http://www.autoblog.com/2007/10/31/keeping-the-enclave-on-boil-gm-keeps-a-lid-on-production/

Of the Lambdas, the Acadia is supposed to be the mass market seller, not the Enclave.

I realize of course that this post is irrelevant since everything here is spun anti-GM no matter what.

Trouble? Isn’t GM the #1 auto/truck mfr in the world?

The logical realist guy in me just can’t get over the fact that the Acadia and Outlook DO NOT compete with the RX, yet people continue to make that comparison.

GM’s closest competition to the RX is the Enclave, and it got creamed by RX sales. The Acadia and Outlook compete with the Highlander, which by itself creamed both the Acadia and Outlook sales-wise.

I also find it ironic that some of you are comparing GM’s full-size CUV platform to one Lexus model in terms of sales. The RX uses the Camry platform, as does the Highlander, as does the Camry and the Avalon. When you compare *platform-to-platform*, the Camry platform simply obliterates GM’s CUV platform sales-wise.

Let’s try and cut down on the idle speculation and wishful thinking and let’s try and stick to the truth here.

Well…..Consumer Reports is coming to the same conclusion on Ford quality as JD Power—-do you dismiss their data out of hand as well ?? I would also stack up the interior materials and build quality of most Ford’s against Toyota any day of the week—have you sat in a Camry or Corolla lately ? Hard / cheap plastic for as far as the eyes can see—certainly as much or more than the new Focus—and certainly more than the Fusion or Taurus.

When i heard that GM was killing Olds and keeping Saturn i was dumb struck. Saturn should have been axed. Every vehicle sold by Saturn with the exception of the Sky roadster and the Ion compact could very easily have been sold as an Olds.

GM still has TOO many brands. Now we have Saturn, Pontiac and Buick all competing for basically the same segment of the market. Those who wanna trade up from a Chevy but not quite ready to go Caddy yet. And why didn’t Chevy get a Lamba crossover??? Or Caddy??????

Toyota covers the US market with 3 brands, Honda with two and GM has trouble doing it with 8. And as for JD Power and Assoc. i have serious doubts about their credibility. This is the same firm that said Ford’s initial quality was alomst as good as Toyota. I’d rather have a Toyota with a few problems than a Ford full of cheap materials and shitty build quality and little too NO trade in value.

As i said before in another post i will stick with Honda. My local dealer is small, has a well trained staff and knows me on a first name basis. I have owned 6 Hondas and have never had a mechinal problem. Can’t say that for Ford, GM and Chrysler products. GM, kill one of these brands: Pontiac, Buick or Saturn and end the misery. If it were me, I’d chop the head off Saturn ASAP !!!

The numbers guy in me just can’t get over that Acadia+Outlook outsold Lexus, yet Lexus is crowned the sales king.

There’s gotta be a brand focus lesson in there somewhere. The Acadia and the Outlook occupy essentially the same point in the market. If Saturn didn’t exist and those sales would have been Acadias, and no one had to pay Saturn’s overhead…

I am not here to defend GM dealers—-because quite frankly (especially for mass brands) there is a LOT of variation in dealer experience at both the transaction and in on-going service that lends itself to about an average experience across the board. NOTE: we are talking about today—not the 70’s-90’s.

JD Power (for what its worth) does surveys on these topics and supports my thoughts and anecdotal experience. Net, Toyota is no better than Chevy who is no better than Ford who is no better than Nissan or Honda—-they are all about the same. http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings/sales-satisfaction http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings/service-ratings

Taking the number of cars only (6852) and dividing by 4 gets you 1,700-ish, that sounds closer. Does anyone have the real number?

As any trip outside Michigan will evidence, The GM Buying Experience syndrome affects most car buyers and growing numbers of pick up buyers too. For booster shots, just stop in a GM dealer at random.

Better that than nothing, but not as good as taking customers from the other guys.

Damn Buick and their portholed hot-rods!

This brings me to an interesting question. I wonder what bundled CUV platform perfromed the best in ‘07—-1) Ford Edge / Lincoln MKX 2) Toyota Highlander / Lexus RX 3) GM Lambda Trio

I think Ford moved about 175K units, GM 134K units, not sure the Toyota / Lexus figures—but I think it has to be north of Ford’s and probably 200-210K range.

Frank is the validator on this one. In any event—I do not think any of the companies are real losers in this equation—all three appear to be meeting consumer CUV needs.

That said, the average transaction price for these vehicles is pretty high. I had heard mid-30s for the GMC and higher for the Enclave earlier this year (I don’t think anyone wants to talk about the Outlook).

A point I must make is that comparing a brand new marque to an established one (Highlander/RX) is always a bit misleading. There is a huge amount of brand equity in the Highlander and RX names even if they are not the best product out there, and there has been no “ramp-up” in sales for either vehicle this year (except the month between the old and new Highlander). The combined platform sales for the two was about 230,000 after about 7 and 9 years on the market, respectively. What did they sell in their first years?

I’d say the 140k or so that GM moved this year, considering the Enclave didn’t debut until almost half way through, is a good showing (even though sales should be an after-thought to profit). But, my guess is that they are also profitable.

Here’s my “uninformed” GM buying experience.

I now pay out of my own pocket for most repairs ($650 + so far) to repair my 2006 GM car (which is under the bumper to bumper warranty) so I don’t have to “experience” the local dealers, except for when a pitted #6 bearing meant several thousand out of my pocket – I had to suffer the dealer then – and it still took three trips for them to repair it properly. FWIW – this is not limited to one dealer, or even one car – I’m keeping this short.

Contrast that with my Lexus, which I happily send my wife to whatever Lexus dealer is closest for maintenance (and it’s sole repair). She gets a nice loaner or a comfortable place to work if she decides to wait, and doesn’t get hosed, or stuck in some service line trying to convince someone she’s actually having a problem.

I enjoyed a very nice experience with my Honda from 2003 to 2006, too, albeit not as much leather furniture and cafe style as with the Lexus.

Spend a little time on popular forums supporting each brand, and I don’t think you’ll find I’m in the minority.

The next question we need to have answered is how many Higlanders Toyota was able to sell in 2007. Now I know this is not a direct comparison because The Highlander went though a mid-model year change.

Somehow even without knowing the exact Highlander sales figures I get the impression that Toyota most likely surpassed the 140,000 unit mark with both Highlanders and RX350s combined. If that is a correct assessment GM is still up shits creek without a you know what. The RX350 commands a higher (more profitable) price and Toyota is in the hole to support only two models while GM is gearing up to support a fourth!

Man IF (and I mean a BIG IF) GM could just cut the fat out (extra brands and dealers) today they would be in excellent shape.