| Date: | 09/21/2009 | Ref. number: | Service / Warranty / |
| Subject: | Changes to the General Motors 100,000 Mile/5 Year Powertrain Warranty for 2010 Model Year Vehicles - |
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GM Service Operations
**Urgent Message**
DCS 412
DATE: September 21, 2009
TO: All US GM Dealers, Service Directors, Warranty Administrators and Parts Managers
SUBJECT: Changes to the General Motors 100,000 Mile/5 Year Powertrain Warranty for 2010 Model Year Vehicles
This message is to provide information regarding the a few changes to the GM Powertrain Warranty for 2010 model year vehicles. Previous model year vehicles are NOT affected by these changes.
For model year 2010, General Motors is announcing a slight change in the components that are covered under the 100,000 mile/5 year limited warranty on all light duty cars and trucks. The Warranty and Owner Assistance Information booklets have already been updated with these changes in all New 2010 model GM vehicles.
The following items have been eliminated from the Powertrain portion of the coverage for 2010, however, they will continue to be covered for the entire length of the Bumper to Bumper Limited Warranty for all GM vehicles. Select components may also be covered by Federal or State Emission coverage. Please refer to the Labor Time Guide and Policies and Procedures (P&P) manual for further details.
1) The entire pressurized fuel system (in-tank fuel pump, lines, fuel rail, injectors and return line.
2) The Engine/Powertrain Control Module (ECM/PCM) and module programming.
3) The Transmission Control Module (TCM), Transfer Case Control Module and module programming.
4) The Throttle Body Assembly.
5) Clutch and Pressure Plate for Manual Transmission.
6) Sealed Wheel Bearing Assemblies or Hub and Bearing Assemblies (axle shafts, seals and bearings that are part of
complete axle housings are still covered).
The following items have been added to the Powertrain portion of the coverage for 2010.
1) Engine oiling system including the hoses, lines and cooler.
2) Crankshaft Pulley.
3) Clutch Master Cylinder.
The GMVIS (GM Vehicle Inquiry System) and the new Global Warranty Management Investigate Vehicle History screen allows you to identify this new warranty by the abbreviated description under the Applicable Warranties section. The word warranty at the end of the description is abbreviated “WTY”. Previous 100,000 mile/5 Year Warranties have the entire word spelled out.
60/100,000 Powertrain Coverage Limited WTY (2010 Model Year example)
Subsequent communications will address other programs that may be coordinated with the New Vehicle Limited Warranty on our vehicles.
The attached wording is what is outlined in all 2010 Warranty and Owner Assistance Information booklets for all GM vehicles.
Engine Coverage Includes: All internally lubricated parts, engine oil cooling hoses, lines and radiators. Also included are all actuators and electrical components internal to the engine (i.e.: Active Fuel Management Valve Lifter Oil Manifold, etc.) as well as the Engine/Powertrain Control Module, module programming, cylinder head, block, timing gears, timing chain, timing cover, oil pump/oil pump housing, OHC carriers, valve covers, oil pan, seals, gaskets, manifolds, flywheel, water pump, harmonic balancer, engine mount, starter motor, turbocharger and supercharger. Timing belts are covered until the first scheduled maintenance interval.
Exclusions: Excluded from the powertrain coverage are sensors, wiring, connectors, engine radiator, coolant hoses, fans, coolant and heater core. Coverage on the engine cooling system begins at the inlet to the water pump and ends with the thermostat housing and/or outlet that attaches to the return hose. Also excluded is the entire pressurized fuel system (in-tank fuel pump, pressure lines, fuel rail(s), regulator, injectors and return line) as well as the Engine/Powertrain Control Module and/or module programming.
Transmission/Transaxle Coverage Includes: All internally lubricated parts, case, torque converter, mounts, seals and gaskets as well as any electrical components internal to the transmission/transaxle. Also covered are any actuators directly connected to the transmission (Slave cylinder, etc.).
Exclusions: Excluded from the powertrain coverage are transmission cooling lines, hoses, radiator, sensors, wiring and electrical connectors. Also excluded are the clutch and pressure plate as well as any Transmission Control Module and/or module programming.
The Transfer Case Coverage Includes: All internally lubricated parts, case, mounts, seals and gaskets as well as any electrical components internal to the transfer case. Also covered are any actuators directly connected to the transfer case as well as encoder motor.
Exclusions: Excluded from the powertrain coverage are transfer case cooling lines, hoses, radiator, sensors, wiring, electrical connectors as well as the transfer case control module and/or module programming.
The Drive Systems Coverage Includes: All internally lubricated parts, final drive housings, axle shafts and bearings, constant velocity joints, propeller shafts, universal joints. All mounts, supports, seals, gaskets as well as any electrical components internal to the drive axle. Also covered are any actuators directly connected to the drive axle (i.e.: front differential actuator, etc).
Exclusions: Excluded from the powertrain coverage are all wheel bearings, drive wheel front and rear hub bearings, locking hubs,drive system cooling, lines, hoses, radiator, sensors, wiring and electrical connectors related to drive systems as well as any drive system control module and/or module programming.
Courtesy Transportation Program
During the 100,000 mile/5 year warranty coverage period, alternate transportation and/or reimbursement of certain transportation expenses will be available under the Courtesy Transportation Program if your vehicle requires warranty repairs. Several transportation options are available. Refer to the Owners Manual for details,
What Is Not Covered
All the above items are not covered for damage due to accident, misuse, alteration, insufficient or improper maintenance, contaminated or poor quality fuel. Medium Duty trucks, including the C4500, are excluded from this powertrain coverage. For complete details refer to your Warranty and Owner Assistance Information Booklet.
Roadside Assistance Program
General Motors is proud to offer the response, security, and convenience of the 24-hour Roadside Assistance Program for a period of 100,000 miles/5 years, whichever comes first. Refer to your Owner Manual for details, or consult your dealer/retailer. The Roadside Assistance contact information is listed in the Customer Assistance Offices section of the Warranty and Owner Assistance Information booklet.
Goodwill Adjustments on Powertrain Items
Based on the addition of the New 100,000 Mile/5 Year Powertrain Warranty, GM would expect that very few powertrain repairs would be considered for Goodwill adjustments outside the 100,000 Mile/5 Year Powertain Warranty period. We ask that dealers continue to analyze goodwill decisions on a case by case basis and recognize that time and mileage are always a factor. Total Goodwill dollars spent will continue to be communicated to all GM dealers as a memo item at the bottom of the GM Dealer Analysis (DA) report. This will allow dealership service mangers to manage the expense and involve their District Service Manager when necessary.
The following labor operations make up the entire list that is included in the New 2010 Powertrain coverage. The Coverage Code section of the labor Time Guide will be updated with this information in the November 2009 release.
81 Comments on “GM Downsizes 100,000 Mile/5 Year Warranty...”
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for the average person the changes statistically are probably a wash.
however this doesn’t help that pesky non-existent perception gap.
That explains why the GM quality badge was removed.
2) The Engine/Powertrain Control Module (ECM/PCM) and module programming.
3) The Transmission Control Module (TCM), Transfer Case Control Module and module programming.
Hum….now why would they do that?
There are gonna be a lot of people sorry that they did not return it in 60 days. Why would GM think that you make more satisfied customers by acting like a bad HMO?
Attn: Robert Lutz
Re: Perception gap
It does not take much on the part of the car-buying public to perceive the gap between the Hyundai warranty and the GM warranty, and all of your bluster and gamemanship will not cover over THAT gap.
It does not take much on the part of the car-buying public to perceive the gap between the Hyundai warranty and the GM warranty, and all of your bluster and gamemanship will not cover over THAT gap.
+1
People have been hammering on this for a while. If GM wants to fix it’s perception problem, it needs concrete plans that people can bank on. Hyundai increased it’s coverage to ten years. Ford put serious money into quality and revamped it’s warranty-claims process. Both brands are garnering customers and moving up the quality rankings.
GM… has harped on about a perception gap and making hay about the quality rankings of a Buick sedan that they no longer make.
You want to change the perception gap? Change people’s perceptions. That’s basic marketing, and something an erstwhile VP of Marketing should know about.
Good thing the crankshaft pulley is covered; you never know when that might fail.
The clutch and pressure plate for manual transmissions should be removed, as they have done. Must have been an oversight to include such a wear item in the first place.
Excluded from the powertrain coverage are sensors, wiring, connectors, engine radiator, coolant hoses, fans, coolant and heater core. Also excluded is the entire pressurized fuel system (in-tank fuel pump, pressure lines, fuel rail(s), regulator, injectors and return line) as well as the Engine/Powertrain Control Module and/or module programming.
That’s quite reassuring. All the expensive stuff (parts or labor) aren’t part of the warranty. And is it saying that normal ECU software upgrades aren’t covered under this warranty?
So what’s the fine print on Hyundai’s 10 year/100k warranty? Is it as poorly conceived as GMs???
If they really wanted to save money they would just eliminate the warranty all together. Everyone knows that GM cars will last atleast 100K miles without any problems.
Too ‘wordy’ for a layman to understand although some components removed seem to be major. Really what’s important is how this compares to a Kia, Hyundia, Honda, or Toyota warranty. Can anyone say that these components are or are not covered?
At least we know they do not stand behind their products. So the timing belt is only covered for the first 6-7k miles?
It’s non-transferable.
BDB : Hyundai has exclusions on their powertrain items too…check it:
10 YEAR / 100,000 MILES POWERTRAIN PROTECTION Covers most engine & transaxle components. Covers repair or replacement of powertrain components (i.e. selected Engine and Transmission/Transaxle components), originally manufactured or installed by Hyundai that are defective in material or factory workmanship, under normal use and maintenance.
I want to know those “selected Engine and Transmission/Transaxle components” for sure.
GM downsizes the warranty. ” May the best car win.”
General Motors is moving in the wrong direction to persuade me, a previous multiple GM customer, to buy another.
Domestic cars dominate Consumer Reports’ annual worst of the worst list. Every long-term reliability, durability and warranty repair survey confirms they are markedly inferior to their class leading competitors. Since 2005, GM’s Canadian market share has slid to 12.1-percent from 23.1-percent. In 2000, it held more than 27-percent.
Most Asian manufacturers embrace kaizen, Japanese for continuous improvement. If something doesn’t work they respond reasonably promptly with corrective measures and extended warranties. The domestic carmakers not. If something doesn’t work they ignore it. If it does work they cheapen it until it doesn’t work anymore.
This is not the confidence builder GM urgently requires.
Also, this sounds more like tweaking than “downsizing” to me. Seems like a wash.
And while not as good as Hyundai’s, GM warranty is longer than the one Toyota and Honda gives you.
2) The Engine/Powertrain Control Module (ECM/PCM) and module programming.
3) The Transmission Control Module (TCM), Transfer Case Control Module and module programming.
Hum….now why would they do that?
Because they can argue that the control modules are part of the electrical system, not the drivetrain.
Obviously, fuel injection and control electronics are expensive to replace so I’m sure there’s some cost savings expectations here.
Before bashing GM, it’d be interesting to see if other manufacturers consider FI and ECUs to be part of the drivetrain warranty.
Eight years for Honda to own up to shrapnel-filled airbags. Eight years.
And Toyota still won’t talk about the paint flaking problem of the Scion tC.
Re: slateslate … the fuel system is actually a costly item since the fuel rail, injectors, and pump are easily damaged. Back in that post about the fuel additives, I commented that accidentally running out of gas can severely damage your fuel system – which is why your fuel light comes on when you actually still have many miles of fuel remaining. Of course, no customer ever admits to running out of gas when they bring their car in for repair – so it’s a warranty item. It’s reasonable GM to strip out fuel-system issues from this warranty since they are actually a major cost item during a warranty period… but obviously the motive from the customer’s perspective is suspect.
Regarding the ECM and TCM programming – so many people flash their computers with aftermarket items that it’s also wise for them to refuse covering those issues. Go check the internet for Diablo Tuners and the like… you’ll be surprised what people try to do to their cars with tweaks to the ECM / TCM programming.
Some customers tend to bring the bad things on themselves. Some people race their Evos in autocrosses and track days… and then they want warranty coverage to repair their their vehicles. I doubt issues would manifest themselves as business problems if people would just own up to their shenanigans.
The difference between Hyundai’s warranty and GM’s? Oh, About 5 years.
Hell what am I saying, I’m 31 years old, GM has never made a car I would have wanted anyway. (Corvette… doesn’t count)
all thosw W-Body cars.
The J Cars
the rattle prone F-Cars
the bloated LeSabres
the Celebrity
the caprice
the grand Am
I could go on about the crap GM has foisted on us but the simple fact is I own Honda’s because they start everyday and I don’t worry about whether I should take it out of town. GM lost me as a customer oh, 31 years ago. No improvement in warranty coverage makes up for 30 years of inferior product.
Restart the Death Watch!
You wouldn’t want to drive a CTS-V? Really?
How about a Malibu? “Never” is a very broad term, even when you exclude the Corvette.
Not a mechanic and I cant make heads or tails of this being better or worse technically speaking. From a business point of view however I can make a judgement. Dumb. For the millionth time..no gimmicks..no lawyer print bring out a knock your socks off warrenty to PROVE these are the best made. Fine print and folksy buy USA non sense doesnt work. Build the best vehicle, price it better then offer a warrenty that shuts everyone up. Tada you win or you can keep arranging the deck chairs on the titanic.
See, now this is why nobody will buy your cars, GM. The same old advertising promise of a great warranty with a bunch of asterisks after it, saying that the expensive parts aren’t covered.
The sad thing is that even if you offered a real 10/100 warranty with all parts covered, you’d have to work hard to actually convince folks that it’s not another GM B.S. warranty where most parts aren’t covered. That’s the real perception gap – folks think so low of you guys that they take everything you say with a grain of salt.
If the cars were as good as you say they are, you would offer a no-hold-barred 10/100 warranty. The fact that you don’t offer one tells me that you don’t believe in your product.
“You wouldn’t want to drive a CTS-V? Really?
How about a Malibu? “Never” is a very broad term, even when you exclude the Corvette.”
BDB :
September 22nd, 2009 at 3:16 pm
Fair enough, GM made a CTS i might like,the “V” but it doesn’t make a CTS i would want over a BMW of a simmilar price.
It’s not that GM hasn’t made compelling cars, it’s that they haven’t made good cars.
The Hyundai / Kia warranty has many exclusions that other warranties do not. A few participants in TrueDelta’s Car Reliability Survey have reported that 5/60 warranty coverage was denied on items that just about any other manufacturer would have covered under their basic warranty.
That said, GM has removed the most likely to fail within 5/100 bits from its coverage here. Fuel systems and wheel bearings are much more likely to fail than parts internal to the engine and transmission.
Do the powertrain warranties at Ford, Honda, and Toyota include these parts? Worth a look.
holydonut,
The number of people who mod their programming is not significant, and these people are unlikely to want GM’s settings returned. The number of GM owners who’ve had to reflash their transmission controls multiple times to try to fix shifting issues…far more significant.
Note to GM: TrueDelta doesn’t count free reflashes as repairs in our stats. We do count those that the customer has to pay for.
More of the same old GM showing through. They probably had a high rate of ECM and BCM failures along with fuel pumps and wheel bearings so those were eliminated to save $$$. This is GM we are talking about here. They have had over 10 years to correct there enternal intermediate steering shaft issues and here we are in 2009 with Impalas, LaCrosses and Malibus that are still affected. My 2008 Impala’s shaft sounds like the front end is coming apart when I make a left turn and accelerate. Haven’t had it in yet but the car now has over 50K on the clock so I’m probably screwed.
Holydonut: Then why not just have a complete void for people who flash their computers with aftermarket stuff? There are always going to be those folks out there and if they want to take a risk like that then they should pay the cost.
What this move does is punish people who did nothing wrong, it tells them before hand that there are a bunch of expensive parts that GM won’t cover no matter what happens – drive this brand new car at your own risk.
I haven’t seen this get much media coverage yet, but to my eyes it certainly makes GM look bad.
Sloan said:
Hell what am I saying, I’m 31 years old, GM has never made a car I would have wanted anyway.
BDB Responded:
You wouldn’t want to drive a CTS-V? Really?
I’m not Sloan, but I can definitely say NO FACKING WAY! Just speaking for myself, y’know!
How about a Malibu? “Never” is a very broad term, even when you exclude the Corvette.
A Malibu? Are you kidding me? I’m wretching with dry heaves at the thought, and without the aid of a spoon! “Never” is not broad enough for me. “Never not ever in a million, jillion, teragigamegazillion years!” is only beginning to narrow it down for me.
Also remember, it’s Government Motors now…aka, “the public option.”
Before bashing GM, it’d be interesting to see if other manufacturers consider FI and ECUs to be part of the drivetrain warranty.
It doesn’t matter – in order to gain market share GM has to make everything far better than the competition. They need cars that are 20% more reliable than Toyota with interiors 20% better than Audi with driving dynamics 20% better than BMW and a warranty 20% better than anyone all for a price 20% less.
The idea that they can be “just as good” is delusional, they need to be significantly better.
Are we talking about the same car? I’d at least cross-shop it if I were in the market for a mid-size sedan (though I’d probably end up in a Fusion).
I mean TTAC gave it five stars, for God’s sake, and said the only one they would put over it is the Mazda 6.
Michael Karesh :
Note to GM: TrueDelta doesn’t count free reflashes as repairs in our stats. We do count those that the customer has to pay for.
Why not? My Corvette had to be flashed under warranty to correct the “steering wheel might lock up under unexpected conditions and not necessarily in the best of neighborhoods” problem. It was a bulletin for Christ’s sake!
But I didn’t learn about the problem until the car would not start one morning. I lost a half-day of work waiting for the tow truck. Luckily my trusty Miata got me to work that day. But I still had to get home before the end of my shift, then wait for the Chevy courtesy driver to come get me so I could pick up my Vette.
And after all that, another dealer later could find no proof in the service computer system that this bulletin had been resolved, so THEY HAD TO DO THE FLASH A SECOND TIME.
Both times were covered under warranty, but the impact to the customer in time lost and associated costs was enormous.
And this is why I hate GM more than I hate brussel sprouts, chickpeas, and lima beans all added up.
ZoomZoom,
I saw at least some reflashes as improvements rather than repairs, and think they’ll become about as common as system updates from Microsoft.
Assuming they improve the car, I didn’t want to give manufacturers any reason not to provide such updates, as long as they’re free.
I see.
Too bad there’s no way to split them out.
Back then I would have waited for a Saturday to do an “improvement flash”. But according to the bulletin, the flash I got was needed to make the car go, so it was a “fix.” Done twice. On the same car.
in my 31 years gm HAS made a handful of cars I admired (never considered buying):
87 GNX
89 ZR1
91 Typhoon
95 Riviera
96 Grand Prix
97 C5
04 CTS-V
05 XLR-V
08 ZR1
But those are mixed in with the Corsicas, the Centurys, the Park Avenues, the Aveos and all other P.O.S. that the general has insisted I take as serious. (ah hell this is fun, how about the Omega, the Towne Coupe, the Chevette, the S-10, the 6000, the Caprice, the Cimmeron)
I didn’t leave GM… GM left me.
Speaking of flashing control units with new software and firmware, I think we’re moving toward open systems that can be updated over time, particularly in the infotainment area. Some of it’s showing up already like Ford’s Sync system and the digital gages and gizmos on the Nissan GT-R. At the NAIAS this year, Johnson Controls was showing what looked like completely programmable instrument panel displays. Eventually things will be like your iPhone, just buy an app for it. The basic hardware like sensors, amps, speakers and display panels will be fixed, but everything else will be software based.
haha, you said “Chevette”!
Now go wash your mouth out with soap.
Oh, damn, I said it too…
Hyundai’s bumper to bumper warranty is 5 years, 60,000 miles, compared to GM’s 3 years, 36,000 miles.
I agree with Karesh about Hyundai denying coverage under the 5/60 for things that should be covered. There are a lot of 2006+ Sonatas with noisy suspensions that have never been cured.
Alfred, no Sky/Solstice? I’m really pissed at GM for killing them with their respective brands, but they were good little roadsters. Difficult top operation and small trunk aside (re: the trunk, you shouldn’t be buying a roadster as your primary vehicle, anyway!)
I agree with jmo, GM has to go above and beyond to change perception here. “May the best car win”?
Sounds like GM is stating that from a spectator’s view, not that of a company fighting for it’s life.
These warranty exclusions echo that.
No thanks GM, I’ll pass.
I’m making calls to get details on what various manufacturers cover. Interesting stuff.
I’m wondering if some of the fuel system exclusions were made because of current or perceived problems with e-85, fuel additives, or alternative fuel blends? If the ethanol blend is not in correct proportions, are there issues with the lines/injectors/pump, etc?
Okay, here’s what I’ve found out so far about various standard powertrain warranties…
Toyota covers all of the above components except for the throttle body assembly.
Honda only covers the fuel pump and the wheel bearings on drive wheels.
Hyundai only covers the wheel bearings on drive wheels.
Nissan covers none of the above items.
Still waiting for a call back on Ford.
http://www.truedelta.com/blog/?p=389
I think that Alfred P. Sloan (who has nothing good to say about GM) and P71 CrownVic (who has nothing good to say about Fords) should consider trading names.
Flashing done by anyone but a dealer would be a no-no in my book. However, most of the rest of the exclusions they are making would make me unlikely to buy the car. Controllers, for example, are electronic devices that are highly susceptible to heat, voltage surges, dumb design decisions and other such issues, none of which are under the control of the car owner. You cannot do “preventive maintenance” on an ECM to extend its life, nor are you likely to do something to cause it to fail early (no flashing). If GM cannot guarantee the controller for a reasonable length of time, I would tell them to eat it.
I believe warranties are not always a reflection of your confidence in your product, but they don’t just pull them out of the air either. They are data-driven. As a person who actually reads (and reads into) his warranty papers, I would be concerned. GM cannot afford to have “concerned” customers right now.
Hey, ZoomZoom, what’s wrong with lima beans?
The powertrain controllers are often included under the 8/80 emissions warranty. So they’re essentially removing 20,000 miles of coverage from people who drive more than 80,000 miles in five years. Not a big impact there.
# Michael Karesh :
September 22nd, 2009 at 3:38 pm
The Hyundai / Kia warranty has many exclusions that other warranties do not. A few participants in TrueDelta’s Car Reliability Survey have reported that 5/60 warranty coverage was denied on items that just about any other manufacturer would have covered under their basic warranty.
I must have an exceptional KIA dealer. They replaced a front hub assembly and all attached parts as a complete unit for free at 115k mile on a Sorento. They said it had never happened before and KIA wanted all the parts. This is the same dealer that replaced a trans on another Sorento that had over 120k miles. They charged me $200 for miscellaneous items.
Needless to say I’ve been buying KIAs for service vehicles because of the stellar service. They are even reasonable for general maintenance such as tune ups, oil changes, cam belts, etc. The local GM and Ford dealers charge every cent they think they can get way with and specialize in denying warranty claims.
BDB:
The Malibu doesn’t offer a manual transmission. Fusion, 6, Altima, hell even the Camry and Accord (last I checked) do. So no, I would *NEVER* consider buying a Malibu.
And no, I would *NEVER* want a CTS-V either, unless I get the car for free and you pay my taxes/registration/insurance. I’m sure I can afford to drive it; it’s owning one I wouldn’t want to pay for. A car is only good if it gives back to the owner (in mobility and enjoyment) more than it extracts financially.