One of GM’s myriad problems is that at least in the US there’s really two different groups of Chevrolet customer. There’s the ones for whom it’s just a cheap car, and then there’s the ones for whom there’s history behind the brand. A Camaro or a ‘Vette or even an upmarket truck is a tougher sell when the showroom’s full of Aveos.
”

Well said and amen especially to the Wimpala part.

“Bigsby :
May 20th, 2009 at 8:40 am

The worst mistake GM ever made was to go entirely front wheel drive for all their non truck platforms. It may have saved money in terms of assembly process and was a help with CAFE but it instantly took away any sort of drive cred away especially with regard to performance and luxury.
”

FWD is as much to blame for GM’s failure as CAFE, UAW, management, etc.

“The Pontiac G8 GT I drove home last night gets it right. The Aussie sedan lacks a luxury interior and some “surprise and delight” features (e.g., rain-sense wipers, HID headlamps, and power reclining seats). But it delivers excitement at a price the average working stiff can afford (more so every day). It is a Pontiac. Perhaps even “the” Pontiac; a car that completely surpasses the performance and handling of the parts-bin specials from which the brand was born. The G8 does exactly what a Pontiac’s supposed to do.”

BAH! The last true Pontiac was the 2002 Firebird/TransAm. If I wanted an import, I’d buy one, or move to AU.

People who think they know best, will continue to want to tell others what to do with (fill in the blank).

Yes, I do own a Prius. It’s because I like good stewardship. Not because I believe in “global warming” (which I consider so much bunkum and BS). I also own a Sonata which actually works out to be a better deal for the money, all things considered, unless a) you do all of your driving in the city or b) gas is $8 a gallon or more. But strictly math and gas savings weren’t the sole reasons for my enjoying the purchase and use of my Prius. I’m a car-guy and like it. I can’t find a good Citroen DS and there are no Citroen mechanics in my area anyway. It’s my choice, my money. Nuff said.

I also see the continual fear-mongering by the powers-that-be and tampering with money by same, to be merely means of controlling we the people, so that we don’t stop, look, learn and change the game plan which currently tilts inordinately towards those who control all the levers behind the curtain….

Except that, under the Clean Air Act, vehicles within a class are capped at the same level of pollutants, regardless of horsepower or gasoline consumed. A 300 horsepower car cannot emit more pollution than a 100 horsepower one.

Axel: It’s more CO2 effecting the greenhouse balance of the planet I live on.

I assume, therefore, that you will be cutting down trees and ceasing to breath as well.

Axel: It’s one less gallon of dino-juice available for me, my children, and my grandchildren to use in the future.

Considering that I paid for it, that one gallon is not yours to use, unless you pay me for it. If I choose to use it in another way, too bad.

Axel: So yes, it is my business, and everyone else’s. You’re free to do what you want with your money, the fruits of your labor. That’s fine.

The fruits of my labor include making money to buy a vehicle and the petroleum to run it. If you don’t like my choice, you need to first educate yourself on this fact, and then learn to mind your own business.

Axel: But you are not free to so what you want with those resources (air, water, non-renewable fuels) that we all must share.

We don’t “share” petroleum. We buy it with our own money. If I buy some, what I do with it is none of your business.

eggsalad: I’m just a person who thinks it’s irresponsible to use a gallon of fuel to move a mere 20 miles, and similarly irresponsible to “require” 300hp to move 5 people about.

That’s a decision to be made by the person actually paying for the vehicle. If they have different priorities in a vehicle than you do, it doesn’t make them irresponsible. It’s none of your business.

The reason it’s irresponsible is because of the effect that behavior has on others. Every gallon burned is more particulate and gaseous pollution effecting my lungs. It’s more CO2 effecting the greenhouse balance of the planet I live on. It’s one less gallon of dino-juice available for me, my children, and my grandchildren to use in the future.

So yes, it is my business, and everyone else’s. You’re free to do what you want with your money, the fruits of your labor. That’s fine. But you are not free to so what you want with those resources (air, water, non-renewable fuels) that we all must share.

Amen on that one.

Pch101: Like an ex-con going straight, it will take years of hard work and a lot of suspicious looks to win people over. (In GM’s case, it’s not even clear that they are doing the hard work.) If a company doesn’t want to fall from grace, it’s better off if it doesn’t burn people in the first place.

Unless there is a wholesale housecleaning of top management, I don’t believe that GM will really change. There is still too much of the “throw everything against the wall and see what sticks” mentality governing decisions. Too many people have been marinated for too long in the poisonous GM culture.

Bankruptcy won’t change anything – if the comments from supporters on this site are any indication, they’ll blame everyone short of the League of Women Voters and the cast of The Facts of Life.

And there’s the rub. The company that helped to invent modern branding as we know it forgot how it’s done.

Brands cut both ways. A brand is synonymous with reputation. If you earn a bad rep, it takes time and effort (notice the “and”) to lose it.

General Motors earned its sorry reputation. Like an ex-con going straight, it will take years of hard work and a lot of suspicious looks to win people over. (In GM’s case, it’s not even clear that they are doing the hard work.) If a company doesn’t want to fall from grace, it’s better off if it doesn’t burn people in the first place.

That’s a decision to be made by the person actually paying for the vehicle. If they have different priorities in a vehicle than you do, it doesn’t make them irresponsible. It’s none of your business.

the Lumina SS, CSV CR8, G8 area ll the same great car, even the V6 variants are fun to drive.

i dont get it how dim do you have to be to figure that these models would work in the US. when it comes to car design and packaging, the Americans and Australians are very similar, only the accent is the difference.

Gm in some sort of way deserves what it’s going through, but it should be put on the backs of the execs that allowed this to happen, and strip them of the pensions.

No, I’m not a vegetarian. I’m just a person who thinks it’s irresponsible to use a gallon of fuel to move a mere 20 miles, and similarly irresponsible to “require” 300hp to move 5 people about.

All of GM’s plethora of errors notwithstanding, when the current American domestic automotive manufacturing debacle is understood, this matter of brand stigma will be the consumer’s contribution. When Americans learn again the difference between being statistically elite and elitist, we’ll have a healthier automotive market and a citizenry less inclined to be its own worst economic enemy.

If I were ready to buy a sedan again, and I wanted or had reason to spend less than the price of a CTS-V, I’d happily buy a Pontiac-badged G8 GT and serenely accept any stigma assigned by others. When that’s a plurality’s view of “stigma” (it’s too much to hope for majority), reconstructed domestic automakers will have a chance. The jackass here isn’t the Pontiac buyer being judged; it’s the knucklehead assigning stigma.

Phil

No need to spend any money at all apart from giving it the marketing it needs.

The Commodore is already sold as a Chevy in middle eastern markets. You would spend more trying to create the Holden brand in the US.

Same with the Falcon. It’s a recognized name in the US. Sell it as a Falcon and create an instant Commodore fighter, something Ford US doesn’t have.

Then GM went and wasted the jewel Impala nameplate on a front-drive fleet-disaster.

Oh, that fleet thing sells, I guess it’s a matter of the biggest barge for the least money, but would it have sold any worse under a different name? I doubt it.

One of GM’s myriad problems is that at least in the US there’s really two different groups of Chevrolet customer. There’s the ones for whom it’s just a cheap car, and then there’s the ones for whom there’s history behind the brand. A Camaro or a ‘Vette or even an upmarket truck is a tougher sell when the showroom’s full of Aveos.