Comments on: California Tightens State Speed Trap Regulations http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/california-tightens-state-speed-trap-regulations/ The Truth About Cars is dedicated to providing candid, unbiased automobile reviews and the latest in auto industry news. Sun, 22 Nov 2009 16:08:04 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: tauronmaikar http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/california-tightens-state-speed-trap-regulations/comment-page-1/#comment-1506252 tauronmaikar Wed, 01 Jul 2009 23:42:00 +0000 http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321651#comment-1506252 Lorenzo: The survey, however long or short, if taken for a reasonable amount of time will include locals and nonlocals alike so this should not be an issue. The fact that speed traps are politically influenced and are in fact more of a revenue stream than a safety ordinance is nothing new and as a matter of fact you may write that down in stone. Lorenzo:

The survey, however long or short, if taken for a reasonable amount of time will include locals and nonlocals alike so this should not be an issue.

The fact that speed traps are politically influenced and are in fact more of a revenue stream than a safety ordinance is nothing new and as a matter of fact you may write that down in stone.

]]> By: Lorenzo http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/california-tightens-state-speed-trap-regulations/comment-page-1/#comment-1506170 Lorenzo Wed, 01 Jul 2009 20:48:12 +0000 http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321651#comment-1506170 As a retired Caltrans engineer, I have to disagree with Chad Dornsife's comment on conditions not readily apparent. Yes, people who use a road every day are aware of most conditions, but use of the road is not limited to the locals. The conditions have to be apparent to everyone who could use the road, which is everybody licensed to drive. He also seems to think a traffic engineering survey consists of an engineer with a clipboard hanging around for a few hours. The survey includes traffic count meters set up for weeks, and on heavily traveled roads, multiple traffic counts for different periods of the day and week taken over months. Loop detectors can be tapped for the same purpose, and speeds can be calculated from some of that data. The time interval from the beginning of a survey to issue of a report is usually six months, and they don't take more than a couple weeks to analyse the data and write the report. One last caveat, for those who think California is doing it right: Caltrans is doing it right, but the department answers to elected officials and their political appointees. They don't usually meddle with the MUTCD, but with a financial crisis in the state at all government levels, and a potential revenue source involved, anything is possible. As a retired Caltrans engineer, I have to disagree with Chad Dornsife’s comment on conditions not readily apparent. Yes, people who use a road every day are aware of most conditions, but use of the road is not limited to the locals. The conditions have to be apparent to everyone who could use the road, which is everybody licensed to drive.

He also seems to think a traffic engineering survey consists of an engineer with a clipboard hanging around for a few hours. The survey includes traffic count meters set up for weeks, and on heavily traveled roads, multiple traffic counts for different periods of the day and week taken over months. Loop detectors can be tapped for the same purpose, and speeds can be calculated from some of that data. The time interval from the beginning of a survey to issue of a report is usually six months, and they don’t take more than a couple weeks to analyse the data and write the report.

One last caveat, for those who think California is doing it right: Caltrans is doing it right, but the department answers to elected officials and their political appointees. They don’t usually meddle with the MUTCD, but with a financial crisis in the state at all government levels, and a potential revenue source involved, anything is possible.

]]> By: carlisimo http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/california-tightens-state-speed-trap-regulations/comment-page-1/#comment-1506031 carlisimo Wed, 01 Jul 2009 15:51:12 +0000 http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321651#comment-1506031 Here in Fremont, CA, they increased a bunch of our speed limits by 5-10mph recently! They did reduce a couple of streets by 5mph, right next to a hospital. It's not all bad. Here in Fremont, CA, they increased a bunch of our speed limits by 5-10mph recently! They did reduce a couple of streets by 5mph, right next to a hospital.

It’s not all bad.

]]> By: tauronmaikar http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/california-tightens-state-speed-trap-regulations/comment-page-1/#comment-1506022 tauronmaikar Wed, 01 Jul 2009 15:37:31 +0000 http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321651#comment-1506022 One tidbit from the NMA completely debunking the notion that speed kills. There are many others. "A. No, federal and state studies have consistently shown that the drivers most likely to get into accidents in traffic are those traveling significantly below the average speed. According to an Institute of Transportation Engineers Study, those driving 10 mph slower than the prevailing speed are six times as likely to be involved in an accident. That means that if the average speed on an interstate is 70 mph, the person traveling at 60 mph is far more likely to be involved in an accident than someone going 70 or even 80 mph" http://www.motorists.org/speedlimits/ One tidbit from the NMA completely debunking the notion that speed kills. There are many others.

“A. No, federal and state studies have consistently shown that the drivers most likely to get into accidents in traffic are those traveling significantly below the average speed. According to an Institute of Transportation Engineers Study, those driving 10 mph slower than the prevailing speed are six times as likely to be involved in an accident. That means that if the average speed on an interstate is 70 mph, the person traveling at 60 mph is far more likely to be involved in an accident than someone going 70 or even 80 mph”

http://www.motorists.org/speedlimits/

]]> By: tauronmaikar http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/california-tightens-state-speed-trap-regulations/comment-page-1/#comment-1506019 tauronmaikar Wed, 01 Jul 2009 15:33:18 +0000 http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321651#comment-1506019 Funny, I thought the police was reducing limits by 20-30 mph and not 5 mph. This news is not so good but hopefully people will start driving faster requiring them to readjust where the 85% percentile lies. Funny, I thought the police was reducing limits by 20-30 mph and not 5 mph. This news is not so good but hopefully people will start driving faster requiring them to readjust where the 85% percentile lies.

]]> By: findude http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/california-tightens-state-speed-trap-regulations/comment-page-1/#comment-1505995 findude Wed, 01 Jul 2009 14:30:16 +0000 http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321651#comment-1505995 My pet peeve about speed limit signs has to do with school zones. Where I live a school zone has two blinking yellow lights and a sign that says "Speed Limit 25 when lights flashing. The problem is that for the schools our kids walk to, the speed limit is <em>always </em>25 MPH, but when the lights are not flashing people assume it is 35 MPH (which it is along some other stretches of the same road where there are no crosswalks. I've casually surveyed people on this for years, and 100% of them (no kidding) believe the limit is 35 unless the lights are flashing. Only after they drive along the road and see the 25 MPH sign they believe me. It makes me wonder if the signs need to also say "AT ALL TIMES" since it is intuitive to imagine that if the limit is 25 when the lights are flashing it is something else when the lights are not flashing. My pet peeve about speed limit signs has to do with school zones. Where I live a school zone has two blinking yellow lights and a sign that says “Speed Limit 25 when lights flashing. The problem is that for the schools our kids walk to, the speed limit is always 25 MPH, but when the lights are not flashing people assume it is 35 MPH (which it is along some other stretches of the same road where there are no crosswalks. I’ve casually surveyed people on this for years, and 100% of them (no kidding) believe the limit is 35 unless the lights are flashing. Only after they drive along the road and see the 25 MPH sign they believe me.

It makes me wonder if the signs need to also say “AT ALL TIMES” since it is intuitive to imagine that if the limit is 25 when the lights are flashing it is something else when the lights are not flashing.

]]> By: FunkyD http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/california-tightens-state-speed-trap-regulations/comment-page-1/#comment-1505988 FunkyD Wed, 01 Jul 2009 14:20:10 +0000 http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321651#comment-1505988 I am glad that I was sitting down when reading this. The shock of a common-sense decision coming from a California agency is almost too much to bear! I am glad that I was sitting down when reading this. The shock of a common-sense decision coming from a California agency is almost too much to bear!

]]> By: David Holzman http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/california-tightens-state-speed-trap-regulations/comment-page-1/#comment-1505980 David Holzman Wed, 01 Jul 2009 14:05:19 +0000 http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321651#comment-1505980 and those who are text messaging while driving and those who are text messaging while driving

]]> By: edgett http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/california-tightens-state-speed-trap-regulations/comment-page-1/#comment-1505972 edgett Wed, 01 Jul 2009 13:42:25 +0000 http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/?p=321651#comment-1505972 With the onset of photo-radar and red-light traps all over the country, it's nice to read that California is trying to avoid this onslaught. If we had any evidence whatsoever of mounting deaths due to speed or red-light running, additional enforcement would be reasonable, but the evidence is not there. Wouldn't it be nice if the cops actually started going after those who are just not paying attention? With the onset of photo-radar and red-light traps all over the country, it’s nice to read that California is trying to avoid this onslaught. If we had any evidence whatsoever of mounting deaths due to speed or red-light running, additional enforcement would be reasonable, but the evidence is not there.

Wouldn’t it be nice if the cops actually started going after those who are just not paying attention?

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