Aside from abject nationalism, is there any compelling reason to not let the Chinese buy GM/Chrysler? The USA needs to lower it’s own debt so we do not have to rely on foreign investors buying our t-bills. If we can save tax dollars by not having to bailout both GM and Chrysler, doesn’t this put us on a path toward a more solvent USA?

We used to worry about the Japanese taking over car-making and the world. Did they? No. That Japanese bubble also burst, with a decade long recession after. And Toyota is not quite the rainmaker it used to be. Larger, sure. More profitable? No. Japan faces strong competition from China and Korea when it comes to the global automobile marketplace. Did anyone predict that this would be the case in the days of predicting Japan would own everything? Not that I’m aware of.

Remember when the rumors were going around about India wanting a (large) piece of Detroit? We didn’t seem as disgusted at that idea. But with Chinese ownership of GM/Chrysler we are about to vomit. Why? Is it communism?? China may not have free elections, but they espouse capitalism and free trade better than most countries. The thing about a communist dictatorship is that things can get done fast. Decisions can be made and implemented very quickly. Here in our democracy, government decisions come slow and take forever to implement. Committees, lobbies, parties, PACs, lawsuits, regulators, and the like that we have here in the USA keep the pace of government change slow as every side of the debate must be heard and considered. Not that I think communism trumps democracy. Carefully considered decisions are usually the wisest. It’s our partisanship for the sake of partisanship politics that gets to me. We can’t even fix up New Orleans or the World Trade Center in a timely fashion. If the The Shanghai World Financial Center was knocked down by Taiwanese terrorists, I’m sure the PRC would have a new one up right quick.

The USA has been moving away from manufacturing for a very long time as it faces global manufacturing competition. It was inevitable that this trend would extend to car making. Frankly, I’m not sure Americans want to make anything anymore. Sure companies do, but American workers do not seem to want to work on assembly lines any more. Are you willing to drill holes in sheet metal all day long? Only if you get a big salary and pension a la the UAW, right? Let’s face it, America’s youth is way past lusting over a factory jobs; they all want to work for the next Google. As well they should. We are the most advanced country and society in the world, why the hell should we be doing the grunt work? If we ever lose our taste for innovation and entrepreneurship then we will have serious problems.

We Americans, like our companies, need to get in shape. We need to be more efficient and do things smarter. There was a day when a high-school education (or less) was enough to get you a good manufacturing job that was a ticket to the middle class. Those days are long gone in America, and in perhaps the world. A college education is mandatory it obtain any sort of good paying job in the USA. It’s been that way for a while and is not going to change. Unskilled labor cannot provide middle class comforts. Even the immigrants in the USA from Mexico and Central and South America know this.

So I say letting China or Chinese companies own GM and/or Chrysler is something to seriously consider. Patriotism and nationalism should not cloud our judgment here. “Who’s gonna make our planes and tanks if there’s another war,” you ask? General Dynamics, not General Motors. Do you think GM can really roll out an M1A1 tank? GM can’t even make a car as good as an Accord, they ain’t gonna be making F-22’s anytime soon. Lockheed Martin/Boeing has us covered there.

I don’t get it, why would the Chinese take anything more than a foothold via just Volvo or at a stretch, just Chrysler? But GM? How would you unravel the basket-case that is GM?

If true, the politics of all this will be extraordinary.

- Sorry, but welcome to the real world. Now you know how the rest of the world feels about the decisions your country makes. A lot of you Americans have always thought you have ruled the world with an iron fist, but not the case anymore, maybe really never were. Live in the 21st century, and help the world become a global community.

They do not need bombs either. Why because the mega firms of the future control the economy of the future. That’s where the power is at.

However, the point that the mega companies are the future. They will be the new social order. However lets hope they have learned from the mistakes of the nations. In other words, be kind to the common man. Remember, God must love the common man because he made so many of them.

You posted “I would look forward to see how the Chinese deal with the UAW.”

I’m afraid you don’t get it: read Menno’s post immediately above yours. The Chinese don’t give a tinker’s damn about the “going concern” named “General Motors” or that other one named “Chrysler LLC”. You are right that they don’t want to deal with a genuine union like the UAW instead of one of the “straw-man” club of informers they call a union. But they won’t have to. All they really want is 100 years of brand loyalty, engineering diagrams, computer software, test results, and THE ROBOTS!

GM alone has invested upward of $4 billion in retooling the past five years. The robots those billions bought will be on a FAST boat to China within weeks after the “rescue”.

I’m for Congress GIVING a gaggle of separate ESOP’s enough money to buy the Chevrolet and Saturn divisions (run by Saturn people, not Chevvy alums), the Buick-Pontiac division, and an amalgam of GMC and Cadillac from GM, with one for Jeep and the PT cruiser and one for the minivans from Chrysler. Let the meaningless Chrysler “me-too” sedans wither; they’re big Fiats.

Demand that the taxpayers receive preferred stock paying dividends after five years or so and leave the corporate husks with the foreign operations. Congress would also have to top up the PBGC to ensure that the company pensions for former workers are worth something.

Something to ease Ford’s burdens would need to be done, too, but it’s far enough along toward becoming an integrated global company that it makes sense to leave it alone.

All this might cost $100 billion but it would result in a competitive industry with a range of products. If the worker/owners fail they then have no one to blame but themselves.

You are right. I’ve always said that new cars are a loss leader for two very profitable businesses: Service and financing. GM botched even that with first selling half of a very profitable GMAC, and then letting them walk into the mortgage minefield. A captive financing arm is a license to print money.

They’re asking for at least 10 billion for GM from Congress.

The Chinese have done the math.

Wired Magazine had an article about 6 months ago with a chart showing all the major car companies in the world. Less than 1/2 are profitable and only a very few earn more than savings bank interest. Good luck to the Chinese.

Also,we (yes – you and I) have to think about what we have been doing.

We didn’t adopt universal health care back in the 1950’s when other industrial countries did which would have removed this burden from our companies.

We ran up terrible credit card debts, car loan debts, and mortgage debts.

We didn’t adopt strong fuel economy standards.

We didn’t raise taxes high enough on fuel.

When we asked our car companies to make improvements they told us to go to hell and we didn’t force them to make enough improvements which would have been good for them and us.

We need to buy 70% of our fuel from other countries because we drive around in obsolete ICE powered vehicles that use most of their fuel to make heat and noise.

Now the Arabs are buying our banks and the Chinese may be buying our car companies. duh.

If you feel a need to blame someone just look in the mirror.

http://gm-volt.com/2008/11/18/is-china-considering-buying-gm/

However, years ago Chrysler went in the verge into bankruptcy and later on Nissan almost went into bankruptcy not long ago. and the reason why that GM is nearly bankrupt because they own GMAC a finance division of GM in which means people that get loans, credit, etc.

Since the housing bubble popped and more and more people are getting laid off from factories like GM and since gas prices have risen and have went down, and it make it hard to sell cars, trucks and suv’s especially if you are the American Automaker competing against the world and it’s economy struggling and suffocating in it’s own debt I think that they need to give them 36 billion dollars to the companys like the big three we need to support not just the company but the people that work there not there just for the benefits but it is a tradition, a American tradition.

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