You forgot emminent domain being used to take property and redirect it to a use deemed more favorable to the state ala Kelso; propaganda being taught in state controlled schools; state support for secular humanism with suppression of religion; and, state redirection of capital to control economic outcomes. Those would be the real marks of socialism and fascism in the US.

Lastly, if you look up the history of the nazi’s, you will find that they called themselves socialists. The important thing to remember is that when we let give too much power to the feds, we cease to have control over what kind of dictators they will become.

from the american heritage dictionary – fascism: a system of government [1] marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, [2] stringent socioeconomic controls, [3] suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically [4] a policy of belligerent nationalism…

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fascism

any of this seem at all familiar?

lets see now…[1] unitary executive. 800+ presidential signing statements. ineffectual congress. highly-politicized department of justice. warrantless wiretaps. [2] $9.5 trillion national debt [increasing $1.7 billion every day]. taxbreaks for the wealthy. decimated middleclass. no hope for the poor, the unemployed and the unemployable. lousy economy. collasping financial system. inadequate healthcare, education, and employment opportunities. [3] iraq’s “smoking gun in the form of a mushroon cloud.” highly-suspicious terror alerts. secretive energy policy. rampant political interference on scientific and environmental issues. co-opted mainstream media. [4] lawlessness within the executive branch. “you’re either with us or against us.” “i’m the decider.” “goodbye from the world’s biggest polluter.”

anybody see any similarities?

and john mccain? mccain’s insane. mccain wants more war.

there’s gotta be a better way.

[ must. exercise. restraint. in. the. face. of. temptation. ]

The good news for conservatives? Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh have both re-upped. So you’ll at least have those sympathetic microphones to rely upon for the next four eight years.

The biggest difference is who gets to claim power. Instead of the “workers” overthrowing the capitalists (which really means out of favor populist politicians taking over), in fascism there is no requirement for such radical change as we take some group of autocrats and put them in charge. Either ends up pretty much with the same result. A central government decides what is best, private property is a false promise, and everyone suffers (though to varying degrees). Free speech is likewise suppressed to protect the power structure.

There is a lot of side arguments about social conservative aspects of fascism, but it’s really not core. There has never actually been a socially conservative fascist state. The only thing socially conservative about them is authoritarianism. Strangely, socialist states are all authoritarian as well, or have you not been reading about traffic enforcement in Britain?

The central theme of socialism is still there in fascism. No one argues otherwise. Not even the liberal left poli sci profs. They will argue the importance of a bunch of things that are not important in order to make a distinction that is so much lip stick on a pig.

Also, no one will argue that the soviets did not take on a huge propaganda campaign in order to push the idea that fascism was a right wing ideology counter to everything socialist. They did it. I guess wiki must still reflect the fallout.

Fascism is a term used to describe authoritarian nationalist political ideologies or mass movements that are concerned with notions of cultural decline or decadence and seek to achieve a millenarian national rebirth by exalting the nation or race, and promoting cults of unity, strength and purity.

Also, for those who like to toss around the term “socialist” as a pejorative, you’d do well to read Wikipedia’s entry on that subject. Turns out you’re not really saying anything concrete. Stick to Marxist.

It’s probably time to stop harping on the 57 states thing. The dude was tired. Considering McCain’s very real, disturbing, and continuous demonstration of a lack of understanding the actual state of the modern world, if you argue that a minor slip of the tongue disqualifies a candidate, you’re gonna have to tell me how McCain would be better in a hypothetical crisis situation. He knows less than I do about what’s actually going on, and I’m doing my best to ignore news from the middle east.

Obama, on the other hand, has now demonstrated a deep grasp of foreign policy, speaking knowledgeably to key players on a variety of subjects, at every granularity from big picture to fine detail. There’s no danger that he’s going to order the Air Force to bomb “East Germany” in the middle of the night.

Also, don’t think Obama forgot the number of states. He was probably thinking of ten other thigns at that moment, and “fifty” came out of his mouth instead of “forty”. Stuff like that happens, and it’s pretty trivial.

You are buying into some old communist propoganda. Fascism is a form of socialism, just as is communism. The Soviets started a huge propaganda campaign back in the thirties saying that the fascists were right wing, but they never were.

The whole right wing, left wing thing isn’t all that accurate anyway, but I suppose you could go with:

Some left wingers lean fascist, while others lean communist. OTOH, some right wingers lean anarchist, while others lean autocrat. That might work to anger all sides. :)

You’ve got a point but I could point to the fact that Bush said that Africa was a country yet could still put up a fight during 9/11.

Obama graduated in the top ranks of his class at Harvard while McCain graduated “fifth from the bottom of his Naval Academy class”.

That’s a decent barometer of a President’s ability to lead but not the only one. Woodrow Wilson was incredibly smart but so engrossed in his theories that he couldn’t get the U.S. Congress to approve his League of Nations Concept. Same thing with Thomas Jefferson, who almost lost the Louisiana Purchase to his political principles.

Same thing with experience. Many good Presidents have had a lot of experience, like Franklin Roosevelt, while a lot of others had very little, like Abraham Lincoln. Often, military experience seems to help, but not always.

http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1717926,00.html

Either Obama or McCain could be a good President, but it depends on your viewpoint on the issues. Carter’s considered good by many Democrats but a lot of Republicans say otherwise. Meanwhile, Republicans loved Reagan while a good deal of Democrats loathe his legacy. In the end, as long as there isn’t a nuclear war and everybody dies, either candidate could go down in history as a great leader. It just depends on POV.

I’m not a defender of the current prez, but I’m wondering how everybody seems to “know” that Junior hasn’t been asking dad for advice?

They told me that if I voted for Goldwater the war (Veitnam) would be escalated. I voted for Goldwater – and the war was escalated.

Great joke! I remember back when W’s dad was still running for the Republican nomination, there was this great joke:

What’s the difference between a good Republican girl and a good Democrat girl?

A good Republican girl has her heart set on Bush!

So true…G.W. is a wealth of foreign relation experience and the son does nothing with one of the best assets available to him. Maybe he forgot his father’s phone number.

They told me that if I voted for Goldwater the war (Veitnam) would be escalated. I voted for Goldwater – and the war was escalated.

Ya think history might repeat itself?

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/apps/pbcs.dll/section?Category=caucus&template=detail&candidate=mccain

Everyone can make geography mistakes, like this recent one where McCain talks about the Iraq-Pakistan border … which doesn’t exist:

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/16270.html

Or how about his recent reference to missile defense systems in Czechoslovakia, and country which hasn’t existed since 1993 when it split into the Czech Republic and Slovakia.

http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/16196.html

Then of course there is the famous scene where Joe Lieberman had to educate McCain on camera as to the factions in Iraq and Iran:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkfM7z0-Vdg

But hey, one dare not question the veracity of John McCain’s claim to be the foreign affairs expert in this contest.

Speaking of flip-flops, he was recently against expanded coastal oil drilling before having a conversion to being for more drilling.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_segkxmffw0&NR=1

This is funny when Obama claims to have visited 57 states with three still not visited. Do they teach there are 60 states in the US public school system?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpGH02DtIws

And Orian don’t forget,
German National Socialist Party=Nazi’s=Fascists

BTW – what’s this Bush is inexperienced stuff? He’s got a higher father he listens to, and a father who used to be president whom he ignores. Perfect setup, if you ask me.

McCain will figure it out, I guess. But the president, whoever gets the job, is not going to be able to get Detroit out of the corner it’s gotten itself into – there’s not enough money around for that to happen.

I’m not exactly sure why people think Obama is inexperienced yet voted Bush into office with far less federal experience. What gives? And age doesn’t necessarily equate experience although McCain has been at the federal government level longer.

McCain would have a much better chance if he wasn’t so tied into a lot of W’s policies – he’s actually a pretty good candidate for the office.

DetN will never hold those accountable that should be – they’d be out of business if they actually did some solid reporting on the Detroit 3.