slateslate :
August 19th, 2009 at 12:25 pm

This is another area the Big 2.8 are hopeless……people are willing to pay a premium for high-content small/compact cars.

Wrong! The VW Jetta is probably at the upper limit of price premium for a high-content small/compact car and it had to grow to fit it’s price.

BTW, Zeta missed its MPG target by about 15%.

http://autos.msn.com/research/compare/exterior.aspx?c=0&n=3&i=0&ph1=t0&ph2=t0&tb=0&dt=0&v=t107115&v=t107323

Maybe that’s the real reason the G8 won’t be revived as a Chevy.

I agree that people cross shop the 3-series and CTS, as they do the 3 and much larger G37, because of pricing. But the Cadillac CTS is much larger than the current 3-series.

The CTS has a 5 inch longer wheelbase and a 13 inches longer length than the 3-series (the CTS has basically the same wheelbase and length as the current 5-series).

http://autos.msn.com/research/compare/exterior.aspx?c=0&n=3&i=0&tb=0&ph1=t0&ph2=t0&dt=0&v=t108794&v=t107115&v=t108687

So there is room for a smaller Cadillac sedan below the CTS. But it would have to be priced low enough that people aren’t just going to buy a CTS instead. Or it would have to be sold as a Buick or Chevy if GM doesn’t want to sell a Cadillac starting in the mid-$20s.

Also, a 1 mpg penalty for RWD vs. FWD with the same engine is very good. RWD cars get lower mileage because they must weigh more (more torsional rigidity in the chassis, a stronger rear suspension, and the driveshaft and separate differential) and because their drivetrains have more mechanical drag than a transverse FWD car. AWD is the worst for fuel economy.

This is one area where CAFE has really screwed up US car design. Europeans would rather drive a RWD car and pay slightly higher gas taxes or get a smaller engine, but CAFE makes US automakers think that they need FWD, instead of just RWD with more efficient engines like the brilliant GM 2 liter turbo direct injection ecotec.

Why on earth would a RWD car have a 1mpg penalty?

We do in fact get A3s and 1-series here, and both are selling reasonably well. The 1-series might actually sell better if it was smaller, cheaper, and simpler – problem is it is just too close in size and price to the 3-series.

And lastly – I would say the CTS is very much a 3-series competitor, they are very similar in size. The latest 3-series is HUGE. Not the small car you may think it is, it is only fractionally smaller than the previous generation 5-series.

I think the CTS is as good as GM is going to get in terms of a competitior to the 3 and G. If they try to copy the size with another model, you know it still won’t be close to the handling of the 3 and G, and it will be small to boot. Who wants that? I don’t think that kind of GM car will stand a chance. Forget a 3-size Caddy and just keep the CTS the way it is in terms of price and size, at least it can get those 3 and G shoppers who want a bigger car, bigger back seat etc. The CTS is well positioned to pick off some buyers from both the compact (3) and mid-size segments (5). That is its only hope- to straddle the segments, it can’t go head to head with either of them.

wouldnt the kappa platform be closer in size to a 1 series and then they could actually get some use out of it

I like vehicles that do a lot with a little such as the Prius, Fit, Transit Connect, 2CV, etc. but after the Vega, Geo, and Aveo it will be a long time before I trust GM.

For those who want great handling like the BMWs and Infinities, are you going to trust the maker of Camaros whose answer to all problems is a bigger heavier engine?

For those who like Miatas are you going to trust the maker of the 400 pound heavier Solstice?

Currently the domestics are being killed at their own game – large cars for the US market – by the Germans, Koreans and Japanese. Making larger cars for the US market is the one dimension in which the domestics might have an edge. For the domestics to try beat the Germans, Koreans and Japanese at their own game (small cars) will never work.

Seems like a no brainer.

“I can’t think of one premium American car less than 185″ in length. Am I missing one?”

The Corvette, but yeah, I get what you’re saying.

Anyway the big problems with the 1-series are that it is 1) Ugly, 2) Expensive, and 3) Very close in price to the 3-series, especially with leasing.

I’ll take the (AWD but bought by people that want a RWD car and don’t want to pay more than the mid-$20s) Subaru Impreza WRX as the test of whether people are willing to buy a small relatively powerful RWD sedan at a good price. They are.

If GM can price this car in the mid-$20s it will succeed, but if Cadillac prices this close to the CTS then people will continue to buy the CTS.

This is the platform that the bloated, overweight Camaro should have been built off of.

I don’t think a stretched Kappa platform would work though… it was just plain not designed with moving passengers in mind.

+1 on the manual trans and sport package.

Edit: To the B&B, If GM does make the Alpha, you KNOW they’re going to spread the platform around. What should it become in one of GM’s three other brands?

I say stretch it about 6 inches and make it the next Camaro. Yes, the Camaro would shrink in size, but it makes perfect sense. 3.6 V6 as base engine, turbo or supercharged V6 for top-end engine.

One word to Mr. Lutz, please make sure at least one trim trim level has a sports pkg with a manual tm.

Well, there was the Cadillac Cimarron.

How can Lincoln/Cadillac ever have a chance with volume if they don’t have a 3-series-sized competitor? Not needing/wanting a big car, I’d seriously consider buying a Civic-sized Caddy with CTS design cues.

I can’t think of one premium American car less than 185″ in length. Am I missing one?

My guess is GM’s internal politics. US-based employees lobby for the assignment because it means better job security for them. (Their formal argument, however, is that they claim to better understand American tastes. Yeah, like the Aztek.) At the RenCen, the top bosses figure there are all those Americans on payroll anyway, so why not use them?

I sure hope all the engineers responsible for fiascos like the Vega, X-cars, DexCool, faulty gaskets, etc., are now gone. You’d think they’d eventually run out of excuses for their incompetence and go swept out in the downsizing.

Now… what about a replacement for the Sky/Solstice for Chevy on this platform? And this time make it with a proper trunk and a top that is easy to use?