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	<title>Comments on: GM&#8217;s Toxic Assets</title>
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	<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/</link>
	<description>The Truth About Cars is dedicated to providing candid, unbiased automobile reviews and the latest in auto industry news.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 22:48:25 -0500</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Captain Tungsten (of GM)</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506457</link>
		<dc:creator>Captain Tungsten (of GM)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 14:31:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506457</guid>
		<description>GM has reclaimed many of it&#039;s old industrial sites, examples include the Centerpoint site in Pontiac, which was originally a truck assembly plant, the site of the Pontiac foundry on which a U.S. Postal Service processing facility stands, the powertrain plant in Flint which had to be remediated before the new I-6/I-5 plant could be built.  There are other examples as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->GM has reclaimed many of it&#8217;s old industrial sites, examples include the Centerpoint site in Pontiac, which was originally a truck assembly plant, the site of the Pontiac foundry on which a U.S. Postal Service processing facility stands, the powertrain plant in Flint which had to be remediated before the new I-6/I-5 plant could be built.  There are other examples as well.<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: NickR</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506452</link>
		<dc:creator>NickR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 14:27:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506452</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;Look at all the jobs GM created by polluting the environment!&lt;/em&gt;

Exactly, talk about job creation.  The companies that make hazmat suits will throw &#039;er in high gear, unused excavators and dump trucks can be used to move this stuff...somewhere.  And loads of people doing the testing, digging, shipping and everything else required for environmental remediation.  It will keep thousands employed for years to come.  May as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start --><em>Look at all the jobs GM created by polluting the environment!</em></p>
<p>Exactly, talk about job creation.  The companies that make hazmat suits will throw &#8216;er in high gear, unused excavators and dump trucks can be used to move this stuff&#8230;somewhere.  And loads of people doing the testing, digging, shipping and everything else required for environmental remediation.  It will keep thousands employed for years to come.  May as well.<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: npbheights</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506424</link>
		<dc:creator>npbheights</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 13:55:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506424</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;And you’ll be paying for it. Government Motor’s environmental liabilities for all sites are estimated at $530 million. Fritz Henderson said money needed to wind down the old GM was $1.25 billion, up from an earlier estimate of $950 million, because of a reassessment of the environmental liabilities.&lt;/em&gt;

After the $20,000,000,000.00 the US government gave GM the last six months that they used for God knows what, doesn&#039;t an extra one or two billion seem really cheap to fix all of the environmental disasters GM has created over the past 100 years?  At least it seems like a lot better use of government money.  Look at all the jobs GM created by polluting the environment!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start --><em>And you’ll be paying for it. Government Motor’s environmental liabilities for all sites are estimated at $530 million. Fritz Henderson said money needed to wind down the old GM was $1.25 billion, up from an earlier estimate of $950 million, because of a reassessment of the environmental liabilities.</em></p>
<p>After the $20,000,000,000.00 the US government gave GM the last six months that they used for God knows what, doesn&#8217;t an extra one or two billion seem really cheap to fix all of the environmental disasters GM has created over the past 100 years?  At least it seems like a lot better use of government money.  Look at all the jobs GM created by polluting the environment!<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: jpcavanaugh</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506417</link>
		<dc:creator>jpcavanaugh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 13:43:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506417</guid>
		<description>I would be very surprised if GM gets out from under this.  Even if old GM goes out without enough money to pay the environmental claim, New GM will likely be liable as a company that is, essentially, a continuation of the same operation.

In Indiana, we recently had a case where a company is being held responsible for environmental contamination at the old Studebaker factory, that is only now being torn down.  Although Studebaker stopped building cars at the site in 1963, the successor to the corporation that was set up to continue all of Studebaker&#039;s other businesses is being held responsible for the cleanup.  GM is not going to get out from under this by changing corporate forms and then staying in the carbuilding business.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->I would be very surprised if GM gets out from under this.  Even if old GM goes out without enough money to pay the environmental claim, New GM will likely be liable as a company that is, essentially, a continuation of the same operation.</p>
<p>In Indiana, we recently had a case where a company is being held responsible for environmental contamination at the old Studebaker factory, that is only now being torn down.  Although Studebaker stopped building cars at the site in 1963, the successor to the corporation that was set up to continue all of Studebaker&#8217;s other businesses is being held responsible for the cleanup.  GM is not going to get out from under this by changing corporate forms and then staying in the carbuilding business.<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: johnny ro</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506385</link>
		<dc:creator>johnny ro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 12:14:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506385</guid>
		<description>St Lawrence Seaway from Lake Ontario to Vermont was beautiful country when I drove it 10 years ago. 

I remember what is a large town for the area-  Messina - and seeing evidence of former prosperity, but activity was comprised of lots of poor looking people hustling into and out of Walmart parking lot in their rusty cars and trucks.  Crumbling older buildings in a recognizeable village remnant arrangement either vacant or underutilized.  I am sure its worse today, with recent dairy industry collapse, and both GM and Alcoa (hydropower fed smelter) closing.

Yes, GM has other many disaster sites, of their own creation, like other manufacturing companies.  I remember one in Syracuse, a large facility, standing empty, high chain link fence around huge empty parking field, GM kept it &quot;open&quot; after production ended, meaning closed and dark and fenced and guarded but not officially closed, because to officially close it triggers cleanup. 

They said its better for today&#039;s profits to let later generation clean up today&#039;s mess.  Or not clean it up, its their problem, right? They did not say this in press release though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->St Lawrence Seaway from Lake Ontario to Vermont was beautiful country when I drove it 10 years ago. </p>
<p>I remember what is a large town for the area-  Messina &#8211; and seeing evidence of former prosperity, but activity was comprised of lots of poor looking people hustling into and out of Walmart parking lot in their rusty cars and trucks.  Crumbling older buildings in a recognizeable village remnant arrangement either vacant or underutilized.  I am sure its worse today, with recent dairy industry collapse, and both GM and Alcoa (hydropower fed smelter) closing.</p>
<p>Yes, GM has other many disaster sites, of their own creation, like other manufacturing companies.  I remember one in Syracuse, a large facility, standing empty, high chain link fence around huge empty parking field, GM kept it &#8220;open&#8221; after production ended, meaning closed and dark and fenced and guarded but not officially closed, because to officially close it triggers cleanup. </p>
<p>They said its better for today&#8217;s profits to let later generation clean up today&#8217;s mess.  Or not clean it up, its their problem, right? They did not say this in press release though.<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: Robert Farago</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506375</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Farago</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 11:33:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506375</guid>
		<description>The cost of cleaning-up polluted industrial sites is enormous. GM has hundreds of them. I don&#039;t think these numbers are right. At all. 

So . . . does New GM walk away from the legal obligation to clean them up, even if they&#039;re NOT sold?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->The cost of cleaning-up polluted industrial sites is enormous. GM has hundreds of them. I don&#8217;t think these numbers are right. At all. </p>
<p>So . . . does New GM walk away from the legal obligation to clean them up, even if they&#8217;re NOT sold?<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: NickR</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506373</link>
		<dc:creator>NickR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 11:11:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506373</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;“Should the bailout money (which is all there is at this point unless you count the impending liquidations) be spent on an industrial clean-up instead of building competitive vehicles?”&lt;/em&gt;

What are you kidding me?  Have you ever read about PCBs and their effects on the food chain in general and on human health in particular?  Cleaning this crap up should be the first priority.

Just goes to show that environmentalists are right...preempting environmental pollution is a damn sight cheaper than ignoring it and leaving the clean up for down the road.

That being said, the environment is an excellent reason for many Western nations to close the door on Chinese crap (which they should).  Regrettably, they have us by the financial short and curlies now, so that could be tough.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start --><em>“Should the bailout money (which is all there is at this point unless you count the impending liquidations) be spent on an industrial clean-up instead of building competitive vehicles?”</em></p>
<p>What are you kidding me?  Have you ever read about PCBs and their effects on the food chain in general and on human health in particular?  Cleaning this crap up should be the first priority.</p>
<p>Just goes to show that environmentalists are right&#8230;preempting environmental pollution is a damn sight cheaper than ignoring it and leaving the clean up for down the road.</p>
<p>That being said, the environment is an excellent reason for many Western nations to close the door on Chinese crap (which they should).  Regrettably, they have us by the financial short and curlies now, so that could be tough.<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: sutski</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506362</link>
		<dc:creator>sutski</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 09:45:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506362</guid>
		<description>“Should the bailout money (which is all there is at this point unless you count the impending liquidations) be spent on an industrial clean-up instead of building competitive vehicles?”

Yes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->“Should the bailout money (which is all there is at this point unless you count the impending liquidations) be spent on an industrial clean-up instead of building competitive vehicles?”</p>
<p>Yes.<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: Bertel Schmitt</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506353</link>
		<dc:creator>Bertel Schmitt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 09:29:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506353</guid>
		<description>Steven:
&lt;i&gt;Wait until the Chinese decide to stop buying so much of our T-Bills… then feel free to get back to me.&lt;/i&gt;

&quot;July 2 (Bloomberg) -- China hopes that the dollar’s exchange rate will “remain stable” as the world’s international reserve currency, Vice Foreign Minister He Yafei told reporters in Beijing. It wouldn’t be unusual for Group of Eight leaders to discuss a new reserve currency at this month’s summit, He said.&quot;  

The USD lost 1.5 cents against the EUR right after that remark (the $ recovered later.)

&lt;i&gt;A lot of folks would prioritize jobs and financial health over an industrial clean-up. &lt;/i&gt; 

China had done that in the past and got lambasted for it.

You can&#039;t paint yourself green, and at the same time walk away from the environmental sins you have committed in the not too distant past.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->Steven:<br />
<i>Wait until the Chinese decide to stop buying so much of our T-Bills… then feel free to get back to me.</i></p>
<p>&#8220;July 2 (Bloomberg) &#8212; China hopes that the dollar’s exchange rate will “remain stable” as the world’s international reserve currency, Vice Foreign Minister He Yafei told reporters in Beijing. It wouldn’t be unusual for Group of Eight leaders to discuss a new reserve currency at this month’s summit, He said.&#8221;  </p>
<p>The USD lost 1.5 cents against the EUR right after that remark (the $ recovered later.)</p>
<p><i>A lot of folks would prioritize jobs and financial health over an industrial clean-up. </i> </p>
<p>China had done that in the past and got lambasted for it.</p>
<p>You can&#8217;t paint yourself green, and at the same time walk away from the environmental sins you have committed in the not too distant past.<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: mistrernee</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506345</link>
		<dc:creator>mistrernee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 06:37:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506345</guid>
		<description>&quot;Should the bailout money (which is all there is at this point unless you count the impending liquidations) be spent on an industrial clean-up instead of building competitive vehicles?&quot;

Yes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->&#8220;Should the bailout money (which is all there is at this point unless you count the impending liquidations) be spent on an industrial clean-up instead of building competitive vehicles?&#8221;</p>
<p>Yes.<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: Rastus</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506340</link>
		<dc:creator>Rastus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 06:00:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506340</guid>
		<description>This is what we need to do to clean up GM&#039;s &quot;toxic assets&quot;...and we need to do it ASAP!!

http://www.jewcy.com/files/crushed-cars-2.jpg</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->This is what we need to do to clean up GM&#8217;s &#8220;toxic assets&#8221;&#8230;and we need to do it ASAP!!</p>
<p><a href="http://www.jewcy.com/files/crushed-cars-2.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://www.jewcy.com/files/crushed-cars-2.jpg</a><!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: Steven Lang</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506339</link>
		<dc:creator>Steven Lang</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 05:54:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506339</guid>
		<description>To be perfectly honest, I&#039;m very surprised that a company as large and as industrial as GM wouldn&#039;t have a far broader variety of waste sites over the decades.

The amount of chemicals and hazardous materials automakers have dealt with over the decades registers well into the thousands of tons. It&#039;s a sad reality. But the development of any industrial empire of modern times has resulted in unintended consequences as it relates to poison and human health.

What&#039;s the alternative? Should GM keep all the properties you mentioned and hope for the best? Should the bailout money (which is all there is at this point unless you count the impending liquidations) be spent on an industrial clean-up instead of building competitive vehicles? 

Let&#039;s ask the really important question. Is it worth it?

A lot of folks would prioritize jobs and financial health over an industrial clean-up and the impending lawsuits. Personally, I&#039;d be interested to find out whether there was any true malicious intent. But I also think that the economic crisis we&#039;re in now is far more important than righting the stupidities of 40+ years ago.

If GM cut off it&#039;s uncompetitive assets and kept the world class products and facilities that it already has, everyone would be far better off. Now if we&#039;re talking about Chrysler then the idea of liquidation over reorganization is obvious to anyone other than the politicos that preside. But GM still is worth far more as a whole to our country than torn apart into dozens of little Chinese government subsidized bits.

Wait until the Chinese decide to stop buying so much of our T-Bills... then feel free to get back to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->To be perfectly honest, I&#8217;m very surprised that a company as large and as industrial as GM wouldn&#8217;t have a far broader variety of waste sites over the decades.</p>
<p>The amount of chemicals and hazardous materials automakers have dealt with over the decades registers well into the thousands of tons. It&#8217;s a sad reality. But the development of any industrial empire of modern times has resulted in unintended consequences as it relates to poison and human health.</p>
<p>What&#8217;s the alternative? Should GM keep all the properties you mentioned and hope for the best? Should the bailout money (which is all there is at this point unless you count the impending liquidations) be spent on an industrial clean-up instead of building competitive vehicles? </p>
<p>Let&#8217;s ask the really important question. Is it worth it?</p>
<p>A lot of folks would prioritize jobs and financial health over an industrial clean-up and the impending lawsuits. Personally, I&#8217;d be interested to find out whether there was any true malicious intent. But I also think that the economic crisis we&#8217;re in now is far more important than righting the stupidities of 40+ years ago.</p>
<p>If GM cut off it&#8217;s uncompetitive assets and kept the world class products and facilities that it already has, everyone would be far better off. Now if we&#8217;re talking about Chrysler then the idea of liquidation over reorganization is obvious to anyone other than the politicos that preside. But GM still is worth far more as a whole to our country than torn apart into dozens of little Chinese government subsidized bits.</p>
<p>Wait until the Chinese decide to stop buying so much of our T-Bills&#8230; then feel free to get back to me.<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: PeteMoran</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506338</link>
		<dc:creator>PeteMoran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 05:50:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506338</guid>
		<description>Those darn capitalist &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Externality&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Externalities&lt;/a&gt;!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->Those darn capitalist <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Externality" rel="nofollow">Externalities</a>!<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: venator</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506332</link>
		<dc:creator>venator</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 05:13:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506332</guid>
		<description>Bertel, the Corvair was more of a 1960s car.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->Bertel, the Corvair was more of a 1960s car.<!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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		<title>By: Rastus</title>
		<link>http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/gms-toxic-assets/comment-page-1/#comment-1506331</link>
		<dc:creator>Rastus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 04:58:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321833#comment-1506331</guid>
		<description>Bertel, with all due respect...GM can pollute the sky, the air, the skyline, the earth, and the water....

...but nothing compares to the PCB/toxic waste/carcinogenic crap they have bestowed upon their cash-paying customers.

The Corvair you mention is but one of many fine examples.

Toxic garbage, in the case of GM, is not a &quot;by product&quot;...it is THE main output...even to this day!!

This is how we must go about cleaning up GM:

http://www.jewcy.com/files/crushed-cars-2.jpg</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><!-- google_ad_section_start -->Bertel, with all due respect&#8230;GM can pollute the sky, the air, the skyline, the earth, and the water&#8230;.</p>
<p>&#8230;but nothing compares to the PCB/toxic waste/carcinogenic crap they have bestowed upon their cash-paying customers.</p>
<p>The Corvair you mention is but one of many fine examples.</p>
<p>Toxic garbage, in the case of GM, is not a &#8220;by product&#8221;&#8230;it is THE main output&#8230;even to this day!!</p>
<p>This is how we must go about cleaning up GM:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.jewcy.com/files/crushed-cars-2.jpg" rel="nofollow">http://www.jewcy.com/files/crushed-cars-2.jpg</a><!-- google_ad_section_end --></p>
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