By on December 25, 2013


Speaking personally, this has been a pretty good Christmas for me, chock-full of unusual and thoughtful gifts as well as some pleasant times with my son. But I’d been kind of hoping against hope that some automaker out there would give me something special for the day — even though I never asked specifically for any of them. Well, that’s what happens when you’re passive-aggressive about stuff, I suppose.

So here’s my list. All of these cars would be possible, if not easy, to build using existing structures and resources. In a few cases, I suppose a little slack would be required from the United States Government. They’re ranked in approximate order from “why not?” to “”. Without further ado:

#8: Porsche 991 GT3 7-speed What possible reason could Porsche have to not make this one available, other than institutional stubbornness and their occasional, inexplicable desire to piss on their customers. The transmission’s already there and already rated for the no-longer-Metzger-motor. Sure, the real GT3 racers have semi-auto boxes. They also need an engine rebuild every 25 hours. No reason to be too authentic, is there?

#7: Viper-Based 6.4L V-8 Corvette Fighter This is car whose failure to exist has puzzled me ever since the Chrysler Firepower concept arrived. It would be fast and balanced, and if it cost a little bit more than a Corvette it would be a little more exotic as well. Just throw slightly different bodywork on it and call it — Diamondback?

#6: Ecoboost V-6 2014 Mustang “GT350” Should have been a no-brainer. Turn the wick on the Ecoboost V-6 up to 400 horses, stuff it in the nose of a GT500, add lightness, cut cost, sell it for about what the GT 5.0 sells for. No more difficult than having the five-liter and the Ecoboost side-by-side in F-150s on the lot, right? Optimize it for the street, not the track. Kind of a polar opposite to the Boss 302. Would have been a fun car.

#5: Accord Sport V-6 Manual Sedan This is a selfish request. I like the Accord Sport manual sedan, and I like the V-6 manual Coupe, but as a member of the Clan Of The Car Seat I need the back doors. All the parts are there. I even (ahem) know a guy who might be able to program the FANUCs to do it. The real love letter to the fans would be to throw the 3.7 from the loaded-up TL in there. And in a perfect world, it could be had without leather upholstery.

#4: Mk7 Golf/Scirocco/Audi TT Combo Sportster The current Scirocco is an interesting steer. So’s the Audi TT. And now there’s a great new Mark Seven GTI. So put the three of them together, get some aluminum underneath it, put sporty bodywork on. Now that Porsche has firmly renounced affordable sports cars in favor of pumped-up Tiguan-alikes, that space is officially open for business under the VW umbrella.

#3: Malibu SS This one’s easy: the Regal GS drivetrain in a Malibu, hold the gingerbread, sell it for under thirty grand, pull out all the stops on the suspension tune. Of course, the Vauxhall Insignia VXR overseas has a 325hp turbo V-6 that would also fit, but maybe that’s asking too much of the General.

#2: Lexus IS-F I’m sure this one’s coming, but I had specific requests: Take the outstanding IS 350 F-Sport, put the five-liter V-8 in, add a clutch pedal, build the greatest Toyota in history. No problem, right?

#1: Dacia Duster Make it as cheap as possible and put the Frontier’s four-cylinder in. Vinyl seats, grey bumpers, FWD, five-speed stick, no carpets, steel six-lug wheels. $13,995 out the door. And since we’re just wishing here, go ahead and make it in Syrna, TN. A proper basic American-built car for the reduced expectations of the new economy, offering a quarter-million miles of service at a rock-bottom price. I’d buy one for the winters, for sure.

Will any of my Christmas dreams ever come true? I doubt it, but you never know. Santa might fire up a production line for me yet. Until then, Happy Holidays to all of you in TTAC-land!

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75 Comments on “My Christmas List Of Oddballs And Improbabilites...”

  • avatar

    Great list. Love the Viper, Mustang and Malibu ideas. Would also add the following: A Lexus GS-F with a 6.0L V8 supercharged. And how about a Cruz-SS turbo-ed to 300HP and using that Regal double upper ball-joint suspension thingy?

  • avatar

    Have you ever driven a Dacia Duster?

    • 0 avatar

      I have! (I know you’re not asking me but, y’know…)
      It was pretty good, no better or worse than the Renault and Euro-Nissan cars that donated bits but it was bloody cheap so it felt like reasonable value.

      It had the potential to be hugely disruptive in the UK market but I’m not sure it’s delivered on that. The UK market has out-performed the Euro market this year because of a weird situation where banks paid out millions to customers they’d mis-sold to and people seem to have bought cars witht he money.

      The Duster was advertised as being available at a bonkers cheap price but there was no stock and a relatively long waiting list, so people went elsewhere.

      Most people also seemed to be ordering the expensive ones rather than the white-only, 2wd base model that Dacia/Renault had anticipated.

      They’re now more expensive used than new because of the lack of waiting list and the new price has also crept up quite a bit.

  • avatar

    I like all the above, and have thought a lot about both nr.6 and 7. I also think they should have made a Gt500RS, basically the Boss with the Gt500 engine, and decent brakes, and no rear seats etc. I’m sure when it comes to Mustangs, a few phonecalls, and some dollar bills can get you more or less whatever you want.
    Add a CRV with a V6, or at least a manual transmission for the Americans (we even get the diesel with a clutch over here in Europe (also in Brown);)),
    and the list is complete.

    • 0 avatar

      Apparently the Trinity engine will fit but its not dainty, even in all aluminum trim the engine with supercharger and intercooler weigh around 600 pounds dressed compared to the 5.0 which weighs around 440 pounds dressed.

      Its great for raw power and pretty damn fun when your stomping the gas but it wrecks the F/R balance making it more muscle car than sports car (perfect for the GT500 which IMO is “the” muscle Mustang).

  • avatar

    This is like a Seinfeld episode, a column about nothing.

  • avatar

    #5 is a must. I doubt they would offer the 3.7 but a 6MT 4 door accord would be sublime.

    I am beyond anxious awaiting the TLX reveal and the myriad of power train options they could throw together.
    -RLX sport hybrid setup?
    – TL SHAWD with DI 3.7?
    – turbo 4 with 6MT and SH-AWD?

    • 0 avatar

      Honda needs to make the Accord Sport (a base LX with bigger tires, slightly tightened suspension, foglights and dual exhaust) a package across the range. An “EX Sport” would be a damn good value–sunroof, nicer CLOTH seats, blinker mirrors, the LaneWatch camera, and keyless start, plus the bigger tires and wheels, etc.

      (Curiously, in Canada, the Touring trim gets you the big wheels and tires plus LED headlights and a choice of four or V6, while the US Touring is V6-only WITHOUT the large wheels and tires, BUT with Adaptive Cruise Control. IMHO, both US and Canada should get a Touring with LEDs, ACC and a choice of engines, with the larger wheels and tires as a part of a “Touring Elite” package.)

      And oh yes, you should be able to order the 6MT on the V6 trims, even if you have to “special-order” and wait for it!

  • avatar

    Sorry to beat a dead horse, but I can’t let it go–manual transmission option for pickups of all sizes and engines.

  • avatar

    Add to the list:

    A credible replacement for the Scion xD and the Matrix. That is, a true 5-door with a four cylinder and a car-like ride, not another CUV.

  • avatar

    “Turn the wick on the Ecoboost V-6 up to 400 horses… Optimize it for the street, not the track.”

    Personally, I would go with “Mach 1” or “SVO” for that type of Mustang. I feel like the “GT350” and “BOSS” monikers belong on the racetrack stuff.

    Just for fun, I’ll add one I’ve used before: Buick Lacrosse with a version of the Silverado/Sierra’s 4.3L V6 de-bored to 3.8L.

    If I want to get really crazy, A VF Commodore wearing Buick badges with a turbocharged 3.8L OHV V6 called the Lesabre Sport Sedan.

  • avatar

    Something that gives some love to extinct brands.

    It doesn’t have to be an all-new car, but some new company making Oldsmobile parts or something would be cool.

  • avatar

    Whelp the GT350 is on the way except it will be fitted with an upgraded version of the current 5.0 V8 possibly in 5.3 or 5.4 guise and thought to be over 500hp naturally aspirated. The Mach 1 is also supposed to be on the way as well.

    Perhaps Ford could resurrect the SVO moniker, give this SVO Mustang the EcoBoost V6 and fit it with top of the line brakes to bump the visual sizzle and keep the outward appearance tame except for a unique palette of colors (essentially make this the S550 generations Bullitt Mustang)

    I’d like to add a #9 and that’s an honest sports car from Ford instead of trying to make the Mustang all things and call that sports car a Cobra then slot it in somewhere between Corvette and Viper

  • avatar

    I’m not the expert, but why would an Ecoboost 6 be less expensive for Ford than the 5.0? If it’s not cheaper to build/buy, would anyone get it just for the power/weight and balance benefits? Hell no.

    • 0 avatar

      A 400-ish hp EcoBoost V6 would probably have 425-450 tq vs the 5.0’s 380-390.

    • 0 avatar

      It has all the right buzz words – direct injection and turbocharged. People love that stuff.

      At one of my online hangouts the lack of direct injection on the V8 was enough to dissuade the poster from considering the purchase of the new Mustang.

      • 0 avatar

        “At one of my online hangouts the lack of direct injection on the V8 was enough to dissuade the poster from considering the purchase of the new Mustang.”

        which is a load of BS. It’s essentially code for “I would never buy a Mustang anyway, but here’s something I pulled out of my ass as a weak justification.”

    • 0 avatar

      I would probably buy the 3.5 Ecoboost over the V8 in a Mustang. I like turbocharged cars, Mustangs, and torque. Such a vehicle would be all those things. Its probably unecessary though, because I am going to buy a next generation Mustang regardless of if it comes with an EB V6.

  • avatar


    Good god man, having something along the lines of a Civic Si Sedan for actual adults (with children) would be a godsend.

    I’m not saying that the Si isn’t family friendly, but families need a bit more room than a Civic can give them.

    Price that sumbitch at a shade under $30k in colors OTHER than black and gray, and dads that aren’t keen on German cars will be lining up to get one.

  • avatar
    Big Al from Oz

    I’ve mentioned about having an Eco Boost Mustang and got shot down. It has to be a V8…..apparently.

    The Duster would suffice with a Nissan 1.8, I don’t know if the chassis can handle any more than that.

    I would like to see on your list a diesel 3.2, 5 cylinder Duratorque F-150. This would be a cheaper challenger to the VM V6 diesel Ram.

    • 0 avatar

      the 1.6 I drove was so utterly bereft of anything resembling “fun to drive” that I can’t see a case for trying to sell it here. The Versa already has “cheap griefbox” covered. Apart from the Duster’s taller stance, I can’t see what it brings to the table. Terrible shifter, lousy materials, approximate build quality, and gutless performance. If the 1.6 has 100 hp, I want to know where some of them are hiding. Plus, by the time they spent the money federalizing it, I don’t think it would be as cheap as Jack thinks it would.

  • avatar

    Either of the following would make my wallet fly open – F31 BMW 328i wagon without Xdrive but with 6spd stick. Or I would settle for the 8spd auto paired with the diesel without Xdrive. Or shoot for the moon – the diesel WITH a stick.

  • avatar

    Personally, if I could just get a Mazda6 wagon, I’d be happy.

    No, I’m not a wagonphile like so many interneters, and I couldn’t care less if GM or anyone else sells one. But the 6 is a great car; I need to throw a couple bikes in the back; and I want to move up from a compact (but I’m not interested in an SUV).

    • 0 avatar

      I’ve also purchased 3 hatchbacks/wagons with visions of bikes in the back. In reality, though, the 2″ receiver and hitch mounted bike rack on my Prius v and my 4Runner is far superior to being able to fit the bikes inside the vehicle. Unless you get something big enough, like a van, where you can mount your bike trays on the floor and lock the bikes in upright, you end up tearing up your interior, getting mud everywhere, and have bikes intertwined with each other. The only advantage to fitting inside the car is security, IMO. The poor availability of wagons and the limited cargo advantages, and the fact we have a big wagon on stilts in the fleet, have pretty much removed my requirement of a wagon as my next vehicle. Sure, it would be nice to have the option, but I no longer plan on being forced into giving up a sporty vehicle just so I can have a cargo area that is a little more useful. Given the choice of a RWD 6MT 328i 6MT sedan or an AWD-only, AT-only 328i wagon, for example, I’m not giving up RWD dynamics and MT fun for a severely sloped hatch thrown onto a sedan.

      Now, if you are a single guy with 1 vehicle that has to do it all, the wagon *might* be a little more necessary, but a roof rack w/ a cargo box or a hitch mount with a platform buys back quite a lot of cargo capability.

    • 0 avatar

      Would the bikes fit in the back of a Mazda6 wagon? The back seems so sloped. I have no idea how tall you bikes are compared to the hatch opening so it very well could work. I am into sailing instead of biking so I have to tow. A Mazda6 or Fusion wagon would be something I would like as my boat and trailer weigh under 1000 lbs.

      • 0 avatar

        Dealt with a previous ten 6 wagon…one bike on its side MAYBE…2…not a chance though the wagon does let you toss a roof rack up there.

      • 0 avatar

        A valid concern.

        I have a Protege5, which is considerably smaller in length and width, but I regularly fit two bikes in it without much difficulty. The new 3 has a shorter load height (26″ instead of 30″), and so a 6 wagon may, too. Their extra length should make up for the slanted rear window, especially since the bikes don’t lie that high. Due to the extra length & width, I suspect it would be easier in the 6 (and possibly in the 3 as well). I use a sheet/blanket to protect the various surfaces and haven’t had a problem with soiling or tearing things up.

        My bike rack does not work with my bikes as they don’t all have top tubes. A hitch-based rack that holds the wheels certainly would be better. I’ve know too many people who have used roof racks and run into things because they forget/misjudge their height. I guess I’ve just grown fond of keeping the bikes secure & protected from wind/bugs/spray/back-up accidents/etc.

  • avatar

    To add a few of my personal favorites I would also love to see:

    Honda CRZ with the F22C1 2.2 liter engine from the last S2000, perhaps the very best engine Honda ever made. Winding it out is more addictive than cocaine… It would turn the current neither sporty nor economical sales flop CRZ into the spiritual successor to the late, lamented CRX Si. Imagine a CRZ with the 240 hp VTEC engine and 6 speed from the S2000…. Failing that, at least stick in the 201 hp 2.4 liter from the current Civic Si and finally give it the performance to match its looks (but, it’ll never happen, because it makes too much sense).

    2014 Mustang Mach 1 with the 444 hp Road Runner engine from the Boss 302. Like others have said, put the great engine in the GT and optimzie it for the street, not the track. Wouldn’t that be a nice ‘special edition’ to send off the current body style?

    Mazda Miata with a rotary engine. Surely Mazda could crank out a few more 13B Renesis engines? Yes, the gas mileage wouldn’t be wonderful, but wouldn’t it be great to have 240 free-revving hp in the Miata, with no weight penalty?

    How about finally harmonizing U.S. and European safety and emissions regulations so we can get some of the fabulous cars sold over there? For me it’s a long list, especially “hot hatches” that have all but disappeared from the U.S. –

    VW Scirocco
    Mazda 6 diesel with a manual transmission
    Citroen DS3
    Peugeot RCZ
    Nissan Juke diesel
    Vauxhaull Astra GTC

    Not too much to ask for, is it?

  • avatar
    Sammy B

    I’ll echo one of yours, some others on here, and add one:

    -Accord V6 6MT Sedan….yes please! The 06-07 models are getting hard to find. I’d love to be able to get a new one.
    -Mazda 6 wagon…this really should be quite easy!
    -As a slight spin on your #2, a detuned/decontented IS250 that carries a toyota or scion badge. I have to think if they got rid of the IS’s luxury goodies, it’d be possible to get it down to near $25K. Would be a nice RWD family sedan. Or make FRS sedan! Either way, like you said, those of us with car seats need back doors!

    • 0 avatar

      My 2013 Accord Touring (Sedan V6 with all boxes checked) is a real sleeper, even with the slusher! Can’t drive a stick (tried learning in a ‘Teg, no less) well enough to function in traffic, but the V6/6MT option should be available in a Sedan! It’s also got the “bank vault” feel of previous generations of Accord, so it’s a helluva deal for the long haul!

  • avatar
    Athos Nobile

    Umm… lets see:

    Current or previous gen 3 Series BMW with the AWESOME triple turbo diesel motor. Since I saw my first 4-series yesterday, it could be one of those. Or that Saab-like GT.

    XR6 Falcon with F6 powertrain and G6E interior/gimmicks, GT-P brakes. Candy orange. A Falcon with the 400KW NSW police engine wouldn’t hurt either.

    Yellow GenF GTS, 8 speed auto with flappy paddles. With LS9 supercharger ;)

    VF SSV Redline tourer with Gen5 V8 and 8 Speed auto. Yes, I’m going soft.

    Speed limits raised outside major cities to 130 km/h, and NT like in the middle of nowhere.

    GM, Ford and Chrysler finally see the light and start selling Wrong Hand Drive pick ups down here. And Charger and Challenger and Mustang and Corvette. GM brings the Tahoe and Suburban.

    A brand new Saab 9-3 XWD.

  • avatar

    Another vote for the V6 6MT Accord Sport. But I would like mine with a real gauge package, and AWD wouldn’t hurt.

    A car that may happen: A GT86/ FR-S with a turbo. What probably won’t happen: an acceptable interior to go with it.

    Something that definitely won’t happen: a new Ford (not Lincoln) sedan based on the upcoming Mustang platform.

  • avatar

    I’m more than ready for the 6mt accord sedan. I’d likely buy one in
    a heartbeat, esp. if I didn’t have to buy the exl trim to go with it.

  • avatar

    Yes to all of the above. My wish list along those lines would be an AWD, manual, diesel VW Tiguan with the mid range spec. That is definitely achievable, a wish that is not so easy would be for the Renault Clio sport.

  • avatar

    I wish Dacia had a Duster that was a pickup truck; I would so go for that were such a handsome beast were to exist.

    Barring that, I want Fiat to bring over the Strada Adventure so that once I have my license again (and finish my “Driving Mlle Miquelon” series for TTAC), I can be stylish and useful to any hipster in Seattle needing help with their vegan free trade handcrafted hot dog truck during my TTAC video review (which I hope will look as great as Top Gear, if not close).

    And of course, I wish the Chevy SS 1.) had a name — Bonneville, Commodore, Lumina or Caprice would be nice — and 2.) had a face like the new Impala.

    Finally, there actually is a; it’s purported to be the future home of “something cool.”

  • avatar

    the problem with all those cars is that they appeal to a small percent of people

    call them “wedge cars”… they are all hardcore enthusiast options that is guaranteed to lose money

    the Duster is realistic however

    i’d probably st least drive a Duster if they sold it with say an MR16DET Nissan or some kind of 1.6 turbo diesel of some sort

    6 spd manual and 4wd?

    strangely there’s SUV you can buy here that is trying to
    “out Duster” the Duster

    Peugeot 2008

    has a base 1,2 turbo 3 cyl. fwd CUV and looks like a viable alterataive to the Dusters and Ecosports of the world

    • 0 avatar

      the Duster is a piece of junk. you complain about “wedge cars” then conjure a Duster with a diesel engine, 6 spd manual, and 4WD? If there is such a thing as a “wedge car” then what you propose is the shining example.

  • avatar

    My dream “daily driver”:

    A Japanese Luxury stick-shift hatchback. I’d be happy with a high-output DI 4 cylinder, or a small V6, but not turbo.

    Infiniti Q30 with a 6-speed, I suppose.

    My other fantasy is Honda offering the 6MT Accord Coupe in more than 3 f’ing colors, and stop sending ALL the blue and white ones up to Canada when they’re built in the US.

  • avatar

    Actually, forget my previous Christmas wish, I’ve got something better.

    A brand new updated version of the old ’78-87 A/G platform cars from GM. Yes, even the Cutlass.

    Modern tech and old school mid-size RWD? It’s an enthusiast’s dream! And how about we call the Chevrolet version a Chevelle, ya?

    • 0 avatar

      Would love to see Photochops, drawings, etc., of a G-Body, brought up to today’s standards, inside and out!

      Even the interiors! Keep the same general look of the dashes (but allow the use of modern analog/digital gauges, for example); the radio/HVAC “pod” in the Olds/Buick/Chevy could easily contain a screen and hard-buttons for those controls in a 2014 Cutlass in a different, more up-to-date configuration! Passenger airbags would fit just fine in the dash above the gloveboxes!

      It would have to have windows that roll down in the back of sedans, even if only in part!

      Do one of these with the 3.6L V6, all the toys including more modern stuff such as Adaptive Cruise, with mid 30s on the highway at 80+, and I’d have a look at it! (A Brougham package, with the classic velour tastefully done in a dark burgundy (or the same in leather, would be the clincher!)

  • avatar

    I have one request: I would like to see someone, anyone, offer a modern, simple, compact or midsize SUV to compete with the Wrangler.

    After doing a bit of online shopping for Wranglers that often equal the cost of a new Lexus I have to think Sergio is rolling around Scrooge McDuck style in his tower of Wrangler monopoly loot. For the love of god someone give the Wrangler some competition!

  • avatar

    My general wish list is packaging or powertrains of vehicles we already have available. I’d love to see more wagons and I realize that they aren’t going to make a comeback any time soon, but it is a wishlist, afterall.

    1) Subaru Levorg – bring it to the US w/ the 2.0DIT from the new WRX. Giving it the WRX goodies would be nice, too… like a proper sport package.
    2) Lexus IS – I love, love, love the look of this car and the reviews have been very good for the 350 F-sport. Putting a stick in it would be awesome (the 8AT is quite good, too, though). A 2.0T to replace the underwhelming 2.5L V6 mated to the 8AT would make it a legitimate 3 series fighter. A 2.0T w/ 6MT would put it in my garage.
    3) Lexus CT – Again, this car is a powertrain away from becoming a legitimate contender. The 1.8HSD is fine for my Prius. When you are trying to sell sporty, though, it doesn’t cut the mustard. The 2.5HSD or the 2.0T from the upcoming NX would greatly compliment the chassis that is actually pretty decent.
    4) BMW 3 wagon – drop the AWD requirement and get the pricing in line. M sport plus the basics (heated seats, push button start) on a 328i xdrive wagon puts you in the $50k range. Your base engine is finally efficient AND powerful, but forcing AWD and forcing 8AT makes me wonder why I would want to spend $50k for something that isn’t what I want. I totally understand limiting options makes vehicles more profitable, but at some point I’d expect to be getting more of a bargain by compromising on the AWD and the MT.
    5) VW Jetta Sportwagen – I chose a GTI over a 2.0T Jetta Sportwagen last time because you put a great engine and tranny into a ho-hum package.

  • avatar

    Take the TTV6 from the XTS-V and put it into the Camaro Z/28. Call it the Z/26 or something similar. Offer it with the 20″ modern versions of the five hole steel Rally wheels that were on all of the Chevys from the 60’s-70’s…

    In reality, it would probably cost as much as the ZL1 and probably not much lighter (if at all) than either one of the V8 powered versions, either.

    I just think it would be cool…

  • avatar

    Another vote for Accord V6 6MT sedan. Like the coupe a lot, just can’t persuade myself to pull the trigger and get it, but the sedan would be a no-brainer. Such a nice engine, that latest version of the port-injected V6, so quiet until you give it the beans and so smooth and responsive.

  • avatar
    Scott Seigmund

    Forget “Viper-based”! Just give the Viper a HEMI and run with it. Why not use an engine shared with other platforms that is also a brand unto itself? I have to believed the stubborn loyalty to the V10 engine is a big part of the reason the new Viper is so expensive. The HEMI would breath new life into the aging platform by having a 6.4 liter base Viper and an unlikely stoke of marketing genius would put a 426 HEMI in the high spec track monster to take on Corvette.

    • 0 avatar

      disagree. The Viper *is* the V10. The new Viper is so expensive because they decided to build a nice car around the engine this time.

      Seriously, go sit in a 1994 Viper, and then a 2014.

  • avatar
    MRF 95 T-Bird

    Here is one to add to the list. A performance XRS version of the Toyota Corolla to compete with Civic Si. 180-200 hp and 6 speed manual.

  • avatar

    At 13 grand I’d buy the Duster but I suspect it would cost more than 13 grand but the time it hit the dealers making some of its flaws stick out a bit more. Also what would Nissan call it…pretty sure Duster is still owned by Chrysler here. Hardbody maybe?

  • avatar

    Ford – Give me a 300 competitor…and it shall be called a Galaxie

  • avatar

    How about a Mazda RX-9 with a supercharged 2.5 Skyactive engine with dry sump oiling system to reduce engine height?

    • 0 avatar

      If it had a normal piston engine then it can’t be a RX car.

      That having been said, on my (post) xmas wishlist:

      16x rotary engine in a 4th gen miata. ~275hp in a 2300lb roadster, low CoG a fantastic chassis and suspension. win.

  • avatar

    A new SRT4 based on the Dart. Give the looks some needed chassis refinement and lots of power.

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