By on June 3, 2011

Mazda will stop making cars in the U.S. at around 2013, The Nikkei [sub] heard from unnamed sources inside of the Japanese company. It’s not that Mazda is leaving America. It’s more a continuing process of its divorce from Ford. Mazda wants to sell its share in AutoAlliance International Inc., a 50-50 U.S. joint venture with Ford, back to Ford.

Mazda currently manufactures the Atenza midsize car via AutoAlliance International. From 2013 on out, Mazdas will most likely come from Japan and Mexico, where Mazda will open a plant in 2013.

The people at AAI’s main plant in Flat Rock, Michigan, must feel like ping-pong balls. The factory was opened by Ford in 1972 as Michigan Casting Center. The plant was closed in 1981.In 1987, Mazda bought the plant and reopened it as Mazda Motor Manufacturing USA.

In 1992, Ford returned. Ford bought a 50 percent share in the plant, and the AutoAlliance International joint venture was born.

 

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52 Comments on “Mazda Pulling Up Stateside Stakes...”


  • avatar
    OldandSlow

    Just an observation from Texas – Mexico is not the safest place on Earth to run a normal business.

    If not already, Mexico is on the verge of becoming a failed state with regards to public safety and security.

    While putting an assembly plant there may seem attractive on paper, i.e. cheaper labor costs, plus the ability to export to the Latin America and the US – there is the risk that the security situation will deteriorate further.

    In addition to the shootouts between narco-warlords, there are daily kidnappings for ransom, hijackings of cargoes and outright extortion by threats of violence.

    • 0 avatar
      Jimal

      You took the words right out of my mouth. Why anyone would want to do business in what is quickly becoming a failed narco-state is beyond me. Cheap labor doesn’t mean much when they’re caught in the crossfire between rival drug lords. And wait until some auto exec is kidnapped and murdered.

      Mazda should go the transplant route; find themselves a nice “right to work” state and set up shop there.

      • 0 avatar
        CJinSD

        That isn’t an option under the Obama regime. Don’t believe me? Ask someone at Boeing. The only way to kill the cancer that afflicts companies in mob run states is to leave the US now. I’d take the drug cartels and hijackings over the UAW any day.

      • 0 avatar
        Jimal

        I don’t believe you, or at least I don’t see the correlation. At this point isn’t Boeing basically the only domestic manufacturer of large passenger aircraft and a defense contractor? Mazda is one of several foreign automakers doing business in the U.S. and shares a plant and some manufacturing with Ford in a plant. NLRB aside, if Toyota can get out of NUMMI and continue to manufacture in “right to work” states there is no reason Mazda can’t do the same.

      • 0 avatar
        CJinSD

        Toyota is continuing to build in RTW states. They didn’t close NUMMI in favor of another labor force, and they had a business case for NUMMI’s demise based on GM pulling out. What does Boeing being our one commercial airline manufacturer have to do with being forced to keep feeding their parasites? It is strictly a function of the corrupt syndicalist in the White House, and Boeing should be announcing their Chinese partnership any day now.

    • 0 avatar
      psarhjinian

      Legalize drugs and most of Mexico’s problems (and many of America’s) would disappear in six months. Drug wars? Border security? Illegal immigrants? Organized crime? Huge, overcrowded prisons? Generations of poor yoked by crime? Gone, gone, gone, gone, gone and gone.

      And then Mazda or whomever could happily open up shop in Cuidad Juarez without fear of production being disrupted by any sort of nastiness.

      • 0 avatar
        TEXN3

        I’m no expert on such matters, but I seriously think all those issues would be “gone, gone, gone…”

        The Prohibition didn’t end organized crime in the US, it just moved them to different fields of work.

      • 0 avatar
        chuckR

        The generations of poor preceded the narco-trade. There is an expanding Mexican middle class but how would legalizing drugs pull the poor up into it? Which drugs would you legalize – grass or coke or heroin and opiates?
        Rather than that, I think we’ll be lucky if, due to some outrageous provocation, we don’t wind up with another Black Jack Pershing style incursion into areas of Mexico that are as uncontrolled by the central government as those of Pakistan – the northeast territories abutting Afghanistan.

      • 0 avatar
        NulloModo

        Very inequal distribution of wealth is a major problem for Mexico (and the current Mexican situation foreshadows what will likely happen in China if current trends continue).

        When the richest man in the world has made his fortune in one of the poorer nations in the world, you can see there is a problem.

        Yes, the drug cartels are a huge issue right now, but a lot of their rise to power has come from their ability to recruit from Mexico’s legions of disenfranchised poor.

        What Mexico needs is a strict anti-corruption initiative combined with sweeping regulations that limit the power of corporations and the extremely wealthy to take advantage of the average Mexican citizens. If working to earn a middle class lifestyle becomes seen as an achievable dream amongst the majority of Mexicans both the drug cartels and the illegal immigration problems will die off.

      • 0 avatar
        George B

        Mexico has always had a problem with the rule of law and corruption. The drug war is only part of the problem. Mexico is rich in natural resources like the US, but unfortunately they missed out on being a British colony. Not sure how they overcome hundreds of years of failed culture.

    • 0 avatar
      Advo

      The money to be made from the illicit drug trade is so, so, so lucrative that it can tempt anybody, never mind poor countries like Mexico.

      So what is up with Mexico, anyways? All these years and not enough economic progress even with a huge consumer market next door (and a free trade agreement to help) and lots of multi-national and U.S. companies willing to go in if there’s decent opportunities.

      It’s easy to say they need to have little corruption, limit the powers of the big corporations, emplace and enforce a culture that follows the rule-of-the-law.

      Getting there, however… Well, few countries have managed to overcome that. You have to wonder if opening up all sectors of the Mexican economy to foreigners will have the triple-effect of increasing choice (less costs for consumers and business purchases) away from the domestic oligopolies, get more sectors involved in exporting, and build up sector skills and infrastructure.

      That’s what China has done with all its corruption. Why can’t Mexico follow a lot of the same path and get its talented expats in the States to so the same in their home country?

      The Mexican auto sector seems to have built up enough know-how to start thriving. Mazda certainly thinks so, and is not afraid to move its operations there. They’re not as pessimistic about the situation there.

  • avatar
    detlump

    Come on, Bertel – Atenza? Is this GT5? Here it is known as the Mazda6 and is not a carbon copy of the Atenza elsewhere.

    I agree that Mexico is not necessarily the best solution, and the problem may lie in the product and lack of advertising. The 6 is not competitive with Fusion, Camry and Accord, it is simply not on many buyers’ radar. Mazda is slightly more relevant than Mitsubishi these days.

    • 0 avatar
      TEXN3

      You are aware that Bertel is not from the states, hence the badge mix-up.

      Mazda is much more relevant than Mitsubishi, the 3 is still selling well…as are the CX crossovers. It is a shame about the 6, as it is definitely competitive with the other models.

  • avatar
    hreardon

    Not to turn this into a “Bash Mexcio” thread, but lack of stability is one of the reasons for Volkswagen opening the Tennessee factory. Long-term there are plans to move Beetle and Jetta production to the new facility.

  • avatar
    John Horner

    Mazda is fading in the US market. They look like a candidate to follow Isuzu, Suzuki and Mitsubishi down the road to North American irrelevance. Flant Rock’s big problem is that the Mazda6 is a sales dud, even with massive rental car fleet sales. Of course, it didn’t held when they went with the silly Mazda6 name instead of continuing to call it the Mazda 626. The 626 actually had a little bit of mind share in its day.

    As Mazda distances itself from Ford, it once again faces the problem of being far too small on its own to do competitive power train and platform development. Absent Ford, Mazda would have folded its tent thirty years ago.

    If Mazda is to survive, it will eventually have to get married to Toyota, Honda or Nissan. Given everything those companies are dealing with right now, I doubt that they are in the marrying mood. But hey, there is always the prospect of a Chinese bride. Those kinds of business arrangements are all the rage just now. Just ask Saab.

    • 0 avatar
      Steven02

      I thought when they changed to the Mazda6, it was ok. The next Mazda6 model was a dude. It got bigger and worse fuel economy. It wasn’t a surprise that people weren’t in line to buy it.

    • 0 avatar
      psarhjinian

      Interestingly, they’re fighting for between fourth and sixth in Canada, and have a perennial spot in the top three (the Mazda3). The 5 also sells very well, here.

      Personally, I don’t get the disconnect.

      • 0 avatar
        ppxhbqt

        YTD in Canada the rankings (as per Good Car Bad Car) is Ford, Chevrolet, Dodge, Toyota, Hyundai, Honda, Nissan, then Mazda. Mazda ended last year comfortably ahead of Nissan. But GMC is only 415 units behind as of May. Kia is 1,788 down YTD as of May, but for May beat Mazda by 341. And Kia’s been up all year, Mazda down. GMC has been up and down, but for the year is down 2.2%, while Mazda’s down 17.3%. If gas prices stabilize, GMC will pick off Mazda. On the current trajectory, Kia will too regardless of gas prices.

        As for top 3, I assume you mean cars only. Through April, only the Corolla has made it all four months. Civic and Elantra have made it thrice. Still, there’s not been a single month that Corolla and Elantra haven’t beaten the Mazda3 and Cruze and Civic both have three of four months meaning the best the Mazda3 has done this year is 4th for two months. Two months it pulled 5th, but with both a new Focus and a new Accent, don’t expect it to pull 4th even any time soon, especially since for 3 of the 4 months the drop over last year has been in the 40-50% range.

        I’m not sure there is any real disconnect.

      • 0 avatar
        John Horner

        The Canadian market is fairly small. California alone, for example, sells about twice as many new light vehicles per month as does all of Canada.

        So, you can’t really extrapolate much from the Canadian market to the US market.

    • 0 avatar
      bumpy ii

      “being far too small on its own to do competitive power train and platform development”

      I dunno; the Sky-G/D engines look promising.

      • 0 avatar
        John Horner

        ” .. the Sky-G/D engines look promising. ”

        Any idea how much those have in common with Ford’s latest crop of direct injected engines. Up until very, very recently Mazda and Ford were sharing engine development a great deal.

        Meanwhile, where is Mazda’s hybrid power train? Where is Mazda’s hydrogen development work at?

      • 0 avatar
        Jimal

        @John Horner, From what I can remember from speaking with Mazda people the Sky is an in-house design. I don’t think Mazda will tinker with hybrids until they get the Sky into production, and even then it is a dicey deal. Fuel cells are an interesting concept but also a non-event for the foreseeable future.

        I’d have to look at the numbers but Mazda always was and continues to be a small manufacturer that builds what it can sell. They’ve determined what their niche is and are working on being successful there. I don’t see them going anywhere anytime soon.

  • avatar
    HoldenSSVSE

    2014 Mazda auto incentives.

    * 1.9% APR 48 month financing
    * $500 cash back
    * No money down $239 a month lease
    * Three heads of executed federales in the trunk
    * One kilo of single cut Nicaraguan in the glovebox, which needs to be delivered to Vito the Nose during the first test drive or your wife and children DIE!

    • 0 avatar
      TEXN3

      Sounds like incentives for a new Ford, VW, GM, or any other manufacture with several products coming out of Mexico.

      • 0 avatar
        HoldenSSVSE

        It was meant only as snark.

        I’m a fan of Mazda and their products.

        Oh ya, Juan El Gato Muerte Castilio said if you don’t get that payment to him you’re a dead man – DEAD MAN!

      • 0 avatar
        TEXN3

        I was a fan of Mazda until my 2006 3 GT wagon was lemoned. Considered a 6 wagon to replace it, but decided to get rid of my old, old F150 4×4 and replace with 1 vehicle (Outback). Still had my wife’s old Volvo at that time too.

  • avatar
    obbop

    Ahem…..

    Ten-percent of Mexico’s nationals are inside the USA now and their brought-along culture is not assimilating.

    Stopping there.

    I was an activist on the topic for pert-near ten years and devoted extensive studies to the many facets of the topic and refuse to argue, debate, attempt to persuade, etc.

    It is non-politically correct to do so.

    If desired, if knowledge is thine desire….

    as with the X Files….

    the truth is out there along with a horde of opinions.

    I am still seeking opinions that I admit are subjective and that the various scenarios within the USA makes guesstimates guess-like but my likelihood of eventually buying a full-size Ford or GMC cargo-van of the long-wheel-type and selling the Silverado 4×4 long-bed W/T (work truck) as a future residence are most assured.

    Will outfit the van with bare basics; minimal built-in facilities; camping potty using disposal bags, one burner propane stove (camping style) etc etc.

    Gotta’ guess when to seek and buy and sell.

    Will buy used. V6 likely best.

    Most basic van possible with lowest mileage.

    So many variables.

    Could a descent into a SEVERE depression lead to the possibility of desperate sellers selling for pennies on the dollar?

    Oh, shanty selling.

    Yeah, possibility of a severe long-lasting depression could send even shanty prices plummeting but I started at 42K$ anyway so it’s not akin to losing with a McMansion.

    Anyway……..

    If the urge arises and you want to offer ANY advice, tips, guesses, hints about future economy, van buying, truck selling, how to outfit a van, what to buy to allow full-time well… survival vice living… ANYTHING…….. input appreciated.

    Will require a van vice pick-up eventually for various reasons with access into pick-up via tailgate one reason and that being able to easily access van interior via front AND the “stealth factor” via a van to assist avoiding/evading jack-booted-thug lackeys of the ruling elites an important concern.

    Thanks in advance!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    http://obbop.wordpress.com/2011/04/28/hi-ttac-comments-area/

  • avatar
    Steven02

    I find this really interesting. Considering Toyota is talking about moving production from Japan because of the Yen, Mazda is moving back to Japan and later Mexico.

  • avatar
    ott

    “–Ford? We don’t need no steenking Ford!”

  • avatar
    DenverMike

    When a U.S. business is looking forward to dealing with druglords, kidnappings and executions, we need to stop and take a good hard look at ourselves.

    • 0 avatar
      John Horner

      Uh, which US business are you referring to?

      • 0 avatar
        DenverMike

        Hershey’s Chocolate of course, DUH. And what could be more ‘Merican? Hershey’s will be Hecho en Mehico after 113 years in Hershey, PA where the street lights are shaped in Kisses but there’s no official word on if the name will change to “Monterrey’s Chocolate”.

      • 0 avatar
        Jimal

        DenverMike, except that isn’t completely true. Hershey is moving (or moved, this seems to be from 2007) 10% of its production of some lower margin candies to Mexico and setting up partnerships in China to go after “emerging markets”, they are in fact not closing up shop in Hershey, Penn. and moving their entire operation to Mexico.

    • 0 avatar
      DenverMike

      Jimal,

      Yeah I know Hershey’s itself didn’t move down there, “Hecho” means manufactured.

      • 0 avatar
        Jimal

        I understand enough rudimentary Spanish to know what “hecho” means. Your comment made it sound like Hershey was moving lock, stock and barrel to Mexico, which exactly what the unsourced e-mails that went around on the topic not too long ago said.

  • avatar
    newfdawg

    Mazda’s decision to sell its shares in AutoAlliance and cease producing automobiles in the United States is simply the first step toward exiting the American Market altogether. Mazda seems on the road to joining Mitsubishi, Suzuki and Isuzu in fading from the American market. I find it odd that Mazda will move production back to Japan given the value of the Yen to the dollar; more so when Toyota apparently going to move production out of Japan for that reason. And who in their right mind would build an assembly plant in a nation that is rapidly becoming a failed narco state?

  • avatar
    VanillaDude

    I never thought it would last.
    Mazda was here in the States to get us to buy their cars, not Fords. As soon as Mazda could reach the goal where they could cut us out of their market plan, they’d divorce us.

    They didn’t reach their goal, but time ran out.

    No one should be surprised considering the difficulties Mazda has had in the US Market.

    • 0 avatar
      HoldenSSVSE

      And I’m left scratching my head on the difficulties.

      The Mazda3 is a tremendous car for the money, well built,and a blast to drive. Its short coming is a big one, the backseat is useless if the front passengers have any height at all. I looked at one in 2005 hot to buy and was so bummed when I discovered that the seat behind me would be rendered completely useless.

      The MX-5 – ’nuff said

      the RX-8 is thirsty, has no torque and has fallen behind the competition, but it took a decade of neglect for that to happen, and it is still one of the best damn packaged 2+2 coupes you can buy. Mazda has done a good job of holding the line on price. I also feel it has aged well from a looks stand point.

      The Mazda6 – could have been the Hyundai Sonata / Kia Optima success story – I know questionable V6 engine quality (wasn’t that a Ford V6) didn’t help, and I have to admit, Mazda’s packaging of options sucked.

      Everyone loves the Mazda5 – except customers.

      The CX-7 and CX-9 are constantly rated in the tops of their classes – again – ignored by customers. Bummer

      • 0 avatar
        NulloModo

        The backseat in the 3 isn’t any worse than in the Corolla or Civic with the front seats all the way back and partially reclined. Room for a 6′ person behind themselves in a compact is still the exception rather than the rule.

        The Miata is one of the best roadsters made, and it does very well in its niche. Unfortunately affordable 2 seater roadsters aren’t a huge niche.

        The headlines about the RX-8 have always been about the Rotary, which granted, is cool, but the real story is the handling and the usability. It’s a sportscar with a functional back seat, which alone is something, but it also has perhaps the absolute best handling of anything in its price class. It’s hard to market handling though, which I think is one reason Mazda has suffered. Enthusiasts know it and respect the cars for it, but for the average buyer a higher HP number means a faster car, and the Mazda models have fallen short in that regard.

        Mazda used the Ford design for their V6 engines, but they modified it with unique heads, cams, and in the case of the Cyclone-based engines unique intake setups. Mazda built a version of the 3.7 in Japan, though I’m not sure if the 3.0s they used were built by Mazda in their own factories or if they were built along the Ford destined engines by Ford. I haven’t heard of major or widespread problems with these engines, and the Ford variants are very solid.

        The Mazda5 could find a larger following if the fuel economy numbers were significantly higher than those of full size minivans. As it stands now it offers a lot of space and utility for the price.

        The CX-7 was hurt by initially coming only with a turbo engine that required premium fuel. Though you can now run the turbo on regular or buy the car with a NA engine, it seems that people don’t even think about it when crossover shopping. The CX-9 was certainly best in class when it debuted. Since then competitors have upped the ante when it comes to large crossovers. It would still work well for a lot of people, but the trick is getting people to pay attention to it.

  • avatar
    200k-min

    I’ve never really understood the Mazda-Ford relationship. Over the years the most common Mazdas I ever saw on the road were just rebadged Fords. Not until the 3 showed up did I see anything that was truly Mazda in a decent number, and even that wasn’t much. My owership experience with the 6 was enough to make me not look again for quite some time.

    They may be popular in Canada, but that market is smaller than California. My bet is Mazda is contemplating a full NA withdrawl and regroup.

    • 0 avatar
      NulloModo

      The Mazda/Ford relationship was mutually beneficial. Mazda got some strong financial backing, a solid small crossover (the Tribute), a truck, and access to Ford’s excellent V6 engines, and Ford got some very good platforms to work off of and some of Mazda’s excellent 4 cylinder engines.

      At this point in time though the separation makes sense. Ford of Europe’s experience in developing car platforms that drive and handle well, as well as their experience with fuel efficient 4 cylinder engines, makes Mazda unnecessary. At the same time, Mazda now has its own CUV lineup, and with the death of the Ranger wouldn’t have a truck to source from Ford anyway (somehow I can’t see rebadged F-150s attracting many buyers on a Mazda lot).

      • 0 avatar
        HoldenSSVSE

        I would not call all of the Ford V6′s Mazda got as “excellent.”

      • 0 avatar
        NulloModo

        The old Duratec 30 wasn’t phenomenal, and was a bit underpowered and coarse, but the Cyclone engines (the ones Ford calls the Duratec 35 and Duratec 37, and with light modification become Mazda MZI engines) are powerful, efficient, and thoroughly modern designs with built in support to have DI added (as is the case of the EcoBoost 3.5).

        And really, the second generation Duratec 30 with VVT is a very nice engine. It revs happily, has nice power for the displacement, and has a pretty small footprint. Drive a 2008 and 2009 Escape or Tribute V6 back to back and the engine modifications (plus the new transmission) result in a night and day difference. I’ve always though Mazda should have offered a version of the Mazda6 with the new 3.0 instead of making you choose between the 2.5 and the 3.7. It could have allowed the V6 Mazda6 to be priced more accessibly, possibly handle a bit better with less weight up front, and not lost that much hp.

      • 0 avatar
        iNeon

        Are the Escape/Tribute not based on the Mazda 626 platform?

    • 0 avatar

      Mazda3 is a rebadged European Ford Focus. But now that European Focus is available in US and it is newer and better platform than Mazda3 – it spells trouble for Mazda. Duratec 3.0L is not an impressive engine. It is okay, inexpensive and reliable and that’s all about it. Ford benefited from Mazda expertise in 4-cyl engines. Most of them were developed together and I suspect Mazda played leading role. Ford also learned from Mazda fast and inexpensive development and manufacturing processes – Japanese know-how. Mazda’s benefit is that it is still alive and in better shape than SAAB or Pontiac.

      First gen Mazda6 was a good car – kind of larger compact and it made it to stand out. New Mazda6 is too big and there is plenty of choice of similar cars

      • 0 avatar
        golden2husky

        I’m saddened by the Ford-Mazda split. The alliance did deliver a lot of competitive cars. Ford really needed them more at first…Compare the original Escort to the Mazda-derived version. The difference was like night and day. America suddenly realized that front wheel bearings were not a 70K wear part. Later ventures were more of an even split between who helped who. I guess it boils down to the fact that Mazda products today simply do not sell as well as they need to. Perhaps the enthusiast bent does not bode well with the toaster-tester types who swear by Consumers. But for valid reasons or not, Mazda has little traction with mainstream buyers here in the States. I say too bad. I always thought that if the first gen 6 was redesigned with the same mission, but with better attention to detail and NVH, it would do well. Mazda chose to follow the same bloated American way of ‘bigger is always better” and redesign accordingly. ‘Cept that those buyers were already loyal to their Accords…

      • 0 avatar
        John Horner

        “Ford really needed them more at first”

        Not really. Ford first bought into Mazda when Mazda was at death’s door thanks to their failed attempt to make rotary engines their bread and mutter. Remember “Mazda Goes Hmmmm”?

  • avatar
    Mr Carpenter

    Mazda are fools to go to Mexico. But then again, they’d be fools to set up any factory in the US, since it is only a matter of months before this economy does another “2002″ and “2008″. The Greatest Depression is only months away, along with unrest as seen in the rest of the world. When people have nothing to eat, they get nasty….

    I honestly wonder if they would be better to actually merge their worldwide operations with Mitsubishi (who are weak in the US but not weak in many other countries) buy the Oshawa plant from GM (which is tossing a bone to the UAW by moving Impala production to the US – despite the fact that Oshawa is historically GM’s “best” plant).

    A reskinned Mazda 6 (with tooling machinery moved from Flat Rock) and a re-reskinned Mitsubishi Galant version would go down with both sets of dealer networks. The two brands could be differentiated sufficiently to flourish;

    Mazda would become the more “mainstream” brand, while Mitsubishi would become the “eco-niche-and-performance” brand.

    It’s just a thought.

    Alternately, I know there is a huge empty factory in a right-to-work state begging for a buyer – cheap. It is in Iowa, sorry, can’t recall the name of the city but I recall it was on “I” street.

    But then again, not many people will be willing and able to buy new cars when the fit his the shan in the banana republic of goldman sachs once known as the USA.

    Got silver, food, guns and ammo?

  • avatar
    GS650G

    Mazda isn’t leaving the NA market. Moving to Mexico is probably based on following Ford production there for suppliers and maybe even labor. It’s a bad move given the lawlessness and chaos we are seeing down there but Canada is out of the question and China is a tough place to start doing business in.

    Maybe the workers and politicians should start talking with Ford about how to save the plant. Come hat in hand and don’t invite the UAW.

  • avatar
    bunkie

    One thing is certain. There’s lots of money to be made off the belief that the end is near.

    “People arent buying Mazdas! It’s sure sign of the apocalypse!”

    It’s so absurd, that I just have to laugh.

  • avatar
    ciddyguy

    I dunno about the rest of you but I SEE Mazdas all over the place here in Seattle, especially the Mazda3 but I’m seeing Mazda2′s selling and I see lots of Miatas, both old ones and new ones on the road as I see Tributes and the old Ranger based Mazda trucks, which appears aren’t even sold anymore by Mazda.

    I also see some Mazda5′s too but not as many as I do the 3 and of course, the ol RX8 sells here too.

    So they ARE doing alright in at least SOME areas of the country. That said, Fiat and Chrysler by extension has a plant in Toluca Mexico and others have a plant, or two down there so why not if that helps Mazda stay in N. A.?


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