If it’s not a typo, does this indicate Ford has indeed switched back to disc brakes for the Hybrid? I had seen other specs that had shown drum brakes for the Hybrid (as discussed in this thread).

Had anyone actually *seen* a 2009 Escape Hybrid with drum brakes? If Ford made a last-minute change to discs all-around, that would be interesting. Perhaps it’s at the urging of fleet operators interesting in reducing downtime and maintenance costs.

And might this explain the delay in launching/delivering the 2009’s?

Yay Ford!

basically it’s too top heavy and not very nimble, but i’m not in a big hurry, either.

i hug trees in public, so am not ashamed to say that low emissions played a role in the decision to buy–OTOH, did not care to run with the prius pack…plus it makes a good statement to my clients as my business is green building.

but mykecusa–DUDE! did i hear you correctly about the tax cred? KA-CHING!

-AA

The IRS just added the 2009 Ford Escape Hybrid to the tax credit list. That is $3000 tax credit for the 2009 FWD Escape Hybrid. $3000 sure brings that price difference of the hybrid Vs the gas verson down to a couple thousand. If I get the EPA mileage, payback might be less than 5 years … more like 3 years.

People act like the hybrid technology conveys by itself some kind of environmental halo over the vechicle but all it really does is help you save gas (and therefore money.)

You’re confusing saving gas with polluting less. “Fair-weather” environmentalists and lazy journalists strangely expect the less polluting car model to pay for itself. But many people are willing to put their money into a new car with lower CO2 and smog emissions. It’s nice that I can pollute less by choosing the smaller engine (and save money), but I can pollute even less by spending $$$ on a hybrid, and soon I hope $$$$ on a battery-electric vehicle.

Great article and I have linked it on a few sites I post on.

Where did you come up with the ‘09 FWD FEH could get up to 60mpg in town? With my ‘05 FWD FEH, I have hit 70.3mpg in a 20 mile round trip when my pack had about 20,000 miles on it. Today, I have about 48,000 miles and I can’t get that number anymore.

A new FWD FEH in the past could not make it to 40mph from a stop, but this ‘09 sounds like it’s possible. Because the ‘09 has so many improvements, I ordered a new ‘09 FWD Limited FEH W/Nav. here in South Florida. What I’m trying to confirm with the ‘09 FEH/MMH is that the A/C to D/C converter was updated to the new Variable Voltage Converter (VVC). Toyota changed to the Buck Boost Converter in the Prius in 2004 and other Hybrids later. Both these converters provide a much more efficient way of reducing conversion losses and increasing voltage. As another benefit, there is not as much heat created in the motors or HV battery. This will allow the 330V HV battery to last longer in EV than the present system. I’m hoping to break through the 80mpg 20 mile round trip if this system has been updated with the new VVC.

The Ford Hybrid Fusion/Milan is also getting the new VVC, but Ford is trying to cut cost with a smaller new 275V HV battery. Hopefully, you will give us a review of a test drive around December of this year.

GaryG

“the world’s first hybrid SUV”

But their too chicken to have the first plug in.

Remember those sweet RAV4 EV’s that still sell for big bucks on eBay? How about an electric Escape? Several different range models to choose from.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_RAV4_EV

How about a lowered city sports model? Ever seen a Saleen Explorer?

http://www.fast-autos.net/vehicles/Saleen/2000/Explorer_XP8/

How about a stripped down model that reduces it’s base price to less then the cost of a Prius?

How about a high performance model that is quicker then most vehicles on the road?

But Toyota sells a similiar vehicle to what you are describing, the Corolla (and even Yaris). I’d rather have the hatch design than a sedan.

M1EK, people here on TTAC are alot more open to realistic performance and vehicles than on Autoblog or LLN. I’ve always been one to prefer a more simple drivetrain that doesn’t cost as much to purchase or operate.

The problem is that despite what you hear from blowhard anti-hybrid FUDders, the battery does in fact help with highway driving as well as city driving. Namely, even with a bigger gas engine like you describe, people wouldn’t tolerate the amount of time it would take to get up to cruising speed, even though even the current gas engine can obviously maintain a highway cruise.

The Prius was the most reliable vehicle one or more of the last few years.

I concur Martin. As a potential Escape buyer, I would much rather get the new XLT I4(2.5l) ATX (6speed) AWD model (AWD is no longer available with MTX)

$22 grand with a decent amount of creature comforts, 177hp/170 lb-ft torque, and 22/26 mpg ratings versus spend over $28grand for the Hybrid AWD model with slightly better fuel savings, same creature comforts, more weight, and possibly more maintenance issues in the future. The I4 non-hybrid model will perform quite well in 95% of driving.

Which also makes me wonder what would happen if Toyota introduced a non-hybrid version of the Prius. use the same skinny tires and slippery design but replace the drivetrain with a 1.5 or 2l I4 of conventional design and a 5 or 6 speed manual tranny. Sure, it wouldn’t be as quick as a hybrid Prius but without all the batteries and hybrid stuff it would be quick enough for 95% of the people out there, and would still likely return 35-40 mpg.

I know lots of people love high-tech, but to me it’s just more stuff to break. The KISS principle is as valid in car design as it is in other parts of life.

$22 grand with a decent amount of creature comforts, 177hp/170 lb-ft torque, and 22/26 mpg ratings versus spend over $28grand for the Hybrid AWD model with slightly better fuel savings, same creature comforts, more weight, and possibly more maintenance issues in the future. The I4 non-hybrid model will perform quite well in 95% of driving.

The mpg ratings are not far off from the current vehicle, Mazda3 with basically the same drivetrain (smaller 2.3l version and FWD).

You can capitalize on a loss-leader. A loss-loser is just that.

I bet they wish it was 2010 and they could quietly forget about the F150 launch.

People act like the hybrid technology conveys by itself some kind of environmental halo over the vechicle but all it really does is help you save gas (and therefore money.) If you can save the same amount of gas some other way, then the hybrid technology doesn’t really add any value.

So my question would be this: What is the price and MPG comparison between the CVT-equipped hybrid and the 4 cyl, FWD, 5 speed (do they still offer a 5 speed) version? Because if you can get 90% of the savings as long as you were willing to put up with a slower vehicle and shift your own gears, and do it for $10k less, wouldn’t that actually be more “environmentally friendly” than the hybrid?

And for that matter, wouldn’t the lower weight of the non hybrid (with no batteries or other hybrid tech) actually help “restore” some of the power you lose by going to the 4 cyl?

It just seems to me we could save a lot of gas in this country if we were just willing to give up 8 second 0-60 times. My old Mazda B2000 pickup probably tood 5 minutes to get up to 60, but it also returned 35mpg on a regular basis.

billik vi borsht

Also, about disc brakes, in the 80’s I had a sports car with f/r disc brakes (which wasn’t common back then). I could still lock them up and lose control. I wish I had had ABS back then, as for the first car that I owned that did, I quickly found out that it helped keep the rear end where it should be under hard braking.

Today I have a Jeep TJ Wrangler. It has rear drums, however it does have ABS. I could have ordered it with f/r discs instead with no ABS, but I selected the ABS. Yes I am aware that ABS isn’t everything, but like I said, it helps to keep the rear end where it should be. It’s especially great on a short wheel base Jeep.

There are other, better places to save money, in my opinion.

Nevertheless, I would love to see the hybrid power plant from this Escape in other Ford vehicles, like Taurux X or Flex.

I’ll pass on Escape.