Comments on: Lincoln BPS (Originally Published in 2003)

By: skor

skor — Tue, 03 Feb 2009 03:39:21 +0000

Here’s a video from the annual Knob Creek(Kentucky) machine gun shoot. All the guns you see in this video are privately owned. I fart in the general direction of your up-armored limos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31vm3-BQRJU&feature=related

By: kazoomaloo

kazoomaloo — Wed, 28 Jan 2009 02:32:09 +0000

oh god westhigh… I’ve learned never to question why somebody needs a bazooka in their closet at home, everybody’s got their reasons, whether they make much sense or not. It’s best not to start up that line of questioning at a car site, or any site whatsoever…

By: GS650G

GS650G — Sat, 24 Jan 2009 15:17:35 +0000

westhighgoalie :

The 2nd Amendment

By: radimus

radimus — Sun, 18 Jan 2009 03:11:20 +0000

Having a good time at the range blasting holes in 1/2 inch thick plate steel sounds like a perfectly justifiable and legal good time.

How far do you really want to take that, west? After all, what possible legal justified use does anyone have for a car like a Bugatti Veyron? Or even a Corvette? Or a Mustang? Or for that matter any car with more that 150 hp? Or more than 100 hp? Obviously people only want high powered, good handling cars to go faster than the posted speed limit and drive recklessly. The only people that should have vehicles like that are the police and military.

By: westhighgoalie

westhighgoalie — Sat, 17 Jan 2009 08:46:22 +0000

What is wrong with some of u guys??

***what possible (Legal) justified use is there for a 7.62 or .308 armor piercing round!

The only people who should have that is police snipers and the military.

By: blowfish

blowfish — Sat, 17 Jan 2009 06:54:11 +0000

See if anybody heard of this story,
An Armoured BMW in Asia somewhere has the system disabled and locked her indignified occupants inside for several hours. A car like that is not that simple as smashing something against the window to free them!

By: JEC

JEC — Sat, 17 Jan 2009 02:57:54 +0000

Areitu,

I’ll have to suggest that to him.

Flashpoint,

I have a Colombian girlfriend. Narrow views like that don’t help her in any situation (”Oh you are from Colombia? Got any good stuff? Ha ha ha.”). Keep an open mind and remember that there are other countries in the world other than your own, and people chose to live their for the same reasons we live in our homes of choice – love of the nation, love of the land, friends, family, and any other reason you need to stay in a land of “kidnappings and gun crimes”.

People in Canada often spout the same kind of ideas about the USA. I’m not one of them.

By: NickR

NickR — Fri, 16 Jan 2009 19:55:39 +0000

degrouch…right you are, Kenny :)

By: degrouch

degrouch — Fri, 16 Jan 2009 18:28:09 +0000

NickR: The M1 Garand was chambered in .30-06, which was (and still is, by many) considered a high-powered round. The M1 Carbine was chambered in .30 Carbine, which was a much lower-powered cartridge. Very different rifles and cartridges.

I agree–they really should be designing against a .50BMG AP round, but I’m not sure there is a practical (possible?) way to do that, for a limo-type vehicle. I guess, better .308 than nothing…

By: NickR

NickR — Fri, 16 Jan 2009 16:40:27 +0000

For the record, the M1 Garand was chambered in .30 Caliber. It is, by rifle standards, very weak. It is small enough to be used in some single action revolvers and for a time an auto pistol.

A smaller round, with a high sectional density like a 6.5 Magnum or even a 6.5×55 Swede would probably penetrate most defenses. Of course, a determined assailant would buy a .50 and be done with it.

If I am not mistaken, you can still get a Grand Marquis with extra thick glass.

By: Areitu

Areitu — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 23:00:37 +0000

# JEC :
January 15th, 2009 at 8:50 am

I have a friend, who will remain nameless, who is chauffered in a level III car. His machine has fixed windows to minimize risk. I had to laugh when I heard about him driving through a downtown area, spotting his wife at the shop, and opening the door to call her over to say hello. Oops.

BMW offers a PA system for their armored cars in Europe for situations just like that.

By: GeeDashOff

GeeDashOff — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 21:39:27 +0000

These days I’d be more worried about something like this, but on a much bigger scale:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QMf8DbZAD6Y

“Can a piece of glass go through 2 inches of solid steel? Yes”

But I guess you would buy something else if you were worried about explosives.

By: CAHIBOstep

CAHIBOstep — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 21:28:32 +0000

It seems like there is a Ted Kennedy joke for almost every conceivable situation.

By: Flashpoint

Flashpoint — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 21:12:48 +0000

I hear in Brazil and parts of S.America, you need BP glass on cars because of kidnappings and gun crimes.

In my opinion, if I lived in a place like that, rather than buy a car, I’d buy A ONE WAY TICKET THE FK OUT !!!!

By: skor

skor — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 21:09:22 +0000

It’ll stand up to a round of .308? Lead core or armor piercing ammo?

Here is a picture of a cast iron small block Chevy engine that I shot to pieces using a surplus M38 Mosin-Nagant and surplus 7.62X54R armor piercing ammo.

http://mysite.verizon.net/vze3j6z2/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/EBS.jpg

I took this picture at my hunting club in Pennsylvania. A local redneck dumped the engine on club property, and I used it to test the penetrating power of the 7.62X54R AP. All the damage you see was caused by that AP ammo.

Keep in mind that I did this with a 70 year old surplus Russian Army rifle that I purchased at a gun show for $69.95. The ammo was 40 year old Cold War surplus that I purchased for $39.95(440 rounds packed in a large “spam can”).

By: cwp

cwp — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 18:49:34 +0000

Remind me never to piss any of you off.

To tie the two conversational threads back together with an infamous bumper sticker: “Ted Kennedy’s car has killed more people than my guns.” :)

By: psarhjinian

psarhjinian — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 18:29:47 +0000

Jesus, there’s a lot of gun nuts on this site. Remind me never to piss any of you off.

By: findude

findude — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 17:56:24 +0000

If you look at the Presidential new cadillac . . . . This is a one off custom job costing millions.

There’s no way there is only one, and they will be used as decoys some of the time.

Years ago in college (likely before many of TTAC’s best and brightest were born), I worked as a valet at fancy restaurants and high-end weddings and other events. Ferris Bueller jokes aside, this is a job I highly recommend to any car fan.

One event was a political fundraiser, and the president in office at that time arrived. He flew into a local airport in Air Force One and was helicoptered to a field a couple of miles away. The motorcade included two presidential Cadillacs, an ambulance, and several white passenger vans full of secret service guys (yeah, so long ago it was before the ubiquitous black Suburban). The obligatory police and squad cars from the local law enforcement accompanied in ridiculously large numbers.

The president was in one of the vans. I can’t speak for the level of armoring it had, but the windows looked like the glass at the walk-up teller outside my bank.

By: Paul Niedermeyer

Paul Niedermeyer — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 17:28:21 +0000

The new Caddy limo has nothing in common with a DTS, except for some styling cues. It’s actually a medium duty (Top Kick) GMC truck chassis with a completely custom body. More like a military armored personnel carrier with a Caddy styling theme.

By: Stewart Dean

Stewart Dean — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 17:12:42 +0000

Not a gun freak but I think I have this correct:
The .308 W/7.56 Nato round is about ballistically identical to to the .30-06 round. The difference is that the cartridge brass was shortened so it could reliably be used in an auto or semi-auto action…the length of the -.06 round meant that the action had too much throw…shorter brass means shorter action throw.
We now return to our regular programming

By: jerry weber

jerry weber — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 17:12:02 +0000

If you look at the Presidential new cadillac, it is even more of a bank vault than the lincoln. The doors are massive framed things and the windows made smaller. The frame is I;m told from a Suburban and as someone says it has DTS skin stretched over it. This is a one off custom job costing millions. Further the caddy is bomb proof, no mention of that by lincoln. the lincoln is a multi edition product affordable by many corporate and political elites.

By: cwp

cwp — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 16:53:02 +0000

Do you get a lot of people who can actually hold on a deer-sized target at 300 yards with a .300 Magnum? The recoil on those things is pretty fearsome.

degrouch: I wonder what the car equivalent of the .308/7.62×51 debate is? :) Your advice is sound, though; you probably won’t have any problem swapping between the two, but better safe than sorry. And all bets are off if you’re loading your own …

By: Kurt.

Kurt. — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 16:52:27 +0000

My question though is that if you are important enough to need a sniper proof car, then how does it stand up to a .50 cal sniper round? What about armor piercing?

I remember several years ago getting to shoot 7.62mm AP through brake rotors, engine blocks and the cinder block walls they were leaned against…

By: degrouch

degrouch — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 16:47:53 +0000

cwp: Agreed, don’t want to get too much into ballistics here, but as a Public Safety Announcement…
The 7.62×51 NATO round is *very close* to the .308Win, but not identical. The NATO round is just a tad longer. Bad things *can* happen if incorrect ammo is used, though many people interchange w/o any problems.

Sorry for the non-auto side-track. I’d just hate for someone to get hurt by grabbing the wrong box of ammo.

By: radimus

radimus — Thu, 15 Jan 2009 16:08:35 +0000

@cwp: Your “generation of lousy rifle shots” comment is probably pretty close to the truth. The only reason these calibers are popular is because they have such a flat trajectory. Inside of 200 yards you don’t have to account for much of any bullet drop. Even at 300 yards there is only about 6-7 inches of drop with factory ammo when zeroed in at 200 yards.

Ballistics? Knowing how your rifle really performs? Bah. Who has time for that?