By on March 1, 2013

Crazy double digit gains have given way to solid single digit growth (on top of the crazy gains of last year).  More importantly for American makers, pickups and SUVs are moving. Stay with us throughout sales day for updates of the sales table.

February 2013 U.S. New Light Vehicle Sales

(Final table courtesy Automotive News [sub]

Automaker Feb. 2013 Feb. 2012 Pct. chng. 2 month
2013
2 month
2012
Pct. chng.
BMW Group 25,697 26,264 –2% 45,976 46,083 0%
    BMW division 21,311 21,204 1% 37,824 37,609 1%
    Mini 4,302 4,980 –14% 7,984 8,314 –4%
    Rolls-Royce 84 80 5% 168 160 5%
BMW Group 25,697 26,264 –2% 45,976 46,083 0%
Chrysler Group 139,015 133,521 4% 256,746 234,670 9%
    Chrysler Division 25,083 27,008 –7% 45,779 44,612 3%
    Dodge 55,639 42,692 30% 98,866 74,146 33%
    Dodge/Ram 79,466 65,974 21% 143,680 115,898 24%
    Fiat 3,302 3,227 2% 5,805 5,138 13%
    Jeep 31,164 37,312 –17% 61,482 69,022 –11%
    Ram 23,827 23,282 2% 44,814 41,752 7%
Chrysler Group 139,015 133,521 4% 256,746 234,670 9%
Daimler AG 24,051 19,685 22% 48,110 41,410 16%
    Maybach 4 –100% 8 –100%
    Mercedes-Benz 23,268 18,912 23% 46,846 40,137 17%
    Smart USA 783 769 2% 1,264 1,265 0%
Daimler AG 24,051 19,685 22% 48,110 41,410 16%
Ford Motor Co. 195,310 178,644 9% 361,173 314,938 15%
    Ford division 190,427 171,732 11% 352,099 302,905 16%
    Lincoln 4,883 6,912 –29% 9,074 12,033 –25%
Ford 195,310 178,644 9% 361,173 314,938 15%
General Motors 224,314 209,306 7% 419,013 377,268 11%
    Buick 16,150 14,023 15% 29,613 24,231 22%
    Cadillac 13,845 11,505 20% 26,961 20,429 32%
    Chevrolet 158,541 151,197 5% 295,845 275,061 8%
    GMC 35,778 32,581 10% 66,594 57,547 16%
General Motors 224,314 209,306 7% 419,013 377,268 11%
Honda (American) 107,987 110,157 –2% 201,613 193,166 4%
    Acura 11,364 11,258 1% 20,853 19,639 6%
    Honda Division 96,623 98,899 –2% 180,760 173,527 4%
Honda (American) 107,987 110,157 –2% 201,613 193,166 4%
Hyundai Group 93,816 96,189 –3% 173,831 174,400 0%
    Hyundai division 52,311 51,151 2% 96,024 93,845 2%
    Kia 41,505 45,038 –8% 77,807 80,555 –3%
Hyundai Group 93,816 96,189 –3% 173,831 174,400 0%
Jaguar Land Rover 5,053 4,277 18% 10,282 8,467 21%
    Jaguar 1,148 1,022 12% 2,177 2,007 9%
    Land Rover 3,905 3,255 20% 8,105 6,460 26%
Jaguar Land Rover 5,053 4,277 18% 10,282 8,467 21%
Maserati 159 191 –17% 331 345 –4%
Maserati 159 191 –17% 331 345 –4%
Mazda 24,936 25,651 –3% 46,255 49,647 –7%
Mazda 24,936 25,651 –3% 46,255 49,647 –7%
Mitsubishi 6,051 4,736 28% 10,710 9,447 13%
Mitsubishi 6,051 4,736 28% 10,710 9,447 13%
Nissan 99,636 106,731 –7% 180,555 186,044 –3%
    Infiniti 9,147 9,239 –1% 16,273 16,035 2%
    Nissan Division 90,489 97,492 –7% 164,282 170,009 –3%
Nissan 99,636 106,731 –7% 180,555 186,044 –3%
Subaru 28,163 25,374 11% 55,826 48,181 16%
Subaru 28,163 25,374 11% 55,826 48,181 16%
Suzuki* 1,250 2,425 –49% 2,736 3,930 –30%
Suzuki* 1,250 2,425 –49% 2,736 3,930 –30%
Toyota 166,377 159,462 4% 324,102 284,002 14%
    Lexus 17,339 16,682 4% 33,550 28,956 16%
    Scion 5,052 4,942 2% 9,945 8,477 17%
    Toyota division 143,986 137,838 5% 280,607 246,569 14%
    Toyota/Scion 149,038 142,780 4% 290,552 255,046 14%
Toyota 166,377 159,462 4% 324,102 284,002 14%
Volkswagen 45,364 41,426 10% 88,030 80,699 9%
    Audi 10,877 8,531 28% 20,933 17,885 17%
    Bentley 180 126 43% 368 244 51%
    Lamborghini* 46 43 7% 92 86 7%
    Porsche 2,805 2,149 31% 6,163 4,699 31%
    VW division 31,456 30,577 3% 60,474 57,785 5%
Volkswagen 45,364 41,426 10% 88,030 80,699 9%
Volvo Cars NA 4,867 5,263 –8% 9,742 9,724 0%
Volvo Cars NA 4,867 5,263 –8% 9,742 9,724 0%
    Other (estimate) 253 245 3% 506 490 3%
TOTAL 1,192,299 1,149,547 4% 2,235,537 2,062,911 8%
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100 Comments on “February U.S. Car Sales...”


  • avatar

    CHRYSLER: I always bet on winners!!!

  • avatar
    philadlj

    Cruze sales are down 12.1%, and I think I know why.

    Chevy is up to its old tricks…rolling out a new product, then letting it rot. The Cruze is entering its sixth year, without so much as a mid-cycle refresh. The diesel’s coming, and that’s nice, but at some point they need to show us what the next-gen Cruze will look like.

    • 0 avatar
      corntrollio

      How could the Cruze possibly be in its 6th year? The original renderings came out in Summer 2008. I don’t even think it was on sale in Korea until October ’08, so right now that’s less than 4.5 years (or 5th year, by your terminology). It wasn’t available anywhere else until probably Feb 2009 or so, and was a 2011 model in the US.

      Also, didn’t they just do a refresh for 2013? Seems like complaining for complaining’s sake here.

    • 0 avatar
      Tomifobia

      Sixth? 2013 is only the Cruze’s third year on the market.

    • 0 avatar
      SV

      The Cruze was new in the US for 2011 as has already been pointed out, so it’s only entering its third year here. It was introduced in Europe in late 2008. There’s a prototype for the next-gen running around now and it should be due out in 2014 for the 2015MY, meaning the first-gen Cruze will have had an exceptionally short 4 year cycle here, and an average-length 6 year lifespan elsewhere.

      http://www.autoblog.com/2013/02/13/next-gen-chevy-cruze-caught-cruising-in-the-cold/

      Also, the Cruze has already been facelifted in Europe and elsewhere, but I’m guessing GM figured it wouldn’t be worth the bother to change the US model when it’s only going to have a 4 year lifespan.

    • 0 avatar
      APaGttH

      Cruze sales are down 12.1%???

      http://media.gm.com/content/dam/Media/gmcom/investor/2013/Deliveries-Jan-2013.pdf

      Feb 2012: 15,049
      Feb 2013: 14,524

      That’s down 3.5%

  • avatar
    thornmark

    Fusion up 28%, Accord up 75%.

    Fusion sells more w/ $159/mo leases and fleet sales but all the momentum is with the Accord w/ lowest lease at 249/mo.

    • 0 avatar
      mike978

      Do you just pop up to criticize the Fusion and laud the Accord. BTW I think the Accord is one of the top two cars in that segment,so I understand your view.

      Surprised by VW brand – only 3%. Passat sales were 7532 and are down from February 2012 – not a good sign for a relatively new car when others like the Accord and Fusion are growing quickly. VW seems to have hit a speed bump.

      Also worryingly for Nissan their sales fell again (also happened in December 2012) even in a growing market. As BS would say major loss of share.

      • 0 avatar
        thornmark

        When I read that Ford was leasing Fusions at $159/mo I knew things were not going well for them.

        Sure, Fusions are moving, but for KMart shoppers.

        • 0 avatar
          tresmonos

          Go into a dealer and try to walk away with $159/month. The production take rate tells me that the odds of this happening are roughly <15%.

        • 0 avatar
          mike978

          I have just looked at the Toyota, Honda and Ford websites for lease offers and :

          Camry : $199 a month plus $2399 at signing (24 months)
          Accord : $219 a month plus $2399 at signing (36 months)
          Fusion : $278 a month with zero down (36 months)

          So the Accord is $7 a month more than the Fusion based on these figures. No doubt individual dealers may have other, better offers but the nation websites should be representative.
          The Fusion has more cashback than the others, but that is not surprising. Ford did the same with the Focus in the first model year. The MSRP is just too high.

          http://automobiles.honda.com/current-offers.aspx
          http://www.toyota.com/camry/#!/Welcome
          http://www.ford.com/cars/fusion/incentives/

          • 0 avatar
            thornmark

            $159/mo Fusion:

            http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/cars-trucks/best-car-

            deals/Ford-Deals/

            249/mo lowest for Accord:
            http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/cars-trucks/best-car-deals/Honda-Deals/

          • 0 avatar
            mike978

            TM – you forgot to mention that the 159 deal needs $3800 down for a 24 month contract. That works out to $318 a month. Come on be honest and do a fair comparison. I agree with you about the Accord’s merits but don`t let your dislike of the Fusion (for whatever reason) allow you to do an apples to orange comparison. They have got their sales increase fair and square not through ultra low priced leases that are way below the competition. As I showed above the per month cost was <$10 between an Accord and Fusion. I would actually expect more Accord buyers to buy rather than lease compared to Ford.

          • 0 avatar
            sunridge place

            stick around long enough and @thornmark will give you his national fleet analysis which consists of looking out his window at what his neighbor got from GE and droppping two year old links.

      • 0 avatar
        th009

        @mike978, lease rates aside, the Passat is two years old with no product changes. The Camry, Accord, Fusion and Malibu have all bee introduced after the Passat. Given that, an 8% single-month drop is not surprising (it’s still up 13% over the first two months).

        If I were VW, I would be more worried about the 11% drop for the Jetta. However, the rumour mill claims that a facelift and new engines are coming for the Jetta in the fall.

        • 0 avatar
          mike978

          I would think the Jetta drop is more understandable because it is an older car than the Passat. I didn`t know the Passat was up for the first two months and two months data is likely to be less prone to bounce than just one month.
          I agree a lot of new competitors have come out, but the Camry was similar timing to the Passat whilst the Sonata and Optima are even older (although still relatively young models).

          I had heard about the Jetta changes coming. From what I hear the 1.8 engine could also go in the Passat. It should hep fuel economy which lags badly behind many other new midsize cars.

    • 0 avatar
      tresmonos

      Nice try. Fusion hasn’t seen any fleet distribution from what I’ve witnessed, yet. Dealer priority.

    • 0 avatar
      SV

      Did a Fusion run over your dog or something, thornmark? It was up 28%, actually, and on a record year for that matter. I don’t think Honda’s sales numbers for February are out yet so I don’t know where you’re getting the Accord’s numbers from.

      • 0 avatar
        thornmark

        28% -I already wrote that.

        Fusions’ poor fuel economy and quality reports must be hitting home via CReports.

        • 0 avatar
          mike978

          I don`t disagree with the two negatives you mention about the Fusion, but you can hardly say they are “hitting” home when sales increase 28% on an already string year. You could say people are oblivious or stupid and have more logic to your argument.

          • 0 avatar
            thornmark

            My bet is that w/ the Fusion Ford again tried to go upscale with agressive pricing – like 1996 Taurus – and that this will end with similar results.

          • 0 avatar
            sunridge place

            What’s funny is that Honda just released their numbers and Fusion outsold Accord by almost 4000 units.

            Very GM like press release as Bertel would probably say if he commented on it.

            They blame snow for poor results and some media flack put the wrong month on their February table.

            **edit…nevemind…their table is all screwed up…looks like a tie.

          • 0 avatar
            SV

            The Fusion’s sales are up more than 40% YTD so far…I don’t see how you could expect a repeat of 1996 at this point unless you’re willfully disregarding reality.

          • 0 avatar
            mike978

            It says Accord was up 35% but Honda as a whole was down 2% due in part to weather. Didn`t other car companies have the same weather to deal with?
            The Accord outsold the Fusion by under 200 units so pretty close so far for second place in the midsize market.
            Now I would expect more of the Accord to be retail rather than lease or fleet than Fusion sales are.

        • 0 avatar
          SV

          You put 20 originally, must have gone back and edited.

          It looks like you’re getting the Accord’s 75% sales increase from the January numbers, in which case it is disingenuous to compare with the Fusion’s February sales. A more apt comparison would be with the Fusion’s performance in January, when it posted a 65% increase over the previous year…a much closer figure, but of course we can’t let logic cloud your world view.

          • 0 avatar
            mike978

            Ah I didn`t realise he was (again) comparing apples to oranges if the 75% figure is Feb vs Jan and the 28% for Ford is Feb’13 vs Feb’12 which is the normal way to express sales data.

            I don`t what car he likes or dislikes I just want data consistently applied. I was surprised by the small per month cost difference for leasing both Accord and Fusion (when you divide the down payment by the number of months). I expect Ford is putting more incentives into this to balance out the worse residual value. But nobody is leasing Fusion just one price, hence why the 28% increase is note-worthy.

            On other matters I just hope the Mazda 6 does well for Mazda, but it is taking them a while to clear out the “old” 2013′s.

          • 0 avatar
            SV

            He’s comparing Jan12 vs. Jan13 with Accord, and Feb12 vs. Feb13 with the Fusion. Still totally apples to oranges though.

            Honda’s February results are just out, and the Accord was up 35% in February to 27,999 units. Fusion was up 28% to 27,875, so they’re effectively neck-in-neck.

            I think they’re both nice cars…the Accord is the more rational purchase, while the Fusion has more emotional appeal, but they’re both good. And I also want to see the 6 do well for Mazda, though I imagine they’re pinning the majority of their hopes in the US on the CX-5 and next-gen 3.

          • 0 avatar
            mike978

            SV – I agree Mazda will probably be pinning their hopes on the next 3 and the current CX5. But my question is why can`t they get to 8-10K a month for the 6. They have the dealer network since they sell that number of 3′s. Also the midsize market is comparable in size to the compact car market so as a % of market share why can`t the 6 do as well as the 3?

          • 0 avatar
            thornmark

            The email I got was wrong. Accord beat Fusion in sales and was up 35%.

        • 0 avatar
          Monty

          Didn’t you use to go by the handle Z71Silvy?

          I get your bias against Ford, it’s understandable. But I’m confused by your obfuscation or ignorance of the leasing deals. It would be preferable if you were to compare leasing deals which included the down payments extrapolated over the length of the term, for a more realistic picture.

          You will sound much more credible.

          • 0 avatar
            thornmark

            And if you weren’t so ignorant you would include projected residuals. My bet is that the Ford leases will prove to be subsidized w/ unrealistic residuals. Only time will tell, but if history is relevant then ….

            Ford has little presence in this area. The Greenwich and New Canaan dealers shut down – not sold.

          • 0 avatar
            Secret Hi5

            Ah . . . It all makes sense now.

            Whatever happened to the Troll Poll? Who was the top troll and what happened to him?

          • 0 avatar
            mike978

            Monty – +1
            TM – residuals are a key component for determining lease cost but to the end consumer they have the choice between these two cars coming down to a <$10 difference on the figures detailed earlier in this post. I fully expect Ford is subsiding the lease more to make up for their lower residuals, no argument from me there. But to the lease end consumer that doesn`t matter, just the per month $ amount.

            I am interested to see how the Camry has done since Toyota have been using "Detroit" tactics to sell the Camry (0% interest, cash back on remaining 2012's, low lease payments etc) whereas Honda has stayed admirably Japanese in their fiscal discipline with respect t o incentives (no cashback, no zero % interest).

          • 0 avatar
            Monty

            Thanks Mike978 – you said it much better than I could’ve.

            People who manipulate or obscure the facts to fit their arguments lose any credibility they may have started with.

            It’s too bad, because hidden in TM’s biased posts is a decent writer.

    • 0 avatar
      jaje

      The Accord sells < 1% to fleets (rental or corporate/gov) so its margins are much higher than any other midsize volume car sold. Ford, GM, Toyota, Nissan sell quite a bit (up 50% in come case such as the Impala). So sales volume numbers are not the end all be all. In fact the Accord was the #1 retail selling car for over a decade even though the Camry sold more outright.

      • 0 avatar
        APaGttH

        Impala fleet sales last I saw were at 76%.

        Really, its has become the “Crown Victoria” of the fleet buyer and retail is secondary.

        And before someone wails “unfair defense” I will quickly point out that when the Panthers were still in the hizzie the gods at TTaC whenever they wrote about fleet sales would take out the Panthers – as they were mostly fleet.

  • avatar
    sunridge place

    Hmm…Silverado/Sierra beats F-150 in total sales for the third month in a row…been a long time since that happened.

    • 0 avatar
      mike978

      I recall an article last year lambasting GM for the fall in market share. Will be interesting to see if a followup article comes. Also around inventory since that has fallen below 100 days from a high in the 120-130′s late last year.
      The other interesting article will be around incentives, which for GM fell compared to others as a % of ATP.

      • 0 avatar
        sunridge place

        ‘I recall an article last year lambasting GM’

        It was a hell of a lot more than one article. TTAC has multiple gloom and doom articles about truck sales and inventories.

        A quick site search found these:

        http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/08/gms-truck-inventories-keep-rising-sales-falling/

        http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/08/chart-of-the-day-gm-full-size-truck-inventory-12010-82012/

        http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/12/the-incentive-wars-gm-mounts-all-out-assault/

        http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/07/general-motors-channel-stuffing-and-the-return-of-2008/

        As the truck market takes off, they have the inventory they planned for all along. A lot of the downtime is still ahead for the transition to the 2014′s and they may end up wishing they had built a few more.

        I’m not holding my breath for a follow up on what was nearly a once a month topic on here last year.

        Ram truck only up 8% YTD 2013 vs 2012 with an all-new Ram out when GM is up 30% YTD 2013 vs 2012 and Ford is up 18% as well is interesting.

        • 0 avatar
          mike978

          Sunridge place – I was being generous to TTAC when I said one article. I recall a series of them about the inventory situation. It would be nice for balance if there was some acknowledgement of that.
          I find it interesting that several companies posted negative sales growth such as Honda, Kia and Nissan with the CRV and Civic both falling by double digits. I don`t recall a recent time where both Ford and GM (all brands) have outgrown Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Kia, Hyundai, VW (brand). Maybe Buickman’s 15% prediction will have to wait for another year. I wonder if BS will write about how losing sales in a growing market is bad news as he did for GM last year when that happened. Again balance would be good.

          • 0 avatar
            sunridge place

            I can only imagine the posts if GM had anything close to what Honda said today in their sales press release:

            ‘American Honda today reported February 2013 U.S. sales of 107,987 units, overcoming winter’s worst to post a decrease of only 2.0 percent compared with February 2012′

            Very GM China-like I guess.

            I’m picturing the Honda ‘Mr. Opportunity’ guy out there with a Ridgeline equipped with a snow plow package clearing the streets to bring in floor traffic.

  • avatar
    NeinNeinNein

    What I dont get. SUV and Truck sales way up? How can these people afford to gas these hogs? @4.30++ a gallon, its gotta be killing people. Right? Are people just now fully accepting of a $80-100 fillup?

    • 0 avatar
      DeadWeight

      You literally beat me to responding to sunridge by seconds, and I was going to essentially echo your comment/curiosity.

      Without even getting into the Chevy/GMC vs Ford pickup sales’ numbers, I find it extremely interesting that p/u trucks are selling at the rate they are.

      There’s been a mild recovery in new construction, as far as I can tell (though I do not travel as much for business as I used to, so it’s all local to me), with some allegedly “spikier” areas here or there, but maybe the pickup is becoming:

      a) Adopted by more people in club or crew cab form as the new sedan,

      b) Purchased or leased in still relatively high numbers despite high fuel prices (and maybe partially because people aren’t driving as much).

      My brother recently purchased a Silverado “something edition” 4×4 crew cab, and even with a somewhat dated dash, I must confess it has a surprisingly plush ride equal to many near luxury cars, is extremely quiet, has a roomy backseat which gets used quite a bit since he has two sons in high school who both play football, baseball, etc., gets something like 27 or 28mpg on the highway, and it cost him less than many sedans similarly equipped would have (it was basically less expensive than the 6 year old truck it replaced, that wasn’t as well equipped).

      Plus, he lives in the sticks where there are a lot of unpaved roads and such, so it more appropriate in that context than a shiny and genteel sedan, in some ways.

      I have to admit that if I were to replace my current vehicle and I lived where he does, I’d be almost very tempted to a pickup like his (and I’m a hardcore devotee of rwd sporty cars with manual transmissions).

      I am going to engage in some conjecture, though, and state that it wouldn’t surprise me at all if the real and partially hidden subsidies (by the manufacturers, for whatever reasons; maybe projected and speculative higher residual values?) being offered to move pickups are fairly aggressive.

      • 0 avatar
        RobertRyan

        ” Adopted by more people in club or crew cab form as the new sedan,”
        Same thing is happening in Australia. Pickups and SUV’s are becoming the “new” Sedans.

      • 0 avatar
        APaGttH

        Depends on where you live. In Puget Sound D.R. Horton is planning to build 5700 new units in 2013 – alone! The new development I live in sold out in 8 months. There is a ton of building going on. So much so that concrete is in short supply and holding up foundation, driveway, patio, etc. work.

    • 0 avatar
      Hummer

      Although I agree gas prices are ridiculous I see no reason why the cost of gas would change my and many others habits. Sure I have less money to spend as the local mom and pop stores but I can’t see people changing a vehicle simply over the cost of gas

    • 0 avatar
      Loser

      I know it has been a few years now but I remember when gas first hit $3 a gallon, you couldn’t give away a truck or SUV. Old Geo Metro’s were selling for insane money on ebay. I thought for sure it was the end of full sized SUV’s and trucks being used as daily drivers. Now gas is again close to $4 and these things are selling like gas is $1.25. Makes me wonder what the magic number will be to trigger the next panic.

      • 0 avatar
        APaGttH

        Well, lets look at the picture a bit more.

        If we go back to the last gas spike, the average pickup truck was stickered for 13/17 MPG (give or take). That was the old, completely unrealistic, EPA pre-2008 standard. So reality was 12/15ish.

        Fast forward a decade later, and the EPA sticker on the less bull crap, but still probably slightly inflated EPA numbers, the average pickup truck is getting 17/21 MPG (give or take).

        The reality is they are probably getting closer to 16/20.

        You’re looking at roughly a 30% improvement in MPG from say 2004ish to 2013. Thirty-percent is huge. When a car gets 40 MPG, going to 42 MPG, meh, not a big benefit. When you’re starting as 12 or 13 and you’re getting 17 now – big difference.

        The only outliers for MPG gains are Toyota and Nissan. I seem to remember before the meltdown Nissan planned to shoot the Titan in the head and rebadge Dodge Ram trucks. The Titan is finally getting a way long overdue update.

        The Tundra fuel economy hasn’t really moved, and honestly I really don’t understand why Toyota hasn’t done more to innovate the 4.7L V8 in particular to get more MPG out of it (or design an all up new engine).

        Another thing that is probably driving truck sales is the general death of the midsize and compact pickup truck. The Colorado/Canyon can barely be given away as it is – they are jokes. The Frontier isn’t exactly a darling of quality, and the Tacoma, the best of the survivors out there, has at least to my eyes (although I haven’t taken a tape measure to one) has bloated out to being bigger than Toyota’s first fullsize offering the T-100. The Ridgeline has never set sales records and continues to limp along.

        If you need, or perceive you need a pickup truck, you don’t have a whole lot of economical choices anymore and heck, a Ram pickup with a V6 can get 25 MPG (so they claim).

        It appears the only MPG victim in the truck category from the last decade is the Chevrolet Avalanche.

    • 0 avatar
      Summicron

      @999

      My question, too. I sold my truck the last time we had $100+ tankfulls in ’08 and it was just a V-6. Loved it, but I just didn’t need the hauling capacity much anymore. And I hated watching it endure Wisconsin winters parked in the driveway.

      But I ask the same question of the first-job, $35,000 earning kids I know with a baby or two and every conceivable electronic gadget they can buy along with their crushing data plans, plus a couple of new-ish cars. Where the hell do they get the money? Parents must help-out a lot.

      • 0 avatar
        Lorenzo

        With interest rates at an all-time low, even the poor credit rates are relatively cheap, and it seems money for everything but houses is available. The kids I’ve seen aren’t getting help from their parents, they just think tomorrow never comes.

    • 0 avatar
      sunridge place

      I realize Toyota cars are going against some huge numbers in the year over year from early in 2012 as they bounced back from the Tsunami, but its very odd to see:

      Toyota/Lexus Car= -3% YOY
      Toyota/Lexus Truck/SUV= +16% YOY

      Before HighDesert comes on here with the 75th repeat of why he has a Tundra and how much he loves gasoline, I will add that the US OEM still absolutely crushed the Tundra with GM/Ford around 55,000 units and Tundra around 7,000 units.

      Guess the pent up demand in the truck market is finally coming out of the woodwork.

    • 0 avatar
      corntrollio

      The gas pump pre-auth limits annoy me. It’s bad enough to stop at $100, but there are still some pumps programmed to the old limit of $75.

      • 0 avatar
        highdesertcat

        I only use credit cards when I’m out of cash. Most gas stations won’t accept $100 or $50 bills for fear that they’re bogus, but they never refuse $20 bills or smaller denominations.

        Since I routinely fill my truck and 4-5gal gas containers at the same time for a total of as much as 50 gallons, I have had to find away around the pump pre-auth limits.

        The only drawback with paying cash is that you have to prepay at the cashier, but it beats whipping out a second credit card to continue filling up.

        Yes, I know a lot of people do that, especially RV owners who fill up with as much as 100 gallons at a time.

    • 0 avatar
      highdesertcat

      NeinNeinNein, this whole gas price thing is overblown. Most Americans do not care what they have to pay for gas. They buy it no matter what it costs.

      They may not like what they have to pay for gas but their need for gas has rearranged their list of priorities. Americans will buy gas until they run out of money.

      SUVs and trucks rule! People want them, and they buy them.

      I spent over $150 just today on gas and filled up twice because I used almost 38 gallons and put a lot of miles on my truck today. Nope, I didn’t like spending that much on gas but I needed the gas to get where I was going and to get home afterwards.

      • 0 avatar
        gslippy

        Gasoline is the lifeblood of Americans. Truck sales aren’t affected by slow rises in gas price, and gas price spikes only have momentary effect on truck sales.

        Today’s $4 gas was to be the ‘crazy’ point at which Americans suddenly abandoned trucks, and $5 gas was to be the incentive for people to buy Volts. $4 is the new normal, so nobody should think anything will change much even if it went to $8.

        • 0 avatar
          highdesertcat

          I believe you are right. The price of gas certainly isn’t going to affect my behavior, and I know for a fact that the people who use their trucks to make a living, like contractors, builders, etc, will just pass on the added costs to their clients.

        • 0 avatar
          DeadWeight

          Historical data strongly suggests you are very wrong.

          There’s a lag between a significant rise in gasoline prices and consumer behavior, but even adjusting for inflation, we’re now at the price point for gasoline that has always and every time preceded a slowdown in broad economic activity.

          I suppose you could engage in pure conjecture and slip in a casual “this time will be different” and no one can prove that to be incorrect (again) until after the fact.

          The impact of $4 per gallon gasoline is already being felt, especially when it comes to discretionary consumer purchases.

          At $5+ per gallon, there will be a dire impact on the economy as a whole.

          Finally, the notion that “businesses will simply pass on the increased costs” of higher fuel prices to their customers is naive, at best, since the real economy functions in a construct whereby consumers’ ability to spend more does not flow from higher prices, but from their real wages and savings, and businesses often choose to swallow such costs rather than pass them on (in whole or in part), so as to not lose business; they often choose to sacrifice margins so as to not risk significant volume.

          Many people here throw out some pretty wild and provably incorrect (by historical record) statements about gasoline prices.

          • 0 avatar
            Summicron

            It would take a mind far more adroit than mine to disagree with you. Household spending is a zero sum activity and the more spent on fuel the less on everything else.

            We’ve become like those deep ocean creatures that depend on thermal vents to survive. Inhibit the flow of energy and we all become poorer, sicker and eventually dead.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            Deadweight, I posted a reply last night to your comment but it seems to have disappeared, although there was nothing offensive in it.

            I did mention UPS and Fedex applying fuel surcharges and that may have offended the white gods in Canada enough to reject my comment. It’s not the first time that reciting a real-life example has failed to make it to the peanut gallery of comments.

            And I’ve been having problems with my ‘net access ever since they put in fiber and took the copper out.

            But, your analysis may prove to be better than mine. Time will tell. I believe that there is no shortage of gas and oil, and I believe there will be plenty of oil available for the next two hundred years or more.

            There will always be gasoline, albeit at a price. And I’m living my life accordingly, along with the millions upon millions of other gasoline-addicts on the planet, buying gas no matter what it costs or until I run out of money.

      • 0 avatar
        doctor olds

        @highdesertcat- You are on the money. If you look at the US market through history you will notice that CAFE just pushed folks into SUVs and Trucks when they couldn’t get big cars anymore. A huge segment of America still want big, powerful vehicles and many really need their capabilites.

        • 0 avatar
          highdesertcat

          doctor olds, it’s not a comforting thought that I, and many other Americans, have to alter our lifestyles in order to continue to buy gasoline, albeit at a higher price. But buy gas we will!

          I have to add here that I love my Tundra 5.7 but if EPA and DOT mandates make the V8 engines of today a scarcity in the half-ton class of pickup trucks, I will be forced to step up to a 3/4-ton with the biggest engine available.

          To me a truck is just not a truck without that slow turning, stump pulling grunt of a V8. To me the whole V6 in a half-ton thing is CAFE driven.

          I started with six-cylinder pickup trucks with three on the tree, and I’m never going back there. When I bought my first new truck, a 1988 Silverado with the 350 and the automatic, I was hooked. It’s been V8 power and automatics for me ever since, the bigger the better.

          Some of my friends and relatives have already moved up to a 3/4 ton or 1-ton, heavier rating for pickup trucks, in order to get the big kahuna under the hood.

          I also own a 2012 Grand Cherokee with the Pentastar V6. It’s a great ride and my wife loves it.

          However, I have serviced and driven the 2012 GC with the 5.7 that belongs to one of her girl friends, and the difference is like night and day.

          I’m talking 290 horses of the V6 vs 390 horses of the 5.7, and that’s not even mentioning the difference in torque.

          Most Americans will choose what they want to drive, even if it does not get great fuel mileage, and they will buy according to what they can afford.

          What I’m saying is that people will adjust their lifestyle to fit the amount of gas they need to buy to maintain the image they want to project.

          In my case, I had to cut back my on daily Starbucks Latte and don’t eat out 3X a day any more in order to stay within the amount I money I get to spend every month.

          It works for me.

          • 0 avatar
            ajla

            “To me the whole V6 in a half-ton thing is CAFE driven.”

            The issue isn’t cylinder count, it’s displacement and (somewhat) application. For example, the GMC V6 was a great truck engine.

            A 5.0L V6 would probably be a better truck motor than a 5.0L V8 seeing how a V6 actually produces better torque for a given displacement than a V8.

            I’ve got high hopes for the output on the new GM 4.3L V6.

          • 0 avatar
            28-Cars-Later

            Never pictured you as a Starbucks guy HDC.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            ajla, I know it’s a personal and preferential thing, the V6 vs V8 debate, but having owned both, I’ll be a V8 kinda guy since 1988.

            I have never worried about fuel economy or the price of gas. I buy what I want and need. Everything else is just part of the cost of living.

            Everyone I know who actually uses a truck for other than commuting seems to share my preference for V8s.

            I’ve been there and done that with 6-cylinder trucks. I’ll stick with the V8s.

            28-Cars-Later, that Starbucks thing started when some of the illegals I hire in for jobs told Federico, my American-born Mexican contractor and foreman, that they wanted to try a Starbucks experience sometime during their lives, but never had the money for $7.00 coffee. My dad being Portuguese I can understand Spanish, a little.

            So, one day, I took the whole lot. Gotta say, I got hooked myself and I keep them in Starbucks each job they work for me, which isn’t all that often.

            That, and specialty burritos for lunch. And if it is a multi-day job, they can sleep in the house we’re working on, gratis.

            I usually send everyone home with a sixpack of Corona when the job is done. They love working for me!

            And my wife’s dad, who pays for it all, trusts me to do the right thing, all around. And it has worked for us since 1980.

            But with rising gas prices I personally gave up Starbucks and eating out 3X a day, since I only get X-amount of dollars each month in my official, tax-payer funded entitlements, which also has to cover my cold beer (Sam Adams, since Bud became Belgian).

          • 0 avatar
            ajla

            @hdc,

            I’m not surprised that you and others prefer the V8 since the V6 has been the “economy” option since the early 70s.

            However, this has to do with displacement of V6 vs V8 offerings, not the configuration itself.

            I’m guessing that your V6 trucks were 4.3L or less. You probably would have been equally unhappy with a 4.3L V8.

            The point with my comment was that if Toyota or Chrysler were to offer a 5.7L V6 it would quite likely out-torque the current V8s.

          • 0 avatar
            highdesertcat

            ajla, my first truck was my dad’s hand-me-down F100 six with three on the tree. I drove it until the wheels fell off.

            Then there were a couple of IHC four door trucks bought used from the Air Force, and an old Dodge, also bought used from the Air Force, because I could not afford to buy anything new.

            Along the way I owned a ’59 Apache, and a few other pickup trucks, usually bought from departing GIs, for a good price because they were parked on the Base lemon lot and needed to be sold.

            I’ve run the course with six cylinder trucks but a buddy of mine has a 1993 S10 with the 4.3 V6 that still runs to this very day. I’ve worked on it enough for him and it is still sound, but it is a compact truck, not a full-size one.

            He’s not about to trade it or retire it but if/when he does he has expressed his desire for a full-size half-ton V8 truck, brand as yet unknown.

            Like many before me, I’ll step up to a 3/4-ton or heavier to keep the biggest gas V8.

            I’m not a diesel fan for anything less than a Kenworth, Peterbilt or Freightliner. I have a CDL and I have rented them before and I can’t imagine a gas engine in one of those tractors either.

            But I can read the handwriting on the wall. The EPA, DOT and government mandated CAFE standards are going to force auto manufacturers to replace the V8 with more economical squirrel engines, in order to meet CAFE standards.

            That’s not for me. No offense meant for anyone who prefers a 6 over an 8, or who prefers a diesel anything over a gas ICE.

        • 0 avatar
          chicagoland

          Big cars were still available in the late 80′s, 1990′s when buyers embraced SUV’s. GM still made full size Caprice/Roadmaster cars/station wagons til 1996. Ford had Panthers sedans til 2011. But, Baby Boomers/Gen X shunned them saying “What old people drive”.

          So, no it was not because “big cars were not avail.” that truck sales went up. It’s just fashion.

          • 0 avatar
            doctor olds

            The number of “big” cars available was miniscule by the mid ’80s. I remember being delighted to see LT1 in Olds product plan until I realized it was just the B wagon. GM, Ford and Chrysler all had to spend $Billions to reengineer their fleets, not for consumer appeal, but for CAFE. AT Olds, we still sold 1,000,000 in ’86, but the new, smaller products drove our traditional customers away.

      • 0 avatar
        Hummer

        Hdc, you get it.

        The people that will hurt the most from high gas prices are businesses, simply because there is less expendable income. But the majority of us aren’t going to give up what we like/need/want

        And also have to agree that CAFE standards will only force me into bigger trucks. The CAFE is also the reason in part that pickups became more dd oriented, I sure as heck don’t want to be in a uniframe car that has plastic bumpers with foam protecting my life under it. Bring back cars with thick sheet metal steel bumpers a honest frame and you can bring back a lot more people.

        • 0 avatar
          highdesertcat

          Hummer, for over 30 years I helped my brothers second-guess what the buyers would buy.

          And through all the good times and the bad times, the ups and the downs, the days of feast and the days of famine, one truism always meandered through:

          “People will choose to buy and drive what they want to buy and drive because there will always be people with money, and if they want it but don’t have the money, they will find the money to buy it.”

          So, our product mix always reflected a very narrow band of vehicles that would sell to the majority of buyers and that even the low-income buyers could aspire to.

          Looking back over the period 1980-2011, we didn’t do too bad. My brothers have all retired now and don’t ever look back, having opened up brand new chapters in their lives doing other things.

          Sorry about the delayed response. This past week has been very busy for me. It was brutal!

  • avatar
    thornmark

    Looks like it’s Camry, Accord then Altima and Fusion in that order.

    Add the Koreans and “midsize” has got to be the most competitive segment.

    • 0 avatar
      mike978

      if the Altima is in between the Accord and the Fusion then second place is essentially a three way tie since <200 units out of 28,000 separated second and fourth on your list.
      The midsize market has been a very competitive segment for a long time and Mazda and VW are trying to break into it with large sales (I would classify that as 100,000 a year or more).

      • 0 avatar
        SV

        It’s actually Camry, Accord, Fusion and Altima, in that order, but there’s only 274 units separating the Accord and Altima (with the Fusion in between) so like you said, effectively a three-way tie. I don’t think the midsize class has ever been this competitive.

    • 0 avatar

      “Add the Koreans and “midsize” has got to be the most competitive segment.”

      I’m pretty sure that midsize cars have been the most competitive segment for decades. It’s also probably the largest volume segment in the world. Outside of pickup trucks it’s the only segment where you have multiple manufacturers selling hundreds of thousands of units in the US. It’s a segment in which you can sell 200,000 cars and still come in fourth place.

  • avatar
    RS

    Jeep down 11%?!?

    Buyers must be waiting for the new Cherokee…

    • 0 avatar
      th009

      Liberty is down 79% so those buyers could be waiting for the Cherokee. But Grand Cherokee is also down 26%.

    • 0 avatar
      highdesertcat

      I can only speak about the Grand Cherokee because I have heard that there is a critical shortage of the model that people are lusting for. That model is the Laredo 4X4 with the cloth interior and the dealers don’t have enough of them.

      What currently sits on their lots is the 2013 Grand Cherokee in Limited and Overland trims, and the SRT8, and 4X4 Laredos in colors that people don’t like.

      Another slow-seller is the RWD Grand Cherokee in any trim. It’s a travesty to try and sell any Jeep without their magnificent four-wheel-drive systems.

      And since the 2014 Grand Cherokee is already in-transit to the dealerships now, and incorporates upgraded electronics and a 8-speed automatic, a lot of people disappointed in their quest for a 2013 GC are sitting it out until the 2014 goes on sale in April or May 2013.

  • avatar
    APaGttH

    Volt sales are pathetic.

    Sonic sales are up, and they said the Spark would never sell!

    Verano keeps on keeping on.

    Holy crap there was one leftover HHR out there!

    • 0 avatar

      Volt sales have been erratic in recent months, with decent numbers in October and December and lower sales in Nov, and Jan. Still, the 1,623 Volts GM sold in Feb 2013, is almost 60% higher than Feb. 2012 sales. Year to date, Volt sales are 70% better than last year.

      If GM sticks with the Volt and if current Volt owners are happy with the 2nd generation Volt when it arrives, I can see Volt sales slowly but continuously rising.

      For comparison’s sake, last year Chevy sold 23,461 Volts and about 13,000 Corvettes.

      • 0 avatar
        mcs

        The Volt had 1,623 deliveries, but they built 3,298. What’s the inventory looking like? If they decided to unload the excess with some big incentives, I might consider one. I want to add a plug-in to my little fleet and would consider it if the price was right.

        I’d like to see a break-out of the Ford Energi Models so we could get a picture of the plug-in segment. I’ve only been able to find total Fusion and total CMax sales.

  • avatar

    an extra $2000 on the hood the last week once again proves only a fool buys GM before month end.

  • avatar
    RatherhaveaBuick

    Must be some pretty special deals on Mitsubishis these days…

  • avatar
    jimmyy

    You can see the damage negative reviews by Consumer Reports did to Ford. In order to get Fusion and Escape into the top 10 list, Ford is handing out well north of 2,000 dollars on the hood of each transaction. For example, on the Fusion 1,500 + 1,000 conquest = 2,500. Wow. Camry and Accord buyers get peanuts. Considering the nearly 3ft snowfall in the northeast stopped all car buying for a weekend in the Toyota and Honda heavy northeast, Ford was still unable to catch Camry and Accord with 2,500 on each hood. Wall Street is not impressed … that is why the price of F continues to lag the S&P.

    Can you imagine the number of sales Accord and Camry would sport if they rebated at those levels? We would be seeing 45,000 monthly sales.

    • 0 avatar
      highdesertcat

      Many buyers simply cannot afford the premium attached to buying a Honda or Toyota product, even though they get it all back when they trade for a new one in the future.

    • 0 avatar
      chicagoland

      #1 issue with Ford is the darn “My Ford Touch” system. Since it is not user friendly, the whole car company is called “poor quality”. Even though the cars are better runnin and built.

      Should have not pushed ‘high tech’ so hard. Cars are transportation, not iPods.

  • avatar
    jpolicke

    Time to start a Lincoln Deathwatch.

  • avatar
    Tstag

    Lincoln is sinking badly by contrast look at how JLR has been flying along for the past few years and how their growth is consistently double digit! New RR Sport is coming out soon watch what that does to sales….. Bad move by Ford keeping the lights on at Lincoln whilst selling world beating Land Rover

    • 0 avatar
      RobertRyan

      Current Ford’s Management’s handling of Limcoln is a disgrace. It went from a make that was a proper luxury car in the 1940′s to the mid 1960′s to something that is barely surviving now.

  • avatar
    GarbageMotorsCo.

    Subaru is on a tear. They just passed the Chrysler by 3000 units unit and are 3000 units away from matching the Volkswagen unit.

    Not bad for a brand with no diesels, no larger sedan, and no fullsize SUV.


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