http://pontiacnationals.com/CarShowResults.html

TJ

I’m pretty entertained by the amount of back and forth generated by comparing the Pontiac to BMW. I recently bought a used 3-series and went into the test drive a complete sceptic. I assumed the BMW was yet another car that was more marketing hyperbole than anything else.

In the end, the handling and solid construction of the car sold me. Before this, I assumed that BMW’s sold solely on snob appeal. I’m sure they sell some cars on that basis but, unfortunately, there may be more of a market for image/status anyway. Can’t say I blame BMW for turning that into a selling point.

Regardless, I think it speaks well of the Pontiac to be compared to a BMW and I’m like what I’ve seen in this review. If the G8 offers solid handling, is reliable, and well assembled, they may win over some BMW owners that don’t necessarily buy into the whole BMW package.

I wouldn’t assume this car can’t be compared to a BMW unless it was proven to me in a test drive.

Thanks for the review Michael.

I own one of those Holden GTO’s that placed 3rd at the Ames Tri-Power Nationals last August at Summit Motorsports Park. There were 22 newbies at the show as well as the previous year. The new car was also well accepted at the 2006 Rolex Series race at Mid-Ohio with a prominent display in the paddock follwed by a drive around the 2.4 mile 13 turn course before the Daytona Prototypes and GT cars, including the Racer’s Group GTO’s. I am also a member of the Lincoln Highway Pontiac Oakland Club and my car is not out of place there either.

As for the G8, Tommy Kendall was involved in a Pontiac Test Drive of the G8 that premiered last Saturday at 7PM. I watched that show and also have it saved on my DVR. There is a 2 minute clip from the show at this site:

http://automotive.speedtv.com/new-models-automotive/

More episodes will appear on Speed Apr. 26 @ 3PM EDT, May 3 @ 8PM EDT and May 11 @ 12:30PM EDT

No worries, the perspective from a real, live Holden owner is helpful. Although the GTO (aka Monaro) got lukeware reviews here in the States, mainly due to styling issues, by all reports the build quality was quite good and it’s developed a ‘cult’ following amongst tuners and guys looking for alternatives.

The styling criticism of the new-gen GTO always strikes me as a little misplaced. It’s certainly bland, but people seem to forget the formula Delorean and crew struck in the early 60s– “take a bland RWD family car and stuff lots of power into it”. It’s only in retrospect that the original GTO styling has attained the respect as “a classic”– at the time it was just a vanilla Pontiac with a big motor. Basically what the new GTO is…. The question now is where GM goes next with Pontiac styling, and the answer seems to be “G8″, although most folks here are wishing more of the wild Holden styling had been retained.

Please publish me as a contributor!

Firstly, the A-pillars. Yes, they are air-bagged, but by Christ they are huge! You are constantly weaving your head back and forth to see around them, not only when having a fang, but in normal driving – i.e. at pedestrian crossings, just to make sure you aren’t about to run over someone! Stupid, stupid design.

The A-pillar will completely hide some idiot in the next lane who thinks that putting on the indicator entitles them to change lanes on top of you. (ref: taxi drivers). Unless you “duck and weave”, you CANNOT see their rear indicator OR their side indicator.

Second gripe – the steering-wheel “roller” function for the trip computer functions. Try this on a rough road – you cannot change the TC specs on the fly, so your speed alarm etc is useless. See, the “roller” scrolls up and down, but it only takes a light press on the roller (like the “enter” key on your keyboard), which makes it hard to navigate on the move. Total crap.

Thirdly: the interior is just plastic shit. Most Ozzie motor writers complain about the handbrake. They seem to want a smooth leather covered shaft with a nice button at the end. I personally find it OK. The top of the dash is some sort of plastic with tiny square holes, which just gather dust and crap to buggery. Same with the door tops – they are shit to clean.

Fourthly – mine is a 5 speed auto, which I find OK (you can’t get a Calais level with manual gearbox), but the dead-pedal placement is just crap. Even after 5 months, my clutch foot is sticking up in the air above the dead pedal – Christ, I drove better ergonomically in a slushbox a decade ago!

Fifthly, fuel consumption of the “high output” V6 absolutely blows chunks around town, and you would hardly notice the difference with the 6.0l V8. On the highway, a totally different story, and I’d easily get 7.5 litres/100 km all the time (31 miles per US gallon).

Sixthly, the “upmarket” leather/fabric mix is just horrible – the “leather” has to be black rhinosceros skin that has been parched under the desert sun for months, and the best I can say for the “fabric” is that it seems impervious to cigarette burns…

OK, now onto the good stuff:

1. This is the best car I have ever owned. The steering was aimed at the exact tactile feel of a 5-series, and they have succeeded.

2. I have owned several new GM cars in Oz, and invariably you have a list of minor problems a mile long at the first warranty service. This car is the first ever with NO complaints.

3. Handling and body control whilst getting up it is simply magnificent. It is so good that the “Wife Screech Factor” is minimalised. That alone is worth the entry price.

4. This car is just bloody fantastic, and it is the first car that I have said to myself “Shit, CasterOil, you don’t REALLY need to have a V8.”

5. The next model should be “almost” perfect.

Hope this helps!

1. Front end redesign. Big mistake. They should have kept it Holden which looks 1000 times better.
2. No turbo four banger for better fuel efficiency.
3. Stiff suspension (A strict no no in my book and so is lack of sound deadening materials)
4. Pontiac Logo.

As hondaphile who owned an e46 and grew up with American v8’s; I would cross shop this with a used e39 M5. I wrote a blog entry here on the GXP http://rhinoracing.org/?p=47 a few weeks ago with embedded videos of some reviews of the Vauxhall from TopGear and 5th gear and an interview with GM engineer. Pontiac clearly aimed for the 5 series, and though they didn’t hit the mark like the GT-R owns the 911, they came close from what I have seen. It is a huge hurdle for me to buy a Pontiac, much less any domestic vehicle, but this is close to convincing.

It is a Holden Commodore, a car designed for the Australian market. There is even less ‘Pontiac’ input than the GTO, the only difference being the bumpers.

The interior looks agricultural because Australian don’t like lots of dials and switches (tacky city). It doesn’t have a soft top option, whitewalls or exterior imitation wood pannelling either.

Derivative ? The Commodore has been made since 1978. The styling of the current model has gradually evolved from the 1988 VN model, which used the bodyshell of a West German Opel Omega.

GM may have a lot of flaws, but anymore they tend not to test their engineering ‘experiments’ out on their customers quite as much as BMW. GM has to build for the masses, so can’t take as many risks with technologies that aren’t ready for release. GM might actually have learned something from those horrible 6.2L diesels and the self-destructing aluminum-block Vegas 30 years ago!

Hence, there’s nothing revolutionary about the G8, but it looks to be a solid value with well-proven components. The 4L60/6L80 transmissions have shipped millions of units by now and the Gen III/IV (despite only 16 valves and a single, lonely camshaft) motors– tens of millions. It’s a proven drivetrain.

And, yes, I want one to sit next to the E46 and the E39.

GM won’t be judged on this car anyway. they will be judged on the Volt as they themselves have set themselves up for the fall.

Edit for image: http://www.houstoncars.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/01/WindowsLiveWriter/HoldenCommodoreSSPontiacG8_D728/holden-commodore-ss%5B2%5D.jpg

Which is too bad, because I’d buy a GT in a heartbeat right now if they offered that Tremec 6060. The alternative is to get on the list for the GXP, which has been pre-announced with the 6-speed and the LS3-derivative motor.

This does seem to be the GM marketing roll-out playbook– offering the generic, ‘vanilla’ versions first, then trickling out the sexier versions over the first few years of the cars’ life cycles– presumably to keep people coming back to look at the more exciting versions. This is what they did with the Solstice, the V-series of CTS and STS, even with the C6 roll-out.

Originally, the 6-cylinder G8 was supposed to be offered with a stick, but that seems to have been canceled. There is a six-speed manual available with this engine in the Commodore, so I am questioning why they did not bring that option here.

Australians get the manual because Holden does not use cylinder deactivation on the engine. If GM wanted to offer the manual on the G8 GT all they would have to do is just have Holden install the L98 version of the V8 on cars that check the manual box. I don’t know if they certified or would have to certify the L98 with the EPA though and that might be one reason why we don’t get it.

It’s the same over at Chrysler with the Challenger except they offer you the choice. Those that opt for the manual get the HEMI without cylinder deactivation. Those that get the automatics get the HEMI with the deactivation.

Whether turning off the cylinders actually saves any fuel in the real world is up for debate. From the figures I’ve seen posted at GM sites and at Holden sites from owners of these cars it looks like the deactivation does not make any real world difference in consumption. Both versions of the car seem to use the same amount of fuel whether it’s in Australia and the US.

The G8 V6 only gets 1 MPG better than the V8 too, and it works much harder to move the car. Little engines in huge cars like this do not really use any less fuel. They just cost less to buy.

The problem with this is that GM needs the PR boost now, while the car is still fresh, not later when the buzz has fallen off.

The manual versions are available in Australia, so there was no reason why they couldn’t have been imported here. It’s was a lost opportunity to get more press attention.

We’ll see what happens. JD Power Australia’s survey put Holden at the bottom of the list, so we’ll see how well they make the transition here.

The car the G8 GT stacks up closest nose-to-nose with is actually the BMW 550i… similar size, 360HP, virtually identical weight. The BMW purists will claim you get a more “refined” car (which translates to high-redline, but not much torque down low) and an “elegant” interior (which includes that abomination known as iDrive). But, that BMW pride-of-ownership” is going to set you back twice the money ($60K!) at list. And, over $70K by the time you spec out the options that bring you the features the G8 GT includes in its generous base price. This is even aside from the fact that most car guys find the Bangle-ized 5-series repulsive. (Full disclosure, I have and enjoy E34, E39 and E46s, but the Bangle cars are flat-out ugly– As Lutz called them, “angry kitchen appliances”.)

The BMWs are all fine automobiles, but the G8 is pretty compelling, especially if you need usable rear seats and a real trunk for half the price of the 550i.

This is finally the spiritual successor to the beloved RWD Impala SS– still a great buy with a lot more of that refinement stuff the BMW guys always talk about.

Or, look at it this way– for the $73K the BMW 550i really costs when optioned out, when you factor in GM rebates and channel pricing you can buy BOTH a G8 and an LS3 Corvette and have the best of both worlds: a real family sedan and a real sports car. The G8 is a real buy.