By on July 17, 2009

This is a moment too powerful to be taken lightly, too special to be considered ironically, too vital to examine with any pretense of journalistic impartiality. I am seated behind the wheel of an absolutely perfect, fully-loaded, brand-new Porsche GT2, unwinding the wheel at the exit of Nelson Ledges Road Course’s Carousel turn. Next to me, the car’s owner, entrepreneur and bon vivant David Kim, has planted himself squarely into the GT2’s fixed-back passenger-side bucket, rigid with anticipation. There is traffic ahead, several cars varying from Improved Touring racers to tuned-up street Hondas. It’s time to accelerate, so I press the right pedal into the carpet.

There’s a “whoosh”, and a chatter from the traction control, and the cars between us and the deadly “Kink” turn are rewound past our side windows. We’ve reached one hundred and fifty miles an hour in a matter of seconds. The closing speeds are verging on the insane. As I stand on the ABS and bend the GT2’s nose into the Kink, a wave in the pavement throws the GT2 briefly airborne. The mass of the rear engine waggles, threatens, then touches safely down with a squeak from the tires. Only one car remains, a Porsche 944 Turbo squatting on coilovers and nosing down into the next left-hander.

A well-prepared 944 Turbo is never a trivial road-course opponent, but I know I have the power to swat the Porsche+Audi like an annoying bug on the upcoming front straight. The reasonable thing to do is to wait, to use the throttle. The unreasonable thing to do is to use the carbon-ceramic yellow-caliper Porsche brakes to dive to the inside and lock up from triple digits to the turn in. That’s what I do, placing this $300,000 car door-to-door on the entrance and chattering until the front wheels find grip and we nose into the next right-hander free and clear. Utterly magical.

A few months ago, I tested Switzer Performance’s eight-hundred-horsepower Nissan GT-R at BeaveRun Road Course under rather snowy conditions. BeaveRun is a modern track, designed by Alan Wilson for safety, enjoyment, and reasonable speeds. Nelson Ledges Road Course, by contrast, is the fastest racetrack on the East Coast, a curbless, narrow, frankly deadly throwback to the callous nineteen-fifties. It seems only appropriate that I would test Switzer’s eight-hundred-plus-horsepower Porsche GT2 here. One of the deadliest modern production automobiles available, at the most uncompromising racetrack available.

The “P800” package costs forty thousand dollars on top of the quarter-million dollars required to purchase a stock 2009 GT2. For that money, you receive nothing but an extra three hundred ponies. No wheels, no brakes, no suspension, no sticker package, just the ability to distort time and space with the accelerator. Under conditions that would be so shocking to TTAC readers I am unwilling to detail them completely, I personally recorded a 0-150 time of 10.5 seconds and a 0-170 time of just under fifteen seconds. In a straight line, this Switzer GT2 would thrash a McLaren F1 and find itself just a car length or two behind a Bugatti Veyron, well past three times the double-nickel.

A full day of thrashing at Ledges failed to move the Porsche’s temperature needles into the proverbial danger zone, but it did reveal some limitations in the GT2’s factory setup. This hypercar doesn’t even handle as well as my SCCA-Solo-prepped 2004 Boxster S, thanks to a ridiculous 235-front and 335-rear staggered setup. Left to my own devices, I would fit Hoosier’s R6 tire in 305 width front and 335 rear to maximize speed potential through the Kink and permit me to rotate the car under trail-braking and midcorner throttle.

And while the carbon-ceramic brakes are positively flawless, they are hideously expensive to replace. Porsche should consider offering a steel-brake package to its dedicated track-rat GT2 customers. Potential purchasers should also consider the fact that this car operates at the kind of speeds that, until recently, were the exclusive province of tube-frame GT racers. It’s possible to kill yourself very easily and very quickly in this shark-gilled hyper-Beetle. No amount of factory stability control can cheat the laws of physics involved with a power-to-weight ratio like this.

As a driving experience, as a statement of devil-may-care masculinity, as  a street car, this Switzer-tuned GT2 satisfies at all levels. There’s just one potential issue, one which came to sharp relief in my mind as I observed one of my fellow NASA racers pull his Carrera GT into the paddock at Mid-Ohio a few weeks after my Ledges test. The watercooled Porsche 911 is a familiar shape, available brand-new for seventy-eight grand at your local dealership and as a 1999-model 911 3.4 on eBay for a third of that price. Can any simple variant of the basic theme be special enough to command a pricetag in Lamborghini, Ferrari, or Carrera GT territory?

For me, the answer to the question goes back to that moment at Nelson Ledges. To have the power to break triple digits in moments—to cut the Gordian knot of any traffic ahead by the application of hyperspace thrust—to do all of this in a car which represents the ultimate refinement of the Porsche Turbo philosophy—that’s special enough for me. What makes this car better than the similarly-powered Switzer P800 Nissan GT-R? It’s simple. In the Nissan, the power merely accelerates the scenery; in this Porsche, there’s skill and bravery required to extract the maximum. It’s a challenge, rather than a mere fact, and it makes this simply one of the best performance cars ever created.

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40 Comments on “Review: 2009 Porsche GT2 — Switzer Performance P800...”


  • avatar
    Stingray

    Under conditions that would be so shocking to TTAC readers I am unwilling to detail them completely

    Would be shocking if I were sitting beside you.

    As is, I enjoy a lot these reviews =)

  • avatar

    I also enjoy reading these reviews. At the same time I question the sanity of the drive (lust) to reach the next corner a few eye-blinks faster than another yahoo. I’d rather have a car and track made for the fun of throwing the car into corners rather than warping asphalt.

  • avatar
    tauronmaikar

    I guess this is the car to own, if you are a turbo lover.

  • avatar
    doctorv8

    What kind of lifespan do the PCCB’s have under track conditions with you behind the wheel?

  • avatar
    Samir

    Yeah, but how is the interior? (Just kidding)

  • avatar
    dolorean23

    And while the carbon-ceramic brakes are positively flawless, they are hideously expensive to replace.

    Seriously?? You already dropped 3 Uber K on a car that will only be comfortable on the track or the back A3. I don’t think the Sheik that purchases this GT2 will care much about the expense of replacing the brakes.

    Good article, love the feeling of being a bug squashed to the glass.

  • avatar
    BEAT

    Looks like the Porsche Hamann Design without the gull wing.

    I love Porsche and I am right next to a Porsche dealer in Burlington,MA

  • avatar
    Jonathan Gregory

    That takes balls to charge the inside corner over-hot, microns away from trading paint in somebody else’s $300-large sled. Impressive however that both the car and driver were able to pull it off.

    Having never track-driven an ass-engined Porsche, that deviantly evil mystique is equal parts seductively enticing and brutally frightening. Much less with 800hp… sheesh!

    Kudos on an article that makes us drool.

  • avatar
    tuckerdawg

    hey looks kinda like my elantra hatchback, same color too! laff

  • avatar
    SupaMan

    In the Nissan, the power merely accelerates the scenery; in this Porsche, there’s skill and bravery required to extract the maximum.

    One of the reasons why I’d spend money elsewhere than at the Nissan dealership. Granted, the GT-R is a highly capable car for the money but for skill, bravery and cajones, I’d buy a ZO6 (or even a Porsche) with my dollar bills.

    Great article.

  • avatar
    Detroit-Iron

    Nice. I’ve always wondered where they put the radiators on those things.

  • avatar
    1981.911.SC

    Detroit-Iron :

    Hey, I don’t think that is the radiator, I think it is the A/C condenser. The radiator is in the front like most other cars.

  • avatar
    keepaustinweird

    While I find reviews of cars this astronomically expensive only marginally useful to the majority of us who come here, memo to rest of TTAC contributors:

    Jack Baruth is the best damn writer of all y’all, as we say in TX. If you’re looking for the yardstick by which your prose is measured, he’s it.

    Let the games begin!

  • avatar
    dolorean23

    re: SupaMan

    In the Nissan, the power merely accelerates the scenery; in this Porsche, there’s skill and bravery required to extract the maximum.

    One of the reasons why I’d spend money elsewhere than at the Nissan dealership. Granted, the GT-R is a highly capable car for the money but for skill, bravery and cajones, I’d buy a ZO6 (or even a Porsche) with my dollar bills.

    Great article.

    I’m with you on the Z06 but for the price of this GT2, I could (feasibly) buy 3 GT-Rs and have enough left over for Nissan pickup and trailer to haul one to the track.

    I thought it was the radiator too. Weird.

  • avatar
    gslippy

    Just don’t tell me there will be a hybrid version in 2011.

  • avatar
    mpresley

    The “P800” package costs forty thousand dollars on top of the quarter-million dollars required to purchase a stock 2009 GT2.

    From Porsche USA:

    * 530 hp @ 6,500 rpm
    * 0-60 mph: 3.6 s
    * Top Track Speed: 204 mph
    *
    * MSRP $ 194,000.00

    Quarter of a mil? Are we talking USD?

  • avatar
    DearS

    I’ve been fining for a fast car. Drove a G35 yesterday and thought it was not really all that fast. Great all around car though. This Porsche may be what I’m looking for, perhaps it’ll scare the daylight outta me. I Feel the Need For Speed.

    Oh and I can’t afford this.

  • avatar

    @mpresley: Not only is the GT2 difficult to obtain, thus commanding a bit of a dealer premium in some places, there’s also absolutely no chance that anybody is buying a base GT2. The David Kim car has $40,000 of options ranging from the interesting (Speed Yellow belts and stitching) to the sublime (a band of carbon fiber where the windshield meets the dashboard) to the indefensible (upgraded floormats).

  • avatar
    agenthex

    In the Nissan, the power merely accelerates the scenery; in this Porsche, there’s skill and bravery required to extract the maximum.

    I love these Baruth articles where apparently worse handling is better. For that group, Nissan should release the GT-R V-Crap version without the stability aids, and charge twice as much for it because more $ = more prestige = more male enhancement. They also need to get some crap driver to add 20 seconds to the GT2′s ‘ring time so their own insecure customers can feel even better about themselves.

    There’s a vid out there of Steve Millen (the real deal macho racing driver) mocking the people calling the GT-R an easy car to drive. Basically the gist of it is that any cars with this kind of tight suspension driven to the limit tends to be a bit ragged and floaty, so it’s pretty obvious where the skills of people who consider any such car easy to drive lie.

  • avatar

    @agenthex:

    Any chance you could link that video? I was looking for it… but there are 9,910 Google results for “steve millen nissan”. This is probably because he has driven for, offered tuning products for, or served in a promotional capacity for Nissan for nearly thirty years. Looking for a particular bit of Millen/Nissan stuff is needle-in-haystack business.

    It’s not entirely clear from your text, but I suspect you may be trying to make a comment about my skills behind the wheel. So… raise your hand if you won a race in a major American sanction last weekend. Anybody holding their hand up but me? How about fast lap for a aforementioned race. Anyone else but me? I wouldn’t be so bold as to compare myself to a multiple IMSA and Indy Lights winner, but if you think I can’t drive, suit up yourself and come find out. :)

  • avatar
    rochskier

    @ agenthex, Jack Baruth:

    This is the only video I could find of Millen in a ’09 GT-R, @ Reno:

    2009 Nissan GT-R Driven by Steve Millen

    I don’t hear any ‘mocking’ comments in the clip. Honestly, that sort of thing strikes me as out of character for Millen. I do hear him praise the GT-R at a couple points.

    Watch the clip and judge for yourselves.

  • avatar
    agenthex

    http://videos.streetfire.net/video/a0427625-bace-447b-b5c0-9ad300c77450.htm

    Here’s transcript I found in a forum that linked to the video, since the audio pickup is poor:

    Shinkaze: Mr. Millen when you drove Road and Tracks test, you got a 1:56 for the gtr and a 2:01 for the ZO6. Millen: Thats right Shinkaze: Car and Driver were unable to get that time, also their 1/4 mile times were significatly slower. Do you have a theory on why their times are off your times? Millen: You know i saw the magazine just today. Their time in the ZO6 was similar in time to what i did, but the gtr time was much slower. I am curious about that because the time is the time. We timed it with a gps system to. I got a number of laps at 1:56 with the gtr. Maybe Car and Driver didn’t know how to make best use of the turbochargers and 4wd and all that. They didn’t take the car as quick as it can go around Buttonwillow. It was the exact same track config. that i drove around to so i was really surprised by that. Shinkaze: One of the theories that’s been put out there. Is that the Car and Driver car was on 91 octane and maybe your car was on race gas, putting the car on a more conservative fuel map, do you think there’s some possibility in that the car isn’t seeing as much hp on 91 octane? Millen: I don’t think so and i’ll tell you why. I did another test recently with Road and Track magazine which is going to come out soon, probably within the next month. And we went to Willow Springs, we went to the big track at willow and went to the streets of willow the next day. And i drove a bunch of different sports cars, i think there was about 12 cars there, um and again the gtr was quite a bit quicker than the ZO6 and the Porsche um GT2. Shinkaze: Quicker than the gt2, the standard gtr is quicker than the gt2? Millen: Yes it was. You will see the test come out real soon. The gtr wasn’t actually the quickest car in the test, there were 2 cars quicker. But you will have to wait till you see Road and Track magazine when it comes out. Did a real good time with the Viper ACR. Which is a very quick car especially on the Michelin tires. Somehow they didn’t get all you can get out of the gtr at Buttonwillow. You know alot of people are misleaded about the gtr and they say how its easy to drive, and it is, it’s very easy to drive upto about 80 or 90%, when you really wanna start pushing that car it’s going to start slipping and sliding around on you, it’s natural. Any car if your going really quick your sliding and moving the car. People getting really secure in the car and think there going quick, but you can go alot quicker. Shinkaze: So the final question and this is the one that sets message boards aflame, is 7:29 on the Nurburgring achievable with this vehicle? Millen: It was done, so ya know Shinkaze: The message boards say oh the car it’s a ringer, it’s tweaked out, it’s a vspec or something crazy. In your professional experience given what other cars have achieved, do you think it’s achievable. Millen: I believe the new ZR1 has gone around in 7:27, so i think that kinds of puts this in perspective. The most amazing thing about the gtr when i first drove it, was i couldn’t believe how well it did everything, cornering and accelerating and so on. And at that time i said, if i was going to do a long distance race in a production car, this is the car i would want to do it in, cause you can do it lap after lap after lap. And you can use the curbs you can really use alot of the track were other cars you can’t. Shinkaze: So what about the people that complain about the 3800 lbs, it’s rated at less than 500 hp, close to 500 just a little bit less, and yet the numbers it achieves at that weight and that power are just ridiculous. What do you think the magic is? Millen: If you look at the acceleration times, like in the Road and Track test that we did, it wasn’t the quickest accelerating, infact the corvette was quicker on the straightaways on the long straightaways it was faster. Cause it’s alot lighter car. It’s all about getting into the corners and through them and out of them, and the momentum you can carry with the gtr is amazing, thats were your getting it. That’s why the cars so quick. Shinkaze: Mr. Millen thank you very much for answering my questions.

  • avatar
    agenthex

    So… raise your hand if you won a race in a major American sanction last weekend. Anybody holding their hand up but me? How about fast lap for a aforementioned race. Anyone else but me?

    Much better drivers than you have questioned the GTR and have been shown to be wrong. It’s generally down to the car’s laps times and why the “easy to drive” car isn’t producing the same results for them. In all cases, even better drivers have done the times and said the same things as Millen (that the car carries more momentum and can pick up throttle earlier than anything else).

    Especially controversial was the Nurburgring
    sub 7:30 times. Basically what happened on those is that they had ideal conditions (which they’ve noted many times), and a super-dedicated driver (their best driver out of 3 testers, quite obvious from the released videos). As the car’s become more available, especially in europe, lap times have been dropping for everyone. Sport auto’s editor just did a 7:38 with the VDC on and commented that several more seconds are possible for him. Coincidentally, no one’s even come remotely close to GM’s claimed times for the Z06 and ZR1, nor Porsche’s 997TT claim, and there is nowhere near the innuendo around them.

    Porsche’s claim of 7:54 for the GT-R is quite hilarious, same as their ridiculously high time for the ferrari 599 when they were promoting the panamera turbo. Pretty obviously sandbagged. A bit back I did some googling to get to the bottom of this, and a guy on 6 speed online has done some impressive analysis on the telemetry data available on these cars around a circuit, especially the ring. It’s little known that nissan has supplied the most data of anyone to substantiate their claims (CAR mag actually timed one 7:27 lap from trackside).

    Anyway, his conclusion is that probably as of now only Suzuki has the balls to set that GT-R time, and many other cars can somewhat improve their laps from deficiencies he’s spotted (headwind, driving error, traffic, etc).

  • avatar

    @agenthex: I think you should talk to some actual racers who aren’t on a manufacturer’s payroll before theorizing too much further about gaps in skill between drivers.

    It’s common for novices to be thrashed by ~20secs a lap or more by experienced drivers and to think that there are similar gaps further down the line.

    The difference between a solid SCCA Improved Touring driver and a legendary talent like Senna might be, in a two-minute sedan lap, one second. Over the ‘Ring, that translates to three or four seconds, max.

    Millen’s (sponsored) comments regarding the “80% easy to drive” GT-R are aimed at the HPDE 3 drivers of the world, the guys who are still five or ten seconds short of competitive pace. Every car is skittish at speed, but street cars are still easy. Something like an American Iron Mustang or D Sports Racer is far tougher to drive at the limit than any street car money can buy.

    Let me present you with two ideas and see which one makes more actual sense to you:

    1) Toshio Suzuki is vastly more talented than any other driver running the ‘Ring, so much so that he just magically wrings ten seconds or more out of a car that nobody else can;

    2) Somebody turned a boost knob.

    That’s besides the point, though, and I would hate to keep people from performing “exhaustive telemetry analysis”.

    Here’s the bottom line, like it or not: I’ve driven both the cars, I am perfectly capable of driving sub-LMP cars to their approximate potential, and I prefer the Porsche GT2 to the Nissan GT-R. You’re free to drive them both and submit “Take Two” reviews to Robert.

  • avatar
    agenthex

    I think you should talk to some actual racers who aren’t on a manufacturer’s payroll before theorizing too much further about gaps in skill between drivers.

    That must be why he trashed the 350z in a similar comparo, and pretty much every pro reflects more or less the same on the car. Well, maybe except the porsche test driver, who really looks like he could use some lessons, with a time worse than even auto journalists and all.

    -
    The difference between a solid SCCA Improved Touring driver and a legendary talent like Senna might be, in a two-minute sedan lap, one second. Over the ‘Ring, that translates to three or four seconds, max.

    LOL, keep it coming, because you’re just going to make the backtracking worse later. The ring is unlike the tracks you’ve driven on, and this is again reflect in pro commentary on the place. It’s a very high speed circuit with continuous fast camber and elevation changes which are extremely dangerous at the limit.

    Suzuki’s driving style is much much more aggressive in the sub 7:30 tapes vs. the first 7:38 lap released. It would help to watch the tapes and compared how many places he lifts compared with other ring vids (even his own earlier lap).

    Further add the fact that 5-10 sec deviations are normal on the track given weather changes and track condition. Dale Lomas, one of the chief instructors at RSR Nurburg (ring driving school), gave huge props to Suzuki’s commitment by commenting that it’s some of the most aggressive driving ever on the ring and he definitely believes it makes the time. Nissan has 3 test driver, one of which is a specialist w/ alleged ~14k laps total at the place, and they are releasing Suzuki’s tapes. Think about that.

    In any case, you don’t necessary have to take just ring times. Here’s a comparo against the precious gt2 on circuit more like ones you’re used to:

    http://www.fastestlaps.com/index.php?page_id=compare&car1=4717b80e35715&car2=46a06c22ab41a

    Millen’s (sponsored) comments regarding the “80% easy to drive” GT-R are aimed at the HPDE 3 drivers of the world, the guys who are still five or ten seconds short of competitive pace.

    Don’t take his word for it, Horst von Saurma does the supertests for Sport Auto and has been around the ring a few times. Remember his first time around testing the GT-R did I think 7:54 vs the new 7:38. Wait, he must have some agenda too in the vast conspiracy to praise nissan.

    1) Toshio Suzuki is vastly more talented than any other driver running the ‘Ring, so much so that he just magically wrings ten seconds or more out of a car that nobody else can;

    2) Somebody turned a boost knob.

    He is about 10 secs faster in ideal conditions than Horst, who is not really a pro driver, who is known to not drive 100% given the dangers of the track, who said there are a more place where he could’ve a few seconds, who had the VDC on, and who has about a couple orders of magnitude less laps around the ring in that car.

    Number 2 is measurable from the telemetry, which folks have done (matching to the in-car / instrument pod) and found that the gt-r makes up time against cars with better hp/wt by the transmission and superb continuous transition speeds and under braking in rough areas.

    I know porsche fanbois are a stubborn lot since they’ve got a significant investment in the profits of the company. I was surprised too at how brazenly deceitful porsche were in this ordeal and it’s made me look at the company differently. The fact is nissan has found some fairly incredible new tech to make their car fast given the limitations. New laps and data are coming in with the general availability of the car in europe, and standing on the wrong side of this argument is only going to get more embarrassing in the future.

    If porsche doesn’t start responding in earnest, I can easily see them turning into a boutique company that sells just on heritage, like men’s handbags, because I guess no advancement can really that away.

    Also, btw, have you looked into the porsche tt and corvette times for cheating as they are off of what anyone else could get by even more?


    Here’s the bottom line, like it or not: I’ve driven both the cars, I am perfectly capable of driving sub-LMP cars to their approximate potential, and I prefer the Porsche GT2 to the Nissan GT-R. You’re free to drive them both and submit “Take Two” reviews to Robert.

    I’ve already commented on the criteria by which this was judged. Apparently hard male enhancement gets points, and so does emotional appeal like it’s a fashion review. I guess worse handling at dangerous speeds is part of it, so I can’t wait for the corvette review where it gets one extra star for numbish steering. Ok, somewhat kidding aside, it’s your opinion, but there’s also a purpose to the comments feature of the site.

    A more reasonable evaluation for this category of cars would be absolute speed, along stability and control under ‘ring-like circumstances, which is really the romantic image these cars are supposed to conjure. That is why I brought up the subject. But the fact is pretty much no one is going to drive these cars into that visualized vista anyway. Off the limit, the nissan is more accessible, and on the limit, it’s apparently much faster than expected to those who didn’t do the design and engineering.

    The time I drove a bit in the GT-R was quite fun, tho a bit disconcerting how eagerly yet trivially the car picks up speed. The electronics inside are OMFG awesome and the feel of a few awd drifts brings joy to the heart of a rally fan. All in all very impressive given the level of accoutrement but also impossibly impractical for normal driving in the same way all cars that fast are.

  • avatar

    @agenthex:

    LOL, keep it coming, because you’re just going to make the backtracking worse later. The ring is unlike the tracks you’ve driven on, and this is again reflect in pro commentary on the place. It’s a very high speed circuit with continuous fast camber and elevation changes which are extremely dangerous at the limit.

    Er, I’ve driven the Nordschleife. 9:15, bridge to gantry, 2006 SLK200 automatic, 167hp.

    Carry on.

  • avatar
    agenthex

    Just so that we’re clear, you think only 3-4 seconds gap is possible between an SCCA amateur and senna going 100%, in ~500hp or over cars, because you drove a 167 auto there once, in spite of commentary from guys who teach and test there. Note that Lomas, the guy giving mad props to Suzuki, does the ring on bikes.

    Again, according to you, GM and Porsche, along with Rohrl and Magnussen are much worse cheaters in comparison.

    IE, the irony is that if anything, GT-R seems to give the amateur an advantage to the pros compared to other cars.

    This whole episode has made me rather sick of many people in the car enthusiast community. Nissan tested and tuned specifically at the ring because of it proximity to difficult real world conditions, and puts out data for their very best laps. Now Porsche and its fanbois, feeling threatened, have to make shit up to protect their status, because the truth is they don’t actually test much at all on their supposedly legendary home circuit.

    What’s perhaps worse is that the prevailing dumbass mass opinion is that Nissan “cheats”, even though they are embodying the best practices that all enthusiast should aspire to (technical excellence, dedication to goals, commitment in drive), because car folks who pretend to be knowledgeable about autos can’t be bothered to do even a tad bit of basic research.

  • avatar
    agenthex

    BTW, if it helps to cure the insecurities of Porsche nut huggers, the GT2 can likely equal or even possibly beat the newest 7:26, even tho its manufacturer is more content faking press releases than getting track time.

  • avatar

    @agenthex:

    Just so that we’re clear, you think only 3-4 seconds gap is possible between an SCCA amateur and senna going 100%, in ~500hp or over cars

    That’s correct. And just to put this in context, the men who have out-lapped “Suzuki-san” at the ‘Ring in production cars include an SCCA racer and a touring-car racer.

    Also, Sebastien Bourdais, who was far less of a washout in F1 than Toshio Suzuki, was beaten reasonably soundly in a Grand-Am car a few years ago.

    in spite of commentary from guys who teach and test there.

    Yes, because there’s nothing pros like more than shining-on pogues, particularly when there’s a dollar or two involved.

    Note that Lomas, the guy giving mad props to Suzuki, does the ring on bikes.

    Really? A bike rider? Couldn’t they find any hot-air balloonists or hang-glider pilots to “give mad props”? Oh, I forgot: on the Internet, bikes are harder to race than cars. Well, I flew the Goodyear Blimp once, and that was pretty hard, so I think you should take my opinion over the opinion of somebody who rides a motorcycle.

  • avatar
    agenthex

    That’s correct. And just to put this in context, the men who have out-lapped “Suzuki-san” at the ‘Ring in production cars include an SCCA racer and a touring-car racer.

    In a different car. Great comparison. According to Jack Baruth, Nick Heidfeld must be the greatest driver of all time because he’s the only one who’s gone in a modern f1 car.

    -

    Yes, because there’s nothing pros like more than shining-on pogues, particularly when there’s a dollar or two involved.

    Yes, of course, Horst von Saurma and Dale Lomas are all on the nissan secret pay-roll along with every party who are going to the ‘ring now with the gt-r. Except porsche of course, they are to be trusted with their sandbag 7:54 time, which is worse than anyone else.

    -

    Really? A bike rider? Couldn’t they find any hot-air balloonists or hang-glider pilots to “give mad props”?

    Lomas is a ring driving school instructor. He was also picked to do the ring tests for Performance Bikes Magazine. I would think he knows a bit more about committed ring laps than Jack Baruth. But then again he is on the secret payroll of nissan (and not a SCCA driver).

    Both he and Horst have fastest witnessed times for given vehicles around the circuit.

    -

    BTW, I’m still waiting for the same accusations against Porsche and GM for cheating for less well documented times that 3rd parties are even further from duplicating.

  • avatar
    agenthex

    It’s also kind of funny you’re trying to mock f1 drivers. Renault has f1 publicity events where the wannabes get to try their hand, including acknowledged Porsche nut hugger Chris Harris. You can watch the vid of how well he did there, but he also performed a ring test for Driving Republic under poor conditions early on between borrowed gt2 and gt-r that’s quoted as truth by porsche fans.

    I should also point out that it’s kind of poignant that all the better drivers and ring experts seem to be on the right side of the argument.

  • avatar
    PeteMoran

    Great posts agenthex. Thanks.

    Everyday that Porsche delay having a 911 Turbo with PDK makes it more likely I’ll stump for a GT-R.

    (After not paying rent or eating for months to save the $$$ of course).

  • avatar
    dean

    To the uneducated eye this thing looks like every other 911 out there. And there are a lot of 911′s out there. For my 300 large I want people to know I’m driving something special.

    Then again, they’ll figure it out pretty quick when they see your taillights recede at warp speed.

  • avatar

    @agenthex:

    You and I aren’t having the same conversation. You’re looking for straw men to knock down. Nobody’s making fun of F1 drivers.

    Tell you what. Go drive the cars, and drive the course, and I’ll be interested in what you have to say. Until then, you’re basically functioning as a search engine that introduces conceptual errors and spelling mistakes in the aggregation stage.

  • avatar
    PeteMoran

    Go drive the cars, and drive the course, and I’ll be interested in what you have to say.

    Respect my authoritah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • avatar
    agenthex

    Until then, you’re basically functioning as a search engine that introduces conceptual errors and spelling mistakes in the aggregation stage.

    Thanks for admitting that you’ve run out of points to make by focusing instead on grammar. However, I’d still like to know my conceptual errors.

    Also, given that likely no one else in the thread has driven a GT2, they should all STFU according to Jack. Apparently he’s driven once at the ring so that makes him qualified to automatically override any direct statement about it unless owner of said statement is to appear in person (and only if they’ve driven the GT2; sorry, Suzuki-san).

    Nobody’s making fun of F1 drivers.

    Realize that when I call Jack a washout who can’t cut it in higher forms of racing where other people would actually pay, I am not mocking him.

  • avatar
    mrcrispy

    The Porsche is a track day car. Easy to fling about, if that floats your boat, and easy to kill yourself in, as the author admits.

    Something like the GT-R, or RS4, is a go anywhere do anything vehicle that will also beat 99.9% of cars on the track, and is much much easier to drive. Apparently easy to drive==no fun according to some.

    I know which I’d rather take. I’m not Jeremy Clarkson who can thrash these for free on a wide open test track, and even chooses sensible Mercs as his cars.

  • avatar
    escapenguin

    Awesome review. Feels like you’re there. After a rocky start, Baruth is starting to become my favorite writer on the site. Keep it up, Jack. I look forward to more.

  • avatar
    highrpm

    Great review!

    To the doubters, come on now. You’re debating the guy but you haven’t driven both cars? Let me ask you something – would you take sex advice from a priest? See my point?

  • avatar
    agenthex

    To the doubters, come on now. You’re debating the guy but you haven’t driven both cars? Let me ask you something – would you take sex advice from a priest?

    A gt2 is a fairly rare car (and note that jack doesn’t drive the factory versions of either). That doesn’t mean folks haven’t driven other 911′s, or gt-r’s.

    So yes, I would take advice from others who haven’t necessarily nailed the exact person of interest.


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