I sold cars (Fords) for 8 months in about 1994. I saw the best & Worst. Buyers are liers on the other hand my boss told me I’d never be a success ’cause “I was too sincere.”

The Explorer & used cars made money. The Aspire did not. The worst were the ones that came in and said I’ll give you $200 over invoice, you showed them the invoice and they we gone off to see if they could get it at another dealer for $150 over invoice.

I raise money for a not for profit as my profession so I try to understand respect people — especially when I am asking for $$. I’ve bought cars by saying I’ll give you $500 over invoice. And boom, done. On the other hand when I bought my 06 Miata I understood that wasn’t going to fly so why be a putz. I was ok with sticker assuming I’d didn’t get screwed on my trade in.

With the amount of information out there the salesman/customer relationship is bad to begin with. Knowone believes anyone.

I sell cars myself and it’s alot of fun.

I’ve run into people who expect us to take off 4 grand off the full price OUT THE DOOR TAXES PDI ETC IN on a car where the profit margin is less than $1500 LOL. I.E. a car selling for 28K MSRP before taxes PDI and just say the end total is 34K (just for sake of numbers) and people say 24K OUT THE DOOR! Sometimes you can bring them to reality but other times you just can’t.

People think we make like $10K profit on a car lol.

Sometimes someone comes in and nickel and dimes for 2 or 3 hours; back and forth over 2 dollars a month. Ridiculous. Or they’ll say “ok x amount of dollars and we have a deal” then we do it and they say “oh no lower lower” what a waste of time. I don’t deal with people who nickel and dime for hours but if management choose to so be it.

I also run into people who expect $13,000 trade in on a car with 180,000KM that sells for $4,000 retail.

You also get people who will shake hands on a deal and then back out minutes later. Or when someone brings in their wife (now there are women who know their cars and I love that) and the wife whines and moans about the most minor things and of course the guy is whipped and has to listen to her.

It’s ridiculous.

People like to come in and take out their stress from their life on us. It’s amusing to say the least.

Many people come in and treat us like a piece of garbage and just want the cheapest price. It’s like people are buying the price and not the car/service.

Some don’t understand you have to drive the car to see if you like it. They all don’t drive nice just because they are new. It’s about preference.

They say salesmen are liars but I’m finding alot of buyers are liars. They’ll say one thing and do something completely different. It’s my job to find out their true buying motives but sometimes you just can’t and you know they are hiding it from you.

I really enjoy when people who come in are friendly and open minded regardless how much they know. They understand that selling cars is a business and they just want what’s best for them. They want to be treated the same way they treat me: with kindness, respect and honesty. These people make it all worthwhile.

I can go on lol.

Agreed, and keep up the good work. I and an older aunt had a great experience at the Hyundai dealership last weekend. I’m allegedly edu-ma-cated, know my cars, and literally help dozens of co-workers and family members with their car buying experiences. After a L-O-N-G day of test driving (Corolla, Mazda3, Versa, Elantra, Civic), and negotiations (loans, trade-in, etc), the best car to fit her needs AND the best deal AND the best delearship experience was at Hyundai.

After she drove off I went back in and congratulated the salesman, letting him know his approach, calmness, and lack of bullshit games was a very strong factor in our decision. I also sent a back-up e-mail to his GM, and plan to steer numerous future advisees his way.

BTW, I allow car salespeople up to three strikes (lies or some such nonsense) before I walk. The only dealer who needed all three was Nissan.
1. After a necessary abrupt stop during the test drive the salesperson commented “thank God for ABS, eh? That’s a standard feature on the Versa”. Not thinking it was, I commented that I was under the impression it was part of a package. No, it was standard he said. A later inspection of the sticker showed it was optional equipment, and the test car didn’t have it.
2. I asked if the car was made in Japan or Mexico. He replied that only the sedans were made in Mexico, and that the hatchbacks were made in North Carolina. I was surprised, not realizing Nissan had aplant in NC. Making Versas. The sticker on the window said Mexico.
3. He kept referring to the $1000 rebate, which I thought was only $500. Once we got into basic negotiations he kept referring to the $1k. Finally, when we were trying to get a final OTD price, I noticed it had dropped to $500. I asked about it, and he sheepishly grinned that the dealership had matched rebates last weekend, but not this weekend.

Also on the test drive, he took 3 personal phone calls, none of which seemed remotely car-sales related.

Thanks for the great post.

I can pretty much write a book and a half about the great folks I’ve met, and thankfully little more than a passing thought to the ones on the far left hand side of the decency curve. I’ll dwell on the later though just for the fact that these individuals were as far off the beaten path as anyone you can imagine.

1) Professional negotiator for school systems in the northwest buys a Lincoln on me from Ebay that I have inspected for him in Atlanta and then ship to Washington. 45 days after the transaction the fellow asks me to pay for upcoming routine maintenance in exchange for positive feedback on Ebay. I told him, in a kind manner, that I don’t respond to extortion. I end up not selling anything on Ebay for a month thanks to negative feedback which thankfully gets removed.

2) Lady with six kids buys a Harley. An absolutely wonderful personality, she would be the life of any party. Unfortunately she has one small problem as it relates to motorcyles. She has never been on the highway on one and the Harley in question has a suspension that dates back to the 1960’s. I’m asked whether I think it would be safe for her to drive it from downtown Atlanta to Tennessee. I kindly inform her that unless she wants to be a statistic on a government chart, I wouldn’t advise it.

I hold onto the vehicle for two more months. The check is already in the bank. Finally, the son comes to pick it up… in a Saturn… and nothing else. The son asks me whether we could possibly fasten it on top of the Saturn. This was of course after he got lost in directions that required him to make a grand total of one turn. A month afterwards the husband finally comes with the right equipment. I shudder to think what has come of that motorcycle.

3) Pakistani national who is using an H1-B through Canada comes by to test a two year old Sienna I have on Ebay. After the test drive, he offers me $13,500. I thank him for the offer, but tell him that I always sell my vehicles at no reserve on Ebay and honor that final bid.

He buys it on Ebay for $14,100 and within five minutes, calls me on the phone and asks whether I would take $13,500 for it. He starts to insist on it, and I tell him I’d give him a call back.

Thankfully a friend of mine works for the same company in upper management and informs him that it would be in his absolute best interest to honor his word. He does so, but not before trying to make every form of outrageous demand from getting personally picked up at his work to getting it detailed. I did it… but only because I’ve always done it for folks who buy on Ebay. I get two more deals from the manager as a result of the professionalism. A month later I find out that this fellow was fired for trying to access sensitive company information.

4) Parasitic twat who works for a staffing company buys a Lexus for $7800. The pictures on Ebay showed two close-up’s of a scratch on the rear right hand side and the fellow comes by to test the car the day before. After a few lowball offers he becomes the winning bidder the next day at the no reserve auction and gives me a certified check.

Two days later he sends me an angry email demanding that I pay him $1700 for a repaint of the vehicle. He says it’s due to an accident but, a local Toyota dealer along with Carmax (who I bought the vehicle from) confirms what’s already listed on Carfax and Autocheck. It’s pristine save the scratch and I hold firm.

Three weeks and a dozen ignored emails later he asks me to contact a paint shop, which also happened to be owned by two very good friends of mine. My preconceptions are confirmed when I’m told that the fellow informed one of the owners that he just wanted to have the scratch redone. After telling them what took place the owners inform him that the vehicle will now be towed and it will cost him $100 to get it out of the local impound lot.

And the one that absolutely topped them all…

1) A fellow from Texas offers to buy a 1993 VW Eurovan that’s now thankfully owned by a TTAC member. After stating he’s an enthusiast he asks whether this one comes with the 4-cylinder or 6-cylinder engine. Anyone who is familiar with this model would know that it only came with a 5-cylinder engine. I tell him I appreciate his interest but I prefer to sell it to someone who already is familiar with VW’s.

The fellow sends me a certified check and pleads with me to let him buy it. I take it to the bank, and spend over an hour trying to get the check verified for funds. Two phone calls, one photocopy and an inspection from an anti-fraud device that detects watermarks and holograms confirms my initial intentions. I tell him I’m not interested in his offer and stop taking his calls.

Three weeks later he has his son-in-law stalk my home while I’m working a sale in downtown Atlanta. Wife informs me of a strange man outside and I call 911 while at the auction and hurry home. Two police cars escort him out of the development and later that day I get a strange phone call from said brother-in-law stating, “I know how to treat black hairs like you.” After giving him a response only a native New Jerseyan could give, I take note of the cell phone numbers for future reference.

Now he’s trying to sue me for NOT selling him the car. This is after I have a certified letter from my bank that was sent to his address along with a letter from his own bank stating that a certified check from his own bank was never actually transacted. Apparently he also sued his own employer if you google his name. The Texas Department of Health had to deal with multiple lawsuits from this fellow, all of which were dismissed. In the latest one, the judge found ‘not even a scintilla of evidence’ in his allegations.

In the end, it’ll cost me at least $1000 to defend and countersue him for fraud. I probably will not even be able to collect the attorney fees or damages thanks to the all too generous civil suit collection laws in Texas (no garnishments, no mortgage liens, high ceiling that exempts collections from bank accounts.) It’s not a big deal at this point since he decided to not even show up for the pre-trial hearing. I’ll just make sure the legal system works in the end.

Before a test drive we always pull the car out of the lot up to customer parking and leave it idling with the AC on while we get photocopis of drivers licenses and insurance, etc. That way the car is cool and ready when the customer comes out, which is a big deal here in the land of near constant 95 degree heat and 100% humidity.

So, could be it wasn’t driven hard, just stuck in slow stop and go traffic or idled in the parking lot waiting to pick someone up.

Also, even if you think I didn’t care about the car because it wasn’t “my own property” pretty sure I didn’t get a loaner life as well. Maybe you shouldn’t make so many assumptions my “recklessness.”

Anyone out there who still wonders why car rental companies are starting to check a vehicle’s computer upon return to see whether the car was abused or operated illegally while it was out?

Just the other day I got an 08 Type-S as a free loaner when I took my old man’s car in for a recall. It was reading something like 20mpg when I got it.

In the time I had it I drove it hard, it saw 130mph a few times but in the end I still got 25mpg.

I can’t imagine what the guy before me did to the car to get 5mpg’s less and I’d hate to see what the long-term reliability on such a car would be… perhaps the cost of the repairs long-term will negate any savings from the initial purchase price?

This is exactly how I bought a Subaru Legacy GT for my wife a few years back. It was out of my budget, but as a demo with $6500 off it fell right in. It was loaded and I got it for the price of a stripped nonturbo Legacy. It didn’t hurt that it was the salesmans first sale and he drove the demo for 3 months. Got my show horse for a work horse price.

I don’t think that I said anything that advocated trying to put someone in a vehicle they can’t afford.

As far as that goes, I don’t know any customer’s complete financial picture, and while there is a glimpse from the credit report and what they say, it is really up to them what they are willing to pay or not. In the end, the customer has the final say if there is a deal or not, the dealer can’t force anyone to buy a car.

These days it is more of just getting people bought more than anything else, people will come in with 10 grand plus of water on their SUV trades, and even if the payment is going up they are saving money overall by moving to a more fuel efficient vehicle (I have even had a couple whose monthly gas bills were near $1000).

It is wrong to put someone in a vehicle they cant
afford, that is just setting someone up to fail
.I have never done that,however customers do it to themselves every day and many times I have
counseled against it with mixed results, those
that listened have been repeat coustomers those
taht didnt are now sub-prime or at a buy here pay
here lot

Don’t mean to put a jalapeno in your argument there but The most miserable customers are always the ones that come in already in adversarial mode, demand ridiculous figures, storm out, come back, repeat, etc, and may after weeks of this nonsense buy the car for the same price or maybe one or two hundred dollars less than they would have if they had just been up front and honest to begin with. Did you ever stop to think that maybe their past experiences with car salesmen have led them to always be on the defensive whenever they roll up to a dealership?

I understand that there are some salesmen out there that have no interest in stringing the buyer along and just want to seal a fair deal, but IMHO, that’s not the majority. When I bought my Elantra (used) I had already visited a couple dealerships, all wanting to push a vehicle on me that I couldn’t afford after I specifically told them: buying cash, have $4k to spend, not interested in lease/finance, show me what you have. Ended up spending the entire night at a Hyundai dealership (right up to closing) having a guy yak me around with financing and leasing and asking me to pay more than I could afford after I showed him the $4k check and said “that’s all I have, what can I get for this?” Then, on the verge of storming out after 4 hours of nonstop heckling, he took me to the back and showed me the Elantra, test drove it (at 1am) and (I guess with a bit of frustration) said I’ll take it. Paperwork was done that same night…err morning, and I came back later on that day to pick it up.

So yeah, I know not all salesmen are like that and that the customer must always be well informed before ever stepping foot in the dealership but when you say “I hate when they always approach me as being adversarial”, lighten up. Previous experiences dictate that they be either defensive or offensive.

Just do the best you can and if not then point them to the other dealership across the street so you don’t waste your time and theirs.

The customer obviously should get the car they want, with a price/payment that they are comfortable with, and the dealer/salesperson should be able to make a profit so that they can continue operations and be able to pay their bills.

There is nothing wrong with being informed, nor with negotiating, but why continue to propogate the subterfuge? The perfect customer is one who comes in with either a specific vehicle in mind, or a good idea of the options/color/etc that would make them happy, as well as a payment they can make. As long as the vehicle is availible and the figures asked for are reasonable the customer leaves happy with the car they were after all in all in around two hours with no stress, hair pulling, or shenanigans.

The most miserable customers are always the ones that come in already in adversarial mode, demand ridiculous figures, storm out, come back, repeat, etc, and may after weeks of this nonsense buy the car for the same price or maybe one or two hundred dollars less than they would have if they had just been up front and honest to begin with. Personally, my time is worth more to me than a couple hundred dollars on a purchase in the tens of thousands.

Also, as far as ‘demo’ cars go, at least around here they are all new, never previously titled vehicles that were either used by dealership employees or owners, and they do represent a good deal if you don’t mind your car having around 5000 miles on it when you take it home. It is illegal to sell a lemon buy-back, as well as to sell a car that has already been titled to a rental fleet as new. Then again, a quick carfax search on any car will show the history.

What do you do when you are a show horse buyer in reverse? I’m currently looking at MZ4s to pull double duty as a track car/weekend warrior/fun evening car. Only problem is, all the ones at most of the local and slightly not so local BMW dealerships are loaded down with every package. I don’t want any of that. I just want the basic cheapest one, as long as it is Alpine White… That being said, do I just tell the dealership I’ll take one of the loaded ones they have on the lot, if they price it at exactly the same as the stripper model I want?

I can remember as a small child playing in an R.V. on display in the showroom while my dad was busy at work one day. As I played, a couple walked by and saw me and I began to point out all the features that I liked about the R.V…the appliances, the way the bed folded down, etc.
They loved my presentation so much they bought it!

Bottom line, people like buying from people; especially people they like.

I would like to apologize to all of you that have had a bad purchasing experience. However, that doesn’t make us all bad.

Profit is not a dirty word…all industries are in business to make money, however just because a client feels that it is a buyer’s market doesn’t mean that they need to be cold or callous to a good sales consultant. If there is a deal to be made, most dealerships are not going to let a little profit stand in the way of earning your business and potentially having you as a client indefinitely.

Doesn’t it piss you off (and make you feel smugly superior) that you always know more about the car you’re looking at than the salesperson does???

Yup, though depending on their personality I try not to destroy them…knowledge is power after all.

Salesman: The ‘09 Maxima comes with a powerful 255hp engine and…
Me: Did you say ‘09?
Salesman: yeah
Me: Wrong sir, 290hp.
Salesman: Uhhh…*looks at sticker* yeah you’re right.
Me: *sigh*

Thanks man, I’ll definitely follow up on those leads and see if they’re willing to negotiate. Hopefully I can get one for a good price and I won’t even bother tradinh in my car, I’ll sell it to CarMax since they’ve treated me very well in the past.

dwford

It’s hard to find salesmen like you. I can understand when some salesmen are new and don’t quite know their products to give an overall description, thus causing them to go to their manager’s office every minute but some of these other guys, I just have to wonder. Like I went to take a look at the new G37 Coupe one day (having already known the MSRP, trim levels and optional equipment) I told the the salesman what trim level I was interested along with the equipment and he seemed very…surprised at how much i knew. He almost had this look of defeat on his face and this led me to believe he thought he had an easy catch before I opened my mouth. I just walked out after that. Keep up the good work man.