To evaluate the all-new 2008 Toyota Sequoia, I spent some quality time with comparable full-size SUVs from GM and FoMoCo. In back-to-back-to-back tests on the highways and byways of Denton County, Texas, I pitted the new Sequoia Platinum against the 2008 Ford Expedition King Ranch Edition and the 2008 Chevrolet Tahoe LTZ "White Diamond" edition. Let's not beat around the Texan brush: the Tahoe outshines its competitors as the best all-around full-sized SUV. Here's why…
The Tahoe is a happy, jumbo-sized appliance. Its massive prow encapsulates the truck's clean, modern design. Although endlessly, relentlesly generic, the big Chevy's sheetmetal is handsome enough from any angle– without getting within two counties of ostentatious (or unpredictable). The $2,365 White Diamond treatment adds pearlescent sparkle to the Tahoe's paint job; the chrome grillwork shines through like a gleaming chain mail vest.
The Tahoe LTZ's cabin strikes the middle ground between Ford's sleek yet sumptuous King Ranch Edition leather cabin and Toyota's plasticized Hell. Okay, the Tahoe also puts its occupants in plasticized Hell. But the Chevy's dashboard is far less cluttered than ToMoCo's big rig, so the Tahoe seems significantly less cheap.
Speaking of not-so-divine retribution, adults condemned to the Tahoe's way back sit with their knees pressed into their chest and their feet wedged between the seats. Every time the Tahoe hits a bump, the seatbelt tensioner ratchets ever tighter, compressing the occupant's shoulder towards the short seatback. After twenty minutes in the third row, anyone who's not a pint-sized passenger will be calling Amnesty International.
In defense of the Tahoe's class-trailing interior packaging (or SUV packaging in general), try towing 8400 lbs. in a minivan. And while the Tahoe's heavy third row seats must be manhandled and removed to create a suitably cavernous load space, the four wheel-drive SUV can thusly carry a large, heavy load AND tow a boat AND retain plenty of off-road capability.
Back up a second. When doing so, the Tahoe's Rearview Camera displays the image on the dash-mounted sat nav screen. At the same time, the Ultrasonic Rear Parking Assist's yellow and red LED lights– mounted on the interior right-rear D-pillar– light-up and beep. Yes but– a driver watching the backup camera can't see the LED lights. And a driver looking at the warning lights over his shoulder (or, God forbid the rear-view mirror) isn't looking at the backup camera view. D'oh!
Fast forward. GM's 5.3-liter Vortec V8 doesn't deliver the same knockout punch as Toyota's ridiculously lusty 5.7-liter mill. Still, with 320hp and 340 ft. lbs. underfoot, accelerative Tahoe drivers won't be left lingering for long. Not that I'd recommend it, but the 5840 lbs. truck will mountain-move from rest to sixty miles per hour in an entirely reasonable 8.7 seconds. More importantly, the Tahoe's four-speed automatic shifts crisply and predictably; a welcome change from the manic six-speeds found in the Toyota Sequoia and Ford Expedition.
At the GMT900 Tahoe's pre-Katrina launch, GM Car Czar Bob Lutz infamously pronounced that "rich people don't care about gas prices." Since then, GM's added Active Fuel Management cylinder deactivation system to their still profitable but no longer so very popular SUV. The non-hybrid 4×4 Tahoe delivers the best fuel efficiency of the troika tested: 14/19mpg. In combined driving, that's a 14 percent improvement over either the 4×2 Expedition or 4×4 Sequoia.
On combined surfaces– neglected highways, pock-marked local roads, gravel, dirt, wherever– the Tahoe LTZ' Autoride makes Chevy drivers feel the most serene of all full-size SUV pilots. The Tahoe's trick suspension system reacts to body and wheel sensor input, triggering bi-state (nothing kinky, just two positions) variable air-assisted shock dampening. It delivers an outstandingly smooth, even luxurious ride.
Combined with a stiff, fully-boxed frame and a multi-link coil spring rear-end, Autoride also helps makes the White Diamond Tahoe the best handling truck of the bunch. As one of our writers pointed out previously, that's a bit like saying it's the world most flame retardant paper hat. But if you're going to drive a full-size SUV on a daily basis, you want the beast to handle safely and predictably, and stop with confidence and poise. That the Tahoe does.
At the end of this test, we're left with three vehicles with three separate strengths. The Toyota Sequoia's engine is a gas (it is what it eats). In the King Ranch Edition Ford Expedition, Kubla Khan a stately pleasure dome did decree. The White Diamond Chevy Tahoe LTZ offers the best mpgs, a business-like (if not class) cabin and the best day-to-day ride and handling. GM wins my Lone Star comparo.
While cratering SUV sales make this something of a booby prize, there's no denying that GM makes the best big rigs. If it could build competitively-priced cars with as much judgment and care, the company would end its time in the wilderness. We watch and hope.
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How about an offering from Dodge?
GM interiors are getting better, they finally got a hint about what people will look at for 100K of driving. For me the interior of a vehicle is most important.
It is pretty evident that nobody does full-sized trucks better than GM. I spent a few long road trips behind the wheel of a Yukon, and couldn’t agree more with your review. GM’s full-sized SUV’s are supremely comfortable, accomodating, and capable. My favorite feature was the Bose 5.1 Centerpoint surround system, which combined with the built-in DVD player made for a home theater experience better than my own living room. And the Yukon’s 380 hp 6.2L V8 with 6 speed will leave tire tracks all over the Sequoia and still get better gas mileage to boot.
i’m sorry, but did you say $59,000?!
i used to think i make good money.
I won’t buy one, but there’s no denying that these are some d@mn fine lookin’ trucks.
Excellent comparison. I’m a packaging geek, so I have a hard time overlooking this aspect of the Tahoe. But you note this shortcoming, and explain why you’d pick the Tahoe anyway. Nicely done.
I’d also like to point out that, of the three trucks tested, this was the only one with:
–pushrods
–live rear axle
–four-speed automatic
And it won anyway.
On the reliability front, TrueDelta initially saw high repair rates for these, but once past the initial quality phase the repair rate appears to be about average. And GM’s full-size trucks certainly have a reputation for lasting forever.
http://www.truedelta.com/reliability.php
Nice to hear the 4-speed auto shifts smoothly and delivers decent mileage. I was half expecting it to get docked for not matching their 6-speeds but if it ain’t broke don’t fix it. That 5.3L Vortec is near-bulletproof too.
I have to admit, I find these a relatively handsome, uncluttered design. In this era of myriad styling affectations, often combined on the same vehicle, it is a relief. I am particularly glad that it isn’t festooned with the manic collection of geometric shapes that pass for light clusters on most vehicles.
Pity GM gets it right on a vehicle so poorly suited to the times. Nevertheless this niche will exist for years to come so they may as well get it right.
Great review sir,though the last paragraph says it all.I’m looking at the used market right now the savings are incredible on a gently used Tahoe.
At a 1.12$ a litre my wifes Jimmy averages 65$ a fill up.I can only imagine what the big Tahoe would drink.
The Tahoe is the official vehicle of my suburban Texas neighborhood. I can tell when one passes the house just by the exhaust note.
It is reviews like this that point out the true problem behind GM’s overall woes, and it has nothing (much) to do with it’s emphasis on trucks.
Fact it, when GM *wants to*, it can build world-class products. The GMT900 series is second to none. My 2002 Avalanche has been bulletproof and the interior has held up well over the years (unlike some previous GM stuff). The Corvette still kicks serious booty and has gravitas in the sports car world. Even the oft-bashed GTO was h*** on wheels and there is still nothing else like it around right now (until the G8 GXP comes out)
Problem is, this know-how doesn’t translate to the stuff that GM needs to build NOW. Why can’t the boffins that produced the killer LS2 engine come up with a decent hybrid? Why can’t a GMT900-class interior find it’s way in to the Malibu?
For every good vehicle like the Tahoe, there’s a cliker like the Ion. Why guys? I want to root for GM, but they make it very difficult to sometimes.
Great review. Thanks to GM for not compromising this truck with IRS. Solid axles still have their place and this is it. It’s outstanding that it wins the ride and handling categories to boot.
I still think that the 3rd row needs to be saved for the Suburban where it is indeed viable.
I don’t think we’ll see a review in this series from Dodge as they do not make a 1/2 ton SUV and haven’t since the Ram Charger of yore.
Hard to believe that the live rear axled Tahoe rides better than the Expedition and Sequoia. I certainly didn’t notice the Escalade I recently drove riding any better than my Navigator.
Do you know if your Expy King Rancher had the same four corner air suspension as the ‘gator?
Just wondering how come TTAC is reviewing a lot of trucks,SUV and CUV?
I think it is the best time to Market energy efficient cars or cars that are more reliable and the same time exciting to drive without scratching your head if your car will reach the next gas station on a gallon of gas.
Remember gas is going up and up and away.
Very good review. These are great trucks. I have often wondered why GM can’t put the same effort into their cars. The Malibu indicates that they are starting to do just that but why so long? From a reliability standpoint these trucks last a long time. We have a contractor in our family and he buys GM trucks exclusively (no cars, though) because they are dependable and easily eclipse 200K with just basic care.
BTW, William C., just what is a “chain mail vest” that you mention in the review?
So…
Tell me, as a European, what is the difference between this the Yukon and the Sclade that makes the latter worth so much more and appear in rap videos.
Seems to me it’s just a poorly badge engineered vehicle with a 10000 dollar premium…
JJ,
You’ve pretty much got it right. The Cadillac has a more powerful standard engine, a very nice interior (for a truck) and is all-wheel-drive versus four-wheel-drive. It should be a bit more expensive, but the buyers are really paying for the badge.
What good is a backup camera when towing? How are the side mirrors? Useful when the sonar and camera are useless?
William C Montgomery:
At the GMT900 Tahoe’s pre-Katrina launch, GM Car Czar Bob Lutz infamously pronounced that “rich people don’t care about gas prices.” Since then, GM’s added Active Fuel Management cylinder deactivation system to their still profitable but no longer so very popular SUV.
“Since then?” The GMT900s have had Active Fuel Management from the start, so even at the “pre-Katrina” launch, that feature was present and accounted for.
I like the looks of the exterior (especially considering they did not add the Griswald Family Truckster head lights ala the new Silverado) and the interior looks nice except the center stack. The center stack looks like they rushed to finish it with all that fake wood surrounding it.
Other that the one spot on the center console I think it is a fine SUV. As someone mentioned above it is a shame GM can’t do all of their vehicles this well (or like the new Malibu).
golden2husky :
April 9th, 2008 at 10:14 am
I have often wondered why GM can’t put the same effort into their cars. The Malibu indicates that they are starting to do just that but why so long?
Last year, and probably this year too, the best selling vehicle in America wasn’t a car. In fact, the best selling sedan in America- the Camry- comes behind two trucks.
If you can sell (~)half again as many Sierrados as Toyota sells Camry’s, why bother investing in a sedan platform? Why bother competing with the Camry at all when you can sell more trucks plus make more money on each sale?
Everybody has 20/20 hindsight, so now that gas is $3.50/gallon we’re all super smart and realize that sedans are the future.
But…. 3 or 4 or 5 years ago, when gas was still insanely cheap, why would the domestics bother spending money they didn’t have in order to sell 300k low-margin sedans when they could simply crank out another 600k high-margin trucks/SUVs and sell enopugh Malibu’s and Cavaliers to fleets to meet CAFE standards?
I’m not defending GM- the writing has been on the wall for a very long time and their “management” team is a bad joke- but it’s very easy to second guess decisions made in 2002 when you have information only available since 2007.
But…. 3 or 4 or 5 years ago, when gas was still insanely cheap, why would the domestics bother spending money they didn’t have in order to sell 300k low-margin sedans when they could simply crank out another 600k high-margin trucks/SUVs and sell enopugh Malibu’s and Cavaliers to fleets to meet CAFE standards?
Would you consider anyone smart who waited until age 64 to start planning their retirement at age 65?
What good is a backup camera when towing? How are the side mirrors? Useful when the sonar and camera are useless?
Backup cameras are really helpful for hitching.
As equipped the side mirrors on my tester were power adjustable, power foldable, auto-dimming (driver’s side), have turn signal indicators, and curb-tilt so you cans see what’s behind you when in reverse. They did not, however telescope out. Drivers intent on pulling large RV trailers would probably need to invest in some aftermarket mirrors.
BTW, William C., just what is a “chain mail vest” that you mention in the review?
Haven’t you seen any of the Lord of the Rings movies?
Do you know if your Expy King Rancher had the same four corner air suspension as the ‘gator?
The Expedition Kind Ranch edition that I tested was equipped with the optional air suspension rear load leveling system.
The Tahoe is the shorter version of the Suburban, right? Is the third-row packaging better in those? I remember being in an Excursion and being impressed by the fact that it’s basically a passenger van inside — so much as I hate to admit it.
Please tell me the White Diamond package gets you something else for your $2,365 than just a fancy paint job.
I mean, twenty three hundred bucks for nice paint?
ctoan : The Tahoe is the shorter version of the Suburban, right? Is the third-row packaging better in those?
There’s more 3rd row space in the Suburban because of the longer wheelbase: in addition to the 2-3 row seat pitch being larger, the floorpan also allows more footroom.
The crux of the live rear axle is that it is difficult to package around: you need clearance for axle/propshaft movement, which restricts your cabin size. The benefit the Expedition (IRS) brings is a fixed propshaft and diff, allowing a deeper footwell in the cabin for more 3rd row space (and the trick fold-and-stow seats)
The Excursion is just plain freakin huge – no compromises made there (nor excuses).
BEAT
Just wondering how come TTAC is reviewing a lot of trucks,SUV and CUV?
Even though FoMoCo nabbed The Truth about Trucks (not to say the site content is similar, just a glib point), nonetheless I applaud this.
These vehicles make up about 50% of the market and TTAC would be remiss not to cover these vehicles.
Michael Karesh
On the reliability front, TrueDelta initially saw high repair rates for these, but once past the initial quality phase the repair rate appears to be about average. And GM’s full-size trucks certainly have a reputation for lasting forever.
MK doesn’t have to necessarily answer this, lest he divulge any of his “trade secrets”, but I wonder if some of this had to do with the rush on the GMT-900 platform. Have the 08’s performed better than comparable 07’s?
William C. Montgomery
On combined surfaces– neglected highways, pock-marked local roads, gravel, dirt, wherever– the Tahoe LTZ’ Autoride makes Chevy drivers feel the most serene of all full-size SUV pilots. The Tahoe’s trick suspension system reacts to body and wheel sensor input, triggering bi-state (nothing kinky, just two positions) variable air-assisted shock dampening. It delivers an outstandingly smooth, even luxurious ride.
Let this statement end the debate for posterity as to where a good share of the traditional American sedan customers parked their dollars for the last 10-15 years.
Nice review, Bill! I can see the Tahoe handling better than the rest, even with a live axle. I like GM’s steering, roll control and off the line punch. And we all know live axles need less attention for those who tow heavy stuff frequently.
Still, that 3rd row is worst in class and once you try power fold rear seats (flat-fold with IRS below it) there is no turning back. That’s what makes SUVs so desirable. I still think GM should have spent the $$$ for an IRS, considering the packaging improvements.
Nice review. Compared to a lot of CUVs, this actually makes some kind of sense as long as you need the towing and passenger capacity. I am no fan of SUVs but this is no worse in gas costs than a Mazda CX-7 which can neither tow nor carry more than 4.5 passengers in comfort.
Let’s say you drive 10,000 miles a year and premium gas is 3.45 and standard 3.25 then the equation is as follows:
CX-7 – 10,000/17Mpg = 588 Gal * 3.45 = $2,028.60
Tahoe – 10,000/14Mpg – 714 Gal * 3.25 = $2,320.50
If you’re going to pay this kind of cash on gas then you may as well get some practicality for your money.
Very nice review, though if towing isn’t a priority I’d go with the Mazda CX-9 (now THAT is a sharp looking CUV). It’s nice that, in this comparison anyway, pushrods/live axle/4 speeds beat the advanced stuff. I was more expecting the Sequoia AND the Expedition to crank out better MPG figures but it shows that Active Fuel Management does have its benefits. Personally, I’d go with the Toyota but not before giving the Tahoe a very close look.
I like the Tahoes/Suburbans that I’ve seen at auto shows, etc. But we have a Suburban as a company vehicle that I can’t say the same for. It has noticeable panel gaps and shoddy interior quality (certain interior parts have fallen off) and this is only after about 10k. This particular Suburban has also had transmission problems. I realize that all cars are different, but this one is through our fleet discount. Do you think that GM’s quality varies depending on whether or not the vehicle is sold on a fleet discount?
I’m glad the Tahoe has the best mpgs among the group, even with that 4-speed tranny, but if they could fit it with a nice 6-speed transmission and bring it the rest of the way into the 21st century, the mileage would be even better.
Chevy NAILED the design of these trucks as well. The Avalanche, Tahoe, and ‘Burban all are stunning trucks. BY FAR the best looking SUVs on the road.
The first time i see praise for GM, is a good direction.
Except high fuel price kybosh the needed sales.
Hope they’ll heed to buyers wish.
Sometimes more speed is becoming a nusance, it will keep shifting up and down every few secs.
To the one who need to show off his newest possession is fun, to the seasoned driver is PITA.
whatdoiknow1 :
April 9th, 2008 at 11:00 am
Would you consider anyone smart who waited until age 64 to start planning their retirement at age 65?
No, but I thought I made it clear that I think GM execs are idiots.
They failed to develop a business plan that contemplated a sudden, sharp rise in fuel prices and they’re paying the price. Their business plan only made sense if fuel cost stayed where it was or dropped, and I’m guessing that failing to plan for any other occurence is a symptom of their general ineptitude.
If they were capable of doing otherwise we wouldn’t have the deathwatch.
whatdoiknow…out of topic
I think people who start saving for his retirement at age of 65 are smarter.
Because they know they will still be working until they die.
It means Americans will never retire except if you are Bill Gates and Bill 0′Riley.
A million dollars in the bank now a days is worth less. it is only good in paying for gas,mortgages medical bills and other expenses but luxury living in Florida is another million dollar to save. 65 years of saving will not add up to a million in 65 years.
Sorry to say We will be working until we run out of breath. retire at the age of 65.
Your choice if your pocket can afford it.
And so what if GM makes the best dinosaur?
In other news, oil prices kept an up upward trend today, as I watched prices go to $107, $108, $109, now $111 per barrel – that, just today.
And locally, yesterday, gas prices (which were already above national high averages locally) went from $3.33 a gallon to $3.49 – just in time for the drive-home commute.
Locally, the Chevrolet dealer has 98 Silverados, 10 Tahoes, 13 Suburbans and 7 Avalanches out of 269 vehicles on the lot, which is 47.5% Gas-Hogosaurus-Americanus and 52.5% General-Messup-Other-Crapus.
This, in a town of 16,000 people 150 miles from a city and 20 miles from an interstate.
All the Tahoeburban needs is the new 4.5L small block diesel with a 5 or 6 speed and it would be the clear class leader.
You would get 10-12k of towing capibility, better MPG and more range between fill-ups.
Viva la Oil Burner!
Thanks for the nice review.
What I would like to have seen is the entire 800 words dedicated to the Tahoe review followed by a comparison review of the 3 trucks.
It’s both good for us readers (more content) and good for TTAC (more advertising revenue) :)
Interesting. Every other review I have seen has put the Fords even or ahead of the Tahoe and the first reviews (including head-to-heads) of the Sequoia have basically indicated it stomps the stuffing out of both.
Actual test mpg for the Toy has been better for the Toy also (as opposed to the EPA geusstimate).
That squares with the mpg with the pickups also, every, and I do mean every, test I have seen that recorded same day, same route milage on the PUs had the Toy 5.7 ahead of the Chevy whether it had the 5.3 or 6.0.
William, did you actually record your milage or just go with the EPA? Did you drive the same or did the Toys power seduce you.
I don’t really give a rip about trucks, but I’m curious.
Bunter
The 4-speed is being dropped next year for the 6-speed. The Tahoe will also offer the top-dog 6.2L V8 on LTZ models.
I’m wondering if not having an IRS actually helps the handling. It’s probably easier to engineer with less variables. Plus you have to wonder about the long term longevity of the IRS axles. 200K on a live axle is nothing. 200K on CV joints could be expensive, sometimes simpler is better.
Using the Sequoias power requires sitting in the Sequoia, yikes! I’ll pass
William, did you actually record your milage or just go with the EPA? Did you drive the same or did the Toys power seduce you.
All mileages quoted in the article are EPA prognostications. I did not drive the same. I was seduced. Sure, I gave the Ford and Chevy the gas to be thorough. But the 5.7L begged to be thrashed. It speaks in a come-hither contralto rasp that must be obeyed (Kathleen Turner, eat your heart out). I can’t understand how anyone could drive that without constantly charging around. Of course, the downside is that you have to actually steer the floppy beast. And feed it.
another stupid truck!
Have you no shame?
It looks like a hippo in drag.
Can we get on with it please? Or is TTAC to be a reliquary of sorry ass early 21st century damn the torpedoes full speed ahead automotive technology?
there are apparantly more men upset about the size of their members than Harley can satisfy.
As you said, “it’s the world’s most fire resistant paper hat”. High praise indeed. Just tell me, who in their right mind would pay $60,000 US for this unmitigated example of a, of a, of a….what is it anyway? What does it do? How is it value for money?
Oh I forgot, this thing IS for the ‘I don’t care how much gas costs’ crowd. Well, it’s one fine example of a fossil-fuel to carbon converter. Great job GM!
I really don’t get the “hate on the big suv for its pointlessness” stance. Is it that hard to believe that a family would be in need of a vehicle that can seat everyone and tow a boat/camper/trailer? What other vehicle can do this? Does it not make more sense to buy one Tahoe instead of a pick-up and a minivan? Granted the White Diamond nonsense is superfluous, but were not talking about a $200k supercar here…
Haven’t you seen any of the Lord of the Rings movies?
No.
Andy Carter :
would make sense if there was ever, ever, ever more than ONE person in these huge things. EVER.
But alas no. So quit with the santimonius “but i use it for its intended purpose” nonsense, Say you like it because it is big and brassy and its for men with small weenies and move forward. That’s the truth anyway. Fess up!!!
jerseydevil
Is it therefore safe to say that minivan drivers are the best endowed?