back in the 90s) of 4-speed autos and 130bhp 4-cyl and 190bhp 6-cyl the V-6 option made sense.
Now, in the era of soon to be 200bhp 4-cyl and 300bhp 6-cyl and 6-speed automatics – I don’t know if you can really engineer a car to route 300 lb/ft of torque via the short first gear of a 6-speed auto through the front wheels.
“# carguy622 :
September 28th, 2009 at 11:34 am
I was helping a friend shop for a coupe recently. We looked at the Altima and Accord coupes. Neither dealer had a V6 model on the lot. The Honda dealer said they can’t move V6s, so of the 50 of so Accords on the lot, not one was a V6.”
I remember back in the 90s when Honda stubbornly refused to offer a v6 Accord, many years after Toyota already offered a Camry V6, and finally it succumbed, but well after the 90-93 model
There will be a commensurate savings to Hyundai in training and service costs associated with only offering one engine.
Blog enthusiasts aren’t often real, paying customers. Good for Hyundai.
marketing your product without being able to claim a competitive maximum number is hard.
In the short run, Hyundai is playing to the fleet market, using its excess capacity to fill the gap left by the domestics. It doesn’t need a 6-cylinder for that.
This would be a bad move for Toyota and Honda, but for Hyundai, it may be a sensible interim measure. At this juncture, a larger engine probably just costs the company money, without providing much added cachet. If it becomes possible to move the Sonata up the price ladder, that would be the time to bring back the larger engine.
Having no V-6 option sounds silly on paper, but a good six-speed autobox with sequential shift will negate much of the “slow car” stigma that four banger sedans currently have. I drove a 2010 Camry recently, equipped with such a tranny, and it makes a huge difference in drivability and perceived performance. It was no rocket, but it felt far from underpowered or unwilling.
The key is whether the new four-cylinder DI engine offers the same refinement and “revability” that you get in the best engines in this class (Honda and Toyota). The current Sonata’s engine doesn’t really match up in this regard.
“threeer :
September 28th, 2009 at 11:20 am
How is this really a “gutsy” move when the market has spoken? ”
It is remarkable that, before the Genesis sedan was introduced, and excluding the several failed attempts it made to enter the near-luxury market with the 300 or 350 G or whatever they called them, the Sonata was Hyundai’s top of the line sedan, and now it can’t even have a v6!
2009 Audi A4s are around 4000lbs and come with only the 2.0 turbo 4 cylinder engine. You get a supercharged 6 with the S4. The A4’s performance is certainly adequate. But they may need to dial back from 255hp and/or 4000lbs to get the EPA highway mileage above 25mpg. In a previous generation A4, I can easily get real world 30+mpg highway and performance is also adequate.
At least it’s not going to be the 1970s, where most Detroit 8s didn’t get you as much power as the 2.0T and still used twice the gas.
I don’t think we’re going from a 60’s to 70’s performance reset.
Anyone who drives a 4 cylinder car knows how horrible that is. Under powered having to keep the rpm’s up for any kind of performance. Lagging and bucking transmission shifting to accomodate the lack of horsepower,and with so many fuel efficient 6 cylinders ,other than price, why?
Autosavant :
September 28th, 2009 at 11:43 am
It is remarkable that, before the Genesis sedan was introduced, and excluding the several failed attempts it made to enter the near-luxury market with the 300 or 350 G or whatever they called them, the Sonata was Hyundai’s top of the line sedan, and now it can’t even have a v6!
They still make the Azera, which is basically a gussied-up Sonata with a V-6. A friend of mine owns one.
CyCarConsulting :
September 28th, 2009 at 11:49 am
Anyone who drives a 4 cylinder car knows how horrible that is. Under powered having to keep the rpm’s up for any kind of performance. Lagging and bucking transmission shifting to accomodate the lack of horsepower,and with so many fuel efficient 6 cylinders ,other than price, why?
Have you driven the newer four-banger midsize sedans? They’re far from inadequate, IMHO.
Mike:
This is one of the near-lux ones I mentioned. I bet all were based on the Sonata platform. None sold well, and the Auto nag reviews were not good either.
DAMN!!
I was looking forward to the new Sonata for at least the last two years; now you tell me I won’t be able to get it with the V6 anymore?
I don’t CARE if it’s wasteful, I want that extra power to be there when I want it, even if I don’t use it most of the time.
I guess I’ll be looking at the V6 Altima now, or maybe the next-gen Azera (if there IS a new Azera on the way).
Under powered having to keep the rpm’s up for any kind of performance.
Huh? Dude, it’s not 1987 anymore.
A 200 bhp 4-cyl is more than enough power for pretty much everyone. It’s not like a fwd car can handle much more.
4’s are VERY adequate for a variety of purposes — it all depends on your gearing/vehicle weight. All 3 of my vehicles are 4’s.
Neon 0-60 in 11.5′ish
STi (4 + turbo) 0-60 in 5′ish
Bike 0-60 in 3-3.5, 1/4 around 125-130.
I don’t feel any missed love for 8’s & 6’s that are disappearing…
CyCarConsulting writes: “Anyone who drives a 4 cylinder car knows how horrible that is. Under powered having to keep the rpm’s up for any kind of performance. Lagging and bucking transmission shifting to accommodate the lack of horsepower”
You really need to trade in your old Cavalier.
Seriously folks – a modern 4 cylinder is plenty motivation for a mid size family car. Good move by Hyundai.
A CVT Equipped I4 Nissan Altima goes from 0-60 in 7.5 seconds.
A 4 Speed Pontiac Grand Prix from 2001 goes from 0-60 in 8.4 seconds.
So why do you need the V6 again? Improvements in transmissions have resulted in better performance- V6 power is superfluous.
It’s a smart move, if fours are making up 90% of this market. Their costs will be substantially lower by not having to make, distribute and market a V6 model with such a low sales profile. And it also shows Hyundai is serious about becoming a low-cost high-efficiency brand.
Bad news for the Taurus SHO?
Even though literally no one will cross-shop a Sonata V6 and a SHO, it looks like there isn’t a big market for a pumped up family sedan— especially in a world with so many high performance, entry-level lux cars that start @ $35k.
autosavant “I remember back in the 90s when Honda stubbornly refused to offer a v6 Accord, many years after Toyota already offered a Camry V6, and finally it succumbed, but well after the 90-93 model”
I remember that. C&D nearly lost their minds when Honda finally offered a V6 in the Accord. It was like the second coming of Jesus to the car world. I do disagree that the V6 is no longer needed due to HP upgrading. While you may have more HP in a 4, most cars (I’m looking at you Taurus) have plumpified to meet the American demand for tall, porky cars. How much more does today’s Sonata weigh over the first iteration? May not seem like too much of a big deal, until you try to merge into traffic or pass a slow moving Semi.
“A direct-injection version of its Theta four-cylinder is expected to be the only engine option, making Sonata the first DI four-pot midsized sedan on the market.”
Flat wrong: the 2.0T in the Jetta and Passat is direct injected. I think it would be the first naturally aspirated DI four-pot, though.
In the age of the ~200hp NA four-banger, I don’t see why a V6 is necessary in a regular family sedan. Save it for the sport sedans. Four cylinders is the new six, six is the new eight, etc.
I’ve had both. Most recently, I went with the V6. It wasn’t that much faster but it was quieter than the four. Hope they include plenty of sound deadening!
While you may have more HP in a 4, most cars (I’m looking at you Taurus) have plumpified to meet the American demand for tall, porky cars.
It’s not only the extra power of the 4-cyl it’s also the move from 4-speed to 6-speed automatics. You’re going to have a much easier time merging with a 200bhp and a 6-speed then you are with 225bhp and a 4 speed.
All of you praising 4 cylinders need to get out more.
bobkarafin – you can still get boucoup extra power (AND efficiency) in the next gen Sonata as soon as they introduce the 4 cylinder HYBRID version which will actually use direct injection, the same new six speed Hyundai designed automatic PLUS a powerful electric motor and battery system developed without any input from Toyota, Honda, Ford, GM, BMW, etc. Hyundai and the South Korean battery company did it (I cannot remember the battery tech but it is new and not the same as Toyota, Honda or laptop batteries – i.e. it is not Nickel Metal Hydride nor is it Lithium Ion).
Apparently about 18 months ago, many folks laughed out loud when Hyundai’s CEO said their upcoming hybrid technology would make the Prius look old-fashioned.
Perhaps they will enjoy eating that crow if someone gives them some tabasco sauce to disguise the flavor.
Because apparently, the new battery tech allows a much wider range of battery discharge (therefore usefulness) than the current batteries used by Honda, Toyota, Ford, etc.
If that photo is what the thing is actually going to look like, I think they will do well. That is a rare thing in today’s market, a truly good looking car. Hyundais have long been among the better looking family sedans, but that has been damning with faint praise. This thing really looks good.
BTW Hyundai aren’t even “first” to announce 4 cylinder only mid-sized cars.
The 2010 Mitsubishi Galant is going to be four cylinder only.
The 2011 Sonata (the one we’re talking about here) won’t be introduced until the Detroit Auto Show in January, I understand.
The 2010 Sonata is virtually the same as the 2009, except the color of my wife’s 2009 is replaced by another shade of red.
We had a 2002 Sonata with a 2.7 V6 (175hp), and replaced it with a 4 cylinder 2007 Sonata (165hp), and the 2009 has 4 cylinders (175hp). Front wheel drive has a difficult time handing over 200hp anyway – plus Hyundai have a right-wheel-drive (rear wheel drive) chassis on which to continue selling V6 and V8 cars (Genesis).
I’m hoping they’ll replace the Azera with a slightly down-sized Genesis sedan with V6’s only (they have a 3.3 V6 RWD engine certified for sale in the US but it has never – yet – been offered in the Genesis sedan or coupe).
The current Genesis sedan is about the size of a BMW 7 series – a car about the size of a BMW 5 series priced where the Azera is now, would be a mega-seller.
All of you praising 4 cylinders need to get out more.
Why would I want a v-6 in my GTI? Would a flat six WRX really be any better?
If the era of the 4-cylinder family sedan is upon us, that’s OK… if this era includes turbo-4s with six-speed transmissions that get 35 mpg highway (in real-life driving) and top out at 200 hp. I’d be all for such developments.
Want more than 200 hp/200 ft-lbs? Either get a “sport” model or a full-sized car in the Taurus/Maxima/Avalon/Azera/Impala class. Seems reasonable to me.
I do hope the extra-torquey V6s stick around for mid-size wagons. Oh, that’s right…
Hyundai is becoming the new Honda. This is an eminently smart decision. My Acura TSX makes over 200 HP without direct injection or turbocharging. It has more than enough power for a four passenger mid-sized sedan.
We just bought a used 2008 Hyundai Sonata 4 banger and it also has more than enough power for a mid-sized sedan.
Personally I had already made the decision not to buy anything bigger than a 4 cylinder powered car going forward. Our 2003 Accord is a V-6, and that engine is very much overkill.
Finally, as someone who does 99% of my own maintenance and repairs I really enjoy the better serviceability of a straight-4. Everything is so much easier when you aren’t dealing with a V-shaped engine crammed into the engine compartment. By comparison, I just helped a friend do the timing belt and valve adjustment on a V-6 equipped 1992 Toyota 4-Runner. That engine is an absolute PITA to work on. Book time to check and adjust the valve lash is five hours, and the book isn’t far off!
“The 2010 Mitsubishi Galant is going to be four cylinder only …”
I will be surprised if Mitsubishi is still in the US market a year from now. Mitsubishi dealers are dropping like flies.
Note 1: Actually, more F-150s were dumped than Explorers. Explorer 4WD was the most dumped vehicle if you separate out drivetrains and count 4WD and 2WD separately.
Note 2: I don’t entirely disagree with your point about the trend, but doesn’t the fact that the Explorer and F-150 were around the highest selling qualifying vehicles mean that they would automatically be one of the most dumped vehicles?
Vehicles beyond a certain age have an increased chance to either be already not driveable and not worth fixing, or are owned by people for whom $4500 still isn’t worth it for them to buy a new car to replace it. (Which is why poor people can get screwed by destroying the cars, since fewer used cars will be on the market for them, and they can’t afford new ones.)
The Explorer and F-150 undoubtedly made up a very large percentage of automobiles that qualified by mileage, qualified because they still ran, and were owned by people for whom $4500 was sufficient for them to buy a new car.
And don’t forget savings on testing (including performance, safety, emissions, etc.) and federalization.
****the current Genesis sedan is about the size of a BMW 7 series – a car about the size of a BMW 5 series priced where the Azera is now, would be a mega-seller.****
ya, makes you wonder if Hyundai’s going to come out with a baby Genesis to replace the Azera. Would make sense if you wanted to up-sell anyone wanting a v6.
A baby Genesis would really put the screws on Acura.
Actually, Audi did pretty well with the 2009 2.0T A4, despite not having a competitor to the C350/335i/IS350/G37, since the 3.2L V6 was so lacking. They just created charts and banners comparing the 2.0T to the 328/C300/IS250. Perhaps Audi is just good at marketing or hot these days.
No, 2009 Audi A4s came with a 3.2L V6 option. But it was relatively underpowered compared to competitors’ offerings and was dropped (see above). The 2010 only has the 2.0T. Also, the A4 Quattro already has EPA highway mileage about 25mpg; 27 for auto and 30 for manual (and I believe that CAFE mpg is based off the old higher EPA numbers).
Heck, the 2010 S4 has an EPA highway mpg of 27 (manual) and 28 (auto– EPA tests love the DSG).
All of you praising 4 cylinders need to get out more.
My daily drivers were rated a mere 113 (’85), 133 (’96), and 153bhp (’07) with their respective 4 bangers. 0-60mph in 10 seconds is enough for me, but YMMV.
dolorean23 :
September 28th, 2009 at 12:19 pm
1. Today’s 4 are MORE poweeful than the 90s V6s, both in HP and Torque.
2. The increase in HP has been far greater than the increase in Weight of these cars!
3. If you still need more HP and TOrque, and at far lower, useful RPM, get a 4 with a TURBO.
4. A 3,000-3,500 lb compact-midsize car with 200 HP and even with the full 5 passengers has more than ample power to merge, but most of the time it willbe just the driver COMMUTING, and then it of course is even more potent, having a far smaller TOTAL weight.
“the current Genesis sedan is about the size of a BMW 7 series (SIC)”
Some may challenge even that.. but regardless, that is probably the ONLY thing the boring Merc E-class clone Genesis has in common with the “MAGNIFICENT 7″ .
How fat and heavy will the new Sonata be?
That’s a big question if it’s four cylinder only. “Midsize” family sedans today are actually yesterday’s fullsizes and are huge.
Many of today’s fours have to be caned to take advantage of those power numbers they advertise and lack low-end oomph.
Also, what exactly is the point of getting the four cylinder if it uses nearly as much gasoline to move the car as the V6? That’s another thing I’ve noticed about four-cylinder cars and cute utes. They use just as much fuel as the V6 option but provide less power and towing capacity.
That’s not exactly efficient.
Or do you prefer LS460 clone Genesis Sedan?
As for the so-called Hyundai “genesis” coupe, I have not seen a greater FRAUD, as it has NOTHING in common with the sedan, not even the V8, and it is a much smaller, 500 lbs lighter vehicle, based on a different platform altogether.