John Heinricy (Cadillac test driver)- Cadillac CTS-V: Top Lap: 2:46:560
Aaron Link (Cadillac development engineer)- Cadillac CTS-V: Top Lap: 2:48:902
Brian Redman- CTS-V: Top Lap: 2:49:596
Michael Cooper (Who is this guy?)- BMW M3: Top Lap: 2:50:424
Jack Baruth- Cadillac CTS-V (TTAC): Top Lap: 2:51:153
Lawrence Ulrich- CTS-V (New York Times): Top Lap: 2:53:157
Bob Lutz- Cadillac CTS-V (VP of Marketing, GM): Top Lap: 2:56:321
Michael Mainwald (carguydad.com)- BMW M5: Top Lap: 3:05:398
Wes Siler- Mitsubishi Evo X (Jalopnik): Top Lap: 3:08:126
Chris Fairman- CTS-V: Top Lap: 3:14:292
Archan Basu- Jaguar XF: Top Lap: 3:15:670
Tom Loder- Audi RS4: Top Lap: 3:15:702
It’s official: TTAC’s top driver has beaten Bob Lutz! Check back tomorrow for Jack’s on-the-ground take on the weirdness that was.
Tagged as Cadillac, challenge, cts-v, GM, jalopnik, Lutz, monticello
96 Comments on “CTS-V Challenge Lap Times...”
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Typo in Jack’s time?
And 18 secs off the pace in an EVO but you save how much money?
Surprised the EVO isn’t doing better. Can that Wes Silver drive?
It’s official: TTAC’s top driver has beaten Bob Lutz!
And this proves what? Next thing you know they’ll be whipping out their personal equipment and measuring it with a ruler.
Surprised the EVO isn’t doing better. Can that Wes Siler drive?
The Evo is down over 200 horsepower. It never had a chance.
There are two Vs, a manual and an automatic. Baruth can blame the fact that his car was the automatic. As was Lutz’s. The best time so far, by GM engineer Aron Link, was in a manual V.
Props to Michael Cooper for a stellar time in his M3–beat Baruth.
Heinricy just posted fastest time yet. Five seconds ahead of Baruth…
KixStart :
October 29th, 2009 at 2:05 pm
And 18 secs off the pace in an EVO but you save how much money?
Not enough
You guys should make a note of automatic CTS-V vs manual CTS-V. That’s important information!
I believe all of the Caddys were automatics, which are faster and easier to operate. From an article that qouted both John Heinricy and Aaron Link, John ran the auto for his record setting run at the ‘Ring and Aaron was operating a manual…right behind John but doing much more work.
http://www.supercars.net/PitLane?viewThread=y&gID=3&fID=0&tID=10073&bottom=950#post964
Without the help of the two GM ‘Ring testers (who both ran top times in the V), the privately-owned M3 sedan did quite well. Now, is Micheal Cooper a professional racer? I’m guessing so.
Aaron Link (the CTS-V engineer) set his (currently) leading time using a manual CTS-V.
Did Jack get a shot at one of those, or is he being forced to drive from the metaphorical ladies’ tee?
Edit – Thanks to Michael Karesh for the clarification there, Jack was driving an automatic. I say give him a shot at a manual and see how many seconds he shaves off.
I think some are thinking about a modded EVO’s capabilities rather than stock. Yes, it’s an impressive car in a lot of ways, but it’s still a 300hp car stepping into the ring with a 556hp beast.
I thought this was about which car is faster, not which driver is faster.
plus – Lutz is 77 years old. If my grandfather could drive half as well as him I would have the coolest grandfather in the world.
also, the CTS-Vs N’ring time was set with the automatic. Its the faster car.
I have to agree with Daanii…what does this prove? So Lutz got his ass handed to him…this still doesn’t make me want to run out and buy a CTS-V (or any other GM product, for that matter).
I’m really having a hard time understanding what all this was supposed to prove. Even TTAC said the CTS-V was a fantastic vehicle; no one doubts that at all. It’s a great car. This test only shows that a bunch of good young drivers can beat an old man on the track. And that GM’s pet race car driver can beat them all. None of this should be surprising.
It would be much better if TTAC had another car besides the Cady. The M3 and Evo times are the most interesting part of this as this is really not about the drivers, but the cars.
wait wait wait…I thought Jack had to be in another mass production 4 door other then the cts-v, right? Jack should easily be a better lapper then Lutz I mean for god sakes Lutz is how old and does what all day?
the only thing this has proved is that Michael Cooper is a heck of a driver. I think he should start writing some articles for TTAC.
So John Heinricy is the Stig? Glad that is finally sorted ;)
Strikes me that as per the original challenge Lutz is on the winning side – may the best car win…
I still don’t want a CTS-V after this though.
…and I’m impressed by the M3 result. Who on Earth was driving the M5 or is that 5 minutes a typo?
yournamehere :
October 29th, 2009 at 2:39 pm
I thought this was about which car is faster, not which driver is faster.
It was about the faster car until the challengers couldn’t get cars. Then, it became about the drivers. At least, that seems to be the claim.
This race proves nothing…but again this isn’t the race that it was supposed to be. Lutz called everyone out with a simple test, bring your stock 4 door sedan (any price) and our’s (CTS-V) will beat it. Not a fools gamble as the CTS-V was (at the time) the fastest 4-door sedan in the world. I think if anything this might give some GM employees a little pride today. Maybe that pride will translate to some small change they make in how they go about their job. Pride in your company can really change how you do your job.
I’d love to lap like Mr Lutz when I’m 77. Really.
He may be old, but it’s on 5th place at 14:35 local.
May have been beat by Baruth, but the M3 beat Jack. And those GM engineers… WIN
The M5 is not even trying
Started out good “who can beat the CTS-V”. Got stupid when your ran their car and claimed some sort of victory.
Who won? Lutz. Who lost? TTAC readers who thought you were going to bring a car that is faster then the Caddy, not a driver who is faster then a AARP member.
The M5 was driven by a friend of carguydad.com. I’m not sure who Michael Cooper is, other than a very fast 20-year-old driver.
One fact is for sure:
The CTS-V beat the M3, XF-R and M5 (this one may not count)
And the other pussies, who didn’t brought their rides to the challenge.
GM people must be proud.
Nice going, Jack.
Heinricy & Link – wow, they’re monsters – as is the CTS-V.
Bring it, Deutschland !!!
This event definately translated to a win for GM. I am surpised TTAC would use a GM product in the event with all the “GM-bashing” that usually takes place here. I really expected TTAC to rise to the occasion here but it didn’t happen. You can say TTAC (Baruth) beat Lutz. But GM won.
Stingray :
October 29th, 2009 at 3:19 pm
One fact is for sure:
The CTS-V beat the M3, XF-R and M5 (this one may not count)
That it did. Very impressed. BUT it did take two very experienced drivers to beat an avg joe in an M3 by just seconds. Too bad BMW did not send their test driver to take the M3 around, I would wager the M3 could have taken top spot had it been piloted by a pro.
Overall, CTS-V is VERY impressive but I think the M3 had a strong showing too.
Michael Karesh :
October 29th, 2009 at 3:14 pm
The M5 was driven by a friend of carguydad.com. I’m not sure who Michael Cooper is, other than a very fast 20-year-old driver.
A very fast driver who’s name is being looked up right now by every cop across the country :)
As I recall, Lutz’s challenge was “I’ll bring my Caddy, you bring your whatever,and I’ll beat you.” That’s a throwdown as old as cars (probably as old as chariots, but I digress).
There was never any mention of substitute drivers, everyone in a Caddy, etc.
So by those terms, the original terms of the challenge, an average guy in an M3 beat Lutz in a CTS-V. END OF STORY.
All this other BS is just distraction:
A professional driver beat a nobody, a 30 year old guy beat a 77 year old guy, a cheaper car came within a week of beating a more expensive car.. whoop-dee-freakin-do!
This is all great for GM because they can claim victory any which way by spinning it all. But GM lost, TTAC didn’t play (didn’t bring their own car) and except for the guy with the M3, nobody else really got off the bench.
RetardedSparks:
Agreed.
Nope. Lutz challenged anyone to find a “stock production sedan on the planet that could outperform the CTS-V on the track.”
GM won.
I haven’t followed closely enough, but if the challenge was a “Beat Lutz Challenge”, then indeed, the M3 beat Lutz.
They should have made the challenge requirement:
1. No professional drivers
2. No company drivers/test drivers
3. Just you, your car and The Lutz.
Nope. Lutz challenged anyone to find a “stock production sedan on the planet that could outperform the CTS-V on the track.”
GM won.
GM “won” using a professional race car driver and a company development engineer, and they “won” by about 4 seconds over some 20 year old kid. Frankly I think everyone expected Heinricy to set the fastest time; this is what he does for a living after all.
Rusnak_322: OK, if that’s the case then they were all idiots for not bringing a pro driver when GM said it was bringing theirs. Nothing was proved with that kind of disparity in talent.
And as I said, GM won the “PR event” no matter what.
Well, Rusnak_322, if you are correct, then the CTS-V did win.
I would have liked to see what Baruth could have done in the M3.
can’t blame GM that the other manufacturers and TTAC failed to bring it.
This is racing. The winners often exploit gray areas of the rulebook to their advantage, and the losers often say it was cheating because they didn’t think of it first.
It is the fastest car. If I wanted to see the fastest driver win I would watch NASCAR, Not F1.
Like I said, a 335i would have done some damage. Ok, now that I said that. It seems like an interesting event.
It is the fastest car. If I wanted to see the fastest driver win I would watch NASCAR, Not F1.
..but you have no idea what you saw, because there was only one pro driver in one car.
I’m waiting for some pro driver to post his rejection letter from GM saying that their car was not a direct competitor or that all available slots were full.
Well done Jack!
Any chance we can get a video of the lap?
-ted
It appears that Michael Cooper is not necessarily a non-professional a.k.a. average guy. So… Lutz did win?
Exactly!
Daanii2 :
October 29th, 2009 at 2:26 pm
It’s official: TTAC’s top driver has beaten Bob Lutz!
And this proves what? Next thing you know they’ll be whipping out their personal equipment and measuring it with a ruler.
A 335i would not have any chance of touching the top times.
Michael Cooper must be a natural. Most impressive.
Is that the same Michael Cooper? The one in the M3 lives in New York, the pro at the link is in NC.
celebrity208 :
October 29th, 2009 at 4:09 pm
It appears that Michael Cooper is not necessarily a non-professional a.k.a. average guy. So… Lutz did win?
THAT michael cooper has red hair and is from North Carolina. The Michael Cooper that took part in the CTS-V challenge has brown hair and is from New Jersey.
Not the same guy.
Well, I knew an M3 would be the right tool for this job…but who the hell is this Michael Cooper kid?
Was the M5 in limp-home mode? Running on snow tires? Or both?
Congrats to the CTS V. Take on the world and whip em good!
The only people getting defensive are those that think everyone else is defensive about the CTS-V (regardless of driver) pulling the best time.
This was a PR campaign by GM and Lutz to show that he could beat anyone (first, just Jalopnik) in any 4-door sport sedan. Everyone thought that an M5 or Panamera would be quicker, but then GM would have pulled the price card. Everyone thought that the XF-R, M3, RS4, and C63 would be slower but GM could still pull the power-rating card and the M3 split the CTS-V numbers.
If it wasn’t a sure thing as a positive win for the CTS-V, then GM wouldn’t have done this.
I think it is very impressive that someone with a less powerful (and supposedly slower) M3 sedan put up such a good time…regardless of their competence and age.
Everyone knew that having John and Aaron in the CTS-V, GM would win the challenge. Lutz did a great job.
Now, will this help sell the CTS-V? It might sway a handful of shoppers…but it won’t make a very big difference, as you still have GM standing behind the product, take that as you may.
Well, given the performance of Heinricy and Link, no one can a) doubt that GM/Cadillac has some serious *expletive* drivers on their roster and that b) when GM tests their cars they really do wring the crap out of them.
And, have to say, Lutz impressed.